CSNbbs

(04-22-2018 08:44 AM)cscottl1981 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-21-2018 10:38 PM)TU4ever Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-21-2018 09:50 PM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-21-2018 09:23 PM)Doglando Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-21-2018 09:05 PM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ]The top ten players (in terms of minutes) of the Elite Eight teams last season had the below ESPN ratings:

Villanova
Two 5 stars
Six 4 stars
One 3 start
One 2 stars

Michigan
Five 4 stars
Two 3 star
One 2 star
Two NR (one of whom played overseas and lead team in scoring)

Kansas
Two 5 stars
Six 4 stars
Two NR (one walk on and one overseas)

Loyola-Chicago
Four 3 stars
Six NR (one of whom was #36 JUCO)

Florida State
One 5 star
Six 4 star
One 3 star
Two NR (one of whom played overseas)

Texas Tech
One 4 Star
Two 3 Star
Two 2 Star
Five NR

Kansas St
Four 3 stars
One 2 star
Five NR

Duke
Six 5 stars
Three 4 stars
One NR (overseas)

In the past, I researched the Elite Eight teams and the 2018 season was unusual. Note, however, that the teams making the Elite Eight more than once or twice in program history are the ones with five and four star players.

In sum, high level talent alone will not achieve the Elite Eight , but without high level talent it is very difficult to consistently obtain high level results.

seems like a lot of work just to contradict the delusions of one tulsa poster. the rest of us know recruiting rankings are important

During the tenure of the former Tiger coach, I encountered a surprising number of posters - some impervious to facts and logic until the bitter end - that shared his or her point of view.

Reading comprehension isn't strong for you all is it?

5 stars= 11

Nr= 23

4 stars = 27

3 stars/2star = 15


38 4/5 stars
38 3 stars or less, 23 not ranked

But hey thanks for backing up the point.

By the way more than half of those 5 stars were on one team that didn't make the final 4.

How many 4 and 5 stars does Tulsa have? Do you think you guys have a chance to win it all next year?

About the same as our 1999-2000 team and VCU, WSU, Butler, last year's South Carolina team, early Gonzaga teams, etc, etc.

Your last question shows your total ignorance and football obsession. This isn't FBS every single team in Div 1 can win the championship next year.

As far as playing time? 3 of those teams combined had 1 4 star and no 5's, pretty sure they played 7-8 players each. That's a lot of time. Meanwhile duke has 6 5 stars who couldn't even all get on the court together since you can only play 5. That doesn't even get into Michigan. Their best player was a NR, no 5 stars, a division 3 transfer as a starter and only five 4 stars on a 13 man roster.

Quit moving the goal posts

Recruiting rankings are bull**** by every metric, they exist to sell subscriptions and give fanboy's hard-ons.

Never mind how many will never get on campus, go juco, go prep school, transfer, quit, injured, legal trouble, family issues, health issues, not as good as advertised, grow, etc.

You don't play games on paper. Having a higher recruiting class doesn't make every basket you score a 3-pointer. Hell you don't even get to start with one extra point.

Having the best recruiting class doesn't get you to the championship or even make you competitive. If it did UConn would dominate the men's and women's conferences the last three years. Ollie had a top 10 recruiting class and pretty sure the top recruiting class in the AAC all three years.

Hmm, no coaching experience, good recruiter, bottom half finishes. . . Sound familiar to anyone?

Recruiting rankings may be bunk, but I sure wouldn’t complain about getting a couple of five stars to find out for sure.

The fact that college basketball has a bracket does give everyone a “chance” to win it all. I do think that helps level the playing field some and I always root for the underdog in March. However, the odds are still against the teams who don’t have the same level of athlete. For some that chance might be 1 in a billion, but it is still a chance. Sure, in basketball you have Cinderella storys every year, but those teams are still in the minority. Many of the 2 and 3 Star type teams you’re taking about won’t make the tourney. Anyways, keep building your team with 2 and 3 Star JUCOs and see how far it gets you. Your storied history says the sky is the limit.

