(04-01-2026 01:31 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:11 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 12:44 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:31 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:19 AM)TripleA Wrote:  Exactly. Not our problem. We fixed the big issue, their march toward nukes.

If they want the Strait open, go take it, you sissies. Damn, 35 countries can't muster enough firepower to stop Iran from dominating what is supposed to be international waters?

We broke it, we dont fix it, we walk away. Cool cool.

I have to remember that one -- neat argument for covering over anytime my actions create a deep, massive, literally global impact issue.

Its Iran blocking the Gulf---not us. Its Iran demanding full control over the Gulf and its Iran demanding a fee for passage. Freedom of navigation is not a real thing. It only exists for shipping because various navies have established and enforced that right (in the past---that direct protection only was provided for their own merchant ships). If your not willing to enforce freedom of the seas---then that right may or may not exist---that right would then be dependent on how aggressive other nations or non-state actors wish to be.

Since the end of WWII the US has defended freedom of navigation on the high seas for everyone at no cost to anyone. We are now 38 trillion indebt. Its time for other nations to pick up part of the tab, or they can do it themselves if they dont want to lend a hand (or they can just pay the Iranian toll, which is how many nations used to handle things like the Barbary Pirates back when this type of thing was more common). Anyone see Russia concerned about how their actions in Ukraine affect the world fuel, steel, fertilizer, neon, or wheat markets? That Russian indifference is how the world REALLY works outside of the American Rules Based Order bubble of defense paid for by a US tax payer who is no longer able to carry the burden. The last 80 years or so is an anomaly. There is a reason no nation in history has ever taxed itself so heavily to create the most powerful military in the world just to maintain the status quo---rather than using it to create an ever-expanding empire for themselves to lord over.

Attack, it was pretty clear that the *first* thing that Iran would do when existentially threatened would be to shut Hormuz down.

We went in with a strike to do just that. And we broke the Strait. For the world mind you.

Now the administration wants *everyone ELSE* to fix what we broke. End of story.

The full cause in fact of Hormuz being shut down is a logical, predictable, and now tangible result of our strike. We. Broke. It. Regardless of anything said above. And regardless of 'how right' we were (or not) to launch a special military operation of choice. We. Broke. It.

Now we are cying for everyone else to fix what we broke. Brilliant.

lol----Again--patently inaccurate. WE did not break it. Iran--and ONLY Iran--closed it. Our Navy has the ability to militarily close any waterway to merchant shipping anywhere in the world. Were we do so in an attempt to force some nation to change some policy---that closure would be ENTIRELY our fault---and the only way it could be reopened is if WE decide to reopen it or if we are militarily FORCED to reopen the waterway. Virtually nobody---other than perhaps you and whoever was running the USA in this example---would point to whatever nation's conduct America was trying to change with the waterway closure---and say the closure was this other nation's fault. Virtually everyone else would point to the USA as the culprit.

In this instance---Iran closed the Strait. Furthermore---the closure negatively affects virtually every other nation not involved more than the US is affected.

Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, Iran shut it down. They didnt do it for ***** and giggles. The reason Iran shut it down was because of our actions. At least be honest in the chain of causation.

We knew damn well that had a high probability of happening. And we did it anyway.

I dont understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation.

(04-01-2026 01:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:31 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:11 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 12:44 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:31 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  We broke it, we dont fix it, we walk away. Cool cool.

I have to remember that one -- neat argument for covering over anytime my actions create a deep, massive, literally global impact issue.

Its Iran blocking the Gulf---not us. Its Iran demanding full control over the Gulf and its Iran demanding a fee for passage. Freedom of navigation is not a real thing. It only exists for shipping because various navies have established and enforced that right (in the past---that direct protection only was provided for their own merchant ships). If your not willing to enforce freedom of the seas---then that right may or may not exist---that right would then be dependent on how aggressive other nations or non-state actors wish to be.

