(07-13-2016 12:09 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(07-13-2016 11:21 AM)Hood-rich Wrote:  How is this any different than saying bright red hair, lots of freckles, large scar on forehead or any other "unusual" feature that could help id?

#gingerlivesmatter

Even if they have no soul?

(07-13-2016 11:46 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(07-13-2016 06:03 AM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(07-13-2016 05:39 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  If you have a CCW and get stopped? Inform the officer your have a permit and there is a loaded firearm in the vehicle. Put your hands on the steering wheel and follow the officers instructions. If you do these two things? You will not give the officer any reason to nervous and misinterpret your intentions. Im skeptical of the reason for the initial stop...but...Castile's actions went against the training he was supposed to receive during the CCW class. It is a tragedy.

Why would the passenger reach over and place their hands on the drivers wheel? According to the driver the officer asked him for id, and shot him for 'reaching'

Sigh...
1) so put them on the dash or just 'up' and wait to be told what to do AFTER you've established that you have something that is going to put the cop on edge.
2) the interview I saw with the driver, SHE said that the cop asked him for ID... HE RESPONDED THAT HE HAD A GUN (something you conveniently left out) as he reached for the ID.

It's bad, no doubt... but you don't need to make it worse by misrepresenting it. I'm not saying what I described is what happened. I'm saying that the interview I saw with the girl on the video, that is what SHE said.

THAT is why the response that while he was correct to identify that he had a gun, he shouldn't have moved.

When you identify that you have a gun, in most cases, the cops are instructed to treat you as a threat until the gun is secured. And this 'threat' moved.

We can discuss the merit of that sort of policy... but I'm pretty sure that if ANY of us were in that job, we'd err on the side of policies that protected us. Tragic MISTAKE. MAYBE the cop was a racist and thus 'angry' more than scared. Maybe the cop was poorly suited to be a cop and thus unreasonably 'scared'. I haven't seen convincing evidence to support that yet, nor would I expect to, yet. Until then, the most obvious explanation is a tragic accident where someone with a CCL didn't do what he should have been trained to do. Maybe the guy who trained him was racist and he told him to HURRY and show the cop your carry permit?

I'm not going to assume some position because of a traffic stop...I'm going to get out my paper work and ask the cop why they pulled me over...i refuse to be treated like a criminal if I've done nothing wrong.

The 2 times I've been pulled over I put my permit and armed guard license under my id and hand it to them...it's always the same 'where's the weapon' I'll say under my seat, and they'll say 'OK, just don't make any quick reaches under your seat' and that's it.

That said, my demographic is a little different than theirs...

By the way, some reports have said that he has been pulled over 31 times by suburban police officers. And most of the tickets were subsequently dropped. Its been well over 10 years since I've been stopped.

(07-13-2016 02:19 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  I'm not going to assume some position because of a traffic stop...I'm going to get out my paper work and ask the cop why they pulled me over...i refuse to be treated like a criminal if I've done nothing wrong.

The 2 times I've been pulled over I put my permit and armed guard license under my id and hand it to them...it's always the same 'where's the weapon' I'll say under my seat, and they'll say 'OK, just don't make any quick reaches under your seat' and that's it.

That said, my demographic is a little different than theirs...

Keeping your hands in plain view and not making any sudden moves isn't 'assuming the position'. It's avoiding misconceptions. People who aren't criminals are very clear about their actions and intentions. I suspect you won't say 'I've got a gun under my seat' as you reach down to the floorboard to retrieve your dropped wallet either. If you HAD reached to give it to them, I suspect they would have aggressively asked you to stop. HOW aggressive depends on lots of facts not in evidence.

It's not about being treated like a criminal. It's about being treated like someone who could end their life in an instant. Whether you know it or not, they treated you like that. They were watching you more carefully. Had you dropped something and quickly reached under the seat, you MIGHT have been shot.... especially if part of the reason they pulled you over is that you matched the description of an armed robber.

(07-13-2016 02:40 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  By the way, some reports have said that he has been pulled over 31 times by suburban police officers. And most of the tickets were subsequently dropped. Its been well over 10 years since I've been stopped.

I've been pulled over about 7 times by "suburban police officers" and typically walk away with a "no proof of insurance" ticket which *ding ding* gets dropped.

