(12-04-2014 02:03 PM)Overrated Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:02 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Not that it hasn't been brought up before but 99% of these large Cities that are jailing these minority Drug related criminals are Major Democrat run Government's and have Unionized employees on the Police Force. Just like Ferguson and St.Louis are mostly Democrat controlled but that hardly ever comes up when discussing problems with supposed racial injustice on Drug related crimes being disproportionately handed out. It always seems to make White Conservatives the source of all minority hardship.

I agree it's a problem with both sides and that police unions not being willing to hold terrible cops accountable is a huge problem. But I guess that raises the question why are conservatives so eager to argue against obvious problems?

Can you name any terrible cops that weren't held accountable?

(12-04-2014 01:57 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:46 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  The one thing that all these stories have in common is not just that it was a white on black crime but also that the killer was not found guilty and in some cases not even arrested.

Let's not confuse the issue with pointing to black on black crime. That is simply a red herring.

Well their chants are all "black lives matter." Explain that, because if it's true then we'd hear complaints about black on black crime and stop riding only the coattails of white on black crimes. So we've got two instances where a white, or almost white person go into a tussle with a black person and had to protect themselves, and another where some overzealous cop put a trained move on a man resisting arrest and suddenly the whole white cop world is racist and out to get the black man.

I've been trained how to put a choke hold on people and I have trained cops how to do it.

What that cop did was not a trained choke hold.

1. He held it for to long

2. He applies pressure to the throat rather than the side of the neck.

(12-04-2014 03:53 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:57 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:46 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  The one thing that all these stories have in common is not just that it was a white on black crime but also that the killer was not found guilty and in some cases not even arrested.

Let's not confuse the issue with pointing to black on black crime. That is simply a red herring.

Well their chants are all "black lives matter." Explain that, because if it's true then we'd hear complaints about black on black crime and stop riding only the coattails of white on black crimes. So we've got two instances where a white, or almost white person go into a tussle with a black person and had to protect themselves, and another where some overzealous cop put a trained move on a man resisting arrest and suddenly the whole white cop world is racist and out to get the black man.

I've been trained how to put a choke hold on people and I have trained cops how to do it.

What that cop did was not a trained choke hold.

1. He held it for to long

2. He applies pressure to the throat rather than the side of the neck.

I think he went about it the wrong way, he let loose after Garner was on the ground though, but he probably panicked or had too much of an adrenaline rush and didn't perform correctly. I'm not choosing sides, Garner looked like a big teddy bear and seemed like a harmless guy, I just think things would have gone different if both sides would have handled things better.

I guess Overrated finally laid down for a nap. Good thing, he's been a diva throughout this entire thread.

(12-04-2014 02:51 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 02:03 PM)Overrated Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:02 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Not that it hasn't been brought up before but 99% of these large Cities that are jailing these minority Drug related criminals are Major Democrat run Government's and have Unionized employees on the Police Force. Just like Ferguson and St.Louis are mostly Democrat controlled but that hardly ever comes up when discussing problems with supposed racial injustice on Drug related crimes being disproportionately handed out. It always seems to make White Conservatives the source of all minority hardship.

I agree it's a problem with both sides and that police unions not being willing to hold terrible cops accountable is a huge problem. But I guess that raises the question why are conservatives so eager to argue against obvious problems?

Can you name any terrible cops that weren't held accountable?

Is that serious? This is a thread about Officer Pantaleo who isn't being held accountable after using excessive force and killing an unarmed civilian who wasn't committing a crime and was no threat to any of the multiple officers.

Jeff Roorda is the racist member of the St. Louis Police Association who released the statement about the Rams players peaceful protest at their game last Sunday. He was fired from the St. Louis PD. But not for filing a false police report against a civilian, which he was "reprimanded" for and can ruin a person's life. He was fired for filing a false report about his police chief's abuse of authority. So challenge authority, get fired, ruin a citizen's life who you are hired to protect and serve and get a slap on the wrist.

In Wisconsin, after a white man's son was shot unjustly and nothing was done to the officer, he created a campaign for police accountability. Part of the findings:

Quote:n 129 years since police and fire commissions were created in the state of Wisconsin, we could not find a single ruling by a police department, an inquest or a police commission that a shooting was unjustified. There was one shooting we found, in 2005, that was ruled justified by the department and an inquest, but additional evidence provided by citizens caused the DA to charge the officer. The city of Milwaukee settled with a confidentiality agreement and the facts of that sealed. The officer involved committed suicide.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2...z3KySng0kt

Police are routinely not held accountable. It happens ALL THE TIME. Open your eyes.

