(06-14-2015 12:02 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  You have your head buried in the sand and refuse to even recognize factual information. I'm sorry if the facts don't support your position but they just don't.

You have a hard time reconciling that facts do not support the result you say they do.

You say premiums were going up prior to Obamacare, and they are going up now. The problem is that the premiums we are paying now arent paying for the same coverage they did before. If premiums are rising now, Oblundersh*t is a catastrophic failure of what it was announced to be, which was a reduction in premiums. Not only did it not reduce the premiums for the coverages we used to have, its not reducing the premium for crappy coverages we are currently stuck with.

You still havent been able to talk about co-pays without deductibles versus copays after deductibles. You know, that thing that so negatively impacts OOP costs.

You tout sign up numbers, but not a peep when the government gets busted over-counting people (twice last year alone). You were also fooled into believing signup numbers meant people with coverage (it didnt) and that those people would be covered for the entire year (they werent). Your numbers also mis-lead by counting people forced onto the exchange who previously had insurance as if that means the exchange is successful.

You touted the fact that your Obamacare policy had really helped your family, until the numbers you were throwing out didnt match any Obamacare plan on the market. You were then told that the reason yor specific coverage was so good is because you were either running under an exempted plan, or a grandfathered one. You denied that for weeks until you checked for yourself. Whoops, you have a grandfathered plan. Whose head was in the sand again?

You have also been woefully silent on the state run exchanges which hav ebeen an unmitigated disaster. Did yo upost about any of the state exchanges that folded up? No you didnt. Did you post about the state exchanges wasting billions of dollars? No you didnt. Again, real facts. But you dont like those facts.

You have also continuously blamed republican states for not expanding medicaid, yet been silent on those states that did it who are now struggling with how to pay for it.

You have touted that signups were ahead of schedule, only to be spouting whitehouse talking points while ignoring the CBO original estimates where we are behind. You are quick to put forward inflated, bloated, and manipulated numbers, and silent when the real numbers come out.

You tout people being forced off the insurance they liked, and giving up the doctors they liked, and being forced onto the exchange as some sort of success story.

I'm not exactly sure why you believe you need to be the mouthpiece for this piece of sh* law. Whats in it for you? You have the same f*cking policy you did prior to Obamacare, so whats so great about it now?

In any event, if you want to come off as someone who is only interested in the facts, then start reporting the facts. All of them.

Otherwise, just admit that you are who Gruber said you were.

(06-14-2015 02:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 12:02 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  You have your head buried in the sand and refuse to even recognize factual information. I'm sorry if the facts don't support your position but they just don't.

You have a hard time reconciling that facts do not support the result you say they do.

You say premiums were going up prior to Obamacare, and they are going up now. The problem is that the premiums we are paying now arent paying for the same coverage they did before. If premiums are rising now, Oblundersh*t is a catastrophic failure of what it was announced to be, which was a reduction in premiums. Not only did it not reduce the premiums for the coverages we used to have, its not reducing the premium for crappy coverages we are currently stuck with.

You still havent been able to talk about co-pays without deductibles versus copays after deductibles. You know, that thing that so negatively impacts OOP costs.

You tout sign up numbers, but not a peep when the government gets busted over-counting people (twice last year alone). You were also fooled into believing signup numbers meant people with coverage (it didnt) and that those people would be covered for the entire year (they werent). Your numbers also mis-lead by counting people forced onto the exchange who previously had insurance as if that means the exchange is successful.

You touted the fact that your Obamacare policy had really helped your family, until the numbers you were throwing out didnt match any Obamacare plan on the market. You were then told that the reason yor specific coverage was so good is because you were either running under an exempted plan, or a grandfathered one. You denied that for weeks until you checked for yourself. Whoops, you have a grandfathered plan. Whose head was in the sand again?

You have also been woefully silent on the state run exchanges which hav ebeen an unmitigated disaster. Did yo upost about any of the state exchanges that folded up? No you didnt. Did you post about the state exchanges wasting billions of dollars? No you didnt. Again, real facts. But you dont like those facts.

You have also continuously blamed republican states for not expanding medicaid, yet been silent on those states that did it who are now struggling with how to pay for it.

You have touted that signups were ahead of schedule, only to be spouting whitehouse talking points while ignoring the CBO original estimates where we are behind. You are quick to put forward inflated, bloated, and manipulated numbers, and silent when the real numbers come out.

You tout people being forced off the insurance they liked, and giving up the doctors they liked, and being forced onto the exchange as some sort of success story.

