(10-02-2024 01:42 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(10-02-2024 07:08 AM)miko33 Wrote:  

(10-02-2024 06:57 AM)Eldonabe Wrote:  I am no fan of unions....but there are times and places for them.

These people are being a little greedy here with what they want for pay, but that said, I can see where they are trying to avoid becoming extinct in the labor workforce.

Then they go overboard as the pay ask is basically begging the higherups to find automated replacements for these people and that is where they are over playing their hand. These people think by getting the concession of no automation, that will mean they cannot possibly be replaced by automation.

Um, ya... ok sure. They are negotiating their way out of a job even more quickly and they are too dumb to see it.

This is where the central limit theorem applies. In isolation, this may very well be a case of greedy dockworkers trying to get massive pay increases while the rest of us struggle. Others will see it as people trying to carve out their place to remain in the middle class. However, as more data rolls in we're going to see a picture develop of Billionaires trying to accumulate more wealth vs the middle class working Americans trying to avoid slipping into poverty. This is where we are heading right now. You can see it with real estate being priced out of more peoples budgets, limited choices with purchasing vehicles where base models are full of features that were considered as premium options in the past and thus significantly outpacing inflation for years. There are other examples, but look at the data enough and you can see what's coming in the future.

I suspect the automation is the sticking point. The dockworkers may be using the ridiculous wage increases to "compromise."

I'm sure that's the case. We're likely getting to that tipping point where all of the automation may not be creating enough new jobs to account for the losses. Maintenance jobs can only grow so much. I can't tell where the creative destruction will lead us to because we're moving up the pyramid - and at some point we'll need a new set of TBD jobs in areas we aren't even thinking about.

Not this again! Some idiot started a rumor there will be a toilet paper shortage do to the dock workers strike. This is false it will not impact the paper supply but there has be a "run" on toilet paper at some Costcos. I was at a Walmart here in Charlotte, I actually needed toilet paper but the entire paper aisle was cleared out. The surest way to create a shortage is panic buying 2 or 3x as much as you need and telling friends to do the same before supplies run out. No commodity can handle a sudden large surge in demand due to panic buying.

Something has hit the fan

(10-02-2024 01:58 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  Not this again! Some idiot started a rumor there will be a toilet paper shortage do to the dock workers strike. This is false it will not impact the paper supply but there has be a "run" on toilet paper at some Costcos. I was at a Walmart here in Charlotte, I actually needed toilet paper but the entire paper aisle was cleared out. The surest way to create a shortage is panic buying 2 or 3x as much as you need and telling friends to do the same before supplies run out. No commodity can handle a sudden large surge in demand due to panic buying.

Something has hit the fan

If there is a no drop in the supply over a couple to three weeks....

wouldn't any sudden large surge in demand level out with in a very shot time? I mean if 25% of your city buys 3x as must TP as they usually do. Over the course of 2 weeks that's going to take 50% out of the market for the demand side.

So any affect should be shortly lived as long as there is no disruption in supply.

(10-02-2024 01:58 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  Not this again! Some idiot started a rumor there will be a toilet paper shortage do to the dock workers strike. This is false it will not impact the paper supply but there has be a "run" on toilet paper at some Costcos. I was at a Walmart here in Charlotte, I actually needed toilet paper but the entire paper aisle was cleared out. The surest way to create a shortage is panic buying 2 or 3x as much as you need and telling friends to do the same before supplies run out. No commodity can handle a sudden large surge in demand due to panic buying.

Something has hit the fan

I hear there's a lot of panic buying going on. I blame the news people and some people just eat that crap up. I believe most of our paper products are made in the USA.

(10-02-2024 02:21 PM)Redbanksdog Wrote:  

(10-02-2024 01:58 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  Not this again! Some idiot started a rumor there will be a toilet paper shortage do to the dock workers strike. This is false it will not impact the paper supply but there has be a "run" on toilet paper at some Costcos. I was at a Walmart here in Charlotte, I actually needed toilet paper but the entire paper aisle was cleared out. The surest way to create a shortage is panic buying 2 or 3x as much as you need and telling friends to do the same before supplies run out. No commodity can handle a sudden large surge in demand due to panic buying.

