(10-04-2023 06:49 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:32 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:30 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  Newt looking to become relevant again?

Would be better than what they have now.

Yet another dinosaur who embodies everything the current generation clams to hate? Rich - check. White - check. Old - check....

Didn't say he was great, just said he was better than the current crew.

The current crew has managed to make people hate conservatives without themselves being conservative.

(10-04-2023 06:45 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 05:07 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  

(10-03-2023 09:44 PM)banker Wrote:  I’m not a big fan of Gaetz, but what he has done is not only right, but possibly the most right thing during my 40 years of voting.

Conservative principle number one in my book is personal responsibility. I think most others on the right hold it in high regard. This message board is constantly littered with posts calling for people and institutions to be held accountable. Kevin McCarthy was just held personally accountable for failing to honor his word and failure to help guide the House back on track to doing its job.

You can’t want Garland or Myorkas impeached and kicked out and turn around and defend the Speaker when his back room deals and failure to oversee a House that takes the use of the People’s treasure in a serious and prudent manner. He agreed to get us back to operating fiscally in an appropriate manner and then decided to just let the brokenness of the system continue.

At some point you have to stop the bleeding and send a message. This is a tough fight because so many of those House members have their hand in the cookie jar. We screw up every 2 years by not voting them out, so I’m glad somebody was willing to commit political suicide to make a statement for us.

Complicated issue, but this is about as good a summation as anyone can offer. Well done, banker. +3.

And well done in the final measure also to former Speaker McCarthy. When faced with his own obvious failure to deliver on the terms he promised, he did the right thing and announced that he was stepping aside. In other words, he accepted personal responsibility for his own missteps and subordinated his personal feelings about Matt Gaetz and others who had come after him personally. He in the end understands that the interests of the nation are much bigger and more important than him. Good for former Speaker McCarthy.

If only the Trumplets would likewise realize that this works both ways. And whatever personal dismay they may have regarding the undeniable mistreatment of their demigod is far less important then what is in the best interests of the nation. That, of course, won’t happen. Personal responsibility and integrity is only for the other chumps, in the view of the M.O.B. Brigade.

And now let the requisite “Reeee” and “TDS” wailing begin.

Wait, what? Am I missing something? He was voted out, he didn't step aside.

Article: "After vote to unseat him, Kevin McCarthy says he will not run again for House speaker". - - Link: https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2023/10/...696347771/


Votes have consequences. For some, at least.

He should have Impeached Myorkas on day one. Let him slide. He did nothing voters put him in there to do.

(10-04-2023 05:07 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  

(10-03-2023 09:44 PM)banker Wrote:  I’m not a big fan of Gaetz, but what he has done is not only right, but possibly the most right thing during my 40 years of voting.

Conservative principle number one in my book is personal responsibility. I think most others on the right hold it in high regard. This message board is constantly littered with posts calling for people and institutions to be held accountable. Kevin McCarthy was just held personally accountable for failing to honor his word and failure to help guide the House back on track to doing its job.

You can’t want Garland or Myorkas impeached and kicked out and turn around and defend the Speaker when his back room deals and failure to oversee a House that takes the use of the People’s treasure in a serious and prudent manner. He agreed to get us back to operating fiscally in an appropriate manner and then decided to just let the brokenness of the system continue.

At some point you have to stop the bleeding and send a message. This is a tough fight because so many of those House members have their hand in the cookie jar. We screw up every 2 years by not voting them out, so I’m glad somebody was willing to commit political suicide to make a statement for us.

Complicated issue, but this is about as good a summation as anyone can offer. Well done, banker. +3.

And well done in the final measure also to former Speaker McCarthy. When faced with his own obvious failure to deliver on the terms he promised, he did the right thing and announced that he was stepping aside. In other words, he accepted personal responsibility for his own missteps and subordinated his personal feelings about Matt Gaetz and others who had come after him personally. He in the end understands that the interests of the nation are much bigger and more important than him. Good for former Speaker McCarthy.

