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Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
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ManleyPointer Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-20-2017 08:34 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  
(03-20-2017 08:32 PM)YNot Wrote:  
(03-20-2017 08:18 PM)bluesox Wrote:  The simplest answer is usually right so gonzaga as team 12 in the mwc to offset Hawaii football only if they want to move. Seattle u replaces gonzaga in the wcc, not sure what byu would do though. If byu isn't happy in the wcc post gonzaga leaving maybe Wichita state and byu without football to the mwc.

No way does BYU remain in the WCC without Gonzaga. None.

Where would you go? Certainly not the MW without football.

AAC with Wichita State.
03-20-2017 09:23 PM
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-20-2017 09:23 PM)ManleyPointer Wrote:  
(03-20-2017 08:34 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  
(03-20-2017 08:32 PM)YNot Wrote:  
(03-20-2017 08:18 PM)bluesox Wrote:  The simplest answer is usually right so gonzaga as team 12 in the mwc to offset Hawaii football only if they want to move. Seattle u replaces gonzaga in the wcc, not sure what byu would do though. If byu isn't happy in the wcc post gonzaga leaving maybe Wichita state and byu without football to the mwc.

No way does BYU remain in the WCC without Gonzaga. None.

Where would you go? Certainly not the MW without football.

AAC with Wichita State.

Only if you bring football.
(This post was last modified: 03-21-2017 07:35 AM by billybobby777.)
03-20-2017 09:35 PM
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HawaiiMongoose Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
If the AAC invites Wichita State then the MWC inviting Gonzaga would be a compelling strategic countermove. MWC basketball has been down a bit recently but even so membership in the conference would offer the Zags an opportunity to compete with programs that have higher profiles, more fan support and better facilities than most of Gonzaga's WCC opponents. Plus the move would have the side benefit of ramping up the pressure on BYU to return. The Cougars could opt for the AAC as an alternative but the travel would be much tougher on their players and fans.
03-21-2017 01:07 AM
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orangefan Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-21-2017 01:07 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  If the AAC invites Wichita State then the MWC inviting Gonzaga would be a compelling strategic countermove. MWC basketball has been down a bit recently but even so membership in the conference would offer the Zags an opportunity to compete with programs that have higher profiles, more fan support and better facilities than most of Gonzaga's WCC opponents. Plus the move would have the side benefit of ramping up the pressure on BYU to return. The Cougars could opt for the AAC as an alternative but the travel would be much tougher on their players and fans.

Agreed. Outside of Gonzaga and BYU, the members of the WCC average just over 2,000 fans a game in attendance. By comparison, the MWC average over 7,000.
03-21-2017 07:28 AM
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MWC Tex Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-21-2017 01:07 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  If the AAC invites Wichita State then the MWC inviting Gonzaga would be a compelling strategic countermove. MWC basketball has been down a bit recently but even so membership in the conference would offer the Zags an opportunity to compete with programs that have higher profiles, more fan support and better facilities than most of Gonzaga's WCC opponents. Plus the move would have the side benefit of ramping up the pressure on BYU to return. The Cougars could opt for the AAC as an alternative but the travel would be much tougher on their players and fans.

I doubt BYU would move to the AAC because that means they gave in to moving all sports including football to a G5 conference with Utah in the PAC-12.
BYU would have to stay in the WCC unless they bring their football program into the MW or AAC.
This could be an intriguing move if the MW and Gonzaga do make a move. Hawaii will always be an affiliate member in football and rests in a decent conference that only has to travel basically to LA for all other sports.
Gonzaga has no intention of playing football, so the MW doesn't have to worry about a start up program for football (Although, I wouldn't mind if they did as that gives the MW a presence in Washington.
BYU is stuck in the WCC unless they move the football to a G5 conference. Maybe BYU could win a WCC title then.
If it does pressure BYU (highly unlikely) to join the MW, then UTEP could round out the conference. If not then MW is just fine with 12 football and then 12 basketball.

**The other big caveat is what happens to the men's soccer team? GU is a powerhouse soccer school and the WCC is a powerhouse soccer conference. With Gonzaga, the MW would have enough schools (6) to have a championship in that sport. The MW would then have SJSU, SDSU, NM, AF, UNLV & GU. NM would have to leave CUSA. SJSU, UNLV and AF the WAC and SDSU the PAC-12.
On that end, I wonder if the PAC-12 would want to bring in the MW schools in then to have 10 or 11 teams.
If fact with the PAC only have 5 schools plus SDSU, I wonder why they haven't brought in SJSU, UNLV, AF and NM to get a nice 10 team conference.
(This post was last modified: 03-21-2017 08:26 AM by MWC Tex.)
03-21-2017 08:13 AM
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-21-2017 07:28 AM)orangefan Wrote:  
(03-21-2017 01:07 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  If the AAC invites Wichita State then the MWC inviting Gonzaga would be a compelling strategic countermove. MWC basketball has been down a bit recently but even so membership in the conference would offer the Zags an opportunity to compete with programs that have higher profiles, more fan support and better facilities than most of Gonzaga's WCC opponents. Plus the move would have the side benefit of ramping up the pressure on BYU to return. The Cougars could opt for the AAC as an alternative but the travel would be much tougher on their players and fans.

