Excellent deep dive on the metrics but the public wants to see Charlotte, they are what we call in this day and age a “sensation”.

(11-24-2022 03:13 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  Excellent deep dive on the metrics but the public wants to see Charlotte, they are what we call in this day and age a “sensation”.

The public wants to see UNCC? Outside of the UNCC campus and surrounding area no one knows they exist. App on the other hand has built a brand, beating Michigan, aTm, winnning multiple national fcs championships. What does UNCC have that comes close? Nothing. They were a bad add.

I sincerely hope they get better fast.

(11-24-2022 04:19 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 03:13 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  Excellent deep dive on the metrics but the public wants to see Charlotte, they are what we call in this day and age a “sensation”.

The public wants to see UNCC? Outside of the UNCC campus and surrounding area no one knows they exist. App on the other hand has built a brand, beating Michigan, aTm, winnning multiple national fcs championships. What does UNCC have that comes close? Nothing. They were a bad add.

I sincerely hope they get better fast.

It’s markets, they represent the city of Charlotte. People will tune in by the thousands. This is a long term investment that will pay off. There’s a reason people prefer programs like Charlotte, Cincy, Tulane, Memphis over schools like Boise St., Coastal Carolina, Troy, Southern Miss and so on. Markets matter big time, they are the only thing that matters besides academics.

(11-24-2022 04:27 PM)Thewavefan Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 04:19 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 03:13 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  Excellent deep dive on the metrics but the public wants to see Charlotte, they are what we call in this day and age a “sensation”.

The public wants to see UNCC? Outside of the UNCC campus and surrounding area no one knows they exist. App on the other hand has built a brand, beating Michigan, aTm, winnning multiple national fcs championships. What does UNCC have that comes close? Nothing. They were a bad add.

I sincerely hope they get better fast.

It’s markets, they represent the city of Charlotte. People will tune in by the thousands. This is a long term investment that will pay off. There’s a reason people prefer programs like Charlotte, Cincy, Tulane, Memphis over schools like Boise St., Coastal Carolina, Troy, Southern Miss and so on. Markets matter big time, they are the only thing that matters besides academics.

I get that. Long term hopefully it works out and they get good. I'm saying that in the here and now when we needed to replace some solid programs, App would have worked well along with UAB and UTSA. UNCC is a project with no brand. We can't reverse the clock so I sincerely hope they become solid in a hurry.

(11-24-2022 04:44 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 04:27 PM)Thewavefan Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 04:19 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 03:13 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  Excellent deep dive on the metrics but the public wants to see Charlotte, they are what we call in this day and age a “sensation”.

The public wants to see UNCC? Outside of the UNCC campus and surrounding area no one knows they exist. App on the other hand has built a brand, beating Michigan, aTm, winnning multiple national fcs championships. What does UNCC have that comes close? Nothing. They were a bad add.

I sincerely hope they get better fast.

It’s markets, they represent the city of Charlotte. People will tune in by the thousands. This is a long term investment that will pay off. There’s a reason people prefer programs like Charlotte, Cincy, Tulane, Memphis over schools like Boise St., Coastal Carolina, Troy, Southern Miss and so on. Markets matter big time, they are the only thing that matters besides academics.

I get that. Long term hopefully it works out and they get good. I'm saying that in the here and now when we needed to replace some solid programs, App would have worked well along with UAB and UTSA. UNCC is a project with no brand. We can't reverse the clock so I sincerely hope they become solid in a hurry.

I have good news, this school you mention has recently rolled out a new branding program in an attempt to take your suggestion and no longer be a project with no brand. The brand is “Charlotte” and if you are hoping they become solid then jump on the Charlotte bandwagon! You don’t have to cheer for them, just use their new branding when you mention them!

Thanks for your help supporting the American P6 Branding and its subsidiary brands!

(11-24-2022 04:27 PM)Thewavefan Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 04:19 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 03:13 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  Excellent deep dive on the metrics but the public wants to see Charlotte, they are what we call in this day and age a “sensation”.

The public wants to see UNCC? Outside of the UNCC campus and surrounding area no one knows they exist. App on the other hand has built a brand, beating Michigan, aTm, winnning multiple national fcs championships. What does UNCC have that comes close? Nothing. They were a bad add.

