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What does successful Miller time look like?
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doss2 Offline
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What does successful Miller time look like?
First year - Good recruit /transfer class, winning record, NIT?

Year two - Good recruiting/retention, what win/loss record, NCAA/NIT?

Year three - Over 25 wins, AAC champs or tourney champs, NCAA Elite 8 or better?

Everyone but his Ex seems to love him! What does he need to do to keep your love?
 
04-19-2021 11:33 AM
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skylinecat Online
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
I think expecting Elite 8 might be a little extreme. I want to be in the upper echelon of the AAC at a minimum by year 3 and an 8 seed or better in the tournament. How things shake out at that point I think is more chance than guarantees.
 
04-19-2021 11:44 AM
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bearcatmark Online
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
Best case scenario is we nail a few front court recruits from the portal and are an ncaa team this year.

I think the expectation should be competing for conference championships and solidly in the tournament by year 3.

After that they should be top 10-15 good around 40% of the time or better.

As far as the next two seasons I'm more concerned with process than specific results. I want to be able to see we're heading in the right direction in all respects.
 
(This post was last modified: 04-19-2021 02:13 PM by bearcatmark.)
04-19-2021 11:52 AM
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bearcat54 Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
(04-19-2021 11:33 AM)doss2 Wrote:  First year - Good recruit /transfer class, winning record, NIT?

Year two - Good recruiting/retention, what win/loss record, NCAA/NIT?

Year three - Over 25 wins, AAC champs or tourney champs, NCAA Elite 8 or better?

Everyone but his Ex seems to love him! What does he need to do to keep your love?

Doss, it's best you don't put too much hope on things like this. It might take a few years to get to Elite 8. If it happens, I consider it a blessing and a bonus.
Just sit back and enjoy the games for a while. Uusually those with huge almost instantaneous hoping for final fours become bitter and want coaches fired.
 
04-19-2021 11:56 AM
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doss2 Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
(04-19-2021 11:56 AM)bearcat54 Wrote:  
(04-19-2021 11:33 AM)doss2 Wrote:  First year - Good recruit /transfer class, winning record, NIT?

Year two - Good recruiting/retention, what win/loss record, NCAA/NIT?

Year three - Over 25 wins, AAC champs or tourney champs, NCAA Elite 8 or better?

Everyone but his Ex seems to love him! What does he need to do to keep your love?

Doss, it's best you don't put too much hope on things like this. It might take a few years to get to Elite 8. If it happens, I consider it a blessing and a bonus.
Just sit back and enjoy the games for a while. Uusually those with huge almost instantaneous hoping for final fours become bitter and want coaches fired.

I was not suggesting my metrics of success, I was just throwing out metrics.

Did not Huggs make the Final Four in year 3?
 
04-19-2021 12:04 PM
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Z-Fly Online
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
(04-19-2021 12:04 PM)doss2 Wrote:  
(04-19-2021 11:56 AM)bearcat54 Wrote:  
(04-19-2021 11:33 AM)doss2 Wrote:  First year - Good recruit /transfer class, winning record, NIT?

Year two - Good recruiting/retention, what win/loss record, NCAA/NIT?

Year three - Over 25 wins, AAC champs or tourney champs, NCAA Elite 8 or better?

Everyone but his Ex seems to love him! What does he need to do to keep your love?

Doss, it's best you don't put too much hope on things like this. It might take a few years to get to Elite 8. If it happens, I consider it a blessing and a bonus.
Just sit back and enjoy the games for a while. Uusually those with huge almost instantaneous hoping for final fours become bitter and want coaches fired.

I was not suggesting my metrics of success, I was just throwing out metrics.

Did not Huggs make the Final Four in year 3?

That was 30 years ago and he's a HOF coach.
 
04-19-2021 12:08 PM
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
(04-19-2021 11:52 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  Best case scenario is we nail a few front court recruits from the portal and are an ncaa team this year.

I think the expectation should be competing for conference championships and solidly in the tournament by year 3.

After that they should be top 10-15 good around 40% of the time or better.

As far as the next two seasons I'm more concerned with process than specific results. I want to be able to see were heading in the right direction in all respects.