(04-22-2018 10:14 AM)TU4ever Wrote: [ -> ]About the same as our 1999-2000 team and VCU, WSU, Butler, last year's South Carolina team, early Gonzaga teams, etc, etc.

recruiting was 100% different in 1999. recruiting wasnt anywhere where it is now. there wasnt a flow of information. i read an article about your final 4 a few weeks ago..bill self said before the season even started he thought he had the best team in the nation (a team that was mostly underclassmen)..

the article also talked about how recruiting was completely different.there was no flow of information, most teams couldn't evaluate a kid till they got on campus..bill self had a way of finding talent, in an era with no information beside word of mouth, vhs tapes, not very big recruiting services and local media.
most of your players in 1999 would have probably been 4*-ish players in todays recruiting

also last year South Carolina had PJ Dozier a McDonald's all-american 5star, who is now in the nba...

what ive realized is you dont seem to understand statistics...you keep referencing outliers ignoring the trend...
-the team that do it every year consistently are regularly ranked on top of recruit rankings,
-the majority of the teams in the elite 8 are teams that are on top in recruiting rankings
but you want to completely debunk it because of that 1 team that 1 time

(04-22-2018 10:26 AM)ShockdaWorld Wrote: [ -> ]Recruiting rankings may be bunk, but I sure wouldn’t complain about getting a couple of five stars to find out for sure.

With Marshall coaching, just adding a few five/four stars to his normal roster would make WSU a legit NC contender nearly every season, IMO.

(04-22-2018 11:18 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 10:26 AM)ShockdaWorld Wrote: [ -> ]Recruiting rankings may be bunk, but I sure wouldn’t complain about getting a couple of five stars to find out for sure.

With Marshall coaching, a just adding a few five/four stars to his normal roster would make WSU a legit NC contender nearly every season, IMO.

Agreed.

(04-22-2018 11:19 AM)HuskyU Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 11:18 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 10:26 AM)ShockdaWorld Wrote: [ -> ]Recruiting rankings may be bunk, but I sure wouldn’t complain about getting a couple of five stars to find out for sure.

With Marshall coaching, a just adding a few five/four stars to his normal roster would make WSU a legit NC contender nearly every season, IMO.

Agreed.5

Not looking to be the case next year right now.

(04-22-2018 12:07 PM)Tigergary Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 11:19 AM)HuskyU Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 11:18 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 10:26 AM)ShockdaWorld Wrote: [ -> ]Recruiting rankings may be bunk, but I sure wouldn’t complain about getting a couple of five stars to find out for sure.

With Marshall coaching, a just adding a few five/four stars to his normal roster would make WSU a legit NC contender nearly every season, IMO.

Agreed.5

Not looking to be the case next year right now.

Next year doesn't look like a normal Wichita roster.

(04-22-2018 12:22 PM)HuskyU Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 12:07 PM)Tigergary Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 11:19 AM)HuskyU Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 11:18 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 10:26 AM)ShockdaWorld Wrote: [ -> ]Recruiting rankings may be bunk, but I sure wouldn’t complain about getting a couple of five stars to find out for sure.

With Marshall coaching, a just adding a few five/four stars to his normal roster would make WSU a legit NC contender nearly every season, IMO.

Agreed.5

Not looking to be the case next year right now.

Next year doesn't look like a normal Wichita roster.

This is very true. We are a complete wild card next year.

(04-22-2018 12:07 PM)Tigergary Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 11:19 AM)HuskyU Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 11:18 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 10:26 AM)ShockdaWorld Wrote: [ -> ]Recruiting rankings may be bunk, but I sure wouldn’t complain about getting a couple of five stars to find out for sure.

With Marshall coaching, a just adding a few five/four stars to his normal roster would make WSU a legit NC contender nearly every season, IMO.

Agreed.5

Not looking to be the case next year right now.

Eh we have a couple 4 stars. Then combined with the fact that Marshall coached kids tend to outperform their recruiting rankings.

Though I agree next year will be rough. The years after have potential though

(04-22-2018 11:18 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 10:26 AM)ShockdaWorld Wrote: [ -> ]Recruiting rankings may be bunk, but I sure wouldn’t complain about getting a couple of five stars to find out for sure.

With Marshall coaching, just adding a few five/four stars to his normal roster would make WSU a legit NC contender nearly every season, IMO.

I agree 100%, but I think we could have some rough spots early next year, but have much more athletic and higher rated recruits than we’ve had in the past. Could be dangerous during conference play, it just depends how quickly all the young guys “get it”. It will be fun to watch them grow up, but definitely a wild card.

So you use 1 season as the base of your argument? Look at the last 5-7 years.

Also, consider what the NCAA Tournament is. It's a 1 game elimination tournament that anything can happen in.

Cinderella is there every year. Why? Because anything can happen. Teams get hot, teams shoot cold, players get injured, you get a coach like Brad Stevens leading a program and so on. There are numerous reasons why a team with superior talent loses.

How about making the tournament? How about regular season performance against top teams with superior talent? How about OCC wins against teams with 3/4/5 star talent, that will ultimately be stronger throughout the course of a season that can help bolster the conference perception and maybe get an extra at large team in.

Let's see continued success, multiple conference titles, multiple finals 4s and so on with all those players you get.

I look forward to Tulsas future dominance, not only in the AAC, but against top OOC schedules and the NCAA Tournament.

