(05-31-2013 01:28 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:25 PM)Smaug Wrote:  It's simple math, Drew.

If you've made it to middle age and haven't developed skills beyond what it takes to flip burgers, you don't get the Porsche.

Who can buy a Porsche on 9.19 an hour...15 may be too high...but 10 sounds right to me.

Because you're so familiar with the local economic environment there, right?

The market will bear $9.19 or whatever. That's what it is.

(05-31-2013 01:32 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:28 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:25 PM)Smaug Wrote:  It's simple math, Drew.

If you've made it to middle age and haven't developed skills beyond what it takes to flip burgers, you don't get the Porsche.

Who can buy a Porsche on 9.19 an hour...15 may be too high...but 10 sounds right to me.

Because you're so familiar with the local economic environment there, right?

The market will bear $9.19 or whatever. That's what it is.

Lol, who knew the lonely mountain was in Seattle...since you're so familiar and all.

(05-31-2013 01:35 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:32 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:28 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:25 PM)Smaug Wrote:  It's simple math, Drew.

If you've made it to middle age and haven't developed skills beyond what it takes to flip burgers, you don't get the Porsche.

Who can buy a Porsche on 9.19 an hour...15 may be too high...but 10 sounds right to me.

Because you're so familiar with the local economic environment there, right?

The market will bear $9.19 or whatever. That's what it is.

Lol, who knew the lonely mountain was in Seattle...since you're so familiar and all.

Only one of us implied they knew better than the market what was reasonable.

Hint: It wasn't me. I bolded the quote in question, for your convenience.

Here's a thought. Should minimum wage be tied to a local area's cost of living rather than a one size fits all govt standard?

(05-31-2013 01:41 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:35 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:32 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:28 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:25 PM)Smaug Wrote:  It's simple math, Drew.

If you've made it to middle age and haven't developed skills beyond what it takes to flip burgers, you don't get the Porsche.

Who can buy a Porsche on 9.19 an hour...15 may be too high...but 10 sounds right to me.

Because you're so familiar with the local economic environment there, right?

The market will bear $9.19 or whatever. That's what it is.

Lol, who knew the lonely mountain was in Seattle...since you're so familiar and all.

Only one of us implied they knew better than the market what was reasonable.

Hint: It wasn't me. I bolded the quote in question, for your convenience.

That's why I said "sounds right"...an 81 cent raise for someone making 9.19 an hour can be a pretty big deal.

(05-31-2013 01:44 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:41 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:35 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:32 PM)Smaug Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:28 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  Who can buy a Porsche on 9.19 an hour...15 may be too high...but 10 sounds right to me.

Because you're so familiar with the local economic environment there, right?

The market will bear $9.19 or whatever. That's what it is.

Lol, who knew the lonely mountain was in Seattle...since you're so familiar and all.

Only one of us implied they knew better than the market what was reasonable.

Hint: It wasn't me. I bolded the quote in question, for your convenience.

That's why I said "sounds right"...an 81 cent raise for someone making 9.19 an hour can be a pretty big deal.

Hell, I don't know anyone who would sneer at at a 9% salary bump. What that's got to do with what the market will bear remains a mystery to me.

(05-31-2013 01:43 PM)VA49er Wrote:  Here's a thought. Should minimum wage be tied to a local area's cost of living rather than a one size fits all govt standard?

There's a federal minimum wage and then there are state minimum wages. It think it works out to what you were implying.

(05-31-2013 01:50 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:43 PM)VA49er Wrote:  Here's a thought. Should minimum wage be tied to a local area's cost of living rather than a one size fits all govt standard?

There's a federal minimum wage and then there are state minimum wages. It think it works out to what you were implying.

Thanks for the info. It seems NY and NC have state minimum wage laws that mirror the federal laws. Actually there are 20 such states. Doesn't seem to make sense that NYC has the same minimum wage as Raleigh, NC.

Here's the site I am referring to ---> State Minimum Wage Laws

(05-31-2013 12:34 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 06:59 AM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  Subway?!? The profit margins at subway are not nearly as big as the National Burger Chains. $15/hr = $6 Big Macs. These idiots don't get it.

It is called a "negotiation". You start high and come down and meet near the middle.

Btw, can you prove that it would raise the prices to $6? I didn't think so.

Most fast food restaurants monitor their daily performance including labor cost to sales ratio. Goal is to have this rate in the low to mid teens to maintain an acceptable profit for the owner/operator. Increase the cost of labor by 67% and the owner has to cut number of workers by 67% or raise prices by 67%. A $3 Big Mac becomes $5.

