(05-27-2013 10:54 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  I would say history majors are needed since half of all graduating high school seniors can't identify what century the Civil War was fought in.

You assume history majors know that!

One problem is that many profs aren't really teaching their subjects, they're indoctrinating students into a belief system. One that doesn't pay much regard to facts.

Something doesn't jive here.

Quote:Harvard, Stanford, and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology have gained attention with their MOOCs, or massive open online courses, which are free and feature famed professors.

Quote:The school’s management forecasts that revenue will reach $200 million in the next academic year—four times what it took in for 2010-11—making it one of the biggest and fastest-growing online operations at any not-for-profit college in the U.S.

Quote:For the current academic year, the university is projecting a $29 million profit from the online college, which amounts to a 22 percent margin.

If the courses are free, how is the revenue generated?

(05-28-2013 10:33 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Something doesn't jive here.

Quote:Harvard, Stanford, and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology have gained attention with their MOOCs, or massive open online courses, which are free and feature famed professors.

Quote:The school’s management forecasts that revenue will reach $200 million in the next academic year—four times what it took in for 2010-11—making it one of the biggest and fastest-growing online operations at any not-for-profit college in the U.S.

Quote:For the current academic year, the university is projecting a $29 million profit from the online college, which amounts to a 22 percent margin.

If the courses are free, how is the revenue generated?

Harvard, Stanford and MIT offer courses, SNHU offers a degree so you have to pay for it. I don't think the online lectures from the big schools give any credit. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, please.

(05-28-2013 10:42 AM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:33 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Something doesn't jive here.

Quote:Harvard, Stanford, and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology have gained attention with their MOOCs, or massive open online courses, which are free and feature famed professors.

Quote:The school’s management forecasts that revenue will reach $200 million in the next academic year—four times what it took in for 2010-11—making it one of the biggest and fastest-growing online operations at any not-for-profit college in the U.S.

Quote:For the current academic year, the university is projecting a $29 million profit from the online college, which amounts to a 22 percent margin.

If the courses are free, how is the revenue generated?

Harvard, Stanford and MIT offer courses, SNHU offers a degree so you have to pay for it. I don't think the online lectures from the big schools give any credit. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, please.

You can get credit from some of the MOOC providers (Standford for sure) but it involves more steps than just taking the class, and yes, it costs money.

(05-28-2013 10:52 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:42 AM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:33 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Something doesn't jive here.

Quote:Harvard, Stanford, and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology have gained attention with their MOOCs, or massive open online courses, which are free and feature famed professors.

Quote:The school’s management forecasts that revenue will reach $200 million in the next academic year—four times what it took in for 2010-11—making it one of the biggest and fastest-growing online operations at any not-for-profit college in the U.S.

Quote:For the current academic year, the university is projecting a $29 million profit from the online college, which amounts to a 22 percent margin.

If the courses are free, how is the revenue generated?

Harvard, Stanford and MIT offer courses, SNHU offers a degree so you have to pay for it. I don't think the online lectures from the big schools give any credit. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, please.

You can get credit from some of the MOOC providers (Standford for sure) but it involves more steps than just taking the class, and yes, it costs money.

I still think that the "higher education factory" model of today isn't a whole lot better than stealing. The costs have so outpaced inflation it borders on criiminal that our elected politicians have allowed it to go on unabated at all state institutions.

Christ - getting a totally online degree shouldn't cost more that $5,000 per year. I mean, obviously the professors have to get paid, and there are server costs as well as some administrative costs - but why in the hell should it cost $10K per year to go online other than "we can get it".

If the governments (either Federal or State) cared at all, this is where they could step-in and create an affordable on-line state accredited degree program that didn't break the bank. They could start de-funding the state higher education oligopoly and force these fat instutitions to start shedding professors in the "useless degrees" many on here have been lamenting.

Wanna major in Sociology - go get it at a private university - and "Oh by the way" - the government won't lend you money for this degree. Same with womens studies, African American studies, etc., etc.

(05-27-2013 08:50 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(05-27-2013 08:46 PM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  I would even say that art, music, english, and history majors are valuable.