Since the end of WWII the US has defended freedom of navigation on the high seas for everyone at no cost to anyone. We are now 38 trillion indebt. Its time for other nations to pick up part of the tab, or they can do it themselves if they dont want to lend a hand (or they can just pay the Iranian toll, which is how many nations used to handle things like the Barbary Pirates back when this type of thing was more common). Anyone see Russia concerned about how their actions in Ukraine affect the world fuel, steel, fertilizer, neon, or wheat markets? That Russian indifference is how the world REALLY works outside of the American Rules Based Order bubble of defense paid for by a US tax payer who is no longer able to carry the burden. The last 80 years or so is an anomaly. There is a reason no nation in history has ever taxed itself so heavily to create the most powerful military in the world just to maintain the status quo---rather than using it to create an ever-expanding empire for themselves to lord over.

Attack, it was pretty clear that the *first* thing that Iran would do when existentially threatened would be to shut Hormuz down.

We went in with a strike to do just that. And we broke the Strait. For the world mind you.

Now the administration wants *everyone ELSE* to fix what we broke. End of story.

The full cause in fact of Hormuz being shut down is a logical, predictable, and now tangible result of our strike. We. Broke. It. Regardless of anything said above. And regardless of 'how right' we were (or not) to launch a special military operation of choice. We. Broke. It.

Now we are cying for everyone else to fix what we broke. Brilliant.

lol----Again--patently inaccurate. WE did not break it. Iran--and ONLY Iran--closed it. Our Navy has the ability to militarily close any waterway to merchant shipping anywhere in the world. Were we do so in an attempt to force some nation to change some policy---that closure would be ENTIRELY our fault---and the only way it could be reopened is if WE decide to reopen it or if we are militarily FORCED to reopen the waterway. Virtually nobody---other than perhaps you and whoever was running the USA in this example---would point to whatever nation's conduct America was trying to change with the waterway closure---and say the closure was this other nation's fault. Virtually everyone else would point to the USA as the culprit.

In this instance---Iran closed the Strait. Furthermore---the closure negatively affects virtually every other nation not involved more than the US is affected.

Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, Iran shut it down. They didnt do it for ***** and giggles. The reason Iran shut it down was because of our actions. At least be honest in the chain of causation.

We knew damn well that had a high probability of happening. And we did it anyway.

I dont understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation.

So Iran is not making a dollar off of oil. Hummm OK….

(04-01-2026 01:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:31 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:11 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 12:44 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:31 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  We broke it, we dont fix it, we walk away. Cool cool.

I have to remember that one -- neat argument for covering over anytime my actions create a deep, massive, literally global impact issue.

Its Iran blocking the Gulf---not us. Its Iran demanding full control over the Gulf and its Iran demanding a fee for passage. Freedom of navigation is not a real thing. It only exists for shipping because various navies have established and enforced that right (in the past---that direct protection only was provided for their own merchant ships). If your not willing to enforce freedom of the seas---then that right may or may not exist---that right would then be dependent on how aggressive other nations or non-state actors wish to be.

Since the end of WWII the US has defended freedom of navigation on the high seas for everyone at no cost to anyone. We are now 38 trillion indebt. Its time for other nations to pick up part of the tab, or they can do it themselves if they dont want to lend a hand (or they can just pay the Iranian toll, which is how many nations used to handle things like the Barbary Pirates back when this type of thing was more common). Anyone see Russia concerned about how their actions in Ukraine affect the world fuel, steel, fertilizer, neon, or wheat markets? That Russian indifference is how the world REALLY works outside of the American Rules Based Order bubble of defense paid for by a US tax payer who is no longer able to carry the burden. The last 80 years or so is an anomaly. There is a reason no nation in history has ever taxed itself so heavily to create the most powerful military in the world just to maintain the status quo---rather than using it to create an ever-expanding empire for themselves to lord over.

Attack, it was pretty clear that the *first* thing that Iran would do when existentially threatened would be to shut Hormuz down.

We went in with a strike to do just that. And we broke the Strait. For the world mind you.

Now the administration wants *everyone ELSE* to fix what we broke. End of story.

