(11-11-2013 03:23 PM)Eagle78 Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:13 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  

(11-09-2013 11:37 PM)The Turk Wrote:  [quote='lumberpack4' pid='9981611' dateline='1384057161']
[quote='UConn-SMU' pid='9981424' dateline='1384055797']
[quote='lumberpack4' pid='9980972' dateline='1384052901']

UConn was always a "good" school. Back in the early 1980's (when I was there) it was the #2 state school in New England, behind UVM. In fact, I was accepted at Syracuse & UConn ... but I was denied admission to UVM.

Now UConn is the unquestioned #1 public school in New England, and the #14 public FBS school.

I am always amused at how fans like to cherry pick data to support their agendas. Uconn-SMU, yes, it is true that Uconn is rated by USN&WR as the top public national university in NE. However, the "universe" you are comparing Uconn to is FIVE other schools. For those who don't know New England, private colleges and universities make up a much bigger chunk of the landscape in New England. When Uconn is compared to the TOTAL number of national universities, located in New England, in the latest USN&WR rankings, they are further down the pack:

#2 Harvard
#3 Yale
#7 MIT
#10 Dartmouth
#14 Brown
#28 Tufts
#31 Boston College
#32 Brandeis
#41 Boston University
#49 Northeastern
#57 Uconn

Your claim about Uconn being the #1 Public School in New England would be like me making the claim that Boston College is the #1 New England College in FBS. Both statements are true, but in the context of this Board and subject, neither are very relevant, IMO.

Being the #1 Public School in New England is still a pretty good attribute. Everyone knows the northeast has a ton of great private schools. Other than Rutgers and Penn St. though, I'd argue that there is no public school in the Northeastern US that is viewed as a very good school and has a nationally relevant athletic program.

(11-11-2013 05:45 PM)HartfordHusky Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 03:23 PM)Eagle78 Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:13 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  

(11-09-2013 11:37 PM)The Turk Wrote:  [quote='lumberpack4' pid='9981611' dateline='1384057161']
[quote='UConn-SMU' pid='9981424' dateline='1384055797']
[quote='lumberpack4' pid='9980972' dateline='1384052901']

UConn was always a "good" school. Back in the early 1980's (when I was there) it was the #2 state school in New England, behind UVM. In fact, I was accepted at Syracuse & UConn ... but I was denied admission to UVM.

Now UConn is the unquestioned #1 public school in New England, and the #14 public FBS school.

I am always amused at how fans like to cherry pick data to support their agendas. Uconn-SMU, yes, it is true that Uconn is rated by USN&WR as the top public national university in NE. However, the "universe" you are comparing Uconn to is FIVE other schools. For those who don't know New England, private colleges and universities make up a much bigger chunk of the landscape in New England. When Uconn is compared to the TOTAL number of national universities, located in New England, in the latest USN&WR rankings, they are further down the pack:

#2 Harvard
#3 Yale
#7 MIT
#10 Dartmouth
#14 Brown
#28 Tufts
#31 Boston College
#32 Brandeis
#41 Boston University
#49 Northeastern
#57 Uconn

Your claim about Uconn being the #1 Public School in New England would be like me making the claim that Boston College is the #1 New England College in FBS. Both statements are true, but in the context of this Board and subject, neither are very relevant, IMO.

Being the #1 Public School in New England is still a pretty good attribute. Everyone knows the northeast has a ton of great private schools. Other than Rutgers and Penn St. though, I'd argue that there is no public school in the Northeastern US that is viewed as a very good school and has a nationally relevant athletic program.

That depends if you consider Pitt to be in the Northeast, which it is if one is including Pennsylvania.

I know Pitt considers itself to be in the Northeast and mid-Atlantic.

Among public colleges in the Northeast, Pitt would have the third highest average freshman SAT scores (after SUNY-Geneseo and Binghamton), the largest endowment (per NACUBO), the most major student fellowships in the past five or 10 years (Rhodes, Marshall, Goldwater), the largest number of major awards annually won by faculty (per CMUP), and the most amount of total and federal R&D (per NSF).

(11-11-2013 02:53 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:44 PM)DexterDevil Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:38 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  UC-SM

How do you think us Buffalo fans feel?

I actually want Buffalo in the Big Ten, if it's any consolation.