I'm not exactly sure why you believe you need to be the mouthpiece for this piece of sh* law. Whats in it for you? You have the same f*cking policy you did prior to Obamacare, so whats so great about it now?

In any event, if you want to come off as someone who is only interested in the facts, then start reporting the facts. All of them.

Otherwise, just admit that you are who Gruber said you were.

It is unbelievable how much misinformation you just typed! If you don't like your employer provided policy, blaming the ACA is blaming the wrong people. It is your employer! There haven't been any provisions of the ACA that even affect you yet. The OOP maximum doesn't take affect until 2016. Your employer decides what plan they are going to purchase, what it will cover, and how large a share of the cost you are going to provide. Why is that so hard to understand?

(06-14-2015 12:04 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  I'll simply stand by what I have said.

I'll stand by it as well

Quote:You have your head buried in the sand and refuse to even recognize factual information. I'm sorry if the facts don't support your position but they just don't.

(06-14-2015 03:07 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 02:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 12:02 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  You have your head buried in the sand and refuse to even recognize factual information. I'm sorry if the facts don't support your position but they just don't.

You have a hard time reconciling that facts do not support the result you say they do.

You say premiums were going up prior to Obamacare, and they are going up now. The problem is that the premiums we are paying now arent paying for the same coverage they did before. If premiums are rising now, Oblundersh*t is a catastrophic failure of what it was announced to be, which was a reduction in premiums. Not only did it not reduce the premiums for the coverages we used to have, its not reducing the premium for crappy coverages we are currently stuck with.

You still havent been able to talk about co-pays without deductibles versus copays after deductibles. You know, that thing that so negatively impacts OOP costs.

You tout sign up numbers, but not a peep when the government gets busted over-counting people (twice last year alone). You were also fooled into believing signup numbers meant people with coverage (it didnt) and that those people would be covered for the entire year (they werent). Your numbers also mis-lead by counting people forced onto the exchange who previously had insurance as if that means the exchange is successful.

You touted the fact that your Obamacare policy had really helped your family, until the numbers you were throwing out didnt match any Obamacare plan on the market. You were then told that the reason yor specific coverage was so good is because you were either running under an exempted plan, or a grandfathered one. You denied that for weeks until you checked for yourself. Whoops, you have a grandfathered plan. Whose head was in the sand again?

You have also been woefully silent on the state run exchanges which hav ebeen an unmitigated disaster. Did yo upost about any of the state exchanges that folded up? No you didnt. Did you post about the state exchanges wasting billions of dollars? No you didnt. Again, real facts. But you dont like those facts.

You have also continuously blamed republican states for not expanding medicaid, yet been silent on those states that did it who are now struggling with how to pay for it.

You have touted that signups were ahead of schedule, only to be spouting whitehouse talking points while ignoring the CBO original estimates where we are behind. You are quick to put forward inflated, bloated, and manipulated numbers, and silent when the real numbers come out.

You tout people being forced off the insurance they liked, and giving up the doctors they liked, and being forced onto the exchange as some sort of success story.

I'm not exactly sure why you believe you need to be the mouthpiece for this piece of sh* law. Whats in it for you? You have the same f*cking policy you did prior to Obamacare, so whats so great about it now?

In any event, if you want to come off as someone who is only interested in the facts, then start reporting the facts. All of them.

Otherwise, just admit that you are who Gruber said you were.

It is unbelievable how much misinformation you just typed! If you don't like your employer provided policy, blaming the ACA is blaming the wrong people. It is your employer! There haven't been any provisions of the ACA that even affect you yet. The OOP maximum doesn't take affect until 2016. Your employer decides what plan they are going to purchase, what it will cover, and how large a share of the cost you are going to provide. Why is that so hard to understand?

Really? point to the MISINFORMATION. If yo udo so correctly, you should jab yourself squarely in the eye.

Guess what, captain clueless. My employer CANT CHANGFE TO A BETTER POLICY because we are strapped to what Oblunershit says we are allowed to have.

You have a better policy, because yours is grandfathered.

I cant wait to hear the butthurt coming out of your mouth if your employer has to ever give that grandfathered plan up.

You see, you have been touting nothing but misinformation. You talk about how great oblundershit is for you, but you dont have an oblundershit policy. You want to blame the people who have restrictions and mandates placed on them, but dont blame the dumbasses who created the mandates and restrictions.

It is pure unadultered sh*t.

