(08-26-2023 11:42 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:30 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Why we be there? Money or troops?

What’s our nations interest in protecting this particular national border when we can’t and won’t protect our own?

How bout we send the next 100 Billion dollars to securing our house? We’re being invaded, anyone who can’t see that is simply blind.

Pro-Tip: this isn’t “immigration”. Stop lying

This is protecting our own. And we are doing with Ukrainian lives, instead of our troops tangling with Russians in NATO countries like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and maybe even Hungary and Poland.

Have none of y'all ever heard of Neville Chamberlin? Munich?

What is our national interest in all this? This will end up with Americans dying for a country that is as corrupt as any African warlord's turf, or maybe the better comparison is our own United States.

(08-27-2023 05:26 AM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:55 PM)BlueDragon Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 09:53 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  Ukraine has zero chance to win this war and the end result will be America troops on the ground dying to fight for one of the most corrupt "democracies" on the globe.

Hopefully NOT. But, this is our war by proxy. As much as I don’t agree with it I still hope Ukraine does enough damage to Russian military capabilities that it will take them decades to recover. That would be the real win.

It’s not like they are batting the German Blitzkrieg.

It already has hit them that hard...

I dont want to add us to the list of "take a decade to recover"

I have no interest at all in continuing to send American money. We have hurt Russia. Russia has been completely exposed. It is well past time for us to turn our sights back to our own country and let Ukraine sink or swim on their own.

(08-26-2023 11:42 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:30 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Why we be there? Money or troops?

What’s our nations interest in protecting this particular national border when we can’t and won’t protect our own?

How bout we send the next 100 Billion dollars to securing our house? We’re being invaded, anyone who can’t see that is simply blind.

Pro-Tip: this isn’t “immigration”. Stop lying

This is protecting our own. And we are doing with Ukrainian lives, instead of our troops tangling with Russians in NATO countries like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and maybe even Hungary and Poland.

Have none of y'all ever heard of Neville Chamberlin? Munich?

I mean one could argue the opposite. Vietnam seems a more appropriate analogy. "If we don't contain them in Vietnam then they'll be a domino effect throughout southeast asia"

Ukraine is losing and will lose this war. It comes down to materials and population. Russia has the advantage. Even US officials are leaking to the media that Ukraien can't win and needs to negotiate.

(08-26-2023 11:42 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:30 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Why we be there? Money or troops?

What’s our nations interest in protecting this particular national border when we can’t and won’t protect our own?

How bout we send the next 100 Billion dollars to securing our house? We’re being invaded, anyone who can’t see that is simply blind.

Pro-Tip: this isn’t “immigration”. Stop lying

This is protecting our own. And we are doing with Ukrainian lives, instead of our troops tangling with Russians in NATO countries like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and maybe even Hungary and Poland.

Have none of y'all ever heard of Neville Chamberlin? Munich?

Putin is struggling badly to even hold a few provinces in Ukraine but now he is going to conquer eastern Europe?

You guys are totally clueless to how contradictory and stupid all this sounds. Ukraine is clearly going to lose but at this rate it would take Putin 300 years to conquer the eastern bloc.

Every war under the sun is Neville Chamberlain and Munich and WW2 all over again of we don't agree to it.

GRADE A BS and its obvious at this point.

(08-27-2023 06:24 AM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:42 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:30 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Why we be there? Money or troops?

What’s our nations interest in protecting this particular national border when we can’t and won’t protect our own?

How bout we send the next 100 Billion dollars to securing our house? We’re being invaded, anyone who can’t see that is simply blind.

Pro-Tip: this isn’t “immigration”. Stop lying

This is protecting our own. And we are doing with Ukrainian lives, instead of our troops tangling with Russians in NATO countries like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and maybe even Hungary and Poland.

Have none of y'all ever heard of Neville Chamberlin? Munich?

