(01-15-2012 11:02 PM)templefan1 Wrote:  

(01-15-2012 09:31 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-15-2012 10:51 AM)templefan1 Wrote:  

(01-15-2012 03:25 AM)JHG722 Wrote:  NJ has more NFL players than MI, IL, VA, SC, NC, AL, TN, and MS. You probably shouldn't laugh.

When you factor in NJ, PA, and MD/DC, Northern VA...you have a very good recruiting area to tap if you are a MAC level program.

Uh huh. That's why UMd and UVa have been such powerhouses lately.

Of course I actually live in the area that we're talking about, so I'm sure some guy from Mass knows it far more than I.

He probably does, he is coaching football for a living...

Just because UVA and UMD have had a couple of bad decades doesn't mean the talent isn't there in those states. It may mean they just weren't getting the limited, available talent. PSU, WVU, VT, Pitt, Rutgers and most of the BE and ACC recruits those areas...

Which just takes us back to the bottom line, why would UMass be more successful?

It's kinda funny that your best arguments just take you back to my original conclusion.

(01-16-2012 09:59 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-15-2012 11:02 PM)templefan1 Wrote:  

(01-15-2012 09:31 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-15-2012 10:51 AM)templefan1 Wrote:  

(01-15-2012 03:25 AM)JHG722 Wrote:  NJ has more NFL players than MI, IL, VA, SC, NC, AL, TN, and MS. You probably shouldn't laugh.

When you factor in NJ, PA, and MD/DC, Northern VA...you have a very good recruiting area to tap if you are a MAC level program.

Uh huh. That's why UMd and UVa have been such powerhouses lately.

Of course I actually live in the area that we're talking about, so I'm sure some guy from Mass knows it far more than I.

He probably does, he is coaching football for a living...

Just because UVA and UMD have had a couple of bad decades doesn't mean the talent isn't there in those states. It may mean they just weren't getting the limited, available talent. PSU, WVU, VT, Pitt, Rutgers and most of the BE and ACC recruits those areas...

Which just takes us back to the bottom line, why would UMass be more successful?

It's kinda funny that your best arguments just take you back to my original conclusion.

The talent that Virginia and Maryland have been getting would be pretty competitive in the MAC, most seasons.

(01-16-2012 10:57 AM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  The talent that Virginia and Maryland have been getting would be pretty competitive in the MAC, most seasons.

Absolutely. But how is UMass gonna pry them away from those two?

That's the point. Not that Div IA talent doesn't exist in MD and VA, just that it's quite limited and NOT in excess of the universities already vying for it.

In contrast, I believe that ME has better talent available to a school like UMass. I also think that RI, CT, VT, NH do as well. No one of those states can generate a fully competitive team, but together, I think you'd do well. Better than taking the relics available from MD and NJ.

Akron picks up another recruit from just down the road with Guard Quaison Osbourne from Hudson HS. He was also offered by Ball State. Originally committed to Youngstown State after he failed to be impressed by Rob Ianello's recruiting skills. Coach Bowden helped change his mind.

(01-16-2012 11:19 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 10:57 AM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  The talent that Virginia and Maryland have been getting would be pretty competitive in the MAC, most seasons.

Absolutely. But how is UMass gonna pry them away from those two?

That's the point. Not that Div IA talent doesn't exist in MD and VA, just that it's quite limited and NOT in excess of the universities already vying for it.

Me saying that Virginia and Maryland would be pretty competitive in the MAC is not me saying that the D I FBS talent is limited in MD and VA. I don't agree with you at all. Temple is getting some good talent from there. So is Navy. So is Rutgers. To a lesser quantity, so is Richmond, Villanova, Old Dominion and James Madison. UMASS has a lot to offer as a FBS school and could take some of those recruits, no question.

(01-16-2012 01:35 PM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 11:19 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 10:57 AM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  The talent that Virginia and Maryland have been getting would be pretty competitive in the MAC, most seasons.

Absolutely. But how is UMass gonna pry them away from those two?

That's the point. Not that Div IA talent doesn't exist in MD and VA, just that it's quite limited and NOT in excess of the universities already vying for it.

Me saying that Virginia and Maryland would be pretty competitive in the MAC is not me saying that the D I FBS talent is limited in MD and VA. I don't agree with you at all. Temple is getting some good talent from there. So is Navy. So is Rutgers. To a lesser quantity, so is Richmond, Villanova, Old Dominion and James Madison. UMASS has a lot to offer as a FBS school and could take some of those recruits, no question.

Brian,

You made me think of a question:

How does UVa (and Maryland) feel if ODU, JMU, etc. move up to FBS this decade?

How would Temple feel?

(01-16-2012 01:35 PM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 11:19 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 10:57 AM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  The talent that Virginia and Maryland have been getting would be pretty competitive in the MAC, most seasons.

Absolutely. But how is UMass gonna pry them away from those two?

That's the point. Not that Div IA talent doesn't exist in MD and VA, just that it's quite limited and NOT in excess of the universities already vying for it.