(06-14-2015 04:04 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 03:07 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 02:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 12:02 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  You have your head buried in the sand and refuse to even recognize factual information. I'm sorry if the facts don't support your position but they just don't.

You have a hard time reconciling that facts do not support the result you say they do.

You say premiums were going up prior to Obamacare, and they are going up now. The problem is that the premiums we are paying now arent paying for the same coverage they did before. If premiums are rising now, Oblundersh*t is a catastrophic failure of what it was announced to be, which was a reduction in premiums. Not only did it not reduce the premiums for the coverages we used to have, its not reducing the premium for crappy coverages we are currently stuck with.

You still havent been able to talk about co-pays without deductibles versus copays after deductibles. You know, that thing that so negatively impacts OOP costs.

You tout sign up numbers, but not a peep when the government gets busted over-counting people (twice last year alone). You were also fooled into believing signup numbers meant people with coverage (it didnt) and that those people would be covered for the entire year (they werent). Your numbers also mis-lead by counting people forced onto the exchange who previously had insurance as if that means the exchange is successful.

You touted the fact that your Obamacare policy had really helped your family, until the numbers you were throwing out didnt match any Obamacare plan on the market. You were then told that the reason yor specific coverage was so good is because you were either running under an exempted plan, or a grandfathered one. You denied that for weeks until you checked for yourself. Whoops, you have a grandfathered plan. Whose head was in the sand again?

You have also been woefully silent on the state run exchanges which hav ebeen an unmitigated disaster. Did yo upost about any of the state exchanges that folded up? No you didnt. Did you post about the state exchanges wasting billions of dollars? No you didnt. Again, real facts. But you dont like those facts.

You have also continuously blamed republican states for not expanding medicaid, yet been silent on those states that did it who are now struggling with how to pay for it.

You have touted that signups were ahead of schedule, only to be spouting whitehouse talking points while ignoring the CBO original estimates where we are behind. You are quick to put forward inflated, bloated, and manipulated numbers, and silent when the real numbers come out.

You tout people being forced off the insurance they liked, and giving up the doctors they liked, and being forced onto the exchange as some sort of success story.

I'm not exactly sure why you believe you need to be the mouthpiece for this piece of sh* law. Whats in it for you? You have the same f*cking policy you did prior to Obamacare, so whats so great about it now?

In any event, if you want to come off as someone who is only interested in the facts, then start reporting the facts. All of them.

Otherwise, just admit that you are who Gruber said you were.

It is unbelievable how much misinformation you just typed! If you don't like your employer provided policy, blaming the ACA is blaming the wrong people. It is your employer! There haven't been any provisions of the ACA that even affect you yet. The OOP maximum doesn't take affect until 2016. Your employer decides what plan they are going to purchase, what it will cover, and how large a share of the cost you are going to provide. Why is that so hard to understand?

Really? point to the MISINFORMATION. If yo udo so correctly, you should jab yourself squarely in the eye.

Guess what, captain clueless. My employer CANT CHANGFE TO A BETTER POLICY because we are strapped to what Oblunershit says we are allowed to have.

You have a better policy, because yours is grandfathered.

I cant wait to hear the butthurt coming out of your mouth if your employer has to ever give that grandfathered plan up.

You see, you have been touting nothing but misinformation. You talk about how great oblundershit is for you, but you dont have an oblundershit policy. You want to blame the people who have restrictions and mandates placed on them, but dont blame the dumbasses who created the mandates and restrictions.

It is pure unadultered sh*t.

Your employer doesn't even have to offer minimum essential coverage. But if they don't now and/or didn't before the ACA then it was a very crappy plan they offered. Nothing in the ACA prevents your employer from offering more than the minimum!

As far as my group policy goes, it isn't anything to brag about. It conformed to the MEC prior to the enactment so being grandfathered doesn't really mean anything. I've got $15 PCP visits, $70 specialists, $700 individual deductible, and $3,210 individual co payment. It is an 80/20 split that I pay a premium for. If I took the default 70/30 I wouldn't be responsible for any of the premium. If I had family coverage I would pay the full premium for everyone but myself.

Here is how much large employers were affected by the ACA in 2014.

Quote:Do I have to make changes to my benefits or how they are offered?
Four items in particular will be new to employee benefits in the large group market in 2014 and beyond.

New out-of-pocket maximum imposed
At renewal in 2014, out-of-pocket maximums cannot exceed the limits established annually by the federal government for high-deductible health plans. In 2014, these limits are $6,350 for single coverage and $12,700 for family coverage. In 2015, these amounts are $6,600/single and $13,200/family.

