(04-08-2015 05:18 PM)South Carolina Duke Wrote:  OT, however another note I hope the Mayor and Police Chief take from this is that that 9mm or .40 pistol round didn't work very well. If the officer had been issued a .45 ACP, one round would have spun him around and he would have dropped due to the force and the slowness of the round. Could have saved Scott's life as well.

It looked as if he was getting stung by a Yellow Jacket!


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why this isn't done is beyond me....the other two suck bones.....

the .45 ACP should be the ONLY standard issue.....shot mine last week.....it's my fave

(04-08-2015 06:51 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  I'm not losing any sleep over this incident. It seems the authorities are handling it well.

neither am I....however, the media dic(k)tates the masses....

this issue is really more about 'that' than the incident....

You hate to see anybody lose their life.

That said, you don't lunge at a cop for any reason if you don't want to get hurt, and potentially killed.

Being a cop is a difficult job because the officer is almost always at the disadvantage when any situation begins.

I'd like to see this play out showing some fidelity to the law and some respect for those involved but I know that won't happen. They will plaster the fact this guy was a life long criminal, which he probably was. Then, they will turn around and talk about how awful police are and how they are all racists etc.

Both of which were utterly irrelevant to what happened at the moment the officer pulled the trigger or when the guy went for the tazer.

Americans will make this into something it isn't to prove something that doesn't exist, left or right.

(04-08-2015 06:04 PM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(04-08-2015 05:03 PM)Crebman Wrote:  

(04-08-2015 04:59 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Running from a cop and lunging for a cop's weapon and then running are two different things.

Absolutely. I just have trouble understanding where either action will leave one better off than just doing what the cop says. One is definitely more dangerous, but both almost without fail lead to a much worse ultimate outcome.

What the hell makes people think - I'll just defy this man with a gun and do what I want!

Okay...I'll try here.

First, many of the people that do this stuff have warrants or they have drugs and/or firearms in their possession. Some of them are on probation/parole and this stop could automatically send them back to jail. So, to many, running is much preferable to spending time in jail and/or prison.

Second, they honestly believe they can get away...or, at least be able to ditch the contraband they possess.

Third, for many of these folks, it is engrained in their psyche to run from the police. It's the wild west when the sheriff rides into the town and the gang quickly leaves...so do these folks.

Okay, I actually understand the ditching the contraband angle. The others-not so much. Fleeing just adds to the list and likely lengthens jail time.

Somehow, I just still can't imagine that they actually think they will get away and won't get caught. I mean, what are the percentages of running and actually getting away?

White man shooting a black man.

Black man shooting a white man.

(04-08-2015 07:24 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  You hate to see anybody lose their life.

That said, you don't lunge at a cop for any reason if you don't want to get hurt, and potentially killed.

Being a cop is a difficult job because the officer is almost always at the disadvantage when any situation begins.

I'd like to see this play out showing some fidelity to the law and some respect for those involved but I know that won't happen. They will plaster the fact this guy was a life long criminal, which he probably was. Then, they will turn around and talk about how awful police are and how they are all racists etc.

Both of which were utterly irrelevant to what happened at the moment the officer pulled the trigger or when the guy went for the tazer.

Americans will make this into something it isn't to prove something that doesn't exist, left or right.

D+/C- again.....they signed up for the task.....shite happens when you put 'them' in a position of provincial power.....

I have zero clue why this surprises anyone....oops, people watch the tele....that explains it...go figure.....

If there's some context that mitigates this incident, I'm all ears, but just looking at the video, this dude should go down hard.

I'm not a cop hater. I have friends and family in law enforcement and respect and admire what they do. You can't tell me, however, that as a profession it doesn't attract its share of low-rent thugs.

I'm willing to pony up my share of the tax burden to outfit every damn cop in America with a body-cam.

I'm all for that. And I would also include Teachers to wearing them as well.


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(04-08-2015 08:30 PM)Smaug Wrote:  If there's some context that mitigates this incident, I'm all ears, but just looking at the video, this dude should go down hard.

I'm not a cop hater. I have friends and family in law enforcement and respect and admire what they do. You can't tell me, however, that as a profession it doesn't attract its share of low-rent thugs.