Agreed. Outside of Gonzaga and BYU, the members of the WCC average just over 2,000 fans a game in attendance. By comparison, the MWC average over 7,000.

Even when they have terrible seasons like this year and last, they always come out at least 7th in conference attendance numbers. The MWC days when BYU and Utah in the league? Every school in the MWC except TCU and AF was averaging over 10k. New Mexico, UNLV, BYU, Utah 15k. SDSU and Wyoming 10k. They have good fans.
03-21-2017 08:18 AM
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MplsBison Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
Makes sense to me. Just have to see if Gonzaga and the MWC would go for it.

Each league would then have 12 full members + a football affiliate.


Still think the MWC should add UTEP at the same time!
03-21-2017 08:43 AM
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MWC Tex Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-21-2017 08:43 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Makes sense to me. Just have to see if Gonzaga and the MWC would go for it.

Each league would then have 12 full members + a football affiliate.


Still think the MWC should add UTEP at the same time!

Adding UTEP would make it unbalanced for football and basketball.

There is no need to add anybody, really. The only reason to add someone like Gonzaga is to see what BYU would do.
03-21-2017 08:55 AM
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MplsBison Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
Wyoming will never let BYU back in the league, without football. Bet other long time MWC teams feel the same.

BYU will never join again in football, so long as Utah is in the PAC.



This is known.
03-21-2017 09:00 AM
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bluesox Offline
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Post: #50
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
It makes a lot of sense for mwc to offer gonzaga a spot to offset Hawaii football and get to 12 for everything. The big ? Is how tight is gonzaga with the other Catholics or byu? The wcc has a great replacement in Seattle. Could gonzaga, byu without football and Wichita state shop themselves as a package to the Mwc? It would ge a great hoops league

Mwc at 14

West: sd state, Fresno, San Jose, unlv, Nevada, Boise, gonzaga
East: Utah st, byu, Wyoming, New Mexico, afa, col state, Wichita state

For football it's 12 with Hawaii and no byu, gonzaga and witicha state. I'm sure byu would agree to 5-6 game schedule alliance but is the bad blood to much to overcome? At the very least the mwc should offer gonzaga a spot and see what happens. Ideally the mwc would want gonzaga, utep and byu with football
(This post was last modified: 03-21-2017 09:44 AM by bluesox.)
03-21-2017 09:40 AM
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MplsBison Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
Gonzaga has "only" been in the WCC since 1979.

Pacific, San Fran, Santa Clara, and St Mary's founded it in 1952, along with San Jose St. Then Loyla Marymount and Perpperdine were added in 1955, along with Fresno St. In the late 60's, San Jose and Fresno left for the PCAA. (Pacific left for the PCAA in 1971, it later became the Big West, and then Pacific returned to the WCC in 2013)

After some comings and goings of UCSB, UNLV, and Nevada, the conference added Seattle in 1971, Portland in 1976, and Gonzaga and San Diego in 1979. Seattle downgraded athletics to NAIA in 1980. (foolish move, IMO)


So yes, if Gonzaga did leave, it would almost be guaranteed that Seattle would get an invite.
(This post was last modified: 03-21-2017 10:39 AM by MplsBison.)
03-21-2017 10:38 AM
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #52
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-21-2017 09:00 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Wyoming will never let BYU back in the league, without football. Bet other long time MWC teams feel the same.

BYU will never join again in football, so long as Utah is in the PAC.



This is known.

This is known.
03-21-2017 12:22 PM
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YNot Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-21-2017 09:40 AM)bluesox Wrote:  ...
For football it's 12 with Hawaii and no byu, gonzaga and witicha state. I'm sure byu would agree to 5-6 game schedule alliance but is the bad blood to much to overcome? At the very least the mwc should offer gonzaga a spot and see what happens. Ideally the mwc would want gonzaga, utep and byu with football

How many votes would be needed? Is it 6 out of the 11 full sports members? Or 7 out of 12, including Hawaii? If the plan was BYU, Gonzaga, and Wichita St. Olympic sports (with *only* a football affiliation with still independent BYU) who would really be against it?

I could see most everyone except the Front Range schools okay with BYU Olympic sports (without football) if Gonzaga is also coming and BYU affiliates for more consistent OOC football games and bowls.

