(02-10-2014 11:12 AM)QuitoTiger Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:41 AM)dan o Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:32 AM)Marc Mensa Wrote:  Smart's NBA future will not ride on the success or failure of this college basketball season in Stillwater... but acting a fool could cost him a ton of money.

Not in the NBA or NFL

Right. They're all ambassadors and artists of good in their own sight. Here's when I stopped watching NBA games.

I'm saying that character, reputation and history of incidents will not cost such folks a dime in either the NBA or NFL

And I've always been a sports fan, but don't watch pro sports either.

(02-10-2014 10:34 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 09:07 AM)AtlTigerfan Wrote:  Maybe meaningless to you, but I would love to see how you would've reacted when you were 19 if someone called you a piece of crap or racial slur. Its easy for us to say let it go when we are watching on tv, debating on a mesageboard, and passing judgement when we have no idea what was said.

Tiger fans thought it was "funny" when Pierre slapped orange jumpsuit guy. Yet Smart was wrong for a two handed shove to the chest?

Yep.

(02-10-2014 11:25 AM)Maiamire Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 11:07 AM)holyterror Wrote:  It's a double standard to presume a young man will represent his university in a mature manner in all situations. Yet this is precisely what is expected. And the athlete signs up for that trip when he accepts the scholarship.

I'm not saying it's the way it ought to be; it isn't. But it's the way it is.

It's not that difficult. It's really not. I remember being in the band, we were held to that same standard. I remember making that trip to UTEP for the conference games in (I think it was) 2011. They had the band seated right next to the UTEP student section. They actually at one point had to place a security officer between us because of how rowdy the students had gotten. There were quite a few less than kind words yelled at us then. And we're the band. But guess what? We didn't go over and push anyone.

I'm not sure that's a fair comparison, lol. Call me crazy.

I would have stabbed the fan.

(02-10-2014 11:29 AM)Stammers Wrote:  I would have stabbed the fan.

Thugs carry knives

(02-10-2014 11:31 AM)dan o Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 11:29 AM)Stammers Wrote:  I would have stabbed the fan.

Thugs carry knives

Yep. He is talking about stabbing someone over something the man didn't say and on top of that stammers isn't African American. WOW!

(02-10-2014 11:29 AM)georgiatiger Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 11:25 AM)Maiamire Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 11:07 AM)holyterror Wrote:  It's a double standard to presume a young man will represent his university in a mature manner in all situations. Yet this is precisely what is expected. And the athlete signs up for that trip when he accepts the scholarship.

I'm not saying it's the way it ought to be; it isn't. But it's the way it is.

It's not that difficult. It's really not. I remember being in the band, we were held to that same standard. I remember making that trip to UTEP for the conference games in (I think it was) 2011. They had the band seated right next to the UTEP student section. They actually at one point had to place a security officer between us because of how rowdy the students had gotten. There were quite a few less than kind words yelled at us then. And we're the band. But guess what? We didn't go over and push anyone.

I'm not sure that's a fair comparison, lol. Call me crazy.

It's not the same thing, no. But the person I quoted had said that it was a double standard to think that young people would represent their school in a mature manner in all situations. That was a situation in which fans from another school were saying rude things about us and our players. Not just me, but other individuals in the band. And none of us represented our school in a less than mature manner. So I was responding to his statement.

For better or worse, I think this is going to ratchet up fan behavior scrutiny as well. Ogg has been asked and agreed to not attend any more home games for the rest of the season.

(02-10-2014 10:33 AM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:28 AM)howboutthemtigers Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:23 AM)tigers311 Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 09:14 AM)howboutthemtigers Wrote:  No racial slur was made. In the audio, you hear the obnoxious fan say "you piece of crap". Smart says. "F*#k you!". And the fan replies "you're not my type." Smart gets pissed and shoves the guy. Teenager or not, racial slur or not...from a legal standpoint, Smart committed assault. I certainly don't think he should be prosecuted. But for folks to blame Travis Ford , the stupid fan, or anyone other than Smart is stupid.

Assault my ass.. You gotta be kidding


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Yes, assault. Shoving someone is assaulting them.

Good luck with that. Oh, I see no assault charges have been filed, that's strange...

It really doesn't take much to be convicted of assault. There are a variety of degrees of assault to capture all forms of aggressive contact by the assailant.

I recently served jury duty and we unanimously charged the defendant for assault causing "fear of bodily harm" for spitting in the arresting officers' faces. Emotional outbursts like these have their consequences in the court room.

(02-10-2014 12:07 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  If you can find where a shove constitutes as assault in Texas law (and do try to cite actual cases), I'll change my tune.

Sec. 22.01. ASSAULT. (a) A person commits an offense if the person:(1) intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly causes bodily injury to another, including the person's spouse; (2) intentionally or knowingly threatens another with imminent bodily injury, including the person's spouse; or(3) intentionally or knowingly causes physical contact with another when the person knows or should reasonably believe that the other will regard the contact as offensive or provocative.

(02-10-2014 12:07 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:37 AM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:33 AM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:28 AM)howboutthemtigers Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:23 AM)tigers311 Wrote:  Assault my ass.. You gotta be kidding


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Yes, assault. Shoving someone is assaulting them.

Good luck with that. Oh, I see no assault charges have been filed, that's strange...

Whether charges are filed or not, that's the definition of assault.

If you can find where a shove constitutes as assault in Texas law (and do try to cite actual cases), I'll change my tune.

Definition of Assault - Texas Penal Code

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§ 22.01. ASSAULT.

(a) A person commits an offense if the person:

(1) intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly causes bodily injury to another, including the person's spouse;

(2) intentionally or knowingly threatens another with imminent bodily injury, including the person's spouse; or

(3) intentionally or knowingly causes physical contact with another when the person knows or should reasonably believe that the other will regard the contact as offensive or provocative.

