(02-21-2012 06:06 PM)Max Power Wrote:  Where does Jesus say life begins at conception? When did he say taxes are theft?

See you guys don't really even have guidance for what constitutes murder or theft because it's so vague. And the provisions that are there give self important sanctimonious preachers/priests grounds to interpret moral laws however they want, dictate to their flock and attempt to enforce their own idea of morality on the rest of us.

And yet you keep typing.

(02-21-2012 04:48 PM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  

(02-21-2012 04:32 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(02-21-2012 04:29 PM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  The fact some religious people seem to think you need religion to have a solid moral compass is always a bit frightening to me.

It's just hard to trust or rely on anyone who believes that.

Yeah, logic is a scary thing!

What's frightening is people who have no intelligence, and try to impose that on everyone else.

So you too are turned off by creationists trying to infiltrate our public schools.

No, I was referring to idiots like you. Not surprised you missed that.

(02-21-2012 06:06 PM)Max Power Wrote:  Where does Jesus say life begins at conception? When did he say taxes are theft?

See you guys don't really even have guidance for what constitutes murder or theft because it's so vague.

Says the whiny lawyer. No thanks Max, your services are not needed.

(02-21-2012 09:16 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(02-21-2012 04:48 PM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  

(02-21-2012 04:32 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(02-21-2012 04:29 PM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  The fact some religious people seem to think you need religion to have a solid moral compass is always a bit frightening to me.

It's just hard to trust or rely on anyone who believes that.

Yeah, logic is a scary thing!

What's frightening is people who have no intelligence, and try to impose that on everyone else.

So you too are turned off by creationists trying to infiltrate our public schools.

No, I was referring to idiots like you. Not surprised you missed that.

Yes.. I got the sarcasm.. was just mocking you pal.

(02-21-2012 06:06 PM)Max Power Wrote:  Where does Jesus say life begins at conception? When did he say taxes are theft?

See you guys don't really even have guidance for what constitutes murder or theft because it's so vague. And the provisions that are there give self important sanctimonious preachers/priests grounds to interpret moral laws however they want, dictate to their flock and attempt to enforce their own idea of morality on the rest of us.

God said the the profit Jemimah:

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations."

Jesus many times referenced these profits as being law givers.

(02-21-2012 06:06 PM)Max Power Wrote:  Where does Jesus say life begins at conception? When did he say taxes are theft?

See you guys don't really even have guidance for what constitutes murder or theft because it's so vague. And the provisions that are there give self important sanctimonious preachers/priests grounds to interpret moral laws however they want, dictate to their flock and attempt to enforce their own idea of morality on the rest of us.

And the left doesn't want to enforce their own idea of morality on us?

That's what politics is. Think about that for a few years and maybe you can eat at the big kids table someday.

(02-21-2012 11:38 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(02-21-2012 06:06 PM)Max Power Wrote:  Where does Jesus say life begins at conception? When did he say taxes are theft?

See you guys don't really even have guidance for what constitutes murder or theft because it's so vague. And the provisions that are there give self important sanctimonious preachers/priests grounds to interpret moral laws however they want, dictate to their flock and attempt to enforce their own idea of morality on the rest of us.

And the left doesn't want to enforce their own idea of morality on us?

Exactly. So Max is busy pushing some contrived, irrational morality he doublespeaks as "social justice" and "tolerance" including actively through the courts, and then pretends that it's someone else who is self-rightous.

(02-21-2012 04:31 PM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  

(02-21-2012 04:29 PM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  The fact some religious people seem to think you need religion to have a solid moral compass is always a bit frightening to me.

It's just hard to trust or rely on anyone who believes that. It implies they're only acting as a decent person because their religion told them to, not because they're just a decent human. If they were naturally a decent person w/o their religion, they wouldn't think other people need to have religion to have a strong moral compass either.

Where do you get the idea of what a decent person is?

It's completely subjective to each individual. Generally as social animals, humans prefer other humans that treat them with fairness and respect their body and possessions, aka. don't kill and steal. A decent person is one that doesn't break rules of social interaction, e.g. a decent person wouldn't stab someone without self-defense being necessary etc.

There are numerous philosophies out there you can live your life by. You don't need religion. If your religion went away tomorrow, would you immediately feel an uncontrollable desire to murder, rape, torture everyone you meet? I hope the answer is no. Additionally you'll think of the consequences of prison and decide it's not a good idea. You'll probably just keep going to work and mind your own business and enjoy your life.

Religion is just one basis for morality, there are many others. I feel much better now that I follow my own internal compass rather than the compass of a several thousand year old book with fantastical claims and numerous flaws.

There's not some magical boogeyman causing all the world's evil. "Good" and "evil" reside only in the will of each individual person.

Two major planks of the Democrat party are "kill" and "steal".