Waiting periods
Group health plans cannot impose a waiting period that exceeds 90 days. The calculation of the 90-day waiting period begins upon the date that an employee becomes eligible to participate in the plan. Employers can set eligiblity conditions for benefits. These may include achieving job-related licensure or certification, completing a specific number of hours (not to exceed 1,200) or completion of an orientation period (not to exceed 30 days).

Plans don’t have to offer coverage to all groups of employees (part-time, etc.), but when it is offered, the waiting period rule applies.

This provision is effective for plan years beginning on or after January 1, 2014. It is not effective for all groups January 1, but will be effective as groups renew. Grandfathered groups must also adhere to this rule.

Auto-enrollment in benefits
Employers with 200 or more employees must auto-enroll their eligible employees in health benefits. The employees can disenroll but the onus is on the employee to do so. Regulation is still pending on this requirement.

Discrimination rules
Nondiscrimination rules will be established to ensure benefits don’t favor the highly compensated employees. Under similar rules in place in the self-funded market, employers cannot offer better or richer benefits to their highly compensated staff. Final regulation is still pending on this requirement. Grandfathered groups are exempt from this rule. Read more.

Mythbusting: Reforms that don’t apply to the large group market
There are many reforms coming to the employer-sponsored insurance marketplace in 2014. There are a few items that you may have heard about that don’t apply to employers with 50 or more full-time (and equivalent) employees.

Large employers do not have to change their plan to follow the essential health benefits requirements.
Health plans sold in the large group market do not have to fit within a metal tier (bronze, silver, gold, platinum) as they do in the small group market.

http://www.understandinghealthreform.com...-benefits/

(06-14-2015 05:43 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 04:04 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 03:07 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 02:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 12:02 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  You have your head buried in the sand and refuse to even recognize factual information. I'm sorry if the facts don't support your position but they just don't.

You have a hard time reconciling that facts do not support the result you say they do.

You say premiums were going up prior to Obamacare, and they are going up now. The problem is that the premiums we are paying now arent paying for the same coverage they did before. If premiums are rising now, Oblundersh*t is a catastrophic failure of what it was announced to be, which was a reduction in premiums. Not only did it not reduce the premiums for the coverages we used to have, its not reducing the premium for crappy coverages we are currently stuck with.

You still havent been able to talk about co-pays without deductibles versus copays after deductibles. You know, that thing that so negatively impacts OOP costs.

You tout sign up numbers, but not a peep when the government gets busted over-counting people (twice last year alone). You were also fooled into believing signup numbers meant people with coverage (it didnt) and that those people would be covered for the entire year (they werent). Your numbers also mis-lead by counting people forced onto the exchange who previously had insurance as if that means the exchange is successful.

You touted the fact that your Obamacare policy had really helped your family, until the numbers you were throwing out didnt match any Obamacare plan on the market. You were then told that the reason yor specific coverage was so good is because you were either running under an exempted plan, or a grandfathered one. You denied that for weeks until you checked for yourself. Whoops, you have a grandfathered plan. Whose head was in the sand again?

You have also been woefully silent on the state run exchanges which hav ebeen an unmitigated disaster. Did yo upost about any of the state exchanges that folded up? No you didnt. Did you post about the state exchanges wasting billions of dollars? No you didnt. Again, real facts. But you dont like those facts.

You have also continuously blamed republican states for not expanding medicaid, yet been silent on those states that did it who are now struggling with how to pay for it.

You have touted that signups were ahead of schedule, only to be spouting whitehouse talking points while ignoring the CBO original estimates where we are behind. You are quick to put forward inflated, bloated, and manipulated numbers, and silent when the real numbers come out.

You tout people being forced off the insurance they liked, and giving up the doctors they liked, and being forced onto the exchange as some sort of success story.

I'm not exactly sure why you believe you need to be the mouthpiece for this piece of sh* law. Whats in it for you? You have the same f*cking policy you did prior to Obamacare, so whats so great about it now?

In any event, if you want to come off as someone who is only interested in the facts, then start reporting the facts. All of them.

Otherwise, just admit that you are who Gruber said you were.

It is unbelievable how much misinformation you just typed! If you don't like your employer provided policy, blaming the ACA is blaming the wrong people. It is your employer! There haven't been any provisions of the ACA that even affect you yet. The OOP maximum doesn't take affect until 2016. Your employer decides what plan they are going to purchase, what it will cover, and how large a share of the cost you are going to provide. Why is that so hard to understand?