If the MWC had 14 football schools (BYU and UTEP?), certain MWC schools might actually play BYU less frequently than the status quo, depending on how the divisions are structured. Note, BYU currently plays Utah St. and Boise St. annually and will have played each of Hawaii and SJSU in 4 out of 8 years from 2011 to 2018. If they're in opposite divisions, it would likely be 2 out of 7 years (consistent with Fresno, UNLV, and Nevada games with BYU since 2011).
03-21-2017 12:44 PM
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YNot Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
Would Gonzaga *really* leave the WCC for the MWC without BYU? WCC has been the better performing basketball conference recently; and the WCC is arguably a better conference for soccer, baseball, cross country, volleyball, and tennis.
03-21-2017 12:44 PM
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MplsBison Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
Does Gonzaga care about soccer, baseball, cross country, volleyball, or tennis?

If getting into the MWC helps its men's bball team, then it would be considered.
03-21-2017 12:46 PM
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YNot Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-21-2017 12:46 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Does Gonzaga care about soccer, baseball, cross country, volleyball, or tennis?

If getting into the MWC helps its men's bball team, then it would be considered.

Yes, Gonzaga does care about the other Olympic sports. The issue is that the MWC has not yet proven that it would significantly help Gonzaga's men's basketball team. So, for now, the MWC isn't attractive enough for the hit that would come to minor sports and the loss of the SMC and BYU basketball rivalries.

However, if the MWC shows a plan for improvement, it could be a great move for all involved. Ie, bring the Gonzaga-BYU rivalry plus Wichita St. and the MWC potential as seen in the attendance numbers and MWC basketball history (of which BYU was a major player).
03-21-2017 12:55 PM
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Post: #57
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
LOL, it's down on the court but aside from the Pac, which Gonzaga will never get in, it's the most high profile conference in the entire west. Rather than playing in high school gyms including St. Mary's, they'd be playing in big arenas, absent from the WCC except for BYU, who is just there because it's the best fit.
03-21-2017 01:06 PM
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YNot Offline
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Post: #58
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-21-2017 01:06 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  LOL, it's down on the court but aside from the Pac, which Gonzaga will never get in, it's the most high profile conference in the entire west. Rather than playing in high school gyms including St. Mary's, they'd be playing in big arenas, absent from the WCC except for BYU, who is just there because it's the best fit.

Rankings and NCAA tournament bids and performance matter.

Right now, Gonzaga-SMC-BYU > MWC

FWIW, I miss the rivalries with SDSU, UNLV, and New Mexico. Intense. Utah St.-BYU would be a crazy in-conference basketball rivalry.

Gonzaga, SDSU, UNLV, New Mexico, Wichita St., BYU, Utah St., Boise St., Nevada, Wyoming, Fresno St., Colorado St., SJSU, Air Force

Why hold up such an awesome lineup? So Wyoming can host BYU in football once every 7 years?
03-21-2017 01:28 PM
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CitrusUCF Offline
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Post: #59
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-20-2017 12:00 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  http://www.bendbulletin.com/sports/51608...oing-to-do


Possible Big East membership. Could BYU and Saint Mary's going with them? WCC would be down by three if this happens. Grand Canyon, Cal. Baptist and Azusa Baptist could be possible targets. Seattle U. and maybe a Northwest Nazarene could be part of the Northern brands to go with Portland.

I want a hit of what this guy's having. There is absolutely zero chance that the WCC would consider Grand Canyon. They are not inviting a for-profit school into a conference of small, religious institutions. Absolutely zero chance.
03-21-2017 01:30 PM
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Post: #60
RE: Gonzaga Possible Future Looking For A New Conference
(03-21-2017 01:28 PM)YNot Wrote:  
(03-21-2017 01:06 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  LOL, it's down on the court but aside from the Pac, which Gonzaga will never get in, it's the most high profile conference in the entire west. Rather than playing in high school gyms including St. Mary's, they'd be playing in big arenas, absent from the WCC except for BYU, who is just there because it's the best fit.

Rankings and NCAA tournament bids and performance matter.

Right now, Gonzaga-SMC-BYU > MWC

FWIW, I miss the rivalries with SDSU, UNLV, and New Mexico. Intense. Utah St.-BYU would be a crazy in-conference basketball rivalry.

Gonzaga, SDSU, UNLV, New Mexico, Wichita St., BYU, Utah St., Boise St., Nevada, Wyoming, Fresno St., Colorado St., SJSU, Air Force

Why hold up such an awesome lineup? So Wyoming can host BYU in football once every 7 years?

That's just the current order of things. The MWC has at least 5 programs who expect to compete for NCAA Tournament berths and almost all have large arenas that would eat the tiny gyms in the WCC. The WCC has 3 and only Gonzaga and BYU have a decent sized arena. St. Mary's just has a really good coach with a recruiting pipeline, so once he leaves, back to obscurity they go. Once BYU finds a major conference home, they'll be gone so stop, the WCC is not better than the MWC other than current on the court performance.
03-21-2017 01:46 PM
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