(12-03-2014 11:05 PM)EagleRockCafe Wrote:  With all the violent crime in NYC they sent these policemen to arrest a guy selling cigarettes. Nuts.

+1 ... The nanny state wanted their cash.... When the cop let go he was still breathing. He was an asthma patient,overweight and combined with the cops move he died. We have all done stupid things or foolish things and once you enter knucklehead land $*** happens.

(12-04-2014 06:24 PM)Overrated Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 02:51 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 02:03 PM)Overrated Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:02 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Not that it hasn't been brought up before but 99% of these large Cities that are jailing these minority Drug related criminals are Major Democrat run Government's and have Unionized employees on the Police Force. Just like Ferguson and St.Louis are mostly Democrat controlled but that hardly ever comes up when discussing problems with supposed racial injustice on Drug related crimes being disproportionately handed out. It always seems to make White Conservatives the source of all minority hardship.

I agree it's a problem with both sides and that police unions not being willing to hold terrible cops accountable is a huge problem. But I guess that raises the question why are conservatives so eager to argue against obvious problems?

Can you name any terrible cops that weren't held accountable?

Is that serious? This is a thread about Officer Pantaleo who isn't being held accountable after using excessive force and killing an unarmed civilian who wasn't committing a crime and was no threat to any of the multiple officers.

Jeff Roorda is the racist member of the St. Louis Police Association who released the statement about the Rams players peaceful ignorant protest at their game last Sunday. He was fired from the St. Louis PD. But not for filing a false police report against a civilian, which he was "reprimanded" for and can ruin a person's life. He was fired for filing a false report about his police chief's abuse of authority. So challenge authority, get fired, ruin a citizen's life who you are hired to protect and serve and get a slap on the wrist.

In Wisconsin, after a white man's son was shot unjustly and nothing was done to the officer, he created a campaign for police accountability. Part of the findings:

Quote:n 129 years since police and fire commissions were created in the state of Wisconsin, we could not find a single ruling by a police department, an inquest or a police commission that a shooting was unjustified. There was one shooting we found, in 2005, that was ruled justified by the department and an inquest, but additional evidence provided by citizens caused the DA to charge the officer. The city of Milwaukee settled with a confidentiality agreement and the facts of that sealed. The officer involved committed suicide.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2...z3KySng0kt

Police are routinely not held accountable. It happens ALL THE TIME. Open your eyes.

FIFY

(12-04-2014 03:53 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:57 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:46 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  The one thing that all these stories have in common is not just that it was a white on black crime but also that the killer was not found guilty and in some cases not even arrested.

Let's not confuse the issue with pointing to black on black crime. That is simply a red herring.

Well their chants are all "black lives matter." Explain that, because if it's true then we'd hear complaints about black on black crime and stop riding only the coattails of white on black crimes. So we've got two instances where a white, or almost white person go into a tussle with a black person and had to protect themselves, and another where some overzealous cop put a trained move on a man resisting arrest and suddenly the whole white cop world is racist and out to get the black man.

I've been trained how to put a choke hold on people and I have trained cops how to do it.

What that cop did was not a trained choke hold.

1. He held it for to long

2. He applies pressure to the throat rather than the side of the neck.

You cannot verbalize if your airway is obstructed in that manner.

People are clueless if they think this man died like a person does when one fully chokes the airway off to the point of asphyxiation.

This man's airway was minimally obstructed, like I said before you cannot verbalize that loudly with an obstructed airway.

This man, since he had asthma, most likely went into acute bronchospasms and then had a cardiac arrest.

The cop should probably be charged with manslaughter at worst.

(12-04-2014 08:11 PM)maximus Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 03:53 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:57 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 01:46 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  The one thing that all these stories have in common is not just that it was a white on black crime but also that the killer was not found guilty and in some cases not even arrested.

Let's not confuse the issue with pointing to black on black crime. That is simply a red herring.

Well their chants are all "black lives matter." Explain that, because if it's true then we'd hear complaints about black on black crime and stop riding only the coattails of white on black crimes. So we've got two instances where a white, or almost white person go into a tussle with a black person and had to protect themselves, and another where some overzealous cop put a trained move on a man resisting arrest and suddenly the whole white cop world is racist and out to get the black man.

I've been trained how to put a choke hold on people and I have trained cops how to do it.

