(02-28-2020 10:49 PM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(02-28-2020 10:10 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(02-28-2020 01:52 PM)uskjtc02 Wrote:  

(02-28-2020 01:13 PM)gusrob Wrote:  

(02-28-2020 01:01 PM)SeñorTiger Wrote:  According to his quote above it does not sound like he does...

You want to argue my observations. Really? ok.....

As a fanbase, we need a break. Even some of our more level headed fans are at wits end. I know I am. But I truly believe Penny is the right man for the job. He’s learning as he goes. He only wants what’s best for Memphis. I’m going to support him for as long as possible. I believe if it comes a time to where he sees he can’t get it done he will step down. But he deserves another year or 2 of our support.

If his teams start producing in the next 1, 2 or even 3 years I'm willing to make him coach for life. I love the guy but I'm sure we all agree that no one is beyond constructive criticism when they aren't producing. But I'll admit that I've gone off the deep end at times in my frustration, especially in the heat of the moment, and shouldn't.

But there is a difference in that and the flat out stupidity (check out twitter) of some people that claim to be fans. I have one that has said that he won't win 10 games next season and will not sign a single recruit and will likely lose half the team. That is just outright stupidity!

Anyone that thinks this team's problems this season aren't due to JW leaving and DJ getting hurt is just wanting to focus on negatives. Yes, it is frustrating; however, the team that is playing right now is NOT in ANY shape the team we are geared to be playing. Anyone that judges Penny as an overall coach based on this team, either doesn't know basketball or just isn't adjusting to the disappointment that is this season.

EVERY struggle of this team would be radically changed if you had JW and DJ playing and that is 100% fact. Teams are simply not having to adjust to the threat JW would provide and DJ is a matchup trouble if a team is having to play against PA and JW. The guards would be more open for shooting, the halfcourt play would be radically different. Players would actually be playing in positions they were actually recruited to play and playing the minutes they are geared to play. Everything about this team would be radically different.

Sure as hell can't argue with any of that but it can be easy to lose sight of it given the expectations we all had. Something like tunnel vision sets in and boom, people like me go nuts and then regret it. I don't know how many times I've looked back through game threads and asked myself "self, what in the hell is your problem??".

It's the coaches job to make adjustments in the game plan pregame and during the game.

We still haven't adjusted to losing Wiseman? Jeffries?

Nobody is expecting us to look like world beaters without them but to lose some of the games we've lost. Well, it's not all on the players. We are undisciplined, anyone can see that.

Lomaxs behind the back turnover last game is a microcosm of this season.

I love Penny and Im pulling for him but there are some major question marks around this team right now. The one real positive going forward is that we are VERY strong defensively.

(02-29-2020 06:14 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(02-28-2020 10:49 PM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(02-28-2020 10:10 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(02-28-2020 01:52 PM)uskjtc02 Wrote:  

(02-28-2020 01:13 PM)gusrob Wrote:  You want to argue my observations. Really? ok.....

As a fanbase, we need a break. Even some of our more level headed fans are at wits end. I know I am. But I truly believe Penny is the right man for the job. He’s learning as he goes. He only wants what’s best for Memphis. I’m going to support him for as long as possible. I believe if it comes a time to where he sees he can’t get it done he will step down. But he deserves another year or 2 of our support.

If his teams start producing in the next 1, 2 or even 3 years I'm willing to make him coach for life. I love the guy but I'm sure we all agree that no one is beyond constructive criticism when they aren't producing. But I'll admit that I've gone off the deep end at times in my frustration, especially in the heat of the moment, and shouldn't.

But there is a difference in that and the flat out stupidity (check out twitter) of some people that claim to be fans. I have one that has said that he won't win 10 games next season and will not sign a single recruit and will likely lose half the team. That is just outright stupidity!

Anyone that thinks this team's problems this season aren't due to JW leaving and DJ getting hurt is just wanting to focus on negatives. Yes, it is frustrating; however, the team that is playing right now is NOT in ANY shape the team we are geared to be playing. Anyone that judges Penny as an overall coach based on this team, either doesn't know basketball or just isn't adjusting to the disappointment that is this season.

EVERY struggle of this team would be radically changed if you had JW and DJ playing and that is 100% fact. Teams are simply not having to adjust to the threat JW would provide and DJ is a matchup trouble if a team is having to play against PA and JW. The guards would be more open for shooting, the halfcourt play would be radically different. Players would actually be playing in positions they were actually recruited to play and playing the minutes they are geared to play. Everything about this team would be radically different.