This may shock you Robert, but these owners are in business to make money.

(05-31-2013 01:43 PM)VA49er Wrote:  Here's a thought. Should minimum wage be tied to a local area's cost of living rather than a one size fits all govt standard?

If there is to be a minium wage than yes...

The easy way to do this is to set the federal at the lowest possible level and let the states deal with their own situation internally. Right now I think the pressure is to raise the federal minimum wage to somewhere in the middle...

The Poverty rate should be likewise calculated in terms of locality.

The correct solution is to do away with the minimum wage altogether. It's a barrier to entry, artificially DEflates the number of available jobs, can work against the better interests of the job holders as it allows them to be complacent and not improve their lot, and prevents those that should be acquiring job skills early on from finding work. Not to mention it saps the resources from employers that won't be willing to take a shot on that marginal guy or girl because of what it's going to cost to bring them aboard.

It's a horrible policy all the way around.

(05-31-2013 01:23 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-30-2013 09:06 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  Many of these folks that will ultimately be subserviant to the government machine. THese jobs are for teens and elderly wanting golf / LifeALert bracelet money. If you are middle-aged with responsibilities and you have no skills that can be marketable outside of running the french fry machine at Wendy's, then shame on you. However, as someone who is working, I hold you in esteem much higher than the parasite class, and would concede that your standard of living should be superior to those that solely suck of the government teat. And the answer is not raising wages, it is lowering benefits for the parasitic class.

So screw the poor...that's what you're saying.

In a word, yes. They are poor for a reason and are not my responsibility. If they had an ounce of ambition, they would not be flipping burgers as middle-aged adults. I'll support those that cannot. I'll loathe those that will not. F them.

(05-31-2013 10:11 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:23 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-30-2013 09:06 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  Many of these folks that will ultimately be subserviant to the government machine. THese jobs are for teens and elderly wanting golf / LifeALert bracelet money. If you are middle-aged with responsibilities and you have no skills that can be marketable outside of running the french fry machine at Wendy's, then shame on you. However, as someone who is working, I hold you in esteem much higher than the parasite class, and would concede that your standard of living should be superior to those that solely suck of the government teat. And the answer is not raising wages, it is lowering benefits for the parasitic class.

So screw the poor...that's what you're saying.

In a word, yes. They are poor for a reason and are not my responsibility. If they had an ounce of ambition, they would not be flipping burgers as middle-aged adults. I'll support those that cannot. I'll loathe those that will not. F them.

Man, it's really crazy that people are so vile toward their fellow citizens. The haves hate the have-nots, and the have-nots hate the haves. It's as if some of you are incapable of viewing this as a complex issue. Maybe people don't have ambition, and many people are stuck in a sh.ithole with no escape. If 1000 people are competing for 10 positions that offer a better life, what do you say about the 990 people that didn't get the job. Are they all lazy fu.ckholes? What about people who are just plain stupid, and can't compete for those 10 jobs? Are they less human beings? Do you kick dirt in their face and call them leeches? People who end up on welfare may have paid into the welfare system for decades before hitting hard times, so who are we to say that they don't deserve something in return?

At the same time, there are true government leeches. Half of the country doesn't pay taxes, but I doubt that half is unemployed. People commit welfare fraud all the time. It's a big problem. We're giving massive amounts of benefits out at the same time that our country is suffocating from debt. We can't ignore it. What's the answer?

Our statue of liberty commands other countries to give us their sick, tired, and poor. Our country runs on the backs of blue collar workers. They are our responsibility as a developed nation.

Jeez, 9.19... lucky bastards... we get 7.25 for like the first year at McDonalds where I live, and it isn't a cheap area to live in.

(05-31-2013 10:21 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 10:11 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:23 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-30-2013 09:06 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  Many of these folks that will ultimately be subserviant to the government machine. THese jobs are for teens and elderly wanting golf / LifeALert bracelet money. If you are middle-aged with responsibilities and you have no skills that can be marketable outside of running the french fry machine at Wendy's, then shame on you. However, as someone who is working, I hold you in esteem much higher than the parasite class, and would concede that your standard of living should be superior to those that solely suck of the government teat. And the answer is not raising wages, it is lowering benefits for the parasitic class.

So screw the poor...that's what you're saying.

In a word, yes. They are poor for a reason and are not my responsibility. If they had an ounce of ambition, they would not be flipping burgers as middle-aged adults. I'll support those that cannot. I'll loathe those that will not. F them.