Really? point to the MISINFORMATION. If yo udo so correctly, you should jab yourself squarely in the eye.

Guess what, captain clueless. My employer CANT CHANGFE TO A BETTER POLICY because we are strapped to what Oblunershit says we are allowed to have.

You have a better policy, because yours is grandfathered.

I cant wait to hear the butthurt coming out of your mouth if your employer has to ever give that grandfathered plan up.

You see, you have been touting nothing but misinformation. You talk about how great oblundershit is for you, but you dont have an oblundershit policy. You want to blame the people who have restrictions and mandates placed on them, but dont blame the dumbasses who created the mandates and restrictions.

It is pure unadultered sh*t.

Your employer doesn't even have to offer minimum essential coverage. But if they don't now and/or didn't before the ACA then it was a very crappy plan they offered. Nothing in the ACA prevents your employer from offering more than the minimum!

As far as my group policy goes, it isn't anything to brag about. It conformed to the MEC prior to the enactment so being grandfathered doesn't really mean anything. I've got $15 PCP visits, $70 specialists, $700 individual deductible, and $3,210 individual co payment. It is an 80/20 split that I pay a premium for. If I took the default 70/30 I wouldn't be responsible for any of the premium. If I had family coverage I would pay the full premium for everyone but myself.

Stop talking out of your ass. You didnt have any idea you were on a grandfathered plan, and you are trying to tell me exactly what my employer is going through?

And if you think your plan isnt that great, just wait until you have to get on a real oblundershit plan.

(06-14-2015 06:49 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 05:43 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 04:04 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 03:07 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 02:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  You have a hard time reconciling that facts do not support the result you say they do.

You say premiums were going up prior to Obamacare, and they are going up now. The problem is that the premiums we are paying now arent paying for the same coverage they did before. If premiums are rising now, Oblundersh*t is a catastrophic failure of what it was announced to be, which was a reduction in premiums. Not only did it not reduce the premiums for the coverages we used to have, its not reducing the premium for crappy coverages we are currently stuck with.

You still havent been able to talk about co-pays without deductibles versus copays after deductibles. You know, that thing that so negatively impacts OOP costs.

You tout sign up numbers, but not a peep when the government gets busted over-counting people (twice last year alone). You were also fooled into believing signup numbers meant people with coverage (it didnt) and that those people would be covered for the entire year (they werent). Your numbers also mis-lead by counting people forced onto the exchange who previously had insurance as if that means the exchange is successful.

You touted the fact that your Obamacare policy had really helped your family, until the numbers you were throwing out didnt match any Obamacare plan on the market. You were then told that the reason yor specific coverage was so good is because you were either running under an exempted plan, or a grandfathered one. You denied that for weeks until you checked for yourself. Whoops, you have a grandfathered plan. Whose head was in the sand again?

You have also been woefully silent on the state run exchanges which hav ebeen an unmitigated disaster. Did yo upost about any of the state exchanges that folded up? No you didnt. Did you post about the state exchanges wasting billions of dollars? No you didnt. Again, real facts. But you dont like those facts.

You have also continuously blamed republican states for not expanding medicaid, yet been silent on those states that did it who are now struggling with how to pay for it.

You have touted that signups were ahead of schedule, only to be spouting whitehouse talking points while ignoring the CBO original estimates where we are behind. You are quick to put forward inflated, bloated, and manipulated numbers, and silent when the real numbers come out.

You tout people being forced off the insurance they liked, and giving up the doctors they liked, and being forced onto the exchange as some sort of success story.

I'm not exactly sure why you believe you need to be the mouthpiece for this piece of sh* law. Whats in it for you? You have the same f*cking policy you did prior to Obamacare, so whats so great about it now?

In any event, if you want to come off as someone who is only interested in the facts, then start reporting the facts. All of them.

Otherwise, just admit that you are who Gruber said you were.

It is unbelievable how much misinformation you just typed! If you don't like your employer provided policy, blaming the ACA is blaming the wrong people. It is your employer! There haven't been any provisions of the ACA that even affect you yet. The OOP maximum doesn't take affect until 2016. Your employer decides what plan they are going to purchase, what it will cover, and how large a share of the cost you are going to provide. Why is that so hard to understand?

Really? point to the MISINFORMATION. If yo udo so correctly, you should jab yourself squarely in the eye.