I sincerely hope they get better fast.

It’s markets, they represent the city of Charlotte. People will tune in by the thousands. This is a long term investment that will pay off. There’s a reason people prefer programs like Charlotte, Cincy, Tulane, Memphis over schools like Boise St., Coastal Carolina, Troy, Southern Miss and so on. Markets matter big time, they are the only thing that matters besides academics.

I respect maintaining the identity of having a presence in big markets, but to be successful you’re going to have to own those markets. Conference USA struggled with that same model. Houston, UCF, SMU Cincy, Memphis, etc are more established brands than Charlotte, FAU, North Texas and Rice. I am excited to see how/if UTSA can grow in the AAC. Different conferences, different identities.

(11-24-2022 04:44 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 04:27 PM)Thewavefan Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 04:19 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 03:13 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  Excellent deep dive on the metrics but the public wants to see Charlotte, they are what we call in this day and age a “sensation”.

The public wants to see UNCC? Outside of the UNCC campus and surrounding area no one knows they exist. App on the other hand has built a brand, beating Michigan, aTm, winnning multiple national fcs championships. What does UNCC have that comes close? Nothing. They were a bad add.

I sincerely hope they get better fast.

It’s markets, they represent the city of Charlotte. People will tune in by the thousands. This is a long term investment that will pay off. There’s a reason people prefer programs like Charlotte, Cincy, Tulane, Memphis over schools like Boise St., Coastal Carolina, Troy, Southern Miss and so on. Markets matter big time, they are the only thing that matters besides academics.

I get that. Long term hopefully it works out and they get good. I'm saying that in the here and now when we needed to replace some solid programs, App would have worked well along with UAB and UTSA. UNCC is a project with no brand. We can't reverse the clock so I sincerely hope they become solid in a hurry.

I completely agree with you. Schools like App St should've been picked over schools like Charlotte, but ESPN who was calling the shots would not allow the AAC to poach from another ESPN property (the SunBelt). Therefore only C-USA teams were options. ESPN used their might to have the AAC and SunBelt pick apart C-USA. Now you can argue the AAC should've taken certain other programs over Charlotte, or only expanded back to 12 instead of 14, but it is what it is. Looking at the C-USA lineup and only being able to pick from C-USA, the only one they didn't pick that probably would've been a better option is Marshall. Otherwise UAB and and UTSA appeared to be top adds. After that I'd have done FAU and Marshall and stopped there. If you had to go to 14 then UNT (to replace SMU if PAC/B12 poaches) and Rice if you wanted elite academics. I guess MTSU or WKU could've been in play also. My preference would've been to add UAB, UTSA, FAU and Marshall to get back to 12 and stop there.

For the sake of the AAC hopefully Charlotte will be able to speed up their development. Maybe they can develop a rivalry with ECU to help build some local interest in the program. Added TV money doesn't hurt either, 10 fold or so over C-USA $$. In the end Charlotte may work out ok and have us all eating crow.

(11-24-2022 10:03 PM)Herdforlife Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 04:27 PM)Thewavefan Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 04:19 PM)PuddlePirate Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 03:13 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  Excellent deep dive on the metrics but the public wants to see Charlotte, they are what we call in this day and age a “sensation”.

The public wants to see UNCC? Outside of the UNCC campus and surrounding area no one knows they exist. App on the other hand has built a brand, beating Michigan, aTm, winnning multiple national fcs championships. What does UNCC have that comes close? Nothing. They were a bad add.

I sincerely hope they get better fast.

It’s markets, they represent the city of Charlotte. People will tune in by the thousands. This is a long term investment that will pay off. There’s a reason people prefer programs like Charlotte, Cincy, Tulane, Memphis over schools like Boise St., Coastal Carolina, Troy, Southern Miss and so on. Markets matter big time, they are the only thing that matters besides academics.

I respect maintaining the identity of having a presence in big markets, but to be successful you’re going to have to own those markets. Conference USA struggled with that same model. Houston, UCF, SMU Cincy, Memphis, etc are more established brands than Charlotte, FAU, North Texas and Rice. I am excited to see how/if UTSA can grow in the AAC. Different conferences, different identities.