Man, it's really crazy that people are so vile toward their fellow citizens. The haves hate the have-nots, and the have-nots hate the haves. It's as if some of you are incapable of viewing this as a complex issue. Maybe people don't have ambition, and many people are stuck in a sh.ithole with no escape. If 1000 people are competing for 10 positions that offer a better life, what do you say about the 990 people that didn't get the job. Are they all lazy fu.ckholes? What about people who are just plain stupid, and can't compete for those 10 jobs? Are they less human beings? Do you kick dirt in their face and call them leeches? People who end up on welfare may have paid into the welfare system for decades before hitting hard times, so who are we to say that they don't deserve something in return?

At the same time, there are true government leeches. Half of the country doesn't pay taxes, but I doubt that half is unemployed. People commit welfare fraud all the time. It's a big problem. We're giving massive amounts of benefits out at the same time that our country is suffocating from debt. We can't ignore it. What's the answer?

Our statue of liberty commands other countries to give us their sick, tired, and poor. Our country runs on the backs of blue collar workers. They are our responsibility as a developed nation.

No, they are the responsibility of a socialist mindset that rewards poor performance and loyalty. Our "poor" live much better than the middle class in most countries, contributing nothing to society but generational economic parasites that have been taught that their plight is not their responsibility. My parents were "white trash"....maternally from a broken home (grew up with grandparents) and paternally from an orphanage. At an early age, it was instilled in me that self-reliance for my responsibilities was paramount above all other considerations. I busted my ass as a kid, learned the value of a good education and hard work, and never complained about the potholes placed in my path.

THe poor feel nothing but being poor. Regardless of the economic environment, they are housed, fed, and medicated without pause. And they breed like rabbits with all the free time afforded them. When labor intensive jobs became the domain of Mexicans, vice the underclass, we gave up any possibility that these generational parasites would ever rise, en masse, from their economic dependence. I loathe them. I loathe the well-intentioned programs that bring short-term relief at the cost of lifetime dependence, and I loathe the perceived moral superiority of liberal douchebags that support the idea that certain groups of Americans are incapable of independently supporting themselves and their offspring. Sound harsh, too damned bad. Someone needs to be the f'n adult in the room and speak the truth. You either contribute to society or you are a parasite. Screw the victimization PC bull****. This is a country of doers, not takers, and you should either earn your way to prosperity or get the **** out. ANd the liberal douchetards are only economically-enslaving the stupid with this class warfare crap. F them and the moronic population that has limited cognitive ability to understand that they are willingly giving up their liberties one piece at at time.

(05-31-2013 11:10 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 10:21 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 10:11 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:23 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(05-30-2013 09:06 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  Many of these folks that will ultimately be subserviant to the government machine. THese jobs are for teens and elderly wanting golf / LifeALert bracelet money. If you are middle-aged with responsibilities and you have no skills that can be marketable outside of running the french fry machine at Wendy's, then shame on you. However, as someone who is working, I hold you in esteem much higher than the parasite class, and would concede that your standard of living should be superior to those that solely suck of the government teat. And the answer is not raising wages, it is lowering benefits for the parasitic class.

So screw the poor...that's what you're saying.

In a word, yes. They are poor for a reason and are not my responsibility. If they had an ounce of ambition, they would not be flipping burgers as middle-aged adults. I'll support those that cannot. I'll loathe those that will not. F them.

Man, it's really crazy that people are so vile toward their fellow citizens. The haves hate the have-nots, and the have-nots hate the haves. It's as if some of you are incapable of viewing this as a complex issue. Maybe people don't have ambition, and many people are stuck in a sh.ithole with no escape. If 1000 people are competing for 10 positions that offer a better life, what do you say about the 990 people that didn't get the job. Are they all lazy fu.ckholes? What about people who are just plain stupid, and can't compete for those 10 jobs? Are they less human beings? Do you kick dirt in their face and call them leeches? People who end up on welfare may have paid into the welfare system for decades before hitting hard times, so who are we to say that they don't deserve something in return?

At the same time, there are true government leeches. Half of the country doesn't pay taxes, but I doubt that half is unemployed. People commit welfare fraud all the time. It's a big problem. We're giving massive amounts of benefits out at the same time that our country is suffocating from debt. We can't ignore it. What's the answer?

Our statue of liberty commands other countries to give us their sick, tired, and poor. Our country runs on the backs of blue collar workers. They are our responsibility as a developed nation.

No, they are the responsibility of a socialist mindset that rewards poor performance and loyalty. Our "poor" live much better than the middle class in most countries, contributing nothing to society but generational economic parasites that have been taught that their plight is not their responsibility. My parents were "white trash"....maternally from a broken home (grew up with grandparents) and paternally from an orphanage. At an early age, it was instilled in me that self-reliance for my responsibilities was paramount above all other considerations. I busted my ass as a kid, learned the value of a good education and hard work, and never complained about the potholes placed in my path.