Guess what, captain clueless. My employer CANT CHANGFE TO A BETTER POLICY because we are strapped to what Oblunershit says we are allowed to have.

You have a better policy, because yours is grandfathered.

I cant wait to hear the butthurt coming out of your mouth if your employer has to ever give that grandfathered plan up.

You see, you have been touting nothing but misinformation. You talk about how great oblundershit is for you, but you dont have an oblundershit policy. You want to blame the people who have restrictions and mandates placed on them, but dont blame the dumbasses who created the mandates and restrictions.

It is pure unadultered sh*t.

Your employer doesn't even have to offer minimum essential coverage. But if they don't now and/or didn't before the ACA then it was a very crappy plan they offered. Nothing in the ACA prevents your employer from offering more than the minimum!

As far as my group policy goes, it isn't anything to brag about. It conformed to the MEC prior to the enactment so being grandfathered doesn't really mean anything. I've got $15 PCP visits, $70 specialists, $700 individual deductible, and $3,210 individual co payment. It is an 80/20 split that I pay a premium for. If I took the default 70/30 I wouldn't be responsible for any of the premium. If I had family coverage I would pay the full premium for everyone but myself.

Stop talking out of your ass. You didnt have any idea you were on a grandfathered plan, and you are trying to tell me exactly what my employer is going through?

And if you think your plan isnt that great, just wait until you have to get on a real oblundershit plan.

So how exactly does cursing and name calling advance your position? Maybe it makes you feel better but it is pretty childish. You have made it clear that you have an employer sponsored plan. I have posted several things that you completely disregard concerning what changes group plans have been subject to under the ACA. If you want to ignore the facts when they don't suit you then that is on you. Cussing the messenger doesn't change that.

(06-14-2015 09:17 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 06:49 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 05:43 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 04:04 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(06-14-2015 03:07 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  It is unbelievable how much misinformation you just typed! If you don't like your employer provided policy, blaming the ACA is blaming the wrong people. It is your employer! There haven't been any provisions of the ACA that even affect you yet. The OOP maximum doesn't take affect until 2016. Your employer decides what plan they are going to purchase, what it will cover, and how large a share of the cost you are going to provide. Why is that so hard to understand?

Really? point to the MISINFORMATION. If yo udo so correctly, you should jab yourself squarely in the eye.

Guess what, captain clueless. My employer CANT CHANGFE TO A BETTER POLICY because we are strapped to what Oblunershit says we are allowed to have.

You have a better policy, because yours is grandfathered.

I cant wait to hear the butthurt coming out of your mouth if your employer has to ever give that grandfathered plan up.

You see, you have been touting nothing but misinformation. You talk about how great oblundershit is for you, but you dont have an oblundershit policy. You want to blame the people who have restrictions and mandates placed on them, but dont blame the dumbasses who created the mandates and restrictions.

It is pure unadultered sh*t.

Your employer doesn't even have to offer minimum essential coverage. But if they don't now and/or didn't before the ACA then it was a very crappy plan they offered. Nothing in the ACA prevents your employer from offering more than the minimum!

As far as my group policy goes, it isn't anything to brag about. It conformed to the MEC prior to the enactment so being grandfathered doesn't really mean anything. I've got $15 PCP visits, $70 specialists, $700 individual deductible, and $3,210 individual co payment. It is an 80/20 split that I pay a premium for. If I took the default 70/30 I wouldn't be responsible for any of the premium. If I had family coverage I would pay the full premium for everyone but myself.

Stop talking out of your ass. You didnt have any idea you were on a grandfathered plan, and you are trying to tell me exactly what my employer is going through?

And if you think your plan isnt that great, just wait until you have to get on a real oblundershit plan.

So how exactly does cursing and name calling advance your position? Maybe it makes you feel better but it is pretty childish. You have made it clear that you have an employer sponsored plan. I have posted several things that you completely disregard concerning what changes group plans have been subject to under the ACA. If you want to ignore the facts when they don't suit you then that is on you. Cussing the messenger doesn't change that.

You havent posted anything that refutes the OOP costs I posted. You ignore my points because you have no answer for them.

Again, you have proven you do not know what you are talking about with your own plan.

(06-12-2015 06:01 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 03:08 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Just a point of clarification: The $2,500 comments from Obama were made WAY before the ACA took final shape and was based on stuff that didn't come anywhere close to what was in the final bill.

These were made back in 2008 before he was even president...and on most occasions, he said up to or as much as $2,500 per year. In a few, he did say an average of $2,500. I know I read how they were calculating that amount at one point, but I can't find the story as of yet.