The full cause in fact of Hormuz being shut down is a logical, predictable, and now tangible result of our strike. We. Broke. It. Regardless of anything said above. And regardless of 'how right' we were (or not) to launch a special military operation of choice. We. Broke. It.

Now we are cying for everyone else to fix what we broke. Brilliant.

lol----Again--patently inaccurate. WE did not break it. Iran--and ONLY Iran--closed it. Our Navy has the ability to militarily close any waterway to merchant shipping anywhere in the world. Were we do so in an attempt to force some nation to change some policy---that closure would be ENTIRELY our fault---and the only way it could be reopened is if WE decide to reopen it or if we are militarily FORCED to reopen the waterway. Virtually nobody---other than perhaps you and whoever was running the USA in this example---would point to whatever nation's conduct America was trying to change with the waterway closure---and say the closure was this other nation's fault. Virtually everyone else would point to the USA as the culprit.

In this instance---Iran closed the Strait. Furthermore---the closure negatively affects virtually every other nation not involved more than the US is affected.

Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, Iran shut it down. They didnt do it for ***** and giggles. The reason Iran shut it down was because of our actions. At least be honest in the chain of causation.

We knew damn well that had a high probability of happening. And we did it anyway.

I dont understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation.

Because it doesnt matter. The key is something you even admit---Iran closed it. We could have closed it. We didnt. FRankly, at this point, Im actually suggesting that we go ahead and close it covertly so that Iran no longer benefits from the closure---and ceases to retain functional control over its closure. Besides, this currnent situation reflects just how big a danger Iran's constant threat of closure has always been to freedom of navigation and the worlds economies. Furthermore, it was a strategic threat that was about to get 100X worse if Iran ever closed the deal on getting a nuke. It had to be dealt with at some point---better sooner than later given the potential danger of a nuclear armed Iran in control of the Strait.

(04-01-2026 02:17 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:31 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:11 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 12:44 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  Its Iran blocking the Gulf---not us. Its Iran demanding full control over the Gulf and its Iran demanding a fee for passage. Freedom of navigation is not a real thing. It only exists for shipping because various navies have established and enforced that right (in the past---that direct protection only was provided for their own merchant ships). If your not willing to enforce freedom of the seas---then that right may or may not exist---that right would then be dependent on how aggressive other nations or non-state actors wish to be.

Since the end of WWII the US has defended freedom of navigation on the high seas for everyone at no cost to anyone. We are now 38 trillion indebt. Its time for other nations to pick up part of the tab, or they can do it themselves if they dont want to lend a hand (or they can just pay the Iranian toll, which is how many nations used to handle things like the Barbary Pirates back when this type of thing was more common). Anyone see Russia concerned about how their actions in Ukraine affect the world fuel, steel, fertilizer, neon, or wheat markets? That Russian indifference is how the world REALLY works outside of the American Rules Based Order bubble of defense paid for by a US tax payer who is no longer able to carry the burden. The last 80 years or so is an anomaly. There is a reason no nation in history has ever taxed itself so heavily to create the most powerful military in the world just to maintain the status quo---rather than using it to create an ever-expanding empire for themselves to lord over.

Attack, it was pretty clear that the *first* thing that Iran would do when existentially threatened would be to shut Hormuz down.

We went in with a strike to do just that. And we broke the Strait. For the world mind you.

Now the administration wants *everyone ELSE* to fix what we broke. End of story.

The full cause in fact of Hormuz being shut down is a logical, predictable, and now tangible result of our strike. We. Broke. It. Regardless of anything said above. And regardless of 'how right' we were (or not) to launch a special military operation of choice. We. Broke. It.

Now we are cying for everyone else to fix what we broke. Brilliant.

lol----Again--patently inaccurate. WE did not break it. Iran--and ONLY Iran--closed it. Our Navy has the ability to militarily close any waterway to merchant shipping anywhere in the world. Were we do so in an attempt to force some nation to change some policy---that closure would be ENTIRELY our fault---and the only way it could be reopened is if WE decide to reopen it or if we are militarily FORCED to reopen the waterway. Virtually nobody---other than perhaps you and whoever was running the USA in this example---would point to whatever nation's conduct America was trying to change with the waterway closure---and say the closure was this other nation's fault. Virtually everyone else would point to the USA as the culprit.