Something has hit the fan

I hear there's a lot of panic buying going on. I blame the news people and some people just eat that crap up. I believe most of our paper products are made in the USA.

90% of toilet paper is made in US.

(10-02-2024 02:27 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  

(10-02-2024 02:21 PM)Redbanksdog Wrote:  

(10-02-2024 01:58 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  Not this again! Some idiot started a rumor there will be a toilet paper shortage do to the dock workers strike. This is false it will not impact the paper supply but there has be a "run" on toilet paper at some Costcos. I was at a Walmart here in Charlotte, I actually needed toilet paper but the entire paper aisle was cleared out. The surest way to create a shortage is panic buying 2 or 3x as much as you need and telling friends to do the same before supplies run out. No commodity can handle a sudden large surge in demand due to panic buying.

Something has hit the fan

I hear there's a lot of panic buying going on. I blame the news people and some people just eat that crap up. I believe most of our paper products are made in the USA.

90% of toilet paper is made in US.

Related / Unrelated story

Starbucks Unionizing

This is funny/curious to me on a number of levels.

The story is about marking the 500th Starbucks to join the Union - which represents roughly 11,000 Baristas.

What is a barista?

noun
, plural ba·ris·tas, ba·ris·ti [b, uh, -, ree, -stee, bah-, r, ees-tee].
a person who is specially trained in the making and serving of coffee drinks, as in a coffee bar.

Baseline Agreements

The second link I posted above just makes my head hurt.

These people are f-ing insane. They are touting the raise structure for Baristas who are on the job for 2-5 YEARS and MORE THAN 5 YEARS.

WTAF am I reading here? Other than an actual franchise owner (and possibly a store manager) this is a minimum wage temporary college-kid job.... who in F is serving coffee for 5 YEARS --- AND --- expecting to earn a living wage doing something that unbelievably simple?


We are doomed as a society aren't we?

Starbucks is insanely priced to begin with, this will only add to that. Kamale better step on that price gouging.

Language Warning:

The only worry they have with injuries is Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. It looks like high school kids in lab running the docks. That's how easy those jobs are, and how overpaid they are. Doesn't take long to see why Americans pay so much more than other countries for stuff. UNIONS

(10-02-2024 03:13 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  

Port Workers? "Ironman" sees it ...

(10-02-2024 03:25 PM)The Sicatoka Wrote:  

(10-02-2024 03:13 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  

Port Workers? "Ironman" sees it ...

And yet this is how they get their crops to market in China (courtesy of a New York Times article from only 4 years ago):

The ports in MS are running. Workers are there.

(10-02-2024 05:27 PM)Eagleaidaholic Wrote:  The ports in MS are running. Workers are there.

Right to work state. Good chance the unions didn't get a foothold there yet.

(10-01-2024 11:27 AM)BartlettTigerFan Wrote:  I should go buy some TP

Why?

(10-03-2024 07:18 AM)BlueDragon Wrote:  

(10-01-2024 11:27 AM)BartlettTigerFan Wrote:  I should go buy some TP

Why?

The shortages I saw in Charlotte are likely bulk purchases by charity groups taking relief supplies to flood ravaged western NC. Toilet paper isn't something folks think about providing to those impacted, but if your home was destroyed and you're staying in a shelter chances are Toilet paper is in short supply.

If this lasts over a week then you’ll see shortages on essential items like toilet paper, canned food, baby items, etc.

(10-03-2024 09:18 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  If this lasts over a week then you’ll see shortages on essential items like toilet paper, canned food, baby items, etc.

It is hard to sift through all the different sources on this, but I have seen anywhere from 1 - 3 weeks before you see any meaningful shortages. I do think some of that estimate is driven by timing of panic purchasing - meaning people stocking up on things they normally would not. That exponentially grows the problem... similar to the covid runs.