So Obama shouldnt have been making those claims since it was clear he hadn't read the bill. Oh yeah i guess he was just like everybody else, he didnt know what was in the bill because we had to pass the bill to find out.

He either knowingly lied, or made statements without knowing what was in his own healthcare bill. I can't decide which is worse.

Ummmm...you do realize don't you that these are all from 2008...before he was president? Before the bill was written and before it was passed?

(06-15-2015 09:45 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 06:01 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 03:08 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Just a point of clarification: The $2,500 comments from Obama were made WAY before the ACA took final shape and was based on stuff that didn't come anywhere close to what was in the final bill.

These were made back in 2008 before he was even president...and on most occasions, he said up to or as much as $2,500 per year. In a few, he did say an average of $2,500. I know I read how they were calculating that amount at one point, but I can't find the story as of yet.

So Obama shouldnt have been making those claims since it was clear he hadn't read the bill. Oh yeah i guess he was just like everybody else, he didnt know what was in the bill because we had to pass the bill to find out.

He either knowingly lied, or made statements without knowing what was in his own healthcare bill. I can't decide which is worse.

Ummmm...you do realize don't you that these are all from 2008...before he was president? Before the bill was written and before it was passed?

Got it. He lied.

(06-15-2015 09:49 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:45 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 06:01 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 03:08 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Just a point of clarification: The $2,500 comments from Obama were made WAY before the ACA took final shape and was based on stuff that didn't come anywhere close to what was in the final bill.

These were made back in 2008 before he was even president...and on most occasions, he said up to or as much as $2,500 per year. In a few, he did say an average of $2,500. I know I read how they were calculating that amount at one point, but I can't find the story as of yet.

So Obama shouldnt have been making those claims since it was clear he hadn't read the bill. Oh yeah i guess he was just like everybody else, he didnt know what was in the bill because we had to pass the bill to find out.

He either knowingly lied, or made statements without knowing what was in his own healthcare bill. I can't decide which is worse.

Ummmm...you do realize don't you that these are all from 2008...before he was president? Before the bill was written and before it was passed?

Got it. He lied.

Well...not exactly...Perhaps he did? But we'll never know because the proposal never became law. Sorry.

http://www.factcheck.org/2008/06/obamas-...h-savings/

(06-15-2015 10:11 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:49 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:45 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Ummmm...you do realize don't you that these are all from 2008...before he was president? Before the bill was written and before it was passed?

Got it. He lied.

Well...not exactly...Perhaps he did? But we'll never know because the proposal never became law. Sorry.

http://www.factcheck.org/2008/06/obamas-...h-savings/

Obama got elected on the promises of Obamacare. SInce it was passed, he has actually embraced that moniker. I haven't seen him distance himself from the bill, have you?

Can you show me one single speech or time where he lamented that 'what was passed' wasn't what he wanted? Which Republicans did he negotiate with to get their votes?

If you want to argue that the Democratic party made him out to be a liar, that's fine.... but I don't think it helps your argument much about which political party anyone should support. It may well have been Pelosi and her ilk that caused him to be a liar, but unfortunately, MOST Americans voted for him, not her... and he couldn't control her.

So if he's not a liar, you're arguing that the most powerful man on the planet was politically impotent within his own party. I would think that the minority voter would find this particularly interesting

(06-15-2015 10:11 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:49 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:45 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 06:01 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 03:08 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Just a point of clarification: The $2,500 comments from Obama were made WAY before the ACA took final shape and was based on stuff that didn't come anywhere close to what was in the final bill.

These were made back in 2008 before he was even president...and on most occasions, he said up to or as much as $2,500 per year. In a few, he did say an average of $2,500. I know I read how they were calculating that amount at one point, but I can't find the story as of yet.

So Obama shouldnt have been making those claims since it was clear he hadn't read the bill. Oh yeah i guess he was just like everybody else, he didnt know what was in the bill because we had to pass the bill to find out.

He either knowingly lied, or made statements without knowing what was in his own healthcare bill. I can't decide which is worse.

Ummmm...you do realize don't you that these are all from 2008...before he was president? Before the bill was written and before it was passed?

Got it. He lied.

Well...not exactly...Perhaps he did? But we'll never know because the proposal never became law. Sorry.

http://www.factcheck.org/2008/06/obamas-...h-savings/

Wow, siting a 2008 fact check. Really up to date.