I mean one could argue the opposite. Vietnam seems a more appropriate analogy. "If we don't contain them in Vietnam then they'll be a domino effect throughout southeast asia"

Ukraine is losing and will lose this war. It comes down to materials and population. Russia has the advantage. Even US officials are leaking to the media that Ukraien can't win and needs to negotiate.

I was going to offer up Vietnam as a comparison. Another war we in which we have no business being involved.

(08-27-2023 06:46 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 06:24 AM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:42 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:30 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Why we be there? Money or troops?

What’s our nations interest in protecting this particular national border when we can’t and won’t protect our own?

How bout we send the next 100 Billion dollars to securing our house? We’re being invaded, anyone who can’t see that is simply blind.

Pro-Tip: this isn’t “immigration”. Stop lying

This is protecting our own. And we are doing with Ukrainian lives, instead of our troops tangling with Russians in NATO countries like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and maybe even Hungary and Poland.

Have none of y'all ever heard of Neville Chamberlin? Munich?

I mean one could argue the opposite. Vietnam seems a more appropriate analogy. "If we don't contain them in Vietnam then they'll be a domino effect throughout southeast asia"

Ukraine is losing and will lose this war. It comes down to materials and population. Russia has the advantage. Even US officials are leaking to the media that Ukraien can't win and needs to negotiate.

I was going to offer up Vietnam as a comparison. Another war we in which we have no business being involved.

Exactly. I think what a lot of guys on here are missing IS OUR DC GOVERNMENT HAS MADE THIS OUR WAR BY PROXY.

We are already at war with Russia. We are the puppeteers of Ukraine. If you want to disagree with that then by all means clarify. To simply say this is not our war and stop sending money in naive at best.

The Puppeteers like Vietnam NEVER showed any interest in winning. The very same thing is being played here. It’s blood money only this time it’s not our blood.

It is about the money. The Puppeteers never knew the Russian Army was third world so initially they were hesitant. But now, they see how incompetent they are so they can play this game and make money at the taxpayers expense period.

They DONT CARE ABOUT WINNING they proved that in Vietnam-and Korea. Get real.

If we have proven anything since WW2 it is our blood sucking leaches called politicians only want to make money off wars not win them.

Stone wall Jackson said it best.

War means fighting. The business of the soldier is to fight. Armies are not called out to dig trenches, to throw up breastworks, to live in camps, but to find the enemy and strike him; to invade his country, and do him all possible damage in the shortest possible time. This will involve great destruction of life and property while it lasts; but such a war will of necessity be of brief continuance, and so would be an economy of life and property in the end.

We don’t follow this simple advice or we would’ve already thrown everything at Russia. But, this would also mean the Greedy wouldn’t get theirs as well.

The Ukrainian Air Force and Zelensky announced the death of 3 pilots when their training flights crashed into each other.

Remember the Ghost of Kiev? The group that shot down 400 Russian planes with only 2 light side arms and a few discarded shells they found, and then reloaded themselves while watching reruns of Servant of the People and humming the Ukrainian anthem? Yeah, he was one of them.

He was the imaginary Ghost of Kiev who became the fictitious Toast of Kiev. Now he’s the Burnt Toast of Kiev.

Word is Ukraine will be auctioning off blades of grass with his actual blood drippings to raise money for F16 lessons. Just kidding. They don’t actually pay for anything.

Bring on the F16’s!

https://nypost.com/2023/08/27/andriy-jui...jet-crash/

So it will all be over in a week, right? No?? Need another trillion billion dollars? OK, here ya go !!!

(08-27-2023 06:05 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:42 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:30 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Why we be there? Money or troops?

What’s our nations interest in protecting this particular national border when we can’t and won’t protect our own?

How bout we send the next 100 Billion dollars to securing our house? We’re being invaded, anyone who can’t see that is simply blind.

Pro-Tip: this isn’t “immigration”. Stop lying

This is protecting our own. And we are doing with Ukrainian lives, instead of our troops tangling with Russians in NATO countries like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and maybe even Hungary and Poland.

Have none of y'all ever heard of Neville Chamberlin? Munich?

