(12-16-2011 10:41 AM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:25 AM)wvucrazed Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 06:46 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  To bad they are evangelicals and their degrees arent respected by any educator.

This is true. It will be interesting to see if any other conferences are going to want to be associated with them. I wonder what ODU and JMU feel about the folks down at Liberty.

I think that perception of Liberty is starting to change though.

http://www.liberty.edu/aboutliberty/index.cfm?PID=7650

The past three companies that I've worked for would throw out resumes from their alums. In the pecking order of Virginia universities, they're somewhere above getting stabbed in the thigh with a screwdriver but behind Janella's Cosmetology Institute.

(12-16-2011 03:33 AM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(12-15-2011 11:18 PM)solohawks Wrote:  same problem all eastern fcs upgrades have...mac or sunbelt? neither is a great fit

The MAC could be a decent fit for Liberty actually.

Liberty would give the MAC that one private school playing FBS ball like the Big Ten has with Northwestern. They could pair Liberty with another nice regional addition like Appalachian State.

Liberty and Northwestern in the same sentence....

(12-20-2011 09:14 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:41 AM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:25 AM)wvucrazed Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 06:46 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  To bad they are evangelicals and their degrees arent respected by any educator.

This is true. It will be interesting to see if any other conferences are going to want to be associated with them. I wonder what ODU and JMU feel about the folks down at Liberty.

I think that perception of Liberty is starting to change though.

http://www.liberty.edu/aboutliberty/index.cfm?PID=7650

The past three companies that I've worked for would throw out resumes from their alums. In the pecking order of Virginia universities, they're somewhere above getting stabbed in the thigh with a screwdriver but behind Janella's Cosmetology Institute.

The last five companies I worked with appreciated their degrees and values. And one of those companies is one of the 25 largest companies in the USA. I was impressed that most of the leaders in those companies were not christophobic. I do confess that as much as possible prior to being self employed I tried to associate with companies that placed a high priority on ethical leadership.

(12-21-2011 01:07 AM)Rabonchild Wrote:  

(12-20-2011 09:14 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:41 AM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:25 AM)wvucrazed Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 06:46 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  To bad they are evangelicals and their degrees arent respected by any educator.

This is true. It will be interesting to see if any other conferences are going to want to be associated with them. I wonder what ODU and JMU feel about the folks down at Liberty.

I think that perception of Liberty is starting to change though.

http://www.liberty.edu/aboutliberty/index.cfm?PID=7650

The past three companies that I've worked for would throw out resumes from their alums. In the pecking order of Virginia universities, they're somewhere above getting stabbed in the thigh with a screwdriver but behind Janella's Cosmetology Institute.

The last five companies I worked with appreciated their degrees and values. And one of those companies is one of the 25 largest companies in the USA. I was impressed that most of the leaders in those companies were not christophobic. I do confess that as much as possible prior to being self employed I tried to associate with companies that placed a high priority on ethical leadership.

It's not "christophobic", it's "I don't want to hire someone that didn't go to a real college." Either they were too dumb to get into a legitimate school or they were too foolish to know the difference. Either way, I'll pass. I have the same stance on University of Phoenix, Strayer, and all the other diploma mills out there.

(12-21-2011 09:21 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(12-21-2011 01:07 AM)Rabonchild Wrote:  

(12-20-2011 09:14 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:41 AM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:25 AM)wvucrazed Wrote:  This is true. It will be interesting to see if any other conferences are going to want to be associated with them. I wonder what ODU and JMU feel about the folks down at Liberty.

I think that perception of Liberty is starting to change though.

http://www.liberty.edu/aboutliberty/index.cfm?PID=7650

The past three companies that I've worked for would throw out resumes from their alums. In the pecking order of Virginia universities, they're somewhere above getting stabbed in the thigh with a screwdriver but behind Janella's Cosmetology Institute.

The last five companies I worked with appreciated their degrees and values. And one of those companies is one of the 25 largest companies in the USA. I was impressed that most of the leaders in those companies were not christophobic. I do confess that as much as possible prior to being self employed I tried to associate with companies that placed a high priority on ethical leadership.