Saint Anthony is not a suburb as most folks understand the term. It's a 2 square mile area surrunded on three sides by Minneapolis with 8K people living in it. For all intents and purposes it's a twin cities neighborhood. Hell, Highland Park in saint paul feels more like a suburb than Saint Anthony.

Not that it matters, but has anyone mentioned the fact that the officer in this case was not white? Sort of hurts the narrative a bit... but they can always fall back on blanket "police brutality" in general in this case...regardless of any facts that get in the way.

His name is Jeronimo Yanez.

(07-13-2016 02:54 PM)ECUGrad07 Wrote:  Not that it matters, but has anyone mentioned the fact that the officer in this case was not white? Sort of hurts the narrative a bit... but they can always fall back on blanket "police brutality" in general in this case...regardless of any facts that get in the way.

His name is Jeronimo Yanez.

Media hid that info as it would have hurt their desire to incite hatred and thus decreased eyeballs thereby decreasing advertising dollars. Things like this make it so obvious. Folks are puppets on a string.

(07-13-2016 02:54 PM)ECUGrad07 Wrote:  Not that it matters, but has anyone mentioned the fact that the officer in this case was not white? Sort of hurts the narrative a bit... but they can always fall back on blanket "police brutality" in general in this case...regardless of any facts that get in the way.

His name is Jeronimo Yanez.

George Zimmerman was half Peruvian. But he still was capable of murdering someone for just being Black and armed with skittles.

(07-13-2016 03:01 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(07-13-2016 02:54 PM)ECUGrad07 Wrote:  Not that it matters, but has anyone mentioned the fact that the officer in this case was not white? Sort of hurts the narrative a bit... but they can always fall back on blanket "police brutality" in general in this case...regardless of any facts that get in the way.

His name is Jeronimo Yanez.

George Zimmerman was half Peruvian. But he still was capable of murdering someone for just being Black and armed with skittles.

Yeah, but the Dallas dude didn't say he wanted to kill Hispanics, he said he wanted to kill whites. White cops are killing blacks, that's what the media is portraying and why the media is a big part of the blame.

(07-13-2016 02:40 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  By the way, some reports have said that he has been pulled over 31 times by suburban police officers. And most of the tickets were subsequently dropped. Its been well over 10 years since I've been stopped.

What charges and in what time frame? Without those two pieces of information the 31 traffic stops is useless data.

One of my neighbors complained about a year ago that his son had been stopped 11 times in a two week period and got 5 tickets out the 11 stops. The reason he got stopped? He had installed those bright HID headlights in his truck without replacing the existing headlight assembly with one designed to prevent the HID lights from blinding oncoming traffic. He swapped back to standard headlights prior to his court dates and all tickets were dropped.

(07-12-2016 10:10 PM)firmbizzle Wrote:  Sounds legit.

http://www.news.com.au/world/north-ameri...a8df880201

Sure does, Castile close up photo compared to the armed robber.

Interesting how none of the MSM is doing any fact checking about Lavish Reynolds and he BS.

(07-13-2016 03:01 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(07-13-2016 02:54 PM)ECUGrad07 Wrote:  Not that it matters, but has anyone mentioned the fact that the officer in this case was not white? Sort of hurts the narrative a bit... but they can always fall back on blanket "police brutality" in general in this case...regardless of any facts that get in the way.

His name is Jeronimo Yanez.

George Zimmerman was half Peruvian. But he still was capable of murdering someone for just being Black and armed with skittles.

And white people never get killed...

he should have waited for the officer allowing him to proceed, but numerous times when i've gotten pulled over i forget the protocol and get all my **** ready for when they approach. getting pulled over can be a nerve wracking experience and you might forget about the fact that the officer has know idea of your intentions, innocent or not.

so he pulled the gun out after the officer asked him not to?

(07-13-2016 03:57 PM)Lush Wrote:  he should have waited for the officer allowing him to proceed, but numerous times when i've gotten pulled over i forget the protocol and get all my **** ready for when they approach. getting pulled over can be a nerve wracking experience and you might forget about the fact that the officer has know idea of your intentions, innocent or not.

so he pulled the gun out after the officer asked him not to?