I'm willing to pony up my share of the tax burden to outfit every damn cop in America with a body-cam.

There is nothing stoping you.

Call up the local PD and tell them their cameras are on the way.

Spending other people's money is easy.

(04-08-2015 08:52 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  

(04-08-2015 08:30 PM)Smaug Wrote:  If there's some context that mitigates this incident, I'm all ears, but just looking at the video, this dude should go down hard.

I'm not a cop hater. I have friends and family in law enforcement and respect and admire what they do. You can't tell me, however, that as a profession it doesn't attract its share of low-rent thugs.

I'm willing to pony up my share of the tax burden to outfit every damn cop in America with a body-cam.

There is nothing stoping you.

Call up the local PD and tell them their cameras are on the way.

Spending other people's money is easy.

Did I mention I'd shoulder my share of the tax burden?

What is upsetting about this, had this video not surfaced, this cop would still be on the streets. I don't see how anyone in their right mind can defend this officer after watching the video. Some people defending the cop may ask "Why was he running from the cop?" Insinuating that the victim was at fault, but after watching the video, you gotta ask yourself, did the cop say or do anything prior to the video that would make the victim feel as if his life was in danger? Because obviously it was. Now I'm not saying that is what happened, but the guy unloaded a clip in the man's back. Moments after his "life was in danger" he was able to think straight enough and calmly move evidence. Failed to administer aid. Not to mention, as seen in the video, his back up was not very far behind, the victim was no Hussein Bolt. You can't discount the possibility that this might have been a bad cop, a cop having a bad day, or someone who shouldn't have been hired as police officer.

(04-08-2015 10:31 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  What is upsetting about this, had this video not surfaced, this cop would still be on the streets. I don't see how anyone in their right mind can defend this officer after watching the video. Some people defending the cop may ask "Why was he running from the cop?" Insinuating that the victim was at fault, but after watching the video, you gotta ask yourself, did the cop say or do anything prior to the video that would make the victim feel as if his life was in danger? Because obviously it was. Now I'm not saying that is what happened, but the guy unloaded a clip in the man's back. Moments after his "life was in danger" he was able to think straight enough and calmly move evidence. Failed to administer aid. Not to mention, as seen in the video, his back up was not very far behind, the victim was no Hussein Bolt. You can't discount the possibility that this might have been a bad cop, a cop having a bad day, or someone who shouldn't have been hired as police officer.

Another very plausible scenario. Unfortunately that side of the story won't be heard. Its always a tough situation in cases like this. I need more evidence before I could definitely say guilty.

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(04-08-2015 04:41 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(04-08-2015 04:31 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  No one is arguing JMU's point though, the discussion isn't about whether or not it's safe to run from the police.

So, no. You didn't read the post to which I was responding. What a weird way to wade into a part of a conversation you either weren't a part of or simply can't understand.

Here, let me help you out...

Failure to comply with an officer's orders is not punishable by death in any jurisdiction in America.

Get it now?

No, I understand perfectly, but just stating you agree with that doesn't negate the fact you follow it up contradicting that stance by deflecting blame onto the victim.

(04-08-2015 05:39 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Stay in your lane UCF. You're all over. As usual.

Is this uh...going to be your thing now?

Is it just me, or does the media really want this to be another Ferguson?

(04-09-2015 06:48 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Is it just me, or does the media really want this to be another Ferguson?

Yes!! The 24/7 channels would love nothing more than more riot film. I think if they could manage it, they would stage car wrecks with deaths with "LIVE FOOTAGE" every day as well.

(04-08-2015 06:13 PM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(04-08-2015 04:33 PM)ODU06 Wrote:  

(04-08-2015 04:05 PM)pharaoh0 Wrote:  

(04-08-2015 03:27 PM)ODU06 Wrote:  

(04-08-2015 03:02 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Well, no schit. But i wouldn't imagine this is a risk any sane person would like to force to chance. If a cop tells you to do something, discretion is the better part of valor.

Sure you can challenge them, sure you can scream about "what you rights" are, or what he can and can't do. Go 'head. You may also get a club upside the head or even worse.

Cop says stop. Stop! Pretty simple rule far as I can tell. This guy would probably still be alive. But, you? You do what you want. Hope that works out for you.