What is our national interest in all this? This will end up with Americans dying for a country that is as corrupt as any African warlord's turf, or maybe the better comparison is our own United States.

Omg havent you heard

Zelinsky is literally churchill.

FFS.

Slavitards

Saliva Urine, or whatever they say over there…

(08-27-2023 09:05 AM)shere khan Wrote:  Omg havent you heard

Zelinsky is literally churchill.

Today's mic drop moment.

I take it your all's position is that you are okay with Russia (that is Putin) grabbing Ukraine by force?

A simple yes or no is all that is needed.

(08-27-2023 09:54 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  I take it your all's position is that you are okay with Russia grabbing Ukraine by force?

A simple yes or no is all that is needed.

Well what do you mean by ok?

I don't agree with it, but I'm not willing to drop a trillion dollars and spill a lot of America blood over it. Nor am I willing to go to WW3 or risk a nuclear war over it. Nations have risen and fallen since man has existed and Ukraine is one of the most corrupt and fake "democracies" in the world.

(08-27-2023 10:09 AM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 09:54 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  I take it your all's position is that you are okay with Russia grabbing Ukraine by force?

A simple yes or no is all that is needed.

Well what do you mean by ok?

I don't agree with it, but I'm not willing to drop a trillion dollars and spill a lot of America blood over it. Nor am I willing to go to WW3 or risk a nuclear war over it. Nations have risen and fallen since man has existed and Ukraine is one of the most corrupt and fake "democracies" in the world.

So you are okay with the takeover by force. You are willing to stand by the sidelines and let it happen with zero response. Sounds fun.

How about Lithuania?

(quick second and third question --- how much American blood has been spilled in Ukraine? Has WW3 started? I cant find a mention of that issue of WW3 being an ogoing issue anywhere. Just trying to separate rhetoric from fact, here....)

(08-27-2023 10:19 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 10:09 AM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 09:54 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  I take it your all's position is that you are okay with Russia grabbing Ukraine by force?

A simple yes or no is all that is needed.

Well what do you mean by ok?

I don't agree with it, but I'm not willing to drop a trillion dollars and spill a lot of America blood over it. Nor am I willing to go to WW3 or risk a nuclear war over it. Nations have risen and fallen since man has existed and Ukraine is one of the most corrupt and fake "democracies" in the world.

So you are okay with the takeover by force. You are willing to stand by the sidelines and let it happen with zero response. Sounds fun.

How about Lithuania?

(quick second and third question --- how much American blood has been spilled in Ukraine? Has WW3 started? I cant find a mention of that issue of WW3 being an ogoing issue anywhere. Just trying to separate rhetoric from fact, here....)

Get real tanq, that is the excuse for every war hawk in America. Go to war with Russia here or we will end up in WW3 because Putin (who is struggling bad to even hold a few provinces) will then conquer the entire eastern bloc.

Your post is a crock and you know it, there are multiple things we could do because engage in a full on war with a nuclear superpower.

You can throw out a thousandth wild fantasy hypotheticals, its not going to convince me we need to risk an all out war with a nuclear superpower just to prop up one of the most corrupt governments in the world.

They could negotiate a cease fire right now and still keep most of Ukraine, but too many powerful people in Washington want a forever war here.

(08-27-2023 01:38 AM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:40 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:27 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:24 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 09:53 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  Ukraine has zero chance to win this war and the end result will be America troops on the ground dying to fight for one of the most corrupt "democracies" on the globe.

You must listen to that idiot Col. MacGregor.

You must listen to that idiot Biden, the deep state MIC and the MSM.

No, I'm not like the Democrats and far right Republicans who manage to believe all kinds of ridiculous propaganda. I didn't realize the far right was as blind as the Russian conspiracy, fine KKKers, bad dead soldiers, wing of the Democrats. I've been very disappointed how easily they swallow ridiculous Russian propaganda.

And then y'all say things as NPC as the dumbest Democrat with the bolded above.