What that cop did was not a trained choke hold.

1. He held it for to long

2. He applies pressure to the throat rather than the side of the neck.

You cannot verbalize if your airway is obstructed in that manner.

People are clueless if they think this man died like a person does when one fully chokes the airway off to the point of asphyxiation.

This man's airway was minimally obstructed, like I said before you cannot verbalize that loudly with an obstructed airway.

This man, since he had asthma, most likely went into acute bronchospasms and then had a cardiac arrest.

The cop should probably be charged with manslaughter at worst.

Like I said, he didn't put pressure in the right spot. Had he done it right, the man would have been out in 5 seconds. End of story.

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

(12-04-2014 10:02 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 08:31 AM)CardFan1 Wrote:  In the late 1970's into the early 1980's a lot of nightclubs hired Ex police and Ex Servicemen as Bar Bouncers. I've seen White Guys get in fights inside the bars and These Big Bouncers would just put Them into a headlock and carry Them right on through the push bar exit doors head first into the parking lot. Never heard the first complaint about mistreatment. Some Bouncers were Black but That was just the way You dealt with trouble makers in the day.

These people are the same ones that are saying something different could have been done in the Brown situation.

Like I always say, if it's not one thing, it's another. Had the police shot Garner, all the people would be saying that the police could have done things differently. They put him in a freaking choke hold to subdue him and he had an asthma attack. I don't see how this is the fault of the police.

Then we have morons coming around saying that whites are threatened and racist, whatever that means. Just sounds like an excuse to riot.

Not all whites are racist, but you certainly are. A fool, too.

(12-04-2014 08:11 PM)maximus Wrote:  You cannot verbalize if your airway is obstructed in that manner.

People are clueless if they think this man died like a person does when one fully chokes the airway off to the point of asphyxiation.

This man's airway was minimally obstructed, like I said before you cannot verbalize that loudly with an obstructed airway.

This man, since he had asthma, most likely went into acute bronchospasms and then had a cardiac arrest.

The cop should probably be charged with manslaughter at worst.

Wouldn't the charge have to be involuntary manslaughter (although I'd assume they'd have tried for multiple charge levels?)? Since I'm assuming nobody was aware of his asthmatic condition?

(12-04-2014 06:24 PM)Overrated Wrote:  Is that serious? This is a thread about Officer Pantaleo who isn't being held accountable after using excessive force and killing an unarmed civilian who wasn't committing a crime and was no threat to any of the multiple officers.

First of all, and the MOST important piece here, he didn't kill Garner. He took him down with a choke hold or headlock, that's the only way to subdue a person resisting arrest. 999 out of 1000 people would still be alive after that. He had further issues that were unknown to the police, THAT'S what killed him. If you resist arrest, you get taken down so the police can cuff you.

(12-05-2014 09:24 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 06:24 PM)Overrated Wrote:  Is that serious? This is a thread about Officer Pantaleo who isn't being held accountable after using excessive force and killing an unarmed civilian who wasn't committing a crime and was no threat to any of the multiple officers.

First of all, and the MOST important piece here, he didn't kill Garner. He took him down with a choke hold or headlock, that's the only way to subdue a person resisting arrest. 999 out of 1000 people would still be alive after that. He had further issues that were unknown to the police, THAT'S what killed him. If you resist arrest, you get taken down so the police can cuff you.

He was committing a crime as well, at least according to NYC. Also, he had been arrested 30+ times before. So, the dude was no angel.

(12-05-2014 04:00 AM)Dak10 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 10:02 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 08:31 AM)CardFan1 Wrote:  In the late 1970's into the early 1980's a lot of nightclubs hired Ex police and Ex Servicemen as Bar Bouncers. I've seen White Guys get in fights inside the bars and These Big Bouncers would just put Them into a headlock and carry Them right on through the push bar exit doors head first into the parking lot. Never heard the first complaint about mistreatment. Some Bouncers were Black but That was just the way You dealt with trouble makers in the day.

These people are the same ones that are saying something different could have been done in the Brown situation.

Like I always say, if it's not one thing, it's another. Had the police shot Garner, all the people would be saying that the police could have done things differently. They put him in a freaking choke hold to subdue him and he had an asthma attack. I don't see how this is the fault of the police.

Then we have morons coming around saying that whites are threatened and racist, whatever that means. Just sounds like an excuse to riot.

Not all whites are racist, but you certainly are. A fool, too.

Go back in your bubble, kid. And save your race card for someone who finds you credible.