In this instance---Iran closed the Strait. Furthermore---the closure negatively affects virtually every other nation not involved more than the US is affected.

Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, Iran shut it down. They didnt do it for ***** and giggles. The reason Iran shut it down was because of our actions. At least be honest in the chain of causation.

We knew damn well that had a high probability of happening. And we did it anyway.

I dont understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation.

Because it doesnt matter. The key is something you even admit---Iran closed it. We could have closed it. We didnt. FRankly, at this point, Im actually suggesting that we go ahead and close it covertly so that Iran no longer benefits from the closure---and ceases to retain functional control over its closure. Besides, this currnent situation reflects just how big a danger Iran's constant threat of closure has always been to freedom of navigation and the worlds economies. Furthermore, it was a strategic threat that was about to get 100X worse if Iran ever closed the deal on getting a nuke. It had to be dealt with at some point---better sooner than later given the potential danger of a nuclear armed Iran in control of the Strait.

The key is that it would have remained open 'but for' our special military intervention. So yes, we *absolutely* bear responsibility for it.

Anthing that forseeable is *absolutely* almost all on us. No quick strike, military action -- no closure. It is really that simple.

Again, Im surprised you so adherently dont wish to consider that initial proximate cause.

But instead you simply go down the path of a whole bunch of 'what ifs'.

(04-01-2026 01:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, Iran shut it down. They didnt do it for ***** and giggles. The reason Iran shut it down was because of our actions. At least be honest in the chain of causation.

We knew damn well that had a high probability of happening. And we did it anyway.

I dont understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation.

Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, we went after the Iranian regime. We didn't do it for ***** and giggles. The reason we went after them was because of their actions--over 47 years of them. At least be honest in your chain of causation.

The Iranian regime knew damn well that had a high probability of eventually happening. And they kept on doing what they had been anyway.

I don't understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation. Oh, wait...yes I do.

(04-01-2026 03:01 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, Iran shut it down. They didnt do it for ***** and giggles. The reason Iran shut it down was because of our actions. At least be honest in the chain of causation.

We knew damn well that had a high probability of happening. And we did it anyway.

I dont understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation.

Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, we went after the Iranian regime. We didn't do it for ***** and giggles. The reason we went after them was because of their actions--over 47 years of them. At least be honest in your chain of causation.

The Iranian regime knew damn well that had a high probability of eventually happening. And they kept on doing what they had been anyway.

I don't understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation. Oh, wait...yes I do.

When your daddy says, "Do that and I'll kick your ass!" and you do it anyway, it's not child abuse, it's permission! You were warned (and they were many times) and they did it anyway, which establishes the quid pro quo which is the permission to receive an ass kicking. End of story.

^^ Beat me to it. His chain of causation left out the origin. Duh.

Another o-fer. That's about 4 or 5 in the last few days.

(04-01-2026 02:42 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 02:17 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:31 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:11 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Attack, it was pretty clear that the *first* thing that Iran would do when existentially threatened would be to shut Hormuz down.

We went in with a strike to do just that. And we broke the Strait. For the world mind you.

Now the administration wants *everyone ELSE* to fix what we broke. End of story.

The full cause in fact of Hormuz being shut down is a logical, predictable, and now tangible result of our strike. We. Broke. It. Regardless of anything said above. And regardless of 'how right' we were (or not) to launch a special military operation of choice. We. Broke. It.

Now we are cying for everyone else to fix what we broke. Brilliant.

lol----Again--patently inaccurate. WE did not break it. Iran--and ONLY Iran--closed it. Our Navy has the ability to militarily close any waterway to merchant shipping anywhere in the world. Were we do so in an attempt to force some nation to change some policy---that closure would be ENTIRELY our fault---and the only way it could be reopened is if WE decide to reopen it or if we are militarily FORCED to reopen the waterway. Virtually nobody---other than perhaps you and whoever was running the USA in this example---would point to whatever nation's conduct America was trying to change with the waterway closure---and say the closure was this other nation's fault. Virtually everyone else would point to the USA as the culprit.