Sent from my LM-G820 using CSNbbs mobile app

(11-24-2022 10:26 PM)Once a Knight... Wrote:  I get that. Long term hopefully it works out and they get good. I'm saying that in the here and now when we needed to replace some solid programs, App would have worked well along with UAB and UTSA. UNCC is a project with no brand. We can't reverse the clock so I sincerely hope they become solid in a hurry.

I completely agree with you. Schools like App St should've been picked over schools like Charlotte, but ESPN who was calling the shots would not allow the AAC to poach from another ESPN property (the SunBelt). Therefore only C-USA teams were options. ESPN used their might to have the AAC and SunBelt pick apart C-USA. Now you can argue the AAC should've taken certain other programs over Charlotte, or only expanded back to 12 instead of 14, but it is what it is. Looking at the C-USA lineup and only being able to pick from C-USA, the only one they didn't pick that probably would've been a better option is Marshall. Otherwise UAB and and UTSA appeared to be top adds. After that I'd have done FAU and Marshall and stopped there. If you had to go to 14 then UNT (to replace SMU if PAC/B12 poaches) and Rice if you wanted elite academics. I guess MTSU or WKU could've been in play also. My preference would've been to add UAB, UTSA, FAU and Marshall to get back to 12 and stop there.

For the sake of the AAC hopefully Charlotte will be able to speed up their development. Maybe they can develop a rivalry with ECU to help build some local interest in the program. Added TV money doesn't hurt either, 10 fold or so over C-USA $$. In the end Charlotte may work out ok and have us all eating crow.
Sent from my LM-G820 using CSNbbs mobile app
[/quote]

ACC had to jump to 14 teams to add more inventory since they were losing most of their top bell cow programs (especially Cinci and UCF) so to keep the 11 conf team revenue the same...they bumped up to 14 teams to give ESPN and ESPN+ more inventory...but still at the same total $$ level.

(11-25-2022 08:08 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 10:26 PM)Once a Knight... Wrote:  I get that. Long term hopefully it works out and they get good. I'm saying that in the here and now when we needed to replace some solid programs, App would have worked well along with UAB and UTSA. UNCC is a project with no brand. We can't reverse the clock so I sincerely hope they become solid in a hurry.

I completely agree with you. Schools like App St should've been picked over schools like Charlotte, but ESPN who was calling the shots would not allow the AAC to poach from another ESPN property (the SunBelt). Therefore only C-USA teams were options. ESPN used their might to have the AAC and SunBelt pick apart C-USA. Now you can argue the AAC should've taken certain other programs over Charlotte, or only expanded back to 12 instead of 14, but it is what it is. Looking at the C-USA lineup and only being able to pick from C-USA, the only one they didn't pick that probably would've been a better option is Marshall. Otherwise UAB and and UTSA appeared to be top adds. After that I'd have done FAU and Marshall and stopped there. If you had to go to 14 then UNT (to replace SMU if PAC/B12 poaches) and Rice if you wanted elite academics. I guess MTSU or WKU could've been in play also. My preference would've been to add UAB, UTSA, FAU and Marshall to get back to 12 and stop there.

For the sake of the AAC hopefully Charlotte will be able to speed up their development. Maybe they can develop a rivalry with ECU to help build some local interest in the program. Added TV money doesn't hurt either, 10 fold or so over C-USA $$. In the end Charlotte may work out ok and have us all eating crow.
Sent from my LM-G820 using CSNbbs mobile app

ACC had to jump to 14 teams to add more inventory since they were losing most of their top bell cow programs (especially Cinci and UCF) so to keep the 11 conf team revenue the same...they bumped up to 14 teams to give ESPN and ESPN+ more inventory...but still at the same total $$ level.
[/quote]

Absolutely right on keeping the total dollars for the media deal. It's maddening how many posters here refuse to accept that, when it is so simple.

However, the three programs departing are merely #1, #3, and #5 in viewers of conference controlled inventory 2017-2021. There's no "big three" and no "bell cows" That fact is part of why those foretelling the demise of the American are wrong. We don't need ALL six to ibe worldbeaters, nor any to transform into UCF / Cincinnati overnight -- if the top two or three dojustice to owning the last five CUSA trophies, we'll be okay even if a couple more are cellar dwellers

(11-25-2022 09:04 AM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(11-25-2022 08:08 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(11-24-2022 10:26 PM)Once a Knight... Wrote:  I get that. Long term hopefully it works out and they get good. I'm saying that in the here and now when we needed to replace some solid programs, App would have worked well along with UAB and UTSA. UNCC is a project with no brand. We can't reverse the clock so I sincerely hope they become solid in a hurry.