(12-05-2014 09:29 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 09:24 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 06:24 PM)Overrated Wrote:  Is that serious? This is a thread about Officer Pantaleo who isn't being held accountable after using excessive force and killing an unarmed civilian who wasn't committing a crime and was no threat to any of the multiple officers.

First of all, and the MOST important piece here, he didn't kill Garner. He took him down with a choke hold or headlock, that's the only way to subdue a person resisting arrest. 999 out of 1000 people would still be alive after that. He had further issues that were unknown to the police, THAT'S what killed him. If you resist arrest, you get taken down so the police can cuff you.

He was committing a crime as well, at least according to NYC. Also, he had been arrested 30+ times before. So, the dude was no angel.

They like to ignore that little factoid.

(12-05-2014 09:32 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 09:29 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 09:24 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 06:24 PM)Overrated Wrote:  Is that serious? This is a thread about Officer Pantaleo who isn't being held accountable after using excessive force and killing an unarmed civilian who wasn't committing a crime and was no threat to any of the multiple officers.

First of all, and the MOST important piece here, he didn't kill Garner. He took him down with a choke hold or headlock, that's the only way to subdue a person resisting arrest. 999 out of 1000 people would still be alive after that. He had further issues that were unknown to the police, THAT'S what killed him. If you resist arrest, you get taken down so the police can cuff you.

He was committing a crime as well, at least according to NYC. Also, he had been arrested 30+ times before. So, the dude was no angel.

They like to ignore that little factoid.

Yeah because selling single cigarettes is a crime punishable by death by choking.

(12-05-2014 11:53 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 09:32 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 09:29 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 09:24 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-04-2014 06:24 PM)Overrated Wrote:  Is that serious? This is a thread about Officer Pantaleo who isn't being held accountable after using excessive force and killing an unarmed civilian who wasn't committing a crime and was no threat to any of the multiple officers.

First of all, and the MOST important piece here, he didn't kill Garner. He took him down with a choke hold or headlock, that's the only way to subdue a person resisting arrest. 999 out of 1000 people would still be alive after that. He had further issues that were unknown to the police, THAT'S what killed him. If you resist arrest, you get taken down so the police can cuff you.

He was committing a crime as well, at least according to NYC. Also, he had been arrested 30+ times before. So, the dude was no angel.

They like to ignore that little factoid.

Yeah because selling single cigarettes is a crime punishable by death by choking.

NOBODY set out to kill the dude. Geez, why is that so hard to understand?

The cop would have never even been there if the dude wasn't breaking a NYC law. Have a problem with that, take it up with NYC.

(12-05-2014 12:20 PM)VA49er Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 11:53 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 09:32 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 09:29 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 09:24 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  First of all, and the MOST important piece here, he didn't kill Garner. He took him down with a choke hold or headlock, that's the only way to subdue a person resisting arrest. 999 out of 1000 people would still be alive after that. He had further issues that were unknown to the police, THAT'S what killed him. If you resist arrest, you get taken down so the police can cuff you.

He was committing a crime as well, at least according to NYC. Also, he had been arrested 30+ times before. So, the dude was no angel.

They like to ignore that little factoid.

Yeah because selling single cigarettes is a crime punishable by death by choking.

NOBODY set out to kill the dude. Geez, why is that so hard to understand?

The cop would have never even been there if the dude wasn't breaking a NYC law. Have a problem with that, take it up with NYC.

Probably because the guy is dead.

Seriously? You choke a man for that long, hear him saying over and over that he can't breathe and you are then surprised when he dies?

Wow. Just Wow.

(12-05-2014 12:49 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  Probably because the guy is dead.

Seriously? You choke a man for that long, hear him saying over and over that he can't breathe and you are then surprised when he dies?

Wow. Just Wow.

The hold was released before Garner said he couldn't breathe... He was restrained in a choke hold until he could no longer resist arrest, that's how it's done and always has been done.

(12-05-2014 12:56 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(12-05-2014 12:49 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  Probably because the guy is dead.

Seriously? You choke a man for that long, hear him saying over and over that he can't breathe and you are then surprised when he dies?

Wow. Just Wow.

The hold was released before Garner said he couldn't breathe... He was restrained in a choke hold until he could no longer resist arrest, that's how it's done and always has been done.

I disagree. In fact, cops rarely use choke holds for several reasons.

1. They are hard to do right
2. You risk hurting the person
3. They is many easier ways to subdue a person.