All you are doing is showing you hypocrisy here, because all I did was respond to you the same way you respond to me.

Putin is not going to back down, he can't now. IMO they cannot win unless we send in our troops and then we have world war on our hands. For what? One of the most corrupt and fake democracies on the planet? No thanks.

Its not our war, it not our land, its not our people, its not our responsibility. And its sure as hell is not word a world war. That is total insanity.

Not at all. I said you must listen to that idiot MacGregor who says stuff like this. And he has been wrong on every single thing. If you listen only to the Russian milibloggers you still would have a better idea of what was going on than someone who listens to MacGregor. I was giving you credit that you weren't just totally making stuff up, but were listening to bad sources. Your response was total NPC. Same response no matter who says something.

(08-27-2023 10:27 AM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 10:19 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 10:09 AM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 09:54 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  I take it your all's position is that you are okay with Russia grabbing Ukraine by force?

A simple yes or no is all that is needed.

Well what do you mean by ok?

I don't agree with it, but I'm not willing to drop a trillion dollars and spill a lot of America blood over it. Nor am I willing to go to WW3 or risk a nuclear war over it. Nations have risen and fallen since man has existed and Ukraine is one of the most corrupt and fake "democracies" in the world.

So you are okay with the takeover by force. You are willing to stand by the sidelines and let it happen with zero response. Sounds fun.

How about Lithuania?

(quick second and third question --- how much American blood has been spilled in Ukraine? Has WW3 started? I cant find a mention of that issue of WW3 being an ogoing issue anywhere. Just trying to separate rhetoric from fact, here....)

Get real tanq, that is the excuse for every war hawk in America. Go to war with Russia here or we will end up in WW3 because Putin (who is struggling bad to even hold a few provinces) will then conquer the entire eastern bloc.

Your post is a crock and you know it, there are multiple things we could do because engage in a full on war with a nuclear superpower.

You can throw out a thousandth wild fantasy hypotheticals, its not going to convince me we need to risk an all out war with a nuclear superpower just to prop up one of the most corrupt governments in the world.

They could negotiate a cease fire right now and still keep most of Ukraine, but too many powerful people in Washington want a forever war here.

Tanq, hot air with NO SUBSTANCE???? That’s really hard to believe. He tends to try to apply his legal philosophy into other areas where it whiffs more times than not.

All in all the points he makes are just more sounding boards of what the talking heads want you to believe.

Follow the money trail to understand Ukraine. It has nothing to do with some moral obligation feel good obsession.

But hey whatever floats your boat. For DC it’s business as usual.

(08-27-2023 06:05 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:42 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:30 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Why we be there? Money or troops?

What’s our nations interest in protecting this particular national border when we can’t and won’t protect our own?

How bout we send the next 100 Billion dollars to securing our house? We’re being invaded, anyone who can’t see that is simply blind.

Pro-Tip: this isn’t “immigration”. Stop lying

This is protecting our own. And we are doing with Ukrainian lives, instead of our troops tangling with Russians in NATO countries like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and maybe even Hungary and Poland.

Have none of y'all ever heard of Neville Chamberlin? Munich?

What is our national interest in all this? This will end up with Americans dying for a country that is as corrupt as any African warlord's turf, or maybe the better comparison is our own United States.

Not capable of reading before responding? Did you even read the first paragraph?

(08-27-2023 10:27 AM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 10:19 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 10:09 AM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(08-27-2023 09:54 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  I take it your all's position is that you are okay with Russia grabbing Ukraine by force?

A simple yes or no is all that is needed.

Well what do you mean by ok?

I don't agree with it, but I'm not willing to drop a trillion dollars and spill a lot of America blood over it. Nor am I willing to go to WW3 or risk a nuclear war over it. Nations have risen and fallen since man has existed and Ukraine is one of the most corrupt and fake "democracies" in the world.

So you are okay with the takeover by force. You are willing to stand by the sidelines and let it happen with zero response. Sounds fun.

How about Lithuania?