In this instance---Iran closed the Strait. Furthermore---the closure negatively affects virtually every other nation not involved more than the US is affected.

Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, Iran shut it down. They didnt do it for ***** and giggles. The reason Iran shut it down was because of our actions. At least be honest in the chain of causation.

We knew damn well that had a high probability of happening. And we did it anyway.

I dont understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation.

Because it doesnt matter. The key is something you even admit---Iran closed it. We could have closed it. We didnt. FRankly, at this point, Im actually suggesting that we go ahead and close it covertly so that Iran no longer benefits from the closure---and ceases to retain functional control over its closure. Besides, this currnent situation reflects just how big a danger Iran's constant threat of closure has always been to freedom of navigation and the worlds economies. Furthermore, it was a strategic threat that was about to get 100X worse if Iran ever closed the deal on getting a nuke. It had to be dealt with at some point---better sooner than later given the potential danger of a nuclear armed Iran in control of the Strait.

The key is that it would have remained open 'but for' our special military intervention. So yes, we *absolutely* bear responsibility for it.

Anthing that forseeable is *absolutely* almost all on us. No quick strike, military action -- no closure. It is really that simple.

Again, Im surprised you so adherently dont wish to consider that initial proximate cause.

But instead you simply go down the path of a whole bunch of 'what ifs'.

Stupid argument. Iran could let all those tankers go through. Many of them go to their friends, but are being stopped. Israel and the US aren't impacted at all directly.

If the police go to arrest a child molester and he starts firing a gun all around, is it the fault of the police that he might have become violent?

(04-01-2026 03:08 PM)TripleA Wrote:  ^^ Beat me to it. His chain of causation left out the origin. Duh.

Another o-fer. That's about 4 or 5 in the last few days.

Sound like someone is pulling for Iran doesn't it.

(04-01-2026 03:25 PM)Redbanksdog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:08 PM)TripleA Wrote:  ^^ Beat me to it. His chain of causation left out the origin. Duh.

Another o-fer. That's about 4 or 5 in the last few days.

Sound like someone is pulling for Iran doesn't it.

I would term it as pulling against Trump. Our late friend Owl #s was absolutely right. Tanq has "an irrational case of TDS."

(04-01-2026 03:31 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:25 PM)Redbanksdog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:08 PM)TripleA Wrote:  ^^ Beat me to it. His chain of causation left out the origin. Duh.

Another o-fer. That's about 4 or 5 in the last few days.

Sound like someone is pulling for Iran doesn't it.

I would term it as pulling against Trump. Our late friend Owl #s was absolutely right. Tanq has "an irrational case of TDS."

That's the same in my book. If you're pulling against a team. They must be pulling for the other team.

(04-01-2026 10:30 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:06 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  In 2025 we imported 256 million barrels of oil and exported 354 million barrels of oil. Figure it out and give them the middle finger.

Our refineries for the vast most part cannot refine the present US mixture. Havent been able to since the late 80s.

So we sell our stuff to the places that can use and refine it, and in return we buy the grade that our refineries are 'tuned' for.

This has been a problem since idk when. The refineries in Houston are geared for the Venezuela crude.

Retooling needs to take place

(04-01-2026 03:41 PM)Redbanksdog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:31 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:25 PM)Redbanksdog Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:08 PM)TripleA Wrote:  ^^ Beat me to it. His chain of causation left out the origin. Duh.

Another o-fer. That's about 4 or 5 in the last few days.

Sound like someone is pulling for Iran doesn't it.

I would term it as pulling against Trump. Our late friend Owl #s was absolutely right. Tanq has "an irrational case of TDS."

That's the same in my book. If you're pulling against a team. They must be pulling for the other team.

Okay, I think you have me there on a technicality, lol.