If only the Trumplets would likewise realize that this works both ways. And whatever personal dismay they may have regarding the undeniable mistreatment of their demigod is far less important then what is in the best interests of the nation. That, of course, won’t happen. Personal responsibility and integrity is only for the other chumps, in the view of the M.O.B. Brigade.

And now let the requisite “Reeee” and “TDS” wailing begin.

You almost made it

(10-04-2023 06:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  It was more than evident the man was DOA from the start. He simply had to make too many concessions to too many members just to get the position that there's no way he could sustain that.

Republicans simply cannot govern. It's not hard to see why when a key part of their platform is that they dislike government.

It's not that they dislike government they dislike enormous government. The democrats have successfully gotten a significant portion of the people hooked on government whether it be social security, or Lyndon Johnson's great society. They did it under the guise of attacking poverty but despite billions spent poverty still exists and one could argue it's worse than prior. Too many people today don't care about being free as much as they care about being taken care of and they seem to have no concept of the consequences.

(10-04-2023 07:46 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  It was more than evident the man was DOA from the start. He simply had to make too many concessions to too many members just to get the position that there's no way he could sustain that.

Republicans simply cannot govern. It's not hard to see why when a key part of their platform is that they dislike government.

It's not that they dislike government they dislike enormous government. The democrats have successfully gotten a significant portion of the people hooked on government whether it be social security, or Lyndon Johnson's great society. They did it under the guise of attacking poverty but despite billions spent poverty still exists and one could argue it's worse than prior. Too many people today don't care about being free as much as they care about being taken care of and they seem to have no concept of the consequences.

Where Republicans are losing the American populace, is instead of doing the work to make government functional, they prefer to tear it all down. Maybe seeing that very tactic used inside your own party might make some realize how short sighted that is.

(10-04-2023 07:53 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 07:46 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  It was more than evident the man was DOA from the start. He simply had to make too many concessions to too many members just to get the position that there's no way he could sustain that.

Republicans simply cannot govern. It's not hard to see why when a key part of their platform is that they dislike government.

It's not that they dislike government they dislike enormous government. The democrats have successfully gotten a significant portion of the people hooked on government whether it be social security, or Lyndon Johnson's great society. They did it under the guise of attacking poverty but despite billions spent poverty still exists and one could argue it's worse than prior. Too many people today don't care about being free as much as they care about being taken care of and they seem to have no concept of the consequences.

Where Republicans are losing the American populace, is instead of doing the work to make government functional, they prefer to tear it all down. Maybe seeing that very tactic used inside your own party might make some realize how short sighted that is.

Kruciff, here is a thought exercise for you. Think of the smartest gov't employee that you personally know. My own selection happens to be named "Ken".

Now ask yourself, is your Ken someone that you want making decisions for you regarding how to conduct your own personal affairs? Or do you think that you can do a better job of that without Ken's involvement?

If you believe that you need Ken making important decisions for you, then you probably are just the kind of person that Democrats expect you to be. Congratulations on turning America into the nanny state that you crave.

Edit: And here's the corallary. Ken is the BEST of the bunch. Most of the gov't workers that I know are named "Margaret". I promise that you do NOT want Margaret making decisions for you.

(10-04-2023 07:53 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 07:46 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  It was more than evident the man was DOA from the start. He simply had to make too many concessions to too many members just to get the position that there's no way he could sustain that.

Republicans simply cannot govern. It's not hard to see why when a key part of their platform is that they dislike government.

It's not that they dislike government they dislike enormous government. The democrats have successfully gotten a significant portion of the people hooked on government whether it be social security, or Lyndon Johnson's great society. They did it under the guise of attacking poverty but despite billions spent poverty still exists and one could argue it's worse than prior. Too many people today don't care about being free as much as they care about being taken care of and they seem to have no concept of the consequences.