Sent from my LG-VM696 using Tapatalk 2

I am so confused... Why Buffalo? And a why a Sparty fan in Dexter?

Academics, seeming improvement in sports, location, potential to become flagship.

As to me being a state fan, I grew up a state fan, in 4th grade my class had to do a history project, someone picked Michigan Football before me so I picked Michigan State sports and because of that project I had picked a side (I grew up in Westland, still a heavily UofM fanbase) and have cheered for them ever since. I also am a fan of Eastern and try my best to buy Eastern gear and tickets as often as I can.

Sent from my LG-VM696 using Tapatalk 2

(11-11-2013 10:58 PM)DexterDevil Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:53 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  I am so confused... Why Buffalo? And a why a Sparty fan in Dexter?

Academics, seeming improvement in sports, location, potential to become flagship.

And when it comes to the main topic, B1G moving east in major markets, the alumni potential is there for Eastern FBS's teams and the two largest SUNY's (whenever athletics greatly stabilize in improvement). People will say there are tons of B1G alums there, but the numbers are only really sizable for Penn St. ND has its broader faith identity which trumps its alums. Yet the large Eastern schools have the huge alumni potential which the B1G obviously noticed for 2:

Rutgers
235,958 in NJ
21,109 in NY State
4,038 in CT
Maryland
25,000+ in Metro NYC

Others
UConn
121,048 in CT
10,415 in NY State
5,682 in NJ
Syracuse
45,680 in Metro NYC
Buffalo
35,659 in Metro NYC
.
.
Temple
18,000 in Metro NYC
UMass
16,000 in Metro NYC

And Stony Brook is a sleeping giant whenever they find an FBS invite with ~100K alumni living in Metro NYC.

(11-12-2013 12:24 AM)RecoveringHillbilly Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 10:58 PM)DexterDevil Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:53 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  I am so confused... Why Buffalo? And a why a Sparty fan in Dexter?

Academics, seeming improvement in sports, location, potential to become flagship.

And when it comes to the main topic, B1G moving east in major markets, the alumni potential is there for Eastern FBS's teams and the two largest SUNY's (whenever athletics greatly stabilize in improvement). People will say there are tons of B1G alums there, but the numbers are only really sizable for Penn St. ND has its broader faith identity which trumps its alums. Yet the large Eastern schools have the huge alumni potential which the B1G obviously noticed for 2:

Rutgers
235,958 in NJ
21,109 in NY State
4,038 in CT
Maryland
25,000+ in Metro NYC

Others
UConn
121,048 in CT
10,415 in NY State
5,682 in NJ
Syracuse
45,680 in Metro NYC
Buffalo
35,659 in Metro NYC
.
.
Temple
18,000 in Metro NYC
UMass
16,000 in Metro NYC

And Stony Brook is a sleeping giant whenever they find an FBS invite with ~100K alumni living in Metro NYC.

Where are you getting your data for "others"? According to video below, UCONN has 22,000 alumni in New York, nearly as many as Penn State. Additionally, Syracuse numbers are closer to 35,000.

http://uconnalumni.com/alumni/find/huski...apters/nyc

(11-11-2013 02:44 PM)DexterDevil Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:38 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  UC-SM

How do you think us Buffalo fans feel?

I actually want Buffalo in the Big Ten, if it's any consolation.

Sent from my LG-VM696 using Tapatalk 2

That makes two of us.. It's a start..

(11-12-2013 01:10 AM)Itgoeslikethis Wrote:  Where are you getting your data for "others"? According to video below, UCONN has 22,000 alumni in New York, nearly as many as Penn State. Additionally, Syracuse numbers are closer to 35,000.

http://uconnalumni.com/alumni/find/huski...apters/nyc

From the institutional research web data and official alumni club data from each school. Such as this from UConn. So that fellow likely means Metro NY area: http://www.oir.uconn.edu/Alumni12_State.pdf

(11-11-2013 02:00 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:19 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(11-09-2013 11:44 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(11-09-2013 11:37 PM)The Turk Wrote:  

(11-09-2013 11:19 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  University administrators know that US News numbers are easily cooked and based in large part on the opinions of a few. There are no output measures at all and the rankings are just to sell magazines.

The 99% you speak of are rubes.

Sorry to bust your bubble with the truth.