Lawyer representing the cop said the gun was out

(07-13-2016 03:57 PM)Lush Wrote:  he should have waited for the officer allowing him to proceed, but numerous times when i've gotten pulled over i forget the protocol and get all my **** ready for when they approach. getting pulled over can be a nerve wracking experience and you might forget about the fact that the officer has know idea of your intentions, innocent or not.

so he pulled the gun out after the officer asked him not to?

I THINK the story is that he was asked for ID and he said "I have a gun permit' as he reached for the ID... and the officer essentially panicked/over-reacted.

I don't think the cop would have been on edge if he hadn't matched the description of the armed robber.... and I really wish he had said that and waited for the officers response. Of course, he didn't know why the cop had pulled him over/that he matched the description.

Just bad all the way around.

Lavish is going to be a terrible witness for the prosecution ....if it ever gets that far.

(07-13-2016 11:46 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(07-13-2016 06:03 AM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(07-13-2016 05:39 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  If you have a CCW and get stopped? Inform the officer your have a permit and there is a loaded firearm in the vehicle. Put your hands on the steering wheel and follow the officers instructions. If you do these two things? You will not give the officer any reason to nervous and misinterpret your intentions. Im skeptical of the reason for the initial stop...but...Castile's actions went against the training he was supposed to receive during the CCW class. It is a tragedy.

Why would the passenger reach over and place their hands on the drivers wheel? According to the driver the officer asked him for id, and shot him for 'reaching'

Sigh...
1) so put them on the dash or just 'up' and wait to be told what to do AFTER you've established that you have something that is going to put the cop on edge.
2) the interview I saw with the driver, SHE said that the cop asked him for ID... HE RESPONDED THAT HE HAD A GUN (something you conveniently left out) as he reached for the ID.

It's bad, no doubt... but you don't need to make it worse by misrepresenting it. I'm not saying what I described is what happened. I'm saying that the interview I saw with the girl on the video, that is what SHE said.

THAT is why the response that while he was correct to identify that he had a gun, he shouldn't have moved.

When you identify that you have a gun, in most cases, the cops are instructed to treat you as a threat until the gun is secured. And this 'threat' moved.

We can discuss the merit of that sort of policy... but I'm pretty sure that if ANY of us were in that job, we'd err on the side of policies that protected us. Tragic MISTAKE. MAYBE the cop was a racist and thus 'angry' more than scared. Maybe the cop was poorly suited to be a cop and thus unreasonably 'scared'. I haven't seen convincing evidence to support that yet, nor would I expect to, yet. Until then, the most obvious explanation is a tragic accident where someone with a CCL didn't do what he should have been trained to do. Maybe the guy who trained him was racist and he told him to HURRY and show the cop your carry permit?

I've never understood this.
The few local cops I've talked to about notifying here in Norfolk VA have said if somebody says they have a gun, and are a permit holder they are usually more comfortable.

VA does not require a CCW holder to tell the officer they have a gun with them during a traffic stop unless specifically asked.
If I remember correctly Minnesota is the same. (Been a while since I was in MN and the laws might have changed.)
The fact that people do tell them lets them know they are not trying to hide anything and are looking to be as helpful to the officer as possible.

I guess their thoughts are, a criminal wouldn't tell me he's carrying.
The one time I was stopped while carrying, I told the officer and he didn't care. Might have been because I already had my paperwork out of the glove box in my hand (While holding the wheel) when he approached.

(07-13-2016 04:27 PM)GhentFan Wrote:  I've never understood this.
The few local cops I've talked to about notifying here in Norfolk VA have said if somebody says they have a gun, and are a permit holder they are usually more comfortable.

VA does not require a CCW holder to tell the officer they have a gun with them during a traffic stop unless specifically asked.
If I remember correctly Minnesota is the same. (Been a while since I was in MN and the laws might have changed.)
The fact that people do tell them lets them know they are not trying to hide anything and are looking to be as helpful to the officer as possible.

I guess their thoughts are, a criminal wouldn't tell me he's carrying.
The one time I was stopped while carrying, I told the officer and he didn't care. Might have been because I already had my paperwork out of the glove box in my hand (While holding the wheel) when he approached.

I suspect it has to do with whether they are actually pulling you over for a traffic ticket, or whether they are pulling you over under the guise of a traffic ticket, but actually because you match the description of an armed robber.

I should have made that more clear. Sorry

Either way, I think the cop is to blame here. I just don't believe (based on what I know now) that it is criminal.