Me saying that Virginia and Maryland would be pretty competitive in the MAC is not me saying that the D I FBS talent is limited in MD and VA. I don't agree with you at all. Temple is getting some good talent from there. So is Navy. So is Rutgers.

Rutgers was a doormat until they hired a coach who recruited heavily from...Florida!

The fact that UMd and UVA are consistently mediocre-to-poor, despite having tremendous advantages, is by definition proof that the talent in the area is limited. You can disagree all you want, but that makes you wrong.

(And Navy is required to recruit from the whole country. It's not right to consider them a local school.)

Ton of top quality players in DC,MD and VA. LOADED. Per Rivals DC,MD & Va in 2010 & 2011 had 433 commitments vs IL 187 over same period. Thats a helluva lot of players!

(01-16-2012 03:26 PM)NIU05 Wrote:  Ton of top quality players in DC,MD and VA. LOADED. Per Rivals DC,MD & Va in 2010 & 2011 had 433 commitments vs IL 187 over same period. Thats a helluva lot of players!

Records from 2010&2011

Rutgers 13-12
Princeton 2-18
UMd 11-14
Towson (Md) 10-13 (Admitted, fast rise from 2010 to 2011. 1-1 against Maine, URI and UNH in those years)
UVa 12-13

Quantity doesn't mean quality. And that's assuming Rivals is right, they aren't exactly known for accuracy.

(01-16-2012 04:21 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 03:26 PM)NIU05 Wrote:  Ton of top quality players in DC,MD and VA. LOADED. Per Rivals DC,MD & Va in 2010 & 2011 had 433 commitments vs IL 187 over same period. Thats a helluva lot of players!

Records from 2010&2011

Rutgers 13-12
Princeton 2-18
UMd 11-14
Towson (Md) 10-13 (Admitted, fast rise from 2010 to 2011. 1-1 against Maine, URI and UNH in those years)
UVa 12-13

Quantity doesn't mean quality. And that's assuming Rivals is right, they aren't exactly known for accuracy.

Records from 2002-2011
Rutgers 66-58 (record improved when that actually kept talent home
UVA- 66-59
UMD-67-60 (includes two 2-10 seasons in there too
Towson- 46-67 not bad considering they probably don't get the recruits that VU, Udel, JMU, and the rest of the CAA get on the CAA/Low MAC level
Princeton- 47-57 No athletic scholarship and going after a completely different athlete than Umass would

That looks pretty promising to me with a larger sample size approach. The problems with UVA, Rutgers, and UMD is that they have always struggled to keep the top in state talent home. They do pretty good with the "avg recruits" in there states...

That is of course if it were true that teams were only allowed to recruit from their state...so this argument is stupid. There is talent to be had in that area...

Umass will be targeting the lower BCS, MAC/CUSA, CAA recruits...plenty of them to go around...

(01-16-2012 05:22 PM)templefan1 Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 04:21 PM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 03:26 PM)NIU05 Wrote:  Ton of top quality players in DC,MD and VA. LOADED. Per Rivals DC,MD & Va in 2010 & 2011 had 433 commitments vs IL 187 over same period. Thats a helluva lot of players!

Records from 2010&2011

Rutgers 13-12
Princeton 2-18
UMd 11-14
Towson (Md) 10-13 (Admitted, fast rise from 2010 to 2011. 1-1 against Maine, URI and UNH in those years)
UVa 12-13

Quantity doesn't mean quality. And that's assuming Rivals is right, they aren't exactly known for accuracy.

Records from 2002-2011
Rutgers 66-58 (record improved when that actually kept talent home
UVA- 66-59
UMD-67-60 (includes two 2-10 seasons in there too
Towson- 46-67 not bad considering they probably don't get the recruits that VU, Udel, JMU, and the rest of the CAA get on the CAA/Low MAC level
Princeton- 47-57 No athletic scholarship and going after a completely different athlete than Umass would

That looks pretty promising to me with a larger sample size approach.

No it looks terrible, and you completely lied about Rutgers.

Quote:The problems with UVA, Rutgers, and UMD is that they have always struggled to keep the top in state talent home. They do pretty good with the "avg recruits" in there states...

So why is UMass going to out-recruit them?

Again, you keep missing the entire point, all while proving it repeatedly.

Quote:That is of course if it were true that teams were only allowed to recruit from their state...so this argument is stupid. There is talent to be had in that area...

So you set up a straw man that's already been knocked down repeatedly? Pathetic.

There is talent in the area, just not much. Not enough for UMass to spend their resources recruiting here.

It's a stupid plan by their coach if he follows through with it.

Quote:Umass will be targeting the lower BCS, MAC/CUSA, CAA recruits...plenty of them to go around...

They may snag some CAA recruits, but they will not win FBS games with them.

Give it up guys. Torch will never admit he is wrong. That's part of being a BG fan. He thinks just because certain teams aren't very good in BCS conferences that they could not compete with that same talent in the MAC, and he seems to think that anyone that goes to a FCS school is not any good because they didn't go to a FBS school. He has no clue of the quality of talent in the area.