Agree.
I would say particularly so, since they make valuable and useful contributions.

We would certainly not be better off forgetting history.

(05-28-2013 12:19 PM)Crebman Wrote:  Wanna major in Sociology - go get it at a private university - and "Oh by the way" - the government won't lend you money for this degree. Same with womens studies, African American studies, etc., etc.

I don't think you need on-line courses for that. Just require that each dept pay for itself...without forcing additional requirements on students.

For Gen Ed requirements, students don't really need anything more than this:
Math- Calc I (unless BFA)
Science- 1 Lab class (Bio, Chem, Geol, Phys, Astr)
Hist- 1 World Hist, 1 US Hist
Lit- 2 classes
Writing- 1 class
Phil- 1 class
Art/Music- 1 class each

That's about 1 year's worth of classes. That's plenty of time to focus on your major.

(05-28-2013 12:19 PM)Crebman Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:52 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:42 AM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:33 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Something doesn't jive here.

Quote:Harvard, Stanford, and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology have gained attention with their MOOCs, or massive open online courses, which are free and feature famed professors.

Quote:The school’s management forecasts that revenue will reach $200 million in the next academic year—four times what it took in for 2010-11—making it one of the biggest and fastest-growing online operations at any not-for-profit college in the U.S.

Quote:For the current academic year, the university is projecting a $29 million profit from the online college, which amounts to a 22 percent margin.

If the courses are free, how is the revenue generated?

Harvard, Stanford and MIT offer courses, SNHU offers a degree so you have to pay for it. I don't think the online lectures from the big schools give any credit. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, please.

You can get credit from some of the MOOC providers (Standford for sure) but it involves more steps than just taking the class, and yes, it costs money.

I still think that the "higher education factory" model of today isn't a whole lot better than stealing. The costs have so outpaced inflation it borders on criiminal that our elected politicians have allowed it to go on unabated at all state institutions.

Christ - getting a totally online degree shouldn't cost more that $5,000 per year. I mean, obviously the professors have to get paid, and there are server costs as well as some administrative costs - but why in the hell should it cost $10K per year to go online other than "we can get it".

If the governments (either Federal or State) cared at all, this is where they could step-in and create an affordable on-line state accredited degree program that didn't break the bank. They could start de-funding the state higher education oligopoly and force these fat instutitions to start shedding professors in the "useless degrees" many on here have been lamenting.

Wanna major in Sociology - go get it at a private university - and "Oh by the way" - the government won't lend you money for this degree. Same with womens studies, African American studies, etc., etc.

I'd have to disagree with the last part. You don't have to offer the degree but I think it would be irresponsible to not offer the classes.

(05-28-2013 01:06 PM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  I'd have to disagree with the last part. You don't have to offer the degree but I think it would be irresponsible to not offer the classes.

Why?

B/c I'd say the opposite, state subsidized classes are for the demonstrable good of the state. That's the deal. That's why most state schools got their start as A&M or Normal colleges. Everything else has been scope creep w/ taxpayers paying for it.

(05-28-2013 01:06 PM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 12:19 PM)Crebman Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:52 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:42 AM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:33 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Something doesn't jive here.





If the courses are free, how is the revenue generated?

Harvard, Stanford and MIT offer courses, SNHU offers a degree so you have to pay for it. I don't think the online lectures from the big schools give any credit. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, please.

You can get credit from some of the MOOC providers (Standford for sure) but it involves more steps than just taking the class, and yes, it costs money.

I still think that the "higher education factory" model of today isn't a whole lot better than stealing. The costs have so outpaced inflation it borders on criiminal that our elected politicians have allowed it to go on unabated at all state institutions.

Christ - getting a totally online degree shouldn't cost more that $5,000 per year. I mean, obviously the professors have to get paid, and there are server costs as well as some administrative costs - but why in the hell should it cost $10K per year to go online other than "we can get it".

If the governments (either Federal or State) cared at all, this is where they could step-in and create an affordable on-line state accredited degree program that didn't break the bank. They could start de-funding the state higher education oligopoly and force these fat instutitions to start shedding professors in the "useless degrees" many on here have been lamenting.