I completely agree with you. Schools like App St should've been picked over schools like Charlotte, but ESPN who was calling the shots would not allow the AAC to poach from another ESPN property (the SunBelt). Therefore only C-USA teams were options. ESPN used their might to have the AAC and SunBelt pick apart C-USA. Now you can argue the AAC should've taken certain other programs over Charlotte, or only expanded back to 12 instead of 14, but it is what it is. Looking at the C-USA lineup and only being able to pick from C-USA, the only one they didn't pick that probably would've been a better option is Marshall. Otherwise UAB and and UTSA appeared to be top adds. After that I'd have done FAU and Marshall and stopped there. If you had to go to 14 then UNT (to replace SMU if PAC/B12 poaches) and Rice if you wanted elite academics. I guess MTSU or WKU could've been in play also. My preference would've been to add UAB, UTSA, FAU and Marshall to get back to 12 and stop there.

For the sake of the AAC hopefully Charlotte will be able to speed up their development. Maybe they can develop a rivalry with ECU to help build some local interest in the program. Added TV money doesn't hurt either, 10 fold or so over C-USA $$. In the end Charlotte may work out ok and have us all eating crow.
Sent from my LM-G820 using CSNbbs mobile app

ACC had to jump to 14 teams to add more inventory since they were losing most of their top bell cow programs (especially Cinci and UCF) so to keep the 11 conf team revenue the same...they bumped up to 14 teams to give ESPN and ESPN+ more inventory...but still at the same total $$ level.

Absolutely right on keeping the total dollars for the media deal. It's maddening how many posters here refuse to accept that, when it is so simple.

However, the three programs departing are merely #1, #3, and #5 in viewers of conference controlled inventory 2017-2021. There's no "big three" and no "bell cows" That fact is part of why those foretelling the demise of the American are wrong. We don't need ALL six to ibe worldbeaters, nor any to transform into UCF / Cincinnati overnight -- if the top two or three dojustice to owning the last five CUSA trophies, we'll be okay even if a couple more are cellar dwellers
[/quote]

Yes, I get that, maintaining revenue was key. What I'm disgusted by is there are more established and successful brands that were available. Not popular choices for some here but just using the ESPN will not poach other ESPN properties, Marshall and/or Southern Miss would have fit.

Beyond that conversation, and yes I know that the revenue conversation is the most important aspect of this whole thing, but just looking at this from an ECU standpoint, we're stuck playing a make believe rival every year. An upstart project that our fans will not get up for. No matter how much people in the ECU camp will deny it Marshall and Southern Miss or App are teams we have a long history with and would have fit much better for us and the conference from a competition standpoint.

Like I said earlier, can't turn back the clock so we're left hoping UNCC works out.

The metric changed from results on the field to viewership for the top three spots. The goalposts will continue to move. There is always a statistic to support each side of the debate.

(11-25-2022 01:27 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  The metric changed from results on the field to viewership for the top three spots. The goalposts will continue to move. There is always a statistic to support each side of the debate.

It's not moving the goalposts -- it's just that there are SO MANY aspects that make us P6 and you G4.

That's true on field, with the highest ranked AAC team being here for the future, and that's true in so many off field metrics, too.

Please go away and don't come back until there is a Sun Belt team in the CFP rankings.

Hope you had a Happy Thanksgiving.

clt says the UF fan should be banned for mentioning the lowly sunbelt here. They were gone!

Also, Charlotte was the second school added to the AAC after UAB

#P6

(11-25-2022 01:38 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(11-25-2022 01:27 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  The metric changed from results on the field to viewership for the top three spots. The goalposts will continue to move. There is always a statistic to support each side of the debate.

It's not moving the goalposts -- it's just that there are SO MANY aspects that make us P6 and you G4.

That's true on field, with the highest ranked AAC team being here for the future, and that's true in so many off field metrics, too.