What does that have to do with the police officer's actions? Yes the suspect should not have resisted and he likely broke the law by doing so and he should have been arrested and punished in accordance with our laws for doing so. And, yes, if he hadn't done so, he'd still be alive. However, he did resist and, at that point, the officer had a choice of how to respond and responded by shooting the man 8 times in the back. A trial will determine whether that choice was murder but many seem to believe it likely was (absent all the facts).

Like you, I would not resist in that situation. But, unlike you, I don't believe that any resistance entitles the officer to do whatever he wants, including 8 shots to the back. There are times that the officer is justified using such force to stop a fleeing suspect as discussed in this thread but "do everything a cop says or the cop is justified to shoot you" is, in my opinion, a terrible standard for society.

I don't think anyone is saying that. HOWEVER, resisting arrest or assaulting an officer is sure-fire way to escalate an incident and lead to an officer needing to make quick decisions of life and death. If you just go along with the program, the worst thing that can happen is that you get arrested. If you resist arrest or assault an officer, then officers are wondering why and being extra cautious about any extra movements you make. That's usually how these shooting happen.

I'll break it down like this. It appears one person committed a misdemeanor by resisting arrest and possibly a lower-level felony if his actions rose to the level of assaulting an officer. It appears the other person might have committed manslaughter or murder and we know he shot a human 8 times in the back. Yet, some are choosing to focus on the actions of the former and not the latter. I find that to be an absurd approach.


If we were playing basketball and you fouled me hard and then I pulled out a gun and shot you, would you think people should focus on my act or focus on saying "well, if you think about it, had that guy Pharaoh not fouled him, he wouldn't have gotten shot." That would be a technically true statement but utterly ridiculous to focus on in that situation.

That is just a silly, asinine comparison and isn't even remotely related to my original statement. It doesn't matter what crime the cops are rightfully (or wrongfully) stopping you for....when you resist and/or assault an officer, you have escalated the situation. Most people run because they have warrants, a gun, drugs, and/or are on parole/probation. Cops know this and it heightens the tension of the detention. You should go read a self-defense statute in your state and then you'll understand why sudden movements (including reaching), given a fleeing suspect can create an unwanted ending.

I was busy last night and couldn't post. Won't be able to much today either. So I'm going to retire from this back and forth. But, to clarify, my example was clearly an intended exaggerated example used for the purpose of making a point which is that you're focusing on the man who got shot 8 times in the back and what he could've done to avoid it and not the man who shot someone 8 times in the back and what he could've done (i.e., not pulled the trigger 8 times when the suspect was fleeing). To me, that is a ridiculous approach but if you think that's the right approach, that's fine. We don't have to agree.

I'm beginning to think there are more race baiters in this country than racist!

So much hate!

If you are a race baiter or a racist, please smoke some crack and off yourself. Also pull out during intercourse!

(04-08-2015 01:27 PM)South Carolina Duke Wrote:  Scott didn't comply with the Officer. When will these idiots figure it out.

I'm speculating here, but it probably stands to reason that people living in lower socioeconomic neighborhoods (LSN) have more of an opportunity to have interactions with cops than people who live in, say, gated subdivisions. I know there are cops that walk the beat who take the time to get to know the people in those neighborhoods, and they treat them with respect. Those aren't the cops I'm talking about right now.

So the guy living in the LSN is probably more likely to get hassled for doing the same thing that the guy in the gated neighborhood might. If I'm walking down the street in some suburban neighborhood with an open beer in my hand to visit my neighbor, nothing's going to happen. Hell, the cop that lives down the street might give me a friendly wave as I walk by. Now, if someone in a LSN walks down the street drinking a beer, it might not be quite so uneventful. Even if he doesn't get arrested, just having some cop **** with you is going to harden your feelings. Now multiply that by 24 hours a day 7 days a week. You might be a completely upstanding citizen with not even a parking ticket on your record, but you're a second-class citizen in your own neighborhood.

I think that's part of why running from a cop from our perspective seems so unfathomable, and why running from the cop seemed like a reasonable response by Mr. Scott.

(04-09-2015 06:48 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Is it just me, or does the media really want this to be another Ferguson?

It's just you.