(10-03-2024 09:24 AM)Eldonabe Wrote:  

(10-03-2024 09:18 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  If this lasts over a week then you’ll see shortages on essential items like toilet paper, canned food, baby items, etc.

It is hard to sift through all the different sources on this, but I have seen anywhere from 1 - 3 weeks before you see any meaningful shortages. I do think some of that estimate is driven by timing of panic purchasing - meaning people stocking up on things they normally would not. That exponentially grows the problem... similar to the covid runs.

Definitely panic buying, which ultimately leads to more panic buying in other items eventually.

The demand would be so significant that it will cause massive inflation and price gouging

I found this interesting about the head of the International Longshoremen’s Association, Harold Daggett.

Bentley Drivers of the world, unite!

Quote:If you haven’t heard of Harold Daggett, by all means you should. He’s the head of the International Longshoremen’s Association (ILA) who has shut down a good chunk of American commerce by leading his workers on strike and closing East and Gulf Coast ports.

Opinion: Potomac Watch
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Mr. Daggett could have been a character from the 1950s movie classic “On the Waterfront.” While presenting himself as a man of the people, the union chief made more than $900,000 last year. The New York Times reported in 2017 that he owned a 76-foot yacht and rode around in a Bentley luxury car.

Mr. Daggett’s union has a stranglehold on the ports, and as you can read nearby he intends to use it. “I will cripple you,” he said in an interview last month, referring to the ports and the U.S. economy. He means it.

The Justice Department has brought civil and criminal charges against Mr. Daggett for conspiring with mob bosses. While he won both cases, the ILA’s port stranglehold is a racket. Workers earn $39 an hour, often for doing little. This is one reason U.S. ports rank among the least efficient in the world. Mr. Daggett is demanding $69 an hour. In 2010 he said longshoremen should make more than $400,000. Some now do with overtime.

Containerization and automation have reduced port jobs, but the union’s contract entitles longshoremen to what is effectively a guaranteed income of tens of thousands of dollars regardless of whether they work. Some local union chiefs make hundreds of thousands of dollars for doing nothing. Most U.S. workers no doubt wish they could get paid for not working.

But look who’s locking arms with the Bentley-driving proletariat. None other than President Biden. “Now is not the time for ocean carriers to refuse to negotiate a fair wage for these essential workers while raking in record profits,” Mr. Biden said Tuesday. Is the 50% wage increase over six years that port employers have offered the union not fair?

Donald Trump was hardly better. “American workers should be able to negotiate for better wages, especially since the shipping companies are mostly foreign flag vessels,” the Republican declared. The reason most ocean carriers are foreign is because union work rules have rendered the U.S. shipbuilding and shipping industries uncompetitive globally.

Mr. Trump could be blaming Mr. Biden for refusing to invoke the Taft-Hartley Act to end the strike with an 80-day cooling off period. That’s what George W. Bush did to end a West Coast work stoppage in 2002.

One reason Congress passed Taft-Hartley in 1947 was to reduce the extortionary power that union chiefs held over the American economy. Mr. Daggett wants to return to those days, and Mr. Biden wants to help him.

(10-03-2024 09:25 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  

(10-03-2024 09:24 AM)Eldonabe Wrote:  

(10-03-2024 09:18 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  If this lasts over a week then you’ll see shortages on essential items like toilet paper, canned food, baby items, etc.

It is hard to sift through all the different sources on this, but I have seen anywhere from 1 - 3 weeks before you see any meaningful shortages. I do think some of that estimate is driven by timing of panic purchasing - meaning people stocking up on things they normally would not. That exponentially grows the problem... similar to the covid runs.

Definitely panic buying, which ultimately leads to more panic buying in other items eventually.

The demand would be so significant that it will cause massive inflation and price gouging

I heard somewhere that price gouging was a no-no these days so that cannot possibly happen or the wrath of the Kamala Administration will descend upon you????