Where Republicans are losing the American populace, is instead of doing the work to make government functional, they prefer to tear it all down. Maybe seeing that very tactic used inside your own party might make some realize how short sighted that is.

muh mail-it-inns and those subsidizing such + decades of educational dysfunction has nothing to do with anything … ewes never disappoint in the ‘not a fk’n clue’ category…

/sarc

(10-04-2023 08:00 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 07:53 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 07:46 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  It was more than evident the man was DOA from the start. He simply had to make too many concessions to too many members just to get the position that there's no way he could sustain that.

Republicans simply cannot govern. It's not hard to see why when a key part of their platform is that they dislike government.

It's not that they dislike government they dislike enormous government. The democrats have successfully gotten a significant portion of the people hooked on government whether it be social security, or Lyndon Johnson's great society. They did it under the guise of attacking poverty but despite billions spent poverty still exists and one could argue it's worse than prior. Too many people today don't care about being free as much as they care about being taken care of and they seem to have no concept of the consequences.

Where Republicans are losing the American populace, is instead of doing the work to make government functional, they prefer to tear it all down. Maybe seeing that very tactic used inside your own party might make some realize how short sighted that is.

Kruciff, here is a thought exercise for you. Think of the smartest gov't employee that you personally know. My own selection happens to be named "Ken".

Now ask yourself, is your Ken someone that you want making decisions for you regarding how to conduct your own personal affairs? Or do you think that you can do a better job of that without Ken's involvement?

If you believe that you need Ken making important decisions for you, then you probably are just the kind of person that Democrats expect you to be. Congratulations on turning America into the nanny state that you crave.

I fail to see how strawman hypotheticals based on your own distrust of anything government does anything to address the fact that Republicans would rather see no government than any government, a stance which is not in tune with the rest of the country.

My answer to your hypothetical: Hold your elected representatives accountable, be informed, vote informed. Republicans don't do this.

(10-03-2023 10:02 PM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  

(10-03-2023 09:36 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  It took 15 votes for McCarthy to make Speaker such was the mistrust.

It took 8 votes from the GOP siding with the DEMS to oust him. 210 GOP voted to retain his speakership. 210 members.

Those 210 are fighting the 8.

There are some in that 210 who should have voted the other way.

(10-04-2023 08:06 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 08:00 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 07:53 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 07:46 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  It was more than evident the man was DOA from the start. He simply had to make too many concessions to too many members just to get the position that there's no way he could sustain that.

Republicans simply cannot govern. It's not hard to see why when a key part of their platform is that they dislike government.

It's not that they dislike government they dislike enormous government. The democrats have successfully gotten a significant portion of the people hooked on government whether it be social security, or Lyndon Johnson's great society. They did it under the guise of attacking poverty but despite billions spent poverty still exists and one could argue it's worse than prior. Too many people today don't care about being free as much as they care about being taken care of and they seem to have no concept of the consequences.

Where Republicans are losing the American populace, is instead of doing the work to make government functional, they prefer to tear it all down. Maybe seeing that very tactic used inside your own party might make some realize how short sighted that is.

Kruciff, here is a thought exercise for you. Think of the smartest gov't employee that you personally know. My own selection happens to be named "Ken".

Now ask yourself, is your Ken someone that you want making decisions for you regarding how to conduct your own personal affairs? Or do you think that you can do a better job of that without Ken's involvement?

If you believe that you need Ken making important decisions for you, then you probably are just the kind of person that Democrats expect you to be. Congratulations on turning America into the nanny state that you crave.

I fail to see how strawman hypotheticals based on your own distrust of anything government does anything to address the fact that Republicans would rather see no government than any government, a stance which is not in tune with the rest of the country.

My answer to your hypothetical: Hold your elected representatives accountable, be informed, vote informed. Republicans don't do this.

How is my comment a "strawman hypothetical"? Do you not personally know any gov't workers? Do you not understand that the function of government is to regulate the behavior of society?