(quick second and third question --- how much American blood has been spilled in Ukraine? Has WW3 started? I cant find a mention of that issue of WW3 being an ogoing issue anywhere. Just trying to separate rhetoric from fact, here....)

Get real tanq, that is the excuse for every war hawk in America. Go to war with Russia here or we will end up in WW3 because Putin (who is struggling bad to even hold a few provinces) will then conquer the entire eastern bloc.

All I have done is ask you questions, which you run away from.

Quote:Your post is a crock and you know it, there are multiple things we could do because engage in a full on war with a nuclear superpower.

I am not sure what you are saying here.

Quote:You can throw out a thousandth wild fantasy hypotheticals, its not going to convince me we need to risk an all out war with a nuclear superpower just to prop up one of the most corrupt governments in the world.

Many say that Taiwan is a horribly corrupt government. Bury our heads in the sand over that one as well?

Eric, I am asking *you* where *your* fuzzy as **** line is. All you can say is 'not Ukraine'.

How about Turkey?

Quote:They could negotiate a cease fire right now and still keep most of Ukraine, but too many powerful people in Washington want a forever war here.

Proof of this vast conspiracy you speak of here? I would love to see it.

My position is that Russia under Putin has to be shown a line where armed aggression cannot and will not be tolerated in empire building. I dont see another one short of the Baltic republics and/or Poland.

In this instance, that line is very definitely being thrown down. With the added benefit that Article 5 is not being invoked. Seems to be a win/win/win here. Russia under Putin is being shown a hard limit. It doesnt involve NATO. It in fact strengthens NATO. And it is bleeding Putin dry.

No US combat personnel (notwithstanding your rhetorical cry), and I still dont see the immediate or near use of any Russian nukes.

That is one rationale why Ukraine has to curbed by not striking Russia proper with too much force.

I dont see a downside. With the added long term benefits of: a) being a stark message to China about Taiwan; and b) hopefully in the medium term, this weakens Putin's hold on the apparatus that the folks there will put a bullet into his head to stop this ****, thus removing hi8m from the table.

Cant wait to see the details on this vast cabal and conspiracy you set forth above. I will guess right now that there will be little to no detail on this, beyond you jumping up and down and yelling about it.

Cant wait to see your rational explanation on 'what line' you are prepared to stand for re: which countries are okay/ not okay for further issues. As opposed to you simply evading the issue.

(08-26-2023 11:42 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-26-2023 11:30 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  Why we be there? Money or troops?

What’s our nations interest in protecting this particular national border when we can’t and won’t protect our own?

How bout we send the next 100 Billion dollars to securing our house? We’re being invaded, anyone who can’t see that is simply blind.

Pro-Tip: this isn’t “immigration”. Stop lying

This is protecting our own. And we are doing with Ukrainian lives, instead of our troops tangling with Russians in NATO countries like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and maybe even Hungary and Poland.

Have none of y'all ever heard of Neville Chamberlin? Munich?

Chamberlin looks like a genius and patriot compared to bobblehead Joe! Joe not only takes money from our enemies but sees no danger in anything. It's not even, "Peace in our time!", but rather "10% is mine!" This is why people doubt foreign policy which was just once accepted because whether a Democrat or Republican we knew they had a good reason for being there. Now with all of the Globalist agenda intermingling with our legislation and impacting our foreign policy so they can trade and profit with our enemies, the public has lost trust. And that's a reason for which I must understand their reticence.

I'm with you on this 100% but the public has lost faith in the motives and mission of our country and have great reason for it. And this goes back past even Afghanistan and Bengasi to the Gulf War where expensive cruise missiles were used so that they could be guided away from American and Allied corporate offices. Now that doesn't sound too bad until people learned that enemy forces hid in those buildings because they knew wouldn't take them out and devalue property held by our Fortune 500 companies. The American death toll would have been a lot less if we had just bombed it all. Having ground troops go door to door and floor to floor in urban settings got a lot of our guys killed, and for what? A quarterly statement!