When I grew up, in New England, Uconn wasn't a great school. It probably wasn't even a good school... was certainly behind UVM and also behind probably at least one of the other New England flagships. What they've done in the past 20 years on the academic side is amazing. This is a region where up until recently, for anyone to go to a state school, even a flagship like Uconn, well that was a safety school, nothing more.

They're now an elite-ish school, to the point where it's probably more prestigious for a kid from VT to go to UConn than it is the reverse. The state has invested in them to a huge extent. Aside from building out the tiny road out to Storrs, I'm not sure they could have done more. Keep in mind, even in bball, Uconn was nothing until 1990 or so.

25 years ago, no one would have thought twice about leaving them out of a major conference, but if picks were being made today, they're probably picked in the top 30-40 based on academics, athletics, potential success, non rev sports, etc.

And i hate UConn and think their fanbase is delusional in general.

I guess in 10 years, when UConn has finally hired enough academics to suck off the teet of we taxpayers to be able to achieve ARWU status, they'll make it in. Whatever

Delaney would have found all kinds of seats to sit in at UConn had he visited this weekend, as they had an almost empty stadium.

Maryland outdrew UConn in Brooklyn for hoops too last Friday. UConn Internet fans are delusional.

I heard a lot more noise from UConn fans than Maryland fans on the TV. But I wasn't in the building, so I don't know for sure.

Well we also had a football game at the exact same time and MD sold (and subsidized their tickets). But I do love the Cuse hate - the school is so popular yet they can't get on TV in upstate NY and get bumped for the UConn women.

(11-12-2013 12:20 PM)uconnwhaler Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:00 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:19 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(11-09-2013 11:44 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(11-09-2013 11:37 PM)The Turk Wrote:  When I grew up, in New England, Uconn wasn't a great school. It probably wasn't even a good school... was certainly behind UVM and also behind probably at least one of the other New England flagships. What they've done in the past 20 years on the academic side is amazing. This is a region where up until recently, for anyone to go to a state school, even a flagship like Uconn, well that was a safety school, nothing more.

They're now an elite-ish school, to the point where it's probably more prestigious for a kid from VT to go to UConn than it is the reverse. The state has invested in them to a huge extent. Aside from building out the tiny road out to Storrs, I'm not sure they could have done more. Keep in mind, even in bball, Uconn was nothing until 1990 or so.

25 years ago, no one would have thought twice about leaving them out of a major conference, but if picks were being made today, they're probably picked in the top 30-40 based on academics, athletics, potential success, non rev sports, etc.

And i hate UConn and think their fanbase is delusional in general.

I guess in 10 years, when UConn has finally hired enough academics to suck off the teet of we taxpayers to be able to achieve ARWU status, they'll make it in. Whatever

Delaney would have found all kinds of seats to sit in at UConn had he visited this weekend, as they had an almost empty stadium.

Maryland outdrew UConn in Brooklyn for hoops too last Friday. UConn Internet fans are delusional.

I heard a lot more noise from UConn fans than Maryland fans on the TV. But I wasn't in the building, so I don't know for sure.

Well we also had a football game at the exact same time and MD sold (and subsidized their tickets). But I do love the Cuse hate - the school is so popular yet they can't get on TV in upstate NY and get bumped for the UConn women.

Example please. Or else it didnt happen.

(11-12-2013 01:19 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(11-12-2013 12:20 PM)uconnwhaler Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:00 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:19 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(11-09-2013 11:44 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  Delaney would have found all kinds of seats to sit in at UConn had he visited this weekend, as they had an almost empty stadium.

Maryland outdrew UConn in Brooklyn for hoops too last Friday. UConn Internet fans are delusional.

I heard a lot more noise from UConn fans than Maryland fans on the TV. But I wasn't in the building, so I don't know for sure.

Well we also had a football game at the exact same time and MD sold (and subsidized their tickets). But I do love the Cuse hate - the school is so popular yet they can't get on TV in upstate NY and get bumped for the UConn women.

Example please. Or else it didnt happen.

http://syracusefan.com/threads/looks-lik...yed.40752/

Here is a link to the Syracuse fans discussing this last January. Syracuse Men v. Providence tape delayed for UConn Women on SNY (which for non-Northeasterners in a NYC sports channel that has feeds into NY, CT, PA, and upstate NY).