It's not "christophobic", it's "I don't want to hire someone that didn't go to a real college." Either they were too dumb to get into a legitimate school or they were too foolish to know the difference. Either way, I'll pass. I have the same stance on University of Phoenix, Strayer, and all the other diploma mills out there.

I'm with ya on this 100%

(12-21-2011 01:07 AM)Rabonchild Wrote:  

(12-20-2011 09:14 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:41 AM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:25 AM)wvucrazed Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 06:46 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  To bad they are evangelicals and their degrees arent respected by any educator.

This is true. It will be interesting to see if any other conferences are going to want to be associated with them. I wonder what ODU and JMU feel about the folks down at Liberty.

I think that perception of Liberty is starting to change though.

http://www.liberty.edu/aboutliberty/index.cfm?PID=7650

The past three companies that I've worked for would throw out resumes from their alums. In the pecking order of Virginia universities, they're somewhere above getting stabbed in the thigh with a screwdriver but behind Janella's Cosmetology Institute.

The last five companies I worked with appreciated their degrees and values. And one of those companies is one of the 25 largest companies in the USA. I was impressed that most of the leaders in those companies were not christophobic. I do confess that as much as possible prior to being self employed I tried to associate with companies that placed a high priority on ethical leadership.

What does ethical leadership have to do with Liberty University? I don't consider virulent homophobia as ethical.

The vast majority of homophobes are closet gays who are afraid to admit it to themselves. So it manifests itself as self-loathing, and an abject fear of anything related to any kind of abnormal sexual behavior, especially homosexuality...

It'll be interesting to see what they conclude - programs like Notre Dame and BYU had to start somewhere, were they always the household names they were today? I have a cousin who went to Liberty, and it seems to me like LU is on the rise.

(12-21-2011 01:56 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  The vast majority of homophobes are closet gays who are afraid to admit it to themselves. So it manifests itself as self-loathing, and an abject fear of anything related to any kind of abnormal sexual behavior, especially homosexuality...

I think you're right, Bit.

I have a gay friend who went to Liberty. It was pretty eye-opening hearing him talk about his time there. I have zero tolerance for their false notion of moral superiority, their wielding of religion as a method of power and control, and their zealous bigotry against gays and lesbians.

Jerry Falwell blamed 9/11 on the gays and other liberals for "incurring God's wrath". It's pretty hard to take any university seriously after something like that.

Also from Falwell: "AIDS is not just God's punishment for homosexuals; it is God's punishment for the society that tolerates homosexuals."

The list goes on. I would never want to be associated in any way with Falwell's legacy, Liberty University, and never will.

The problem with much of what has been posted here against Liberty is that you are assuming / assigning every viewpoint, every policy, every outragous statement ever made by Jerry Farwell or any administrator or trustee at Liberty to every professor, student or administrator at the school. I never cared for Farwell myself but to assign blame like that and totally write off any one or anything that ever came out of the University as a result seems to be a bit shortsighted and just plain wrong.

(12-21-2011 02:30 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  The problem with much of what has been posted here against Liberty is that you are assuming / assigning every viewpoint, every policy, every outragous statement ever made by Jerry Farwell or any administrator or trustee at Liberty to every professor, student or administrator at the school. I never cared for Farwell myself but to assign blame like that and totally write off any one or anything that ever came out of the University as a result seems to be a bit shortsighted and just plain wrong.

Not true; I'm sure many students don't agree with much of Falwell's dogma. Some, like my gay friend, go there to please their parents.

But the university itself is run very much in keeping with Falwell's personal beliefs. They teach Young Earth Creationism in science class (lol). At one point they banned college democrats from campus, saying being in the Democratic party was "incompatible with Christianity". They promote and associate with the completely discredited and fraudulent and harmful "ex-gay therapy" con artists like Exodus International. They ban books they deem "pro-gay" from their library.

Their prominant law professor Matt Barber is one of the most outspoken and vicious anti-gay voices in the country. He said that anti-bullying policies aimed at helping gay youth (or youth perceived to be gay) are "sexualizing children" and "running interference for the pedophile movement" and that the efforts of gay rights are geared toward "supporting the pedophile movement".