Sure as hell can't argue with any of that but it can be easy to lose sight of it given the expectations we all had. Something like tunnel vision sets in and boom, people like me go nuts and then regret it. I don't know how many times I've looked back through game threads and asked myself "self, what in the hell is your problem??".

Trust me, I TOTALLY understand. Sometimes I am so strong in my statements because it is to remind myself, as much as anyone else.

Only an idiot thinks that this team should be able to just "adjust" to losing two of its three best players and that wouldn't radically change the outcome of the season. BUT, anyone can get frustrated with how things are happening. I was jumping up and down at some of the play and yelling at the tv, "why do you have in both small guards!" and then was reminded that one had fouled out and the other had been spotty at best. Then Harris hits what was essentially the game winner and I realize sometimes I should just say Go Tigers!

The fact that we are remotely talking about the bubble and what we could do to get there... it's testament to how good the coaches are doing and players are playing. Even if at times it drives me crazy.

(02-29-2020 06:48 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  It's the coaches job to make adjustments in the game plan pregame and during the game.

We still haven't adjusted to losing Wiseman? Jeffries?

Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

(03-01-2020 08:49 AM)GTigers Wrote:  

(02-29-2020 06:48 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  It's the coaches job to make adjustments in the game plan pregame and during the game.

We still haven't adjusted to losing Wiseman? Jeffries?

Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 08:49 AM)GTigers Wrote:  

(02-29-2020 06:48 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  It's the coaches job to make adjustments in the game plan pregame and during the game.

We still haven't adjusted to losing Wiseman? Jeffries?

Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

Exactly.

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 08:49 AM)GTigers Wrote:  

(02-29-2020 06:48 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  It's the coaches job to make adjustments in the game plan pregame and during the game.

We still haven't adjusted to losing Wiseman? Jeffries?

Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 08:49 AM)GTigers Wrote:  

(02-29-2020 06:48 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  It's the coaches job to make adjustments in the game plan pregame and during the game.

We still haven't adjusted to losing Wiseman? Jeffries?

Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

I get what you are saying but translating the NBA to college is absurd. Teams that are not making the playoffs have a well known trend of tanking. Golden State has no incentive to try and finish 9th or 10th in their conference. It was pretty well known they were tanking this season so they could make a run at possibly the #1 overall pick once it was decided neither Steph or Klay would be playing anymore.

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 08:49 AM)GTigers Wrote:  

(02-29-2020 06:48 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  It's the coaches job to make adjustments in the game plan pregame and during the game.

We still haven't adjusted to losing Wiseman? Jeffries?

Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

Hyperbole maybe? Durant, Curry, Thompson, Eguodala, Livingston gone? No wonder we can't have a discussion based on reality.

(03-02-2020 10:11 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 08:49 AM)GTigers Wrote:  

(02-29-2020 06:48 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  It's the coaches job to make adjustments in the game plan pregame and during the game.

We still haven't adjusted to losing Wiseman? Jeffries?

Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

Hyperbole maybe? Durant, Curry, Thompson, Eguodala, Livingston gone? No wonder we can't have a discussion based on reality.

Yes, because you won't admit that Durant, Eguodala and Livingston are like our seniors graduating and Curry and Thompson are like JW and DJ not playing.

See, the way I see it is some people will never see the forest through the trees. If you don't think Golden State with Thompson and Curry playing all season, regardless of why they are missing games, isn't a playoff team then you need help. Everything else you tossed on is hyperbole and distracts from the real conversation.

(03-02-2020 10:03 AM)SeñorTiger Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 08:49 AM)GTigers Wrote:  

(02-29-2020 06:48 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  It's the coaches job to make adjustments in the game plan pregame and during the game.

We still haven't adjusted to losing Wiseman? Jeffries?

Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

I get what you are saying but translating the NBA to college is absurd. Teams that are not making the playoffs have a well known trend of tanking. Golden State has no incentive to try and finish 9th or 10th in their conference. It was pretty well known they were tanking this season so they could make a run at possibly the #1 overall pick once it was decided neither Steph or Klay would be playing anymore.

All true.
It was just a ridiculous example for a ridiculous topic that we continue to have to discuss here, because some folks have no reality for what they think we should be accomplishing right now. They keep saying things like "good coaches adjust - why haven't we by now".

I could have easily used a dozen actual college teams to make the point, but it doesn't seem to get everyone's attention as much.

Cal - 2013 UK - Noel
Self - 2019 KU - Azubuike
K - 2019 Duke - Zion
Roy - 2020 UNC - Anthony

just to name a few...

(03-02-2020 12:21 PM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 10:11 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 08:49 AM)GTigers Wrote:  Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

Hyperbole maybe? Durant, Curry, Thompson, Eguodala, Livingston gone? No wonder we can't have a discussion based on reality.