THe poor feel nothing but being poor. Regardless of the economic environment, they are housed, fed, and medicated without pause. And they breed like rabbits with all the free time afforded them. When labor intensive jobs became the domain of Mexicans, vice the underclass, we gave up any possibility that these generational parasites would ever rise, en masse, from their economic dependence. I loathe them. I loathe the well-intentioned programs that bring short-term relief at the cost of lifetime dependence, and I loathe the perceived moral superiority of liberal douchebags that support the idea that certain groups of Americans are incapable of independently supporting themselves and their offspring. Sound harsh, too damned bad. Someone needs to be the f'n adult in the room and speak the truth. You either contribute to society or you are a parasite. Screw the victimization PC bull****. This is a country of doers, not takers, and you should either earn your way to prosperity or get the **** out. ANd the liberal douchetards are only economically-enslaving the stupid with this class warfare crap. F them and the moronic population that has limited cognitive ability to understand that they are willingly giving up their liberties one piece at at time.

What do you propose we, as the greatest nation on earth, do? Over 90% of Americans are already contributing to society. Are these people parasites too? Do you think the greatest nation on earth should aspire to just be better than the middle class of poor countries, or should we aspire to make everyone here better?

We were supposed to be a nation founded on enlightened principles.

(05-31-2013 11:19 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 11:10 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 10:21 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 10:11 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 01:23 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  So screw the poor...that's what you're saying.

In a word, yes. They are poor for a reason and are not my responsibility. If they had an ounce of ambition, they would not be flipping burgers as middle-aged adults. I'll support those that cannot. I'll loathe those that will not. F them.

Man, it's really crazy that people are so vile toward their fellow citizens. The haves hate the have-nots, and the have-nots hate the haves. It's as if some of you are incapable of viewing this as a complex issue. Maybe people don't have ambition, and many people are stuck in a sh.ithole with no escape. If 1000 people are competing for 10 positions that offer a better life, what do you say about the 990 people that didn't get the job. Are they all lazy fu.ckholes? What about people who are just plain stupid, and can't compete for those 10 jobs? Are they less human beings? Do you kick dirt in their face and call them leeches? People who end up on welfare may have paid into the welfare system for decades before hitting hard times, so who are we to say that they don't deserve something in return?

At the same time, there are true government leeches. Half of the country doesn't pay taxes, but I doubt that half is unemployed. People commit welfare fraud all the time. It's a big problem. We're giving massive amounts of benefits out at the same time that our country is suffocating from debt. We can't ignore it. What's the answer?

Our statue of liberty commands other countries to give us their sick, tired, and poor. Our country runs on the backs of blue collar workers. They are our responsibility as a developed nation.

No, they are the responsibility of a socialist mindset that rewards poor performance and loyalty. Our "poor" live much better than the middle class in most countries, contributing nothing to society but generational economic parasites that have been taught that their plight is not their responsibility. My parents were "white trash"....maternally from a broken home (grew up with grandparents) and paternally from an orphanage. At an early age, it was instilled in me that self-reliance for my responsibilities was paramount above all other considerations. I busted my ass as a kid, learned the value of a good education and hard work, and never complained about the potholes placed in my path.

THe poor feel nothing but being poor. Regardless of the economic environment, they are housed, fed, and medicated without pause. And they breed like rabbits with all the free time afforded them. When labor intensive jobs became the domain of Mexicans, vice the underclass, we gave up any possibility that these generational parasites would ever rise, en masse, from their economic dependence. I loathe them. I loathe the well-intentioned programs that bring short-term relief at the cost of lifetime dependence, and I loathe the perceived moral superiority of liberal douchebags that support the idea that certain groups of Americans are incapable of independently supporting themselves and their offspring. Sound harsh, too damned bad. Someone needs to be the f'n adult in the room and speak the truth. You either contribute to society or you are a parasite. Screw the victimization PC bull****. This is a country of doers, not takers, and you should either earn your way to prosperity or get the **** out. ANd the liberal douchetards are only economically-enslaving the stupid with this class warfare crap. F them and the moronic population that has limited cognitive ability to understand that they are willingly giving up their liberties one piece at at time.

What do you propose we, as the greatest nation on earth, do? Over 90% of Americans are already contributing to society. Are these people parasites too? Do you think the greatest nation on earth should aspire to just be better than the middle class of poor countries, or should we aspire to make everyone here better?