Wanna major in Sociology - go get it at a private university - and "Oh by the way" - the government won't lend you money for this degree. Same with womens studies, African American studies, etc., etc.

I'd have to disagree with the last part. You don't have to offer the degree but I think it would be irresponsible to not offer the classes.

Ok, as Torch just stated - make the departments pay for themselves. Or maybe all those sociology majors, etc. can donor up to fund the department.

(05-28-2013 01:10 PM)Crebman Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 01:06 PM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 12:19 PM)Crebman Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:52 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:42 AM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  Harvard, Stanford and MIT offer courses, SNHU offers a degree so you have to pay for it. I don't think the online lectures from the big schools give any credit. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, please.

You can get credit from some of the MOOC providers (Standford for sure) but it involves more steps than just taking the class, and yes, it costs money.

I still think that the "higher education factory" model of today isn't a whole lot better than stealing. The costs have so outpaced inflation it borders on criiminal that our elected politicians have allowed it to go on unabated at all state institutions.

Christ - getting a totally online degree shouldn't cost more that $5,000 per year. I mean, obviously the professors have to get paid, and there are server costs as well as some administrative costs - but why in the hell should it cost $10K per year to go online other than "we can get it".

If the governments (either Federal or State) cared at all, this is where they could step-in and create an affordable on-line state accredited degree program that didn't break the bank. They could start de-funding the state higher education oligopoly and force these fat instutitions to start shedding professors in the "useless degrees" many on here have been lamenting.

Wanna major in Sociology - go get it at a private university - and "Oh by the way" - the government won't lend you money for this degree. Same with womens studies, African American studies, etc., etc.

I'd have to disagree with the last part. You don't have to offer the degree but I think it would be irresponsible to not offer the classes.

Ok, as Torch just stated - make the departments pay for themselves. Or maybe all those sociology majors, etc. can donor up to fund the department.

But the "victims studies" programs are usually in the history dept.

(05-28-2013 10:52 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:42 AM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:33 AM)VA49er Wrote:  Something doesn't jive here.

Quote:Harvard, Stanford, and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology have gained attention with their MOOCs, or massive open online courses, which are free and feature famed professors.

Quote:The school’s management forecasts that revenue will reach $200 million in the next academic year—four times what it took in for 2010-11—making it one of the biggest and fastest-growing online operations at any not-for-profit college in the U.S.

Quote:For the current academic year, the university is projecting a $29 million profit from the online college, which amounts to a 22 percent margin.

If the courses are free, how is the revenue generated?

Harvard, Stanford and MIT offer courses, SNHU offers a degree so you have to pay for it. I don't think the online lectures from the big schools give any credit. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, please.

You can get credit from some of the MOOC providers (Standford for sure) but it involves more steps than just taking the class, and yes, it costs money.

Right, so the freely available lectures online are different to online degree courses which you have to pay for? I think that's the difference that wasn't made entirely clear in the article.

(05-28-2013 01:14 PM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  Right, so the freely available lectures online are different to online degree courses which you have to pay for? I think that's the difference that wasn't made entirely clear in the article.

Not necessarily. Depends on who's sponsoring it. In short it's exactly as someone wrote: Some schools are giving it away, SNHU is charging, but you get a shot at a degree.

http://ocw.mit.edu/about/
http://www.extension.harvard.edu/open-le...initiative

I think we're making the same point. The free open course materials that Harvard and MIT offer do not give credit, MIT's OCW is a massive undertaking to get all of their materials online freely available to anyone, it is not an online degree though, it is there to educate anyone who wants access to the kind of stuff that they teach. If you want a diploma from online courses then you have to pay for them, that's why some schools (SNHU) make money from online education and some schools don't. Of course some places charge for classes and don't give credit.

(05-28-2013 02:09 PM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  http://ocw.mit.edu/about/
http://www.extension.harvard.edu/open-le...initiative

I think we're making the same point. The free open course materials that Harvard and MIT offer do not give credit, MIT's OCW is a massive undertaking to get all of their materials online freely available to anyone, it is not an online degree though, it is there to educate anyone who wants access to the kind of stuff that they teach. If you want a diploma from online courses then you have to pay for them, that's why some schools (SNHU) make money from online education and some schools don't.