(02-22-2012 08:08 AM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(02-21-2012 04:31 PM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  

(02-21-2012 04:29 PM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  The fact some religious people seem to think you need religion to have a solid moral compass is always a bit frightening to me.

It's just hard to trust or rely on anyone who believes that. It implies they're only acting as a decent person because their religion told them to, not because they're just a decent human. If they were naturally a decent person w/o their religion, they wouldn't think other people need to have religion to have a strong moral compass either.

Where do you get the idea of what a decent person is?

It's completely subjective to each individual. Generally as social animals, humans prefer other humans that treat them with fairness and respect their body and possessions, aka. don't kill and steal. A decent person is one that doesn't break rules of social interaction, e.g. a decent person wouldn't stab someone without self-defense being necessary etc.

There are numerous philosophies out there you can live your life by. You don't need religion. If your religion went away tomorrow, would you immediately feel an uncontrollable desire to murder, rape, torture everyone you meet? I hope the answer is no. Additionally you'll think of the consequences of prison and decide it's not a good idea. You'll probably just keep going to work and mind your own business and enjoy your life.

Religion is just one basis for morality, there are many others. I feel much better now that I follow my own internal compass rather than the compass of a several thousand year old book with fantastical claims and numerous flaws.

There's not some magical boogeyman causing all the world's evil. "Good" and "evil" reside only in the will of each individual person.

As humans, according to science, we have "evolved" past the point of having instincts. Meaning everything we know or do is learned. So, the notion of good vs. bad is learned and was learned a very long time ago. So where did that first concept of good/bad come from. And this isn't an attempt to trick anyone or suck anyone into a philosophical argument defending religion. I'm just curious as to where you or anyone on this board thinks we derived our sense of right/wrong.

(02-22-2012 08:42 AM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  As humans, according to science, we have "evolved" past the point of having instincts. Meaning everything we know or do is learned.

Incorrect, humans do many things by instinct. How do you think babies know how to breastfeed?

Humans are social animals. It is not unreasonable to assume that there are certain instinctual codes of behavior that must be followed in order for a society to exist.

The nuances of acceptable behavior are dictated by the culture but the major "rules" appeal to baser instincts. Theft and murder, for example, are discouraged by most social animals, just go watch one dog try to steal another dog's squeak toy.

(02-22-2012 08:55 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(02-22-2012 08:42 AM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  As humans, according to science, we have "evolved" past the point of having instincts. Meaning everything we know or do is learned.

Incorrect, humans do many things by instinct. How do you think babies know how to breastfeed?

Humans are social animals. It is not unreasonable to assume that there are certain instinctual codes of behavior that must be followed in order for a society to exist.

The nuances of acceptable behavior are dictated by the culture but the major "rules" appeal to baser instincts. Theft and murder, for example, are discouraged by most social animals, just go watch one dog try to steal another dog's squeak toy.

Take it up with science. I'm just regurgitating what I was taught forever ago. There may be an exception for newborn's though. I remember someone asking about babies and swimming too. I'm pretty sure that at a certain age instincts go out the window and everything is learned.

(02-22-2012 08:58 AM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  

(02-22-2012 08:55 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(02-22-2012 08:42 AM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  As humans, according to science, we have "evolved" past the point of having instincts. Meaning everything we know or do is learned.

Incorrect, humans do many things by instinct. How do you think babies know how to breastfeed?

Humans are social animals. It is not unreasonable to assume that there are certain instinctual codes of behavior that must be followed in order for a society to exist.

The nuances of acceptable behavior are dictated by the culture but the major "rules" appeal to baser instincts. Theft and murder, for example, are discouraged by most social animals, just go watch one dog try to steal another dog's squeak toy.

Take it up with science. I'm just regurgitating what I was taught forever ago. There may be an exception for newborn's though. I remember someone asking about babies and swimming too. I'm pretty sure that at a certain age instincts go out the window and everything is learned.

Not sure where you went to school, but maybe if there was a national standard for curriculum, there wouldn't be populations so under-served as yourself by our education system.

Seriously though, it's not that instincts "go out the window", but rather they're not as needed for every day survival. Once we've developed the necessary motor and communication skills, we are able to survive based on our ability to think and interact with other humans. But as I stated before, certain instincts govern those interactions as a basic level, allowing us to continue to survive, thrive, and create a safe place for the next generation.

(02-22-2012 09:08 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(02-22-2012 08:58 AM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  

(02-22-2012 08:55 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(02-22-2012 08:42 AM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  As humans, according to science, we have "evolved" past the point of having instincts. Meaning everything we know or do is learned.

Incorrect, humans do many things by instinct. How do you think babies know how to breastfeed?

Humans are social animals. It is not unreasonable to assume that there are certain instinctual codes of behavior that must be followed in order for a society to exist.