Yes, because you won't admit that Durant, Eguodala and Livingston are like our seniors graduating and Curry and Thompson are like JW and DJ not playing.

See, the way I see it is some people will never see the forest through the trees. If you don't think Golden State with Thompson and Curry playing all season, regardless of why they are missing games, isn't a playoff team then you need help. Everything else you tossed on is hyperbole and distracts from the real conversation.

You can't see the forest or the trees with that logic. GS lost all 5 since last season - and with Durant & Curry, they are top 5 players in the NBA.

(03-02-2020 12:31 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 10:03 AM)SeñorTiger Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 08:49 AM)GTigers Wrote:  Many fans have not. They’ve not understood without those two, especially Wiseman, this was not necessarily a top 25 team. Penny has adjusted but it doesn’t replace the talent and potential that was built into expectations.

It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

I get what you are saying but translating the NBA to college is absurd. Teams that are not making the playoffs have a well known trend of tanking. Golden State has no incentive to try and finish 9th or 10th in their conference. It was pretty well known they were tanking this season so they could make a run at possibly the #1 overall pick once it was decided neither Steph or Klay would be playing anymore.

All true.
It was just a ridiculous example for a ridiculous topic that we continue to have to discuss here, because some folks have no reality for what they think we should be accomplishing right now. They keep saying things like "good coaches adjust - why haven't we by now".

I could have easily used a dozen actual college teams to make the point, but it doesn't seem to get everyone's attention as much.

Cal - 2013 UK - Noel
Self - 2019 KU - Azubuike
K - 2019 Duke - Zion
Roy - 2020 UNC - Anthony

just to name a few...

The frustration is not that we are no longer a championship caliber team. It is the fact that we are losing to and struggling with teams that we clearly have superior talent to even without Wiseman and DJ.

We are losing to teams like SMU, Tulsa by 40 and South Florida. We are struggling with ECU, Tulane. That is the frustration, not the fact that we are not national champion contenders anymore. There is a pretty significant difference you are ignoring.

(03-02-2020 02:58 PM)SeñorTiger Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 12:31 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 10:03 AM)SeñorTiger Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

I get what you are saying but translating the NBA to college is absurd. Teams that are not making the playoffs have a well known trend of tanking. Golden State has no incentive to try and finish 9th or 10th in their conference. It was pretty well known they were tanking this season so they could make a run at possibly the #1 overall pick once it was decided neither Steph or Klay would be playing anymore.

All true.
It was just a ridiculous example for a ridiculous topic that we continue to have to discuss here, because some folks have no reality for what they think we should be accomplishing right now. They keep saying things like "good coaches adjust - why haven't we by now".

I could have easily used a dozen actual college teams to make the point, but it doesn't seem to get everyone's attention as much.

Cal - 2013 UK - Noel
Self - 2019 KU - Azubuike
K - 2019 Duke - Zion
Roy - 2020 UNC - Anthony

just to name a few...

The frustration is not that we are no longer a championship caliber team. It is the fact that we are losing to and struggling with teams that we clearly have superior talent to even without Wiseman and DJ.

We are losing to teams like SMU, Tulsa by 40 and South Florida. We are struggling with ECU, Tulane. That is the frustration, not the fact that we are not national champion contenders anymore. There is a pretty significant difference you are ignoring.

Dead on the money. I never bought into the championship hype to begin with, but dont tell me it is acceptable to get beat by SMU, South Florida, and absolutely get manhandled blown out by Tulsa.

I wouldnt buy into a ridiculous championship and I wont buy into a ridiculously blown out game against Tulsa.

(03-02-2020 12:40 PM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 12:21 PM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 10:11 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

Hyperbole maybe? Durant, Curry, Thompson, Eguodala, Livingston gone? No wonder we can't have a discussion based on reality.

Yes, because you won't admit that Durant, Eguodala and Livingston are like our seniors graduating and Curry and Thompson are like JW and DJ not playing.

See, the way I see it is some people will never see the forest through the trees. If you don't think Golden State with Thompson and Curry playing all season, regardless of why they are missing games, isn't a playoff team then you need help. Everything else you tossed on is hyperbole and distracts from the real conversation.

You can't see the forest or the trees with that logic. GS lost all 5 since last season - and with Durant & Curry, they are top 5 players in the NBA.

How about we talk about Duke then...

No Vernon Carey 17.6 points (Wiseman)
No Cassius Stanley for 5 games 12.1 Points (Lester)
And No Matthew Hurt for 15 games 10.2 Points (DJ)

Are you seriously going to argue that Coach K would still have them ranked in that situation?