Pretty much, except I think Stanfraud's courses are the same, but you can arrange to pay and take them for credit.

(05-27-2013 06:55 PM)dmacfour Wrote:  

(05-27-2013 06:49 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(05-27-2013 06:33 PM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  I would really like to find out the amount of people that graduate with a "victim" studies degree. The way you guys talk, the number is massive and includes yourselves.

One is way too many.

The world would be a far better place if possession of a degree in sociology were a capital offense. And there are about a dozen other majors a out which the same could be said.

I heard that Purdue gave a guy a Master's degree in Magic once.

What a waste. On the other hand, if he could actually do magic, it could turn out pretty lucrative.

Just do not understand why some universities are literally getting filthy rich with online courses, while others are abstaining from them so much. Some administrators attitudes to them being "diploma mills" if they do a lot of online courses seem to be part of the rejection by some of the universities not offering a lot of online courses.

"Liberty’s expansion has yielded a river of money. The university ended 2012 with more than $1 billion in net assets for the first time, counting cash, property, investments and other holdings. That is 10 times what the school had in 2006, putting Liberty in the same financial league as universities such as Pepperdine, Georgetown and Tulane."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/educ...story.html

(05-30-2013 07:16 AM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Just do not understand why some universities are literally getting filthy rich with online courses, while others are abstaining from them so much. Some administrators attitudes to them being "diploma mills" if they do a lot of online courses seem to be part of the rejection by some of the universities not offering a lot of online courses.

"Liberty’s expansion has yielded a river of money. The university ended 2012 with more than $1 billion in net assets for the first time, counting cash, property, investments and other holdings. That is 10 times what the school had in 2006, putting Liberty in the same financial league as universities such as Pepperdine, Georgetown and Tulane."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/educ...story.html

They are ALL diploma mills to some extent excepting maybe only the most endowed and elite, but even those are "education factories" to a point.

In the end, it's all for getting "credentials" that will allow someone to get a job and have a career path. The costs to do that have gotten out of hand - I think most all on here agree with that.

Unfortunately, I can't see the costs coming down at traditional colleges until the "easy" federal borrowing gets tougher. It's too easy for a 19 year old to sign on the dotted line and take a loan - there is no pain involved until much too late.

(05-28-2013 01:14 PM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 01:10 PM)Crebman Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 01:06 PM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 12:19 PM)Crebman Wrote:  

(05-28-2013 10:52 AM)DrTorch Wrote:  You can get credit from some of the MOOC providers (Standford for sure) but it involves more steps than just taking the class, and yes, it costs money.

I still think that the "higher education factory" model of today isn't a whole lot better than stealing. The costs have so outpaced inflation it borders on criiminal that our elected politicians have allowed it to go on unabated at all state institutions.

Christ - getting a totally online degree shouldn't cost more that $5,000 per year. I mean, obviously the professors have to get paid, and there are server costs as well as some administrative costs - but why in the hell should it cost $10K per year to go online other than "we can get it".

If the governments (either Federal or State) cared at all, this is where they could step-in and create an affordable on-line state accredited degree program that didn't break the bank. They could start de-funding the state higher education oligopoly and force these fat instutitions to start shedding professors in the "useless degrees" many on here have been lamenting.

Wanna major in Sociology - go get it at a private university - and "Oh by the way" - the government won't lend you money for this degree. Same with womens studies, African American studies, etc., etc.

I'd have to disagree with the last part. You don't have to offer the degree but I think it would be irresponsible to not offer the classes.

Ok, as Torch just stated - make the departments pay for themselves. Or maybe all those sociology majors, etc. can donor up to fund the department.

But the "victims studies" programs are usually in the history dept.

Mad...You know ECU leads the NC schools in distance Ed. It makes one hell of a lot of money doing it.

I see this as the marketplace responding to signals. It is going to change the way schools market their product to respond to this competition. Don't think for one second that Universities are not big business and view this as a threat. It will be interesting to see how this shakes out. Who knows? It may lead to a reduction in tuition to respond.