Bolded, I'll take this more optimistic scenario. Less a handful of head scratching losses, this team would have taken Wichita State's slot in the NCAA this past year. And finishing in the upper echelon of this particular conference should be a given--this isn't the ACC and if Miller is the coach we believe he can be, he's going to have the 'Cats in the hunt quickly and in the top 3-4 or better, in the conference consistently.
 
04-19-2021 01:08 PM
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bearcat_df Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
Year one - the team competes.
By year 2-3 back to competing for AAC championships (regular and tourney) and NCCA bid.

Be nice to make it to the second weekend by year 4-5. I think we should expect this level of success once every 4 years or so.

I don’t ever want to watch how weak and lost the team looked in some of the early season games last year; or the games against Houston. I’m trying to recall if we have ever looked that weak since before Huggins.

Even when we were depleted and had FB players on the roster, we played w toughness and were competitive
 
04-19-2021 01:37 PM
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Cat-Man Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
[Image: miller-time.jpg]
 
04-19-2021 01:47 PM
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BrooklynRocket Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
Year 1:
-No bad losses in OOC
-Finish top 5 in AAC
-Top 100 KenPom

Year 2:
-NIT bid/compete for at-large NCAA bid

Year 3:
-NCAA bid

Ideally also beat Xavier in 2 of the next 3 games.
 
04-19-2021 01:51 PM
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cinbinsportsfan Online
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
Year 1 for me, regardless of record: Establish an identity. By the end of year 1 I want to have a good handle on what Wes Miller's culture is going to be at Cincinnati. By year 2 of the Brannen era I still had no idea what it was; man-to-man defense until it became a layup line then maybe use zone? Sprint-instead-of jog on offense and shoot a bunch of threes? Emphasize the center position but also lean on small-ball lineups?

By this time next year I want to be confident in understanding the culture Miller is going to establish here. Years 2 - ??? will take care of itself after that.
 
04-19-2021 01:56 PM
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
Basically be an NIT/NCAA bubble team in year one and an NCAA team after that. That really is the expectation at Cincinnati no matter who the coach is and what the circumstances are.
 
04-19-2021 01:57 PM
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natibeast21 Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
(04-19-2021 01:51 PM)BrooklynRocket Wrote:  Year 1:
-No bad losses in OOC
-Finish top 5 in AAC
-Top 100 KenPom

Year 2:
-NIT bid/compete for at-large NCAA bid

Year 3:
-NCAA bid

Ideally also beat Xavier in 2 of the next 3 games.

I like this. Very reasonable expectations for where the program was at when he picked it up and he has exceeded my first 3-4 day expectations thus far by a lot. For now I’m just along for the ride!

In a perfect world, we get Eason back and get some quality transfers to go along with the young or at least former Bearcat core that recommitted and the guys that stayed. If that occurs then we could maybe even sneak into the tourney next year, and have guys that would then have great experience moving forward, but that would be perfection.

It’s hard to project to far into the future with the way the current basketball landscape is IMO.
 
04-19-2021 02:09 PM
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robertfoshizzle Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
I just hope people aren't calling for his job if he doesn't get off to a fast start in year 1. Tired of the knee-jerk reactions. I think BrooklynRocket's expectations are very reasonable.
 
04-19-2021 02:12 PM
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Banter Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
(04-19-2021 01:37 PM)bearcat_df Wrote:  Year one - the team competes.
By year 2-3 back to competing for AAC championships (regular and tourney) and NCCA bid.

Be nice to make it to the second weekend by year 4-5. I think we should expect this level of success once every 4 years or so.

I don’t ever want to watch how weak and lost the team looked in some of the early season games last year; or the games against Houston. I’m trying to recall if we have ever looked that weak since before Huggins.

Even when we were depleted and had FB players on the roster, we played w toughness and were competitive

I feel like that is selective memory. In my time as a student in just 2006-2010 we got our doors blown off by
OSU (22pts)
Memphis (33pts)
UAB (19pts)
Georgetown (20pts)
and the real gem... we lost to UCONN 51-96...

We were terrible in my time at UC, and anyone who thinks we played those early Cronin years with grit an toughness is mistaking it for desperation by a team who was routinely losing games by 15 points.
 