It would be pretty close to the same situation with them only having their All american caliber point guard playing the entire season (Precious).

You want to have a honest conversation based on a fair equivalency...Lets discuss this.

(03-02-2020 02:58 PM)SeñorTiger Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 12:31 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 10:03 AM)SeñorTiger Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

I get what you are saying but translating the NBA to college is absurd. Teams that are not making the playoffs have a well known trend of tanking. Golden State has no incentive to try and finish 9th or 10th in their conference. It was pretty well known they were tanking this season so they could make a run at possibly the #1 overall pick once it was decided neither Steph or Klay would be playing anymore.

All true.
It was just a ridiculous example for a ridiculous topic that we continue to have to discuss here, because some folks have no reality for what they think we should be accomplishing right now. They keep saying things like "good coaches adjust - why haven't we by now".

I could have easily used a dozen actual college teams to make the point, but it doesn't seem to get everyone's attention as much.

Cal - 2013 UK - Noel
Self - 2019 KU - Azubuike
K - 2019 Duke - Zion
Roy - 2020 UNC - Anthony

just to name a few...

The frustration is not that we are no longer a championship caliber team. It is the fact that we are losing to and struggling with teams that we clearly have superior talent to even without Wiseman and DJ.

We are losing to teams like SMU, Tulsa by 40 and South Florida. We are struggling with ECU, Tulane. That is the frustration, not the fact that we are not national champion contenders anymore. There is a pretty significant difference you are ignoring.

no

No one has mentioned winning a championship. The point we were discussing was a comment about us not adjusting to losing Wiseman and Jeffries. So the counter-point is (as discussed ad nauseam but still evidently necessary)...young teams losing key pieces struggle. It ALWAYS happens. Yeah, we can all get frustrated. But to say things like "why haven't our coaches adjusted" is simply ignorance.

There has never been a team losing 2 of their top 3 guys before Feb 1, who have even made it into the NCAA tourney. We are hoping for and you are expecting something that has never happened.

The examples I gave were not NC contenders that made deep runs but failed to grab the ring after injuries. The examples are NC contenders that weren't even tourney caliber teams after the injuries.

(03-02-2020 04:13 PM)memtigbb Wrote:  Dead on the money. I never bought into the championship hype to begin with, but dont tell me it is acceptable to get beat by SMU, South Florida, and absolutely get manhandled blown out by Tulsa.

I wouldnt buy into a ridiculous championship and I wont buy into a ridiculously blown out game against Tulsa.

Sorry, but it's sports. You lose some head-scratchers, especially when 18-year olds are involved. The Tulsa fiasco was terrible. It was also obviously an aberration - a fluke. The only time they've given up all year.

There have been plenty of weird ones across basketball this year. Not "acceptable" but what's the alternative? Keep talking about it?

(03-02-2020 12:40 PM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 12:21 PM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 10:11 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(03-01-2020 10:06 AM)MvETigers Wrote:  It does tend to blow one's mind that some people know so little about things that you just "adjust" to losing the best player in the nation and then losing your third best player after that. Especially when your whole team, not to mention everything you've spent all pre-season and half of the season gearing up for changed radically.

The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

Hyperbole maybe? Durant, Curry, Thompson, Eguodala, Livingston gone? No wonder we can't have a discussion based on reality.

Yes, because you won't admit that Durant, Eguodala and Livingston are like our seniors graduating and Curry and Thompson are like JW and DJ not playing.

See, the way I see it is some people will never see the forest through the trees. If you don't think Golden State with Thompson and Curry playing all season, regardless of why they are missing games, isn't a playoff team then you need help. Everything else you tossed on is hyperbole and distracts from the real conversation.

You can't see the forest or the trees with that logic. GS lost all 5 since last season - and with Durant & Curry, they are top 5 players in the NBA.

And JW is the #1 recruit in the nation. Durant was gone like a graduating senior, so to use him in the conversation is kind of stupid. You can say that it's not logical, but it is you that is losing that argument.

The fact that with two injuries, Golden State went from an NBA Championship caliber team to one of the worst in the NBA shows that it goes a lot further than just coaching or adjustments. Once again, if you don't think if Golden State had Curry and Thompson all season they wouldn't be one of the top teams in the NBA then you don't watch basketball and I really don't believe it to be the case. The fact is Golden State is built around their top players and without them, they don't have a team. There is no adjusting to the loss of those two, regardless of how good the coach is or who else is on the team. If they were both to come back tomorrow, Golden State has a chance to make the playoffs.