[quote='CrazyPaco' pid='9989950' dateline='1384214036']
That depends if you consider Pitt to be in the Northeast, which it is if one is including Pennsylvania.

I know Pitt considers itself to be in the Northeast and mid-Atlantic.

[quote]

I'm no Northeast expert, and Pitt can do what Pitt wants. But in my limited travels, when you leave Philly and the rest of the Northeast megalopolis, and head over the mountains to Pittsburgh, you have definitely gone somewhere else. It reminds me of the trip from St. Louis to Kansas City. It's only 300 miles or so, and it's even in the same state. But it is damn sure not the same place.

[quote='JunkYardCard' pid='9993728' dateline='1384284298']
[quote='CrazyPaco' pid='9989950' dateline='1384214036']
That depends if you consider Pitt to be in the Northeast, which it is if one is including Pennsylvania.

I know Pitt considers itself to be in the Northeast and mid-Atlantic.

[quote]

I'm no Northeast expert, and Pitt can do what Pitt wants. But in my limited travels, when you leave Philly and the rest of the Northeast megalopolis, and head over the mountains to Pittsburgh, you have definitely gone somewhere else. It reminds me of the trip from St. Louis to Kansas City. It's only 300 miles or so, and it's even in the same state. But it is damn sure not the same place.
[/quote]

I'm not saying it isn't culturally different than Philly or the east coast megaloposis. It absolutely is. For sure, Western Pennsylvania is unique from the East Coast but it is also unique from the Midwest and South. It fits in none of those regions, but has influences of all of them, as has been documented by sociologists and demographers. It is better defined as a unique urban/northern Appalachia complete with its own language idioms. But geographically, it is part of the Northeast, particularly if one considers State College, PA northeast, because Centre County, Pennsylvania is also nothing like the East Coast or Philly either, more like the South to be honest.

The University of Pittsburgh itself looks to the northeast, primarily recruits athletes and students from the northeast, has most of its alumni located on the East Coast, and is has absolutely been more tied to the northeast and mid-Atlantic, both historically and contemporaneously. No matter, when you are talking official political or technical definitions of the terms, Pittsburgh is always placed in either the Northeast or Mid-Atlantic.

(11-12-2013 02:13 PM)uconnwhaler Wrote:  

(11-12-2013 01:19 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(11-12-2013 12:20 PM)uconnwhaler Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:00 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:19 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  Maryland outdrew UConn in Brooklyn for hoops too last Friday. UConn Internet fans are delusional.

I heard a lot more noise from UConn fans than Maryland fans on the TV. But I wasn't in the building, so I don't know for sure.

Well we also had a football game at the exact same time and MD sold (and subsidized their tickets). But I do love the Cuse hate - the school is so popular yet they can't get on TV in upstate NY and get bumped for the UConn women.

Example please. Or else it didnt happen.

http://syracusefan.com/threads/looks-lik...yed.40752/

Here is a link to the Syracuse fans discussing this last January. Syracuse Men v. Providence tape delayed for UConn Women on SNY (which for non-Northeasterners in a NYC sports channel that has feeds into NY, CT, PA, and upstate NY).

Hmm so one time it happens must be all the time? Did you know they were bumped for contractural reasons? UConn fans love spinning isolated incidents into some grande conclusion.

Cuse was in the 2nd highest rated College Basketball Game last year nationally and it beat every college football game except for the BCS Championship. I'm happy you got to see your UConn Women play live since your Men's team wasn't going anywhere in March.

http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2013/04/...t-and-nit/

Well, having travelled through PA many times, I can assure you thusly - PA is three states - eastern PA is part of the NE megalopolis, western PA is Pittsburgh a thing unto itself, middle PA is Alabama. Pitt the university is Northeastern in style and focus, not Midwestern. PSU is something else, like the City of Pittsburgh, the PSU is something akin to itself, not Midwestern, not Northeastern, sometimes not even Northern, but never Southern.

(11-12-2013 03:19 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(11-12-2013 02:13 PM)uconnwhaler Wrote:  

(11-12-2013 01:19 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(11-12-2013 12:20 PM)uconnwhaler Wrote:  

(11-11-2013 02:00 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  I heard a lot more noise from UConn fans than Maryland fans on the TV. But I wasn't in the building, so I don't know for sure.