(01-16-2012 07:50 PM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  Give it up guys. Torch will never admit he is wrong. That's part of being a BG fan. He thinks just because certain teams aren't very good in BCS conferences that they could not compete with that same talent in the MAC, and he seems to think that anyone that goes to a FCS school is not any good because they didn't go to a FBS school. He has no clue of the quality of talent in the area.

+1.... Thought the good Dr would back off AFTER the 433 rides in two years, it didn't slow him down a bit. Oh well, 16 days to National Letter of Intent day. The eye candy is off the board, but still plenty of good players left out there for the staff that knows what it is doing.

Back on track here................Toledo just received a commitment from Toledo, OH (Whitmer High School) running back Jody Webb. Jody is the nephew of former Tennessee Vols and NFL running back Chuck Webb.

Jody Webb is a nice little player...little being the operative word...:) You guys seem to be opening a Whitmer pipeline. BGSU had that going in the 90's....

BG lands *** (Rivals) JUCO DB Josh Pettus. They list him as a CB..the run support abilty he shows on film says he's a safety.

Dr Torch's unwillingness to admit he's wrong has nothing to do with his being a BG fan...We can admit our mistakes..I was wrong when I said Gregg Brandon was a good fit and I admit that. Torch is wrong because he doesn't seem to know much about sports.

(01-17-2012 12:17 AM)El Grande Flippero Wrote:  Jody Webb is a nice little player...little being the operative word...:) You guys seem to be opening a Whitmer pipeline. BGSU had that going in the 90's....

BG lands *** (Rivals) JUCO DB Josh Pettus. They list him as a CB..the run support abilty he shows on film says he's a safety.

Dr Torch's unwillingness to admit he's wrong has nothing to do with his being a BG fan...We can admit our mistakes..I was wrong when I said Gregg Brandon was a good fit and I admit that. Torch is wrong because he doesn't seem to know much about sports.

Webb's a heck of a running back with a lot of speed. He's been electronically timed at 4.38. But, he has not received a high enough ACT score yet to be eligible in 2012. That and his size are why he slipped to a MAC school.

(01-16-2012 07:50 PM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  Give it up guys. Torch will never admit he is wrong.

Yes, that's what happens when you're right. You ought to try it some time before you bash it.

Funny how I'm in N. Maryland, watching what happens here, yet from hundreds of miles away, people who know nothing about the subject like to insist their opinion has value. There's a word for people like that.

El Grand Loser Wrote:Torch is wrong because he doesn't seem to know much about sports.

Except that I'm right more often than you. Of course that's what makes you a loser...

(01-17-2012 08:13 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 07:50 PM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  Give it up guys. Torch will never admit he is wrong.

Yes, that's what happens when you're right. You ought to try it some time before you bash it.

Funny how I'm in N. Maryland, watching what happens here, yet from hundreds of miles away, people who know nothing about the subject like to insist their opinion has value. There's a word for people like that.

El Grand Loser Wrote:Torch is wrong because he doesn't seem to know much about sports.

Except that I'm right more often than you. Of course that's what makes you a loser...

Torch, you need to read my comments before you make a fool of yourself. I already said I am not hundreds of miles away. I live in NOVA and know some Maryland and Virginia high school coaches.

As for you calling your fellow BG fan a loser, you are showing your ignorance. First, you are frustrated that no one agrees with you, and second you are acting like a child by calling someone a loser. Class act Torch!

ACC teams have no problem with talent (look at how many play in the NFL) they have problems with coaching (which honestly I think is more important).

(01-17-2012 11:35 AM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  

(01-17-2012 08:13 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(01-16-2012 07:50 PM)BrianNowicki Wrote:  Give it up guys. Torch will never admit he is wrong.

Yes, that's what happens when you're right. You ought to try it some time before you bash it.

Funny how I'm in N. Maryland, watching what happens here, yet from hundreds of miles away, people who know nothing about the subject like to insist their opinion has value. There's a word for people like that.

El Grand Loser Wrote:Torch is wrong because he doesn't seem to know much about sports.

Except that I'm right more often than you. Of course that's what makes you a loser...

Torch, you need to read my comments before you make a fool of yourself. I already said I am not hundreds of miles away. I live in NOVA and know some Maryland and Virginia high school coaches.

Yes, you're the one who brought VA into the discussion about MD and NJ. You're not even wrong.

Quote:As for you calling your fellow BG fan a loser, you are showing your ignorance. First, you are frustrated that no one agrees with you,

Not at all. But why is your ignorance acceptable? Answer that before you attempt a failed analysis of me.

Quote:and second you are acting like a child by calling someone a loser. Class act Torch!

**** off Brian!

How's that? You don't know jack ****, yet you keep arguing. In my world that's classless. If you don't like it, then **** off again.

No one asked Flipper to vent on me b/c he fantasizes about BG's return to success w/o doing the hard things. Yet he persists. So he gets the hard truth. You call truth "classless"? Maybe that works in your world. Doesn't work in mine.

Oh, and BTW

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/15/opinio...wanted=all