(04-01-2026 03:45 PM)BlueDragon Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:30 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:06 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  In 2025 we imported 256 million barrels of oil and exported 354 million barrels of oil. Figure it out and give them the middle finger.

Our refineries for the vast most part cannot refine the present US mixture. Havent been able to since the late 80s.

So we sell our stuff to the places that can use and refine it, and in return we buy the grade that our refineries are 'tuned' for.

This has been a problem since idk when. The refineries in Houston are geared for the Venezuela crude.

Retooling needs to take place

Maybe not now so much.

(04-01-2026 03:54 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:45 PM)BlueDragon Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:30 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:06 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  In 2025 we imported 256 million barrels of oil and exported 354 million barrels of oil. Figure it out and give them the middle finger.

Our refineries for the vast most part cannot refine the present US mixture. Havent been able to since the late 80s.

So we sell our stuff to the places that can use and refine it, and in return we buy the grade that our refineries are 'tuned' for.

This has been a problem since idk when. The refineries in Houston are geared for the Venezuela crude.

Retooling needs to take place

Maybe not now so much.

regardless, at whatever level, it needs to begin, STAT!!!

we need to create/incentivize our own hemispherical market...

that'd pickle the globohomos arses...

(04-01-2026 03:08 PM)TripleA Wrote:  ^^ Beat me to it. His chain of causation left out the origin. Duh.

Another o-fer. That's about 4 or 5 in the last few days.

He no take de Logic. He no need it. Just ax him.

(04-01-2026 03:08 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:01 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, Iran shut it down. They didnt do it for ***** and giggles. The reason Iran shut it down was because of our actions. At least be honest in the chain of causation.

We knew damn well that had a high probability of happening. And we did it anyway.

I dont understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation.

Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, we went after the Iranian regime. We didn't do it for ***** and giggles. The reason we went after them was because of their actions--over 47 years of them. At least be honest in your chain of causation.

The Iranian regime knew damn well that had a high probability of eventually happening. And they kept on doing what they had been anyway.

I don't understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation. Oh, wait...yes I do.

When your daddy says, "Do that and I'll kick your ass!" and you do it anyway, it's not child abuse, it's permission! You were warned (and they were many times) and they did it anyway, which establishes the quid pro quo which is the permission to receive an ass kicking. End of story.

How come you can see it but he kaint?

(04-01-2026 03:59 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:08 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:01 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 01:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, Iran shut it down. They didnt do it for ***** and giggles. The reason Iran shut it down was because of our actions. At least be honest in the chain of causation.

We knew damn well that had a high probability of happening. And we did it anyway.

I dont understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation.

Your string of causation ends well short. Yes, we went after the Iranian regime. We didn't do it for ***** and giggles. The reason we went after them was because of their actions--over 47 years of them. At least be honest in your chain of causation.

The Iranian regime knew damn well that had a high probability of eventually happening. And they kept on doing what they had been anyway.

I don't understand why you choose to gloss over that very solid 'but for' causation. Oh, wait...yes I do.

When your daddy says, "Do that and I'll kick your ass!" and you do it anyway, it's not child abuse, it's permission! You were warned (and they were many times) and they did it anyway, which establishes the quid pro quo which is the permission to receive an ass kicking. End of story.

How come you can see it but he kaint?

How come 90% of this board can see it but he can't?

(04-01-2026 03:57 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:54 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 03:45 PM)BlueDragon Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:30 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-01-2026 10:06 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  In 2025 we imported 256 million barrels of oil and exported 354 million barrels of oil. Figure it out and give them the middle finger.

Our refineries for the vast most part cannot refine the present US mixture. Havent been able to since the late 80s.

So we sell our stuff to the places that can use and refine it, and in return we buy the grade that our refineries are 'tuned' for.

This has been a problem since idk when. The refineries in Houston are geared for the Venezuela crude.

Retooling needs to take place

Maybe not now so much.

regardless, at whatever level, it needs to begin, STAT!!!

we need to create/incentivize our own hemispherical market...

that'd pickle the globohomos arses...

Yes sir for that comment.