Well we also had a football game at the exact same time and MD sold (and subsidized their tickets). But I do love the Cuse hate - the school is so popular yet they can't get on TV in upstate NY and get bumped for the UConn women.

Example please. Or else it didnt happen.

http://syracusefan.com/threads/looks-lik...yed.40752/

Here is a link to the Syracuse fans discussing this last January. Syracuse Men v. Providence tape delayed for UConn Women on SNY (which for non-Northeasterners in a NYC sports channel that has feeds into NY, CT, PA, and upstate NY).

Hmm so one time it happens must be all the time? Did you know they were bumped for contractural reasons? UConn fans love spinning isolated incidents into some grande conclusion.

Cuse was in the 2nd highest rated College Basketball Game last year nationally and it beat every college football game except for the BCS Championship. I'm happy you got to see your UConn Women play live since your Men's team wasn't going anywhere in March.

http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2013/04/...t-and-nit/

Well that is even better then. Why can't the Syracuse Men get a better contract than the UConn women in NYC?

(11-12-2013 03:23 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  Well, having travelled through PA many times, I can assure you thusly - PA is three states - eastern PA is part of the NE megalopolis, western PA is Pittsburgh a thing unto itself, middle PA is Alabama. Pitt the university is Northeastern in style and focus, not Midwestern. PSU is something else, like the City of Pittsburgh, the PSU is something akin to itself, not Midwestern, not Northeastern, sometimes not even Northern, but never Southern.

That's pretty spot on. It really could be said to be three states. Centre County is one of the places in PA where you'd most likely find a Confederate flag flying. Central PA is more Southern than Northeastern, as you said, Alabama, per James Carville. That includes Centre County and thus Penn State, which is dominated by football culture and greek social life and also includes a recent history of racial tensions.

(11-12-2013 03:29 PM)uconnwhaler Wrote:  Well that is even better then. Why can't the Syracuse Men get a better contract than the UConn women in NYC?

SU's Final 4 ratings notwithstanding (all Final 4 games gain huge ratings no matter the schools), SNY isn't anything to crow or moan about due to its sudden lack of inventory. It was already a distant 3rd in ratings to YES and MSG before the BE split. SU will be more than fine and attractive in NYC/Upstate for coverage. SNY loves UConn women due to the huge 4.0-5.0 ratings they gain in Hartford, a market they can actually grab those few times other than when YES is dominating Hartford, as well as Upstate NY.

(11-12-2013 04:02 PM)RecoveringHillbilly Wrote:  

(11-12-2013 03:29 PM)uconnwhaler Wrote:  Well that is even better then. Why can't the Syracuse Men get a better contract than the UConn women in NYC?

SU's Final 4 ratings notwithstanding (all Final 4 games gain huge ratings no matter the schools), SNY isn't anything to crow or moan about due to its sudden lack of inventory. It was already a distant 3rd in ratings to YES and MSG before the BE split. SU will be more than fine and attractive in NYC/Upstate for coverage. SNY loves UConn women due to the huge 4.0-5.0 ratings they gain in Hartford, a market they can actually grab those few times other than when YES is dominating Hartford, as well as Upstate NY.

Well stated. SU's games are now on MSG and YES and no longer on SNY, since moving to the Acc. The link you shared is very interesting as YES, in some cases, has more viewers than MSG and SNY combined.

Well, let's see. Pittsburgh finds itself in the AFC North, NL Central and NHL Metropolitan, so forgive them if they're confused.

Also, I've spent many happy hours trout fishing in Centre Co., PA, and it never seemed Southern to me. Rural yes.

(11-12-2013 04:44 PM)westwolf Wrote:  Well, let's see. Pittsburgh finds itself in the AFC North, NL Central and NHL Metropolitan, so forgive them if they're confused.

Also, I've spent many happy hours trout fishing in Centre Co., PA, and it never seemed Southern to me. Rural yes.

The Pirates are still trying to get back in the NL East. They've never liked being stuck in the Central. They consider their main rival to be the Phillies. All the Penguins rivalries are definitely in the east: Flyers, Caps. All of Pitt's rivalries are in the east. Only the Steelers "traditional" rival, Cleveland, is to the west, a product of being moved together from the NFL to the AFL at the time of the merger. Now though, probably their bigger rival is Baltimore.