When 50% of the population pays no net federal income tax, I find your logic lacking. If you get more that you give, you are, by definition , a parasite. Forced societal charity is neither constitutional nor fair.

(05-31-2013 11:26 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 11:19 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 11:10 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 10:21 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(05-31-2013 10:11 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  In a word, yes. They are poor for a reason and are not my responsibility. If they had an ounce of ambition, they would not be flipping burgers as middle-aged adults. I'll support those that cannot. I'll loathe those that will not. F them.

Man, it's really crazy that people are so vile toward their fellow citizens. The haves hate the have-nots, and the have-nots hate the haves. It's as if some of you are incapable of viewing this as a complex issue. Maybe people don't have ambition, and many people are stuck in a sh.ithole with no escape. If 1000 people are competing for 10 positions that offer a better life, what do you say about the 990 people that didn't get the job. Are they all lazy fu.ckholes? What about people who are just plain stupid, and can't compete for those 10 jobs? Are they less human beings? Do you kick dirt in their face and call them leeches? People who end up on welfare may have paid into the welfare system for decades before hitting hard times, so who are we to say that they don't deserve something in return?

At the same time, there are true government leeches. Half of the country doesn't pay taxes, but I doubt that half is unemployed. People commit welfare fraud all the time. It's a big problem. We're giving massive amounts of benefits out at the same time that our country is suffocating from debt. We can't ignore it. What's the answer?

Our statue of liberty commands other countries to give us their sick, tired, and poor. Our country runs on the backs of blue collar workers. They are our responsibility as a developed nation.

No, they are the responsibility of a socialist mindset that rewards poor performance and loyalty. Our "poor" live much better than the middle class in most countries, contributing nothing to society but generational economic parasites that have been taught that their plight is not their responsibility. My parents were "white trash"....maternally from a broken home (grew up with grandparents) and paternally from an orphanage. At an early age, it was instilled in me that self-reliance for my responsibilities was paramount above all other considerations. I busted my ass as a kid, learned the value of a good education and hard work, and never complained about the potholes placed in my path.

THe poor feel nothing but being poor. Regardless of the economic environment, they are housed, fed, and medicated without pause. And they breed like rabbits with all the free time afforded them. When labor intensive jobs became the domain of Mexicans, vice the underclass, we gave up any possibility that these generational parasites would ever rise, en masse, from their economic dependence. I loathe them. I loathe the well-intentioned programs that bring short-term relief at the cost of lifetime dependence, and I loathe the perceived moral superiority of liberal douchebags that support the idea that certain groups of Americans are incapable of independently supporting themselves and their offspring. Sound harsh, too damned bad. Someone needs to be the f'n adult in the room and speak the truth. You either contribute to society or you are a parasite. Screw the victimization PC bull****. This is a country of doers, not takers, and you should either earn your way to prosperity or get the **** out. ANd the liberal douchetards are only economically-enslaving the stupid with this class warfare crap. F them and the moronic population that has limited cognitive ability to understand that they are willingly giving up their liberties one piece at at time.

What do you propose we, as the greatest nation on earth, do? Over 90% of Americans are already contributing to society. Are these people parasites too? Do you think the greatest nation on earth should aspire to just be better than the middle class of poor countries, or should we aspire to make everyone here better?

When 50% of the population pays no net federal income tax, I find your logic lacking. If you get more that you give, you are, by definition , a parasite. Forced societal charity is neither constitutional nor fair.

I bet that almost all of us get more than we give.

And piling on, the massive expanse of the federal government is a contributory reason for the lack of low-skill jobs. When unelected and unchecked federal workers in the EPA, OSHa, et al make mandates that make AMerican business less competitive, the people hurt are the working class.

Ref the oil sands in CA, where environmentalists are attempting to block a second gold rush with their assualts on fracking.

We can and should be energy independent, yet tree-hugging libtards are blocking progress. Just like the Cental Coast Delta Smelt controvery. Grow the f up.

(05-31-2013 11:32 PM)ODUsmitty Wrote:  And piling on, the massive expanse of the federal government is a contributory reason for the lack of low-skill jobs. When unelected and unchecked federal workers in the EPA, OSHa, et al make mandates that make AMerican business less competitive, the people hurt are the working class.

Ref the oil sands in CA, where environmentalists are attempting to block a second gold rush with their assualts on fracking.

We can and should be energy independent, yet tree-hugging libtards are blocking progress. Just like the Cental Coast Delta Smelt controvery. Grow the f up.

Jesus dude, it sounds like you hate things that are actually good for humans. I've never met someone who was actually against better worker safety.