So, what does anyone think about Travis Ford's lack of action?

Violence is NOT the answer. What ever happened to the "Sticks and Stones" motto and "Turning the other cheek?"

(02-10-2014 11:29 AM)Stammers Wrote:  I would have stabbed the fan.

Me too.

(02-10-2014 12:30 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 12:18 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  § 22.01. ASSAULT.

(a) A person commits an offense if the person:


(3) intentionally or knowingly causes physical contact with another when the person knows or should reasonably believe that the other will regard the contact as offensive or provocative.[/b]

And said bodily injury? One must also prove he "knowingly" caused physical contact and it was not as a result of emotional distress.

...Actually, why the **** am I playing devil's advocate here? This thread is NTR, this discussion is NTR and at the end of the day, I couldn't give less of a **** about the incident if I tried. I'm out.

The "or's" in the statute mean that there are other options. If 1) doesn't fit, read 2). If 2) doesn't fit, look to 3).

So, under 22.01(a)(3):

Did Smart a) "intentionally" b) cause physical contact?

Simple answer: yes.

Did the fan find the contact "offensive?" By the looks of his reaction (and that of his wife) YES.

You have the elements of assault. End of story.

Now, if you want to argue defenses to the charge of assault, that is a different story. Although, there doesn't seem to be much in the way of an affirmative defense based upon what the video showed.

Heck, in TN you can be charged with assault without even touching someone. If one were to ball up a fist and act like they were going to hit you, as long as you perceived the threat to be real, that is an assault.

(02-10-2014 12:42 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 12:38 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 12:30 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 12:18 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  § 22.01. ASSAULT.

(a) A person commits an offense if the person:


(3) intentionally or knowingly causes physical contact with another when the person knows or should reasonably believe that the other will regard the contact as offensive or provocative.[/b]

And said bodily injury? One must also prove he "knowingly" caused physical contact and it was not as a result of emotional distress.

...Actually, why the **** am I playing devil's advocate here? This thread is NTR, this discussion is NTR and at the end of the day, I couldn't give less of a **** about the incident if I tried. I'm out.

The "or's" in the statute mean that there are other options. If 1) doesn't fit, read 2). If 2) doesn't fit, look to 3).

So, under 22.01(a)(3):

Did Smart a) "intentionally" b) cause physical contact?

Simple answer: yes.

Did the fan find the contact "offensive?" By the looks of his reaction (and that of his wife) YES.

You have the elements of assault. End of story.

Now, if you want to argue defenses to the charge of assault, that is a different story. Although, there doesn't seem to be much in the way of an affirmative defense based upon what the video showed.

Heck, in TN you can be charged with assault without even touching someone. If one were to ball up a fist and act like they were going to hit you, as long as you perceived the threat to be real, that is an assault.

I said I'm out. I don't care whether it was assault or they were playing footsie, please leave me out of any replies. This is a topic that isn't Tiger related and I honestly am not in the mood to play devil's advocate with it.

Wow just wow

(02-10-2014 12:42 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 12:38 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 12:30 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 12:18 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  § 22.01. ASSAULT.

(a) A person commits an offense if the person:


(3) intentionally or knowingly causes physical contact with another when the person knows or should reasonably believe that the other will regard the contact as offensive or provocative.[/b]

And said bodily injury? One must also prove he "knowingly" caused physical contact and it was not as a result of emotional distress.

...Actually, why the **** am I playing devil's advocate here? This thread is NTR, this discussion is NTR and at the end of the day, I couldn't give less of a **** about the incident if I tried. I'm out.

The "or's" in the statute mean that there are other options. If 1) doesn't fit, read 2). If 2) doesn't fit, look to 3).

So, under 22.01(a)(3):

Did Smart a) "intentionally" b) cause physical contact?

Simple answer: yes.

Did the fan find the contact "offensive?" By the looks of his reaction (and that of his wife) YES.

You have the elements of assault. End of story.

Now, if you want to argue defenses to the charge of assault, that is a different story. Although, there doesn't seem to be much in the way of an affirmative defense based upon what the video showed.

Heck, in TN you can be charged with assault without even touching someone. If one were to ball up a fist and act like they were going to hit you, as long as you perceived the threat to be real, that is an assault.

I said I'm out. I don't care whether it was assault or they were playing footsie, please leave me out of any replies. This is a topic that isn't Tiger related and I honestly am not in the mood to play devil's advocate with it.

Ha. Tuck your tail.

YOU were the one spouting off about what is and isn't assualt then dared someone to prove you wrong--to the point you would admit the error of your ways.

Two people with divergent board personalities set you straight. Yet, your histrionic response is to take your toys and go home.

Man up, admit you were wrong, and leave the thread with a shred of dignity.

(02-10-2014 12:18 PM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 12:07 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:37 AM)TigerBill Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:33 AM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(02-10-2014 10:28 AM)howboutthemtigers Wrote:  Yes, assault. Shoving someone is assaulting them.

Good luck with that. Oh, I see no assault charges have been filed, that's strange...

Whether charges are filed or not, that's the definition of assault.

If you can find where a shove constitutes as assault in Texas law (and do try to cite actual cases), I'll change my tune.

Definition of Assault - Texas Penal Code

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Comments (39)
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§ 22.01. ASSAULT.

(a) A person commits an offense if the person:

(1) intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly causes bodily injury to another, including the person's spouse;

(2) intentionally or knowingly threatens another with imminent bodily injury, including the person's spouse; or

(3) intentionally or knowingly causes physical contact with another when the person knows or should reasonably believe that the other will regard the contact as offensive or provocative.

i told these people it was assault the other day and they were all derp.

Dignity left this thread long before anyone else did.