This is only the very tip of the iceberg. Liberty is all about indoctrination to a particularly bigoted and warped brand of evangelism, and their goal is to unleash their graduates out into the world to help spread their view.

Falwell's son now runs Liberty, very much in the same vein that his father did. They don't permit dissent there. So yeah - - it's safe to correlate Falwell's statements and positions with those of Liberty University as a whole, as they prove day in and day out by their policies, actions, and the statements of their prominent leaders.

(12-21-2011 02:17 PM)wvucrazed Wrote:  

(12-21-2011 01:56 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  The vast majority of homophobes are closet gays who are afraid to admit it to themselves. So it manifests itself as self-loathing, and an abject fear of anything related to any kind of abnormal sexual behavior, especially homosexuality...

I think you're right, Bit.

I have a gay friend who went to Liberty. It was pretty eye-opening hearing him talk about his time there. I have zero tolerance for their false notion of moral superiority, their wielding of religion as a method of power and control, There you go. I knew it would be just a matter of time before bringing you out of the closet about why you’ re attitude is so vile towards Liberty. It appears it is because Liberty espouses what citizens in states across the USA have expressed (every time) they have been given an opportunity to vote on this issue (which is over 30 times). I know of many straight students who have been hated on in public Liberal art schools. It doesn’t seem to of had a negative effect on them. I’m sure your gay friend will find success. and their zealous bigotry against gays and lesbians.

Jerry Falwell blamed 9/11 on the gays and other liberals for "incurring God's wrath". It's pretty hard to take any university seriously after something like that.



Also from Falwell: "AIDS is not just God's punishment for homosexuals; it is God's punishment for the society that tolerates homosexuals."

The list goes on. I would never want to be associated in any way with Falwell's legacy, Liberty University, and never will.

There you go. I knew it would be just a matter of time before bringing you out of the closet about why you’ re attitude is so vile towards Liberty. It appears it is because Liberty espouses what citizens in states across the USA have expressed (every time) they have been given an opportunity to vote on this issue (which is over 30 times). I know of many straight students who have been hated on in public Liberal art schools. It doesn’t seem to of had a negative effect on them. I’m sure your gay friend will find success.

(12-21-2011 09:21 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(12-21-2011 01:07 AM)Rabonchild Wrote:  

(12-20-2011 09:14 AM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:41 AM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(12-16-2011 10:25 AM)wvucrazed Wrote:  This is true. It will be interesting to see if any other conferences are going to want to be associated with them. I wonder what ODU and JMU feel about the folks down at Liberty.

I think that perception of Liberty is starting to change though.

http://www.liberty.edu/aboutliberty/index.cfm?PID=7650

The past three companies that I've worked for would throw out resumes from their alums. In the pecking order of Virginia universities, they're somewhere above getting stabbed in the thigh with a screwdriver but behind Janella's Cosmetology Institute.

The last five companies I worked with appreciated their degrees and values. And one of those companies is one of the 25 largest companies in the USA. I was impressed that most of the leaders in those companies were not christophobic. I do confess that as much as possible prior to being self employed I tried to associate with companies that placed a high priority on ethical leadership.

It's not "christophobic", it's "I don't want to hire someone that didn't go to a real college." Either they were too dumb to get into a legitimate school or they were too foolish to know the difference. Either way, I'll pass. I have the same stance on University of Phoenix, Strayer, and all the other diploma mills out there.

I didn't know you were hiring at McDonalds. That's great news! Now those with degrees from West Virginia can get a job. Their low educational standards is the reason given for the ACC not accepting them over Pitt & Syracuse

(12-21-2011 03:09 PM)Rabonchild Wrote:  There you go. I knew it would be just a matter of time before bringing you out of the closet about why you’ re attitude is so vile towards Liberty. It appears it is because Liberty espouses what citizens in states across the USA have expressed (every time) they have been given an opportunity to vote on this issue (which is over 30 times). I know of many straight students who have been hated on in public Liberal art schools. It doesn’t seem to of had a negative effect on them. I’m sure your gay friend will find success.