The nuances of acceptable behavior are dictated by the culture but the major "rules" appeal to baser instincts. Theft and murder, for example, are discouraged by most social animals, just go watch one dog try to steal another dog's squeak toy.

Take it up with science. I'm just regurgitating what I was taught forever ago. There may be an exception for newborn's though. I remember someone asking about babies and swimming too. I'm pretty sure that at a certain age instincts go out the window and everything is learned.

Not sure where you went to school, but maybe if there was a national standard for curriculum, there wouldn't be populations so under-served as yourself by our education system.

Seriously though, it's not that instincts "go out the window", but rather they're not as needed for every day survival. Once we've developed the necessary motor and communication skills, we are able to survive based on our ability to think and interact with other humans. But as I stated before, certain instincts govern those interactions as a basic level, allowing us to continue to survive, thrive, and create a safe place for the next generation.

I wasn't under-served...the Anthropology prof. maybe. He made some compelling arguments though. I think most people on this board at least would have a hard time refuting him. It made sense at the time.

Any scientists on here care to shed some light on this.

(02-21-2012 06:06 PM)Max Power Wrote:  Where does Jesus say life begins at conception? When did he say taxes are theft?

Jesus viewed the Scriptures of the Old Testament as the very words of God. Psalm 139 shows how God feels about the unborn.

He did not equate taxes with theft (render unto Caesar what is Caesar's).

Christianity isn't really all about "how to live a good life". Granted, it stresses the point of living out a life of holiness time and time again. But it is all about salvation through the sacrifice that Jesus made on the Cross of Calvary. Ultimately, it is more than just about a moral compass, it is about where you end up when you pass away. Lake of fire. Serving the Lord in Heaven. Jesus chose me, and that's where I'm heading. Grand assurance from God is a wonderful thing.

(02-22-2012 09:41 AM)TampaKnight Wrote:  Christianity isn't really all about "how to live a good life". Granted, it stresses the point of living out a life of holiness time and time again. But it is all about salvation through the sacrifice that Jesus made on the Cross of Calvary. Ultimately, it is more than just about a moral compass, it is about where you end up when you pass away. Lake of fire. Serving the Lord in Heaven. Jesus chose me, and that's where I'm heading. Grand assurance from God is a wonderful thing.

I love that the great "prize" in heaven is basically an eternity of church

(02-22-2012 09:41 AM)TampaKnight Wrote:  Christianity isn't really all about "how to live a good life". Granted, it stresses the point of living out a life of holiness time and time again. But it is all about salvation through the sacrifice that Jesus made on the Cross of Calvary. Ultimately, it is more than just about a moral compass, it is about where you end up when you pass away. Lake of fire. Serving the Lord in Heaven. Jesus chose me, and that's where I'm heading. Grand assurance from God is a wonderful thing.

Jesus chose you? So.. an all powerful god, creator of man, is just picking & choosing certain people (even though he created all of us) to enjoy his embrace & ******* over the rest of us?

I mean.. if Jesus / god didn't choose me, I certainly don't have the right to tell an all knowing being that he's wrong, so I'm basically screwed from the get go? And yet some Christians still wonder why some of us out there prefer to embrace logic & reason over the Good Book.

(02-22-2012 10:08 AM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  

(02-22-2012 09:41 AM)TampaKnight Wrote:  Christianity isn't really all about "how to live a good life". Granted, it stresses the point of living out a life of holiness time and time again. But it is all about salvation through the sacrifice that Jesus made on the Cross of Calvary. Ultimately, it is more than just about a moral compass, it is about where you end up when you pass away. Lake of fire. Serving the Lord in Heaven. Jesus chose me, and that's where I'm heading. Grand assurance from God is a wonderful thing.

Jesus chose you? So.. an all powerful god, creator of man, is just picking & choosing certain people (even though he created all of us) to enjoy his embrace & ******* over the rest of us?

I mean.. if Jesus / god didn't choose me, I certainly don't have the right to tell an all knowing being that he's wrong, so I'm basically screwed from the get go? And yet some Christians still wonder why some of us out there prefer to embrace logic & reason over the Good Book.

No. We don't wonder. That's the difference between you and me. I don't care what you believe. You try to legislate what I believe and how I worship.

(02-22-2012 10:07 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(02-22-2012 09:41 AM)TampaKnight Wrote:  Christianity isn't really all about "how to live a good life". Granted, it stresses the point of living out a life of holiness time and time again. But it is all about salvation through the sacrifice that Jesus made on the Cross of Calvary. Ultimately, it is more than just about a moral compass, it is about where you end up when you pass away. Lake of fire. Serving the Lord in Heaven. Jesus chose me, and that's where I'm heading. Grand assurance from God is a wonderful thing.

I love that the great "prize" in heaven is basically an eternity of church

Fortunately, that's not true.