Everyone agrees experience and coaching are major factors but if you don't think recruiting is important you don't know anything.

Tulsa is bringing in players this year that couldn't see the court at utep and uc davis

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...ris-barnes

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...ter-hewitt

of course they try to convince themselves recruiting isnt as important as it is

(04-22-2018 02:07 PM)Doglando Wrote: [ -> ]Tulsa is bringing in players this year that couldn't see the court at utep and uc davis

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...ris-barnes

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...ter-hewitt

of course they try to convince themselves recruiting isnt as important as it is

I don’t think recruiting rankings are the end all be all for guys like Sampson, Marshall, and Cronin. We’ve seen them be successful at developing players. But Haith can’t develop players the same way those guys can. And those guys are getting higher rated recruits than Tulsa. So Tulsa needs to keep up in the recruiting department, or Sampson, Marshall, Cronin are going to wipe the floor with Haith.

arguably the best guard in the aac

(04-22-2018 03:04 PM)pesik Wrote: [ -> ]arguably the best guard in the aac

That's a relief. We should be somewhat competitive this year. Jalen has the potential to be one of the AAC's best this coming season.

(04-22-2018 03:04 PM)pesik Wrote: [ -> ]arguably the best guard in the aac

Good news for UConn and the AAC.

(04-22-2018 01:52 PM)Tigermaniac Wrote: [ -> ]So you use 1 season as the base of your argument? Look at the last 5-7 years.

Also, consider what the NCAA Tournament is. It's a 1 game elimination tournament that anything can happen in.

Cinderella is there every year. Why? Because anything can happen. Teams get hot, teams shoot cold, players get injured, you get a coach like Brad Stevens leading a program and so on. There are numerous reasons why a team with superior talent loses.

How about making the tournament? How about regular season performance against top teams with superior talent? How about OCC wins against teams with 3/4/5 star talent, that will ultimately be stronger throughout the course of a season that can help bolster the conference perception and maybe get an extra at large team in.

Let's see continued success, multiple conference titles, multiple finals 4s and so on with all those players you get.

I look forward to Tulsas future dominance, not only in the AAC, but against top OOC schedules and the NCAA Tournament.

Everyone agrees experience and coaching are major factors but if you don't think recruiting is important you don't know anything.

Recruiting is important. Recruiting services aren't. Recruiting rankings aren't. Learn the difference.

The players proove it on the court. I've given numerous examples of teams over multiple years and eras. You simply can not over come the numbers problem and unpredictability of kids. Most of the people doing the scouting have little skill in evaluating talent or they wouldn't be doing it for a recruiting service. The coaches who identify good talent are clear, they have consitantly winning programs and there are numerous examples of programs consitantly winning with out 5 stars.

Who knew Robinson would grow 6 inches when he entered the naval academy?

(04-22-2018 11:11 AM)pesik Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2018 10:14 AM)TU4ever Wrote: [ -> ]About the same as our 1999-2000 team and VCU, WSU, Butler, last year's South Carolina team, early Gonzaga teams, etc, etc.

recruiting was 100% different in 1999. recruiting wasnt anywhere where it is now. there wasnt a flow of information. i read an article about your final 4 a few weeks ago..bill self said before the season even started he thought he had the best team in the nation (a team that was mostly underclassmen)..

the article also talked about how recruiting was completely different.there was no flow of information, most teams couldn't evaluate a kid till they got on campus..bill self had a way of finding talent, in an era with no information beside word of mouth, vhs tapes, not very big recruiting services and local media.
most of your players in 1999 would have probably been 4*-ish players in todays recruiting

also last year South Carolina had PJ Dozier a McDonald's all-american 5star, who is now in the nba...

what ive realized is you dont seem to understand statistics...you keep referencing outliers ignoring the trend...
-the team that do it every year consistently are regularly ranked on top of recruit rankings,
-the majority of the teams in the elite 8 are teams that are on top in recruiting rankings
but you want to completely debunk it because of that 1 team that 1 time

The problem is you have no idea what you are talking about. You should stick to football.

Tennessee isn't a blue blood in basketball.

Tulsa has never been to a final four.

Our freshman class in 1999 was recruited by almost no one and wouldn't have been now, because they were small and not elite. Our Center was a Juco Cali kid who was recruited well. But our star was an unknown country kid who went pro in rodeo.

You can just stop now.

(04-22-2018 02:07 PM)Doglando Wrote: [ -> ]Tulsa is bringing in players this year that couldn't see the court at utep and uc davis

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...ris-barnes

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...ter-hewitt

of course they try to convince themselves recruiting isnt as important as it is

Has UCF ever been to the dance? Asking for a friend