Please go away and don't come back until there is a Sun Belt team in the CFP rankings.

Hope you had a Happy Thanksgiving.

Well said. No metrics have changed. The formula has always been the same, markets and academics are the only things that the powers that be care about. SBC fans can talk all they want about winning a game here and there but until they have a team make the NY6 bowl they are the lowest conference on the totem pole and not worthy of even talking to us on a message board. College football is about markets and academics, the rest of the nonsense is arbitrary. Enough of the G4 fans thinking they are in the same universe as the P6, I’ve had enough of the delusion.

P6 doesn’t have exist, never did outside of this board and some commercials P5 teams chuckled at, heck the P5 won’t exist with the latest shift.

(11-25-2022 01:51 PM)Thewavefan Wrote:  

(11-25-2022 01:38 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(11-25-2022 01:27 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  The metric changed from results on the field to viewership for the top three spots. The goalposts will continue to move. There is always a statistic to support each side of the debate.

It's not moving the goalposts -- it's just that there are SO MANY aspects that make us P6 and you G4.

That's true on field, with the highest ranked AAC team being here for the future, and that's true in so many off field metrics, too.

Please go away and don't come back until there is a Sun Belt team in the CFP rankings.

Hope you had a Happy Thanksgiving.

Well said. No metrics have changed. The formula has always been the same, markets and academics are the only things that the powers that be care about. SBC fans can talk all they want about winning a game here and there but until they have a team make the NY6 bowl they are the lowest conference on the totem pole and not worthy of even talking to us on a message board. College football is about markets and academics, the rest of the nonsense is arbitrary. Enough of the G4 fans thinking they are in the same universe as the P6, I’ve had enough of the delusion.

About the bolded, I'm not so sure. Using those metrics, it seems that Tulane would be more valuable on the open realignment market than LSU. Which IMO is not tenable.

(11-25-2022 09:11 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  P6 doesn’t have exist, never did outside of this board and some commercials P5 teams chuckled at, heck the P5 won’t exist with the latest shift.

That's true. I don't think anyone outside the AAC took "P6" seriously. Our bowls and TV deals certainly don't say "P", IMO.

Going forward, we'll have a P2, M3 and G4.

(11-25-2022 01:51 PM)Thewavefan Wrote:  

(11-25-2022 01:38 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(11-25-2022 01:27 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  The metric changed from results on the field to viewership for the top three spots. The goalposts will continue to move. There is always a statistic to support each side of the debate.

It's not moving the goalposts -- it's just that there are SO MANY aspects that make us P6 and you G4.

That's true on field, with the highest ranked AAC team being here for the future, and that's true in so many off field metrics, too.

Please go away and don't come back until there is a Sun Belt team in the CFP rankings.

Hope you had a Happy Thanksgiving.

Well said. No metrics have changed. The formula has always been the same, markets and academics are the only things that the powers that be care about. SBC fans can talk all they want about winning a game here and there but until they have a team make the NY6 bowl they are the lowest conference on the totem pole and not worthy of even talking to us on a message board. College football is about markets and academics, the rest of the nonsense is arbitrary. Enough of the G4 fans thinking they are in the same universe as the P6, I’ve had enough of the delusion.

clt says this is correct.

(11-25-2022 09:35 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(11-25-2022 09:11 PM)Saint3333 Wrote:  P6 doesn’t have exist, never did outside of this board and some commercials P5 teams chuckled at, heck the P5 won’t exist with the latest shift.

That's true. I don't think anyone outside the AAC took "P6" seriously. Our bowls and TV deals certainly don't say "P", IMO.

Going forward, we'll have a P2, M3 and G4.

Nope a P2 and a g8 going forward.
Unless usc and UCLA go big10— then yeah a p2 and g8 will exist.
College football will be dead

In the new CFP format, there is no P5, no autobid. It will take awhile for it to sink in, but the top 6 ranked conference champs get in, regardless of who they are. It is quite realistic for 2 of the champs of the AAC, MWC or SBC to get in ahead of a weak champ from the Big 12, PAC 12 or ACC in a given year. Boise St, SMU, ECU, Tulane, Memphis, SDSU all could accomplish this right off the bat. The stigma of P5 vs A5 will dissipate a good bit, and will begin to affect recruiting.