What IS a strawman hypothetical? Your absurd comment that Republicans want NO government. Name one poster on this site who has said anything close to that. You can't.

You're wasting your breath AM, he's a gibbering idiot. Everything that comes out of his mouth is a Liberal stereotype.

newt said to run Gaetz's out of congress on a rail

(10-04-2023 06:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  It was more than evident the man was DOA from the start. He simply had to make too many concessions to too many members just to get the position that there's no way he could sustain that.

Republicans simply cannot govern. It's not hard to see why when a key part of their platform is that they dislike government.

Probably the wisest statement in this entire thread.


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Republicans can't govern... Yea... The Dems are doing a knockout job...

(10-04-2023 06:51 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:49 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:32 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:30 AM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  Newt looking to become relevant again?

Would be better than what they have now.

Yet another dinosaur who embodies everything the current generation clams to hate? Rich - check. White - check. Old - check....

Didn't say he was great, just said he was better than the current crew.

The current crew has managed to make people hate conservatives without themselves being conservative.

Bingo.

The folks who think this is fabulous give liberals a run for the money for hive mind talking points.

There are 438 congressional districts with democrats pointing and laughing today.

Meanwhile, Trump is sitting back waiting to throw Gaetz under the bus if this blows up...Gaetz says it was blessed by Trump. Trump saying no such thing. Complete circus.

Some around here are more upset about a messy situation involving a vacated Speaker of the House seat, which is minor in comparison, than the complete chaos that’s going on in this nation right now from every corner of government and society. There are estimates that 10 million illegals have entered this country in last few years. Ukraine spending is more important than anything else and the FBI is brazen about their bootstrap tactics…..these are just a taste of examples

(10-04-2023 07:53 AM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 07:46 AM)bearcat65 Wrote:  

(10-04-2023 06:37 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  It was more than evident the man was DOA from the start. He simply had to make too many concessions to too many members just to get the position that there's no way he could sustain that.

Republicans simply cannot govern. It's not hard to see why when a key part of their platform is that they dislike government.

It's not that they dislike government they dislike enormous government. The democrats have successfully gotten a significant portion of the people hooked on government whether it be social security, or Lyndon Johnson's great society. They did it under the guise of attacking poverty but despite billions spent poverty still exists and one could argue it's worse than prior. Too many people today don't care about being free as much as they care about being taken care of and they seem to have no concept of the consequences.

Where Republicans are losing the American populace, is instead of doing the work to make government functional, they prefer to tear it all down. Maybe seeing that very tactic used inside your own party might make some realize how short sighted that is.

Infighting happens within a political party. It can actually be healthy long term for survival. What is dangerous is everyone voting in lockstep regardless of debate or beliefs and collecting checks.

I see both sides of this, don’t think Gaetz has a real plan but he views it as keeping a promise. Pretty simple.


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(10-04-2023 08:31 AM)BigTigerMike Wrote:  Some around here are more upset about a messy situation involving a vacated Speaker of the House seat, which is minor in comparison, than the complete chaos that’s going on in this nation right now from every corner of government and society. There are estimates that 10 million illegals have entered this country in last few years. Ukraine spending is more important than anything else and the FBI is brazen about their bootstrap tactics…..these are just a taste of examples

Exactly. None of this matters at all. The only people who care are the people who follow the daily fodder from DC.


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McCarthy made concessions in order to become Speaker.

He made those concessions, regardless of how the process played out, in good faith.

Either he violated those one or more of those concessions or he honored them all.

Unless there is evidence that he honored all concessions, the Gaetz and others were right in removing him. And not only were they right, any Republicans who opposed his ouster are in the wrong.

McCarthy should be held accountable to his word.

Of course the Democrats would vote against him, or any Republican for that matter.


For those saying the GOP members should stick together, does that mean they should stick together to support a man who broke his word or to depose him?