(03-02-2020 06:29 PM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 12:40 PM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 12:21 PM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 10:11 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 09:53 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  The real question is why hasn't Steve Kerr adjusted with the GS Warriors? They've played 61 games by now. And he was even allowed to backfill roster spots for injured Curry and Thompson - unlike in college. Good coaches make adjustments and overcome. Smart fans keep expectations high - lest the team use injuries as an excuse, and rest on its laurels. Since they are the worst team in the NBA, Kerr must be a bad coach. And their fans must be no good, because I don't hear any outrage from them.

Hyperbole maybe? Durant, Curry, Thompson, Eguodala, Livingston gone? No wonder we can't have a discussion based on reality.

Yes, because you won't admit that Durant, Eguodala and Livingston are like our seniors graduating and Curry and Thompson are like JW and DJ not playing.

See, the way I see it is some people will never see the forest through the trees. If you don't think Golden State with Thompson and Curry playing all season, regardless of why they are missing games, isn't a playoff team then you need help. Everything else you tossed on is hyperbole and distracts from the real conversation.

You can't see the forest or the trees with that logic. GS lost all 5 since last season - and with Durant & Curry, they are top 5 players in the NBA.

And JW is the #1 recruit in the nation. Durant was gone like a graduating senior, so to use him in the conversation is kind of stupid. You can say that it's not logical, but it is you that is losing that argument.

The fact that with two injuries, Golden State went from an NBA Championship caliber team to one of the worst in the NBA shows that it goes a lot further than just coaching or adjustments. Once again, if you don't think if Golden State had Curry and Thompson all season they wouldn't be one of the top teams in the NBA then you don't watch basketball and I really don't believe it to be the case. The fact is Golden State is built around their top players and without them, they don't have a team. There is no adjusting to the loss of those two, regardless of how good the coach is or who else is on the team. If they were both to come back tomorrow, Golden State has a chance to make the playoffs.

I agree that losing a bunch of talent hurt the tigers...

But to say the team was BUILT around Wiseman and they haven't been able to adjust to that is not true. This team just doesn't have enough talent/experience to excel (I will admit they should play smarter) and much of that is due to not having Wiseman. I don't think it has a thing to do with strategy issues because they were built to play with Wiseman.

(03-02-2020 06:39 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 06:29 PM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 12:40 PM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 12:21 PM)MvETigers Wrote:  

(03-02-2020 10:11 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  Hyperbole maybe? Durant, Curry, Thompson, Eguodala, Livingston gone? No wonder we can't have a discussion based on reality.

Yes, because you won't admit that Durant, Eguodala and Livingston are like our seniors graduating and Curry and Thompson are like JW and DJ not playing.

See, the way I see it is some people will never see the forest through the trees. If you don't think Golden State with Thompson and Curry playing all season, regardless of why they are missing games, isn't a playoff team then you need help. Everything else you tossed on is hyperbole and distracts from the real conversation.

You can't see the forest or the trees with that logic. GS lost all 5 since last season - and with Durant & Curry, they are top 5 players in the NBA.

And JW is the #1 recruit in the nation. Durant was gone like a graduating senior, so to use him in the conversation is kind of stupid. You can say that it's not logical, but it is you that is losing that argument.

The fact that with two injuries, Golden State went from an NBA Championship caliber team to one of the worst in the NBA shows that it goes a lot further than just coaching or adjustments. Once again, if you don't think if Golden State had Curry and Thompson all season they wouldn't be one of the top teams in the NBA then you don't watch basketball and I really don't believe it to be the case. The fact is Golden State is built around their top players and without them, they don't have a team. There is no adjusting to the loss of those two, regardless of how good the coach is or who else is on the team. If they were both to come back tomorrow, Golden State has a chance to make the playoffs.

I agree that losing a bunch of talent hurt the tigers...

But to say the team was BUILT around Wiseman and they haven't been able to adjust to that is not true. This team just doesn't have enough talent/experience to excel (I will admit they should play smarter) and much of that is due to not having Wiseman. I don't think it has a thing to do with strategy issues because they were built to play with Wiseman.

It's a bit of a semantic argument though. IF Wiseman was here, most of the issues this team is having are wiped out. The cure to poor guard play is dominant front court play. The cure to shooting issues, have a dominant Center that causes defenses to collapse. The cure to undersized defenders, funnel them down low where there is a dominant defender. Not to mention, the cure to having players play out of position... have them play the positions they were recruited to play.

I do believe that the team isn't built like a Villanova, but is having to play that style, which is causing players to push too much. Penny could crack down and make them run set offenses, but I honestly think his coaching will pay off HUGE next year if we add a couple of more pieces.

I think it is completely true to say you simply don't "adjust" to losing your #1 and #3 players, especially when you're #1 changes the complete dynamic of the team.