Here's one that is a little more current:

ELM doesn't save money

(06-15-2015 10:11 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:49 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:45 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 06:01 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 03:08 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Just a point of clarification: The $2,500 comments from Obama were made WAY before the ACA took final shape and was based on stuff that didn't come anywhere close to what was in the final bill.

These were made back in 2008 before he was even president...and on most occasions, he said up to or as much as $2,500 per year. In a few, he did say an average of $2,500. I know I read how they were calculating that amount at one point, but I can't find the story as of yet.

So Obama shouldnt have been making those claims since it was clear he hadn't read the bill. Oh yeah i guess he was just like everybody else, he didnt know what was in the bill because we had to pass the bill to find out.

He either knowingly lied, or made statements without knowing what was in his own healthcare bill. I can't decide which is worse.

Ummmm...you do realize don't you that these are all from 2008...before he was president? Before the bill was written and before it was passed?

Got it. He lied.

Well...not exactly...Perhaps he did? But we'll never know because the proposal never became law. Sorry.

http://www.factcheck.org/2008/06/obamas-...h-savings/

Wow, siting a 2008 fact check. Really up to date.

Here's one that is a little more current:

ELM doesn't save money

Here's some additional information. Read it carefully.

In my own particular case, my Blue Cross/Blue Shield premiums went up 21% in 2015. My Specialist co-pay rose 25%. Rx co-pays went up different amounts depending on what tier; although they averaged 20%. No increase in PCP co-pay and I don't have a deductable.

(06-15-2015 10:22 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 10:11 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:49 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:45 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Ummmm...you do realize don't you that these are all from 2008...before he was president? Before the bill was written and before it was passed?

Got it. He lied.

Well...not exactly...Perhaps he did? But we'll never know because the proposal never became law. Sorry.

http://www.factcheck.org/2008/06/obamas-...h-savings/

Obama got elected on the promises of Obamacare. SInce it was passed, he has actually embraced that moniker. I haven't seen him distance himself from the bill, have you?

Can you show me one single speech or time where he lamented that 'what was passed' wasn't what he wanted? Which Republicans did he negotiate with to get their votes?

If you want to argue that the Democratic party made him out to be a liar, that's fine.... but I don't think it helps your argument much about which political party anyone should support. It may well have been Pelosi and her ilk that caused him to be a liar, but unfortunately, MOST Americans voted for him, not her... and he couldn't control her.

So if he's not a liar, you're arguing that the most powerful man on the planet was politically impotent within his own party. I would think that the minority voter would find this particularly interesting

Once again, you're reading WAY too much into this. I'm only saying that the $2,500 amount was an "up to" figure and that those promises were made before actual Congressional action on the bill even began...and in fact, before he was even president. Basically, he got what he could. You do remember the Blue Dogs don't you?
'Blue Dog' Democrats Hold Health-Care Overhaul at Bay

(06-15-2015 10:32 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  In my own particular case, my Blue Cross/Blue Shield premiums went up 21% in 2015. My Specialist co-pay rose 25%. Rx co-pays went up different amounts depending on what tier; although they averaged 20%. No increase in PCP co-pay and I don't have a deductable.

And mine actually went down a few cents. Also, my company switched prescription providers and I'm saving quite a bit due to lower prescription costs.

(06-15-2015 10:28 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 10:11 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:49 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  

(06-15-2015 09:45 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-12-2015 06:01 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  So Obama shouldnt have been making those claims since it was clear he hadn't read the bill. Oh yeah i guess he was just like everybody else, he didnt know what was in the bill because we had to pass the bill to find out.

He either knowingly lied, or made statements without knowing what was in his own healthcare bill. I can't decide which is worse.

Ummmm...you do realize don't you that these are all from 2008...before he was president? Before the bill was written and before it was passed?

Got it. He lied.

Well...not exactly...Perhaps he did? But we'll never know because the proposal never became law. Sorry.

http://www.factcheck.org/2008/06/obamas-...h-savings/

Wow, siting a 2008 fact check. Really up to date.

Here's one that is a little more current:

ELM doesn't save money

Here's some additional information. Read it carefully.

Dude...you're missing the boat. We're talking about a quote and promise from 2008 before he was president...before the law was written...before the law was passed. You HAVE to analyze the facts from the time of the quote to determine veracity. That's what that article does. Please tell me you can understand this?

Yes...no one doubts that the ACA is likely not currently saving anyone $2,500 per year. My only point is that the $2,500 promise was made before the bill was even debated in Congress.