30 out of 30 states have gone on record supporting the notion that AIDS is God's wrath on homosexuals? They've gone on record stating that homosexuals are supporting a pedophile agenda? The citizens of 30 out of 30 states would agree with Falwell when he states that separation of church and state is a myth and that we should basically be governed as a Christian theocracy?

No, it's more than just opposition to gay marriage - - far more.

Jerry Falwell: "I hope I live to see the day when, as in the early days of our country, we won't have any public schools. The churches will have taken them over again and Christians will be running them. What a happy day that will be!"

Would citizens of 30 out of 30 states agree with that sentiment?

I make no apologies for having a "vile attitude" towards Liberty because frankly, I find them vile, and their positions dangerous and anti-American.

Oh, and my gay friend has found success. Despite his traumatic experiences in Lynchburg.

(12-21-2011 03:17 PM)Rabonchild Wrote:  I didn't know you were hiring at McDonalds. That's great news! Now those with degrees from West Virginia can get a job. Their low educational standards is the reason given for the ACC not accepting them over Pitt & Syracuse

How DID the dinosaurs fit on Noah's Ark? I've always wondered, but since they didn't teach mythology as science at WVU, I've never been able to figure it out.

(12-15-2011 09:59 PM)army56mike Wrote:  LU currently has 13,000 students and wants to be at 20,000 by 2020 on campus. They have over 80,000 if you count their online students. They are sinking millions of dollars into campus improvements in academic, student life and athletics. They have a great football facility that is 20,000 and expanding to 30,000. Money is not an issue with Liberty.

This is not true at all.

Their endowment is only $50.6 million. Other than EMU, San Jose State, and a couple of Sun Belt schools, this would be the smallest endowment in FBS. Money would be a HUGE impediment for them.

I think this thread should turn into a "let's see which side is better at stereotyping" thread. Who wins: Evangelicals or Hippies?

You see! Liberty is a perfect addition for any conference. In many folks eyes they are a lightning rod and elicit high emotional responses. A conference couldn't buy that kind of publicity or garner the attention from all sorts that Liberty U. would be able to bring to the table.

That being said, as a soon to be Liberty graduate, I and most people around me would say I am a great professional with good character. I'm sorry Mr. Falwell offended you. And I get a great sense that you oppose Christianity far more than Liberty University, but that is my assumption based on your remarks.

Thankfully, the Liberty Flames will find an FBS home in the future and represent themselves and their conference with great sportsmanship on the field and good character and respectfullness off the field.

IMO Jerry Falwell is an idiot. But he's not the first such, and won't be the last either. Liberty is a decent school. However its attitudes are set in the late 1800s, for the most part. But that's a product of Falwell's denomination...

Some Christians exalt the love and glory of God, while others preach eternal damnation. Falwell is of the latter variety. The purpose of all the hellfire and damnation preaching is to keep their flock in perpetual fear of God. That's to keep people good, because they're afraid of God...

Something about that seems slightly off kilter to me. If God exists, and is such a loving God, why should anyone live in fear of him?

(12-21-2011 05:58 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  IMO Jerry Falwell is an idiot. But he's not the first such, and won't be the last either. Liberty is a decent school. However its attitudes are set in the late 1800s, for the most part. But that's a product of Falwell's denomination...

Some Christians exalt the love and glory of God, while others preach eternal damnation. Falwell is of the latter variety. The purpose of all the hellfire and damnation preaching is to keep their flock in perpetual fear of God. That's to keep people good, because they're afraid of God...

Something about that seems slightly off kilter to me. If God exists, and is such a loving God, why should anyone live in fear of him?

I am sure you have read both the New and Old Testament right? After reading them you really have to wonder if it is the same God because they are so different (of course there are many reasons for that if you take a look at when they were written, the history of that time, and how beliefs and attitudes changed). The time the OT dealt with was much more brutal than the NT time and that was more brutal than today in many ways.

I think those who go towards the views you are talking about probably put more emphasis on what was written in the Old testament (not that they don't put emphasis on the New testament of course but the tone is very different in the new from the old).