04-19-2021 02:14 PM
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robertfoshizzle Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
(04-19-2021 02:14 PM)Banter Wrote:  
(04-19-2021 01:37 PM)bearcat_df Wrote:  Year one - the team competes.
By year 2-3 back to competing for AAC championships (regular and tourney) and NCCA bid.

Be nice to make it to the second weekend by year 4-5. I think we should expect this level of success once every 4 years or so.

I don’t ever want to watch how weak and lost the team looked in some of the early season games last year; or the games against Houston. I’m trying to recall if we have ever looked that weak since before Huggins.

Even when we were depleted and had FB players on the roster, we played w toughness and were competitive

I feel like that is selective memory. In my time as a student in just 2006-2010 we got our doors blown off by
OSU (22pts)
Memphis (33pts)
UAB (19pts)
Georgetown (20pts)
and the real gem... we lost to UCONN 51-96...

We were terrible in my time at UC, and anyone who thinks we played those early Cronin years with grit an toughness is mistaking it for desperation by a team who was routinely losing games by 15 points.

Notre Dame beat us by almost 40 in the Big East Tournament in Mick's first tournament season. I also remember getting beaten by 20+ to VCU, Georgetown, and SMU during our run of tournament appearances. Blowouts just happen sometimes.
 
(This post was last modified: 04-19-2021 02:21 PM by robertfoshizzle.)
04-19-2021 02:21 PM
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
Right out of the gate?

Have a personality.

Bring energy and toughness back.

Form a real identity...nobody could say what UC hung its hat on the past 2 years.

Hire a quality coaching staff.

Hire a great S&C guy.

Backfill with some decent foundational guys in the portal to even out the classes.

Not turn the ball over a ton, rebound and not play like we want to avoid contact.

Do that and the wins will take care of themselves.
 
(This post was last modified: 04-19-2021 02:22 PM by rath v2.0.)
04-19-2021 02:22 PM
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
LOL, the hated Brannen played in the conference championship game in year 2 and I think was the #1 seed in year 1. But hey, for some we now have a coach, with expectations below the accomplishments of the hated Brannen. Absolutely laughable.
 
04-19-2021 02:23 PM
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Banter Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
(04-19-2021 02:21 PM)robertfoshizzle Wrote:  
(04-19-2021 02:14 PM)Banter Wrote:  
(04-19-2021 01:37 PM)bearcat_df Wrote:  Year one - the team competes.
By year 2-3 back to competing for AAC championships (regular and tourney) and NCCA bid.

Be nice to make it to the second weekend by year 4-5. I think we should expect this level of success once every 4 years or so.

I don’t ever want to watch how weak and lost the team looked in some of the early season games last year; or the games against Houston. I’m trying to recall if we have ever looked that weak since before Huggins.

Even when we were depleted and had FB players on the roster, we played w toughness and were competitive

I feel like that is selective memory. In my time as a student in just 2006-2010 we got our doors blown off by
OSU (22pts)
Memphis (33pts)
UAB (19pts)
Georgetown (20pts)
and the real gem... we lost to UCONN 51-96...

We were terrible in my time at UC, and anyone who thinks we played those early Cronin years with grit an toughness is mistaking it for desperation by a team who was routinely losing games by 15 points.

Notre Dame beat us by almost 40 in the Big East Tournament in Mick's first tournament season. I also remember getting beaten by 20+ to VCU, Georgetown, and SMU during our run of tournament appearances. Blowouts just happen sometimes.

Which is exactly why I am not up in arms about those Houston games. I would have liked them to be more competitive, but that was a very good Houston team against a bunch of Freshman and a coach who lost the team. People will forget about those eventually, just like we don't talk about the 50 point loss to UCONN.
 
04-19-2021 02:24 PM
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robertfoshizzle Offline
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RE: What does successful Miller time look like?
(04-19-2021 02:23 PM)Bcatbog Wrote:  LOL, the hated Brannen played in the conference championship game in year 2 and I think was the #1 seed in year 1. But hey, for some we now have a coach, with expectations below the accomplishments of the hated Brannen. Absolutely laughable.

Well, your boy Brannen didn't leave Wes a whole lot to work with. So, yeah, expectations for Miller are lower than they were for Brannen in year 1.
 
04-19-2021 02:30 PM
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