I wish there was a way for both of these groups to have this blow up in their face. I'm not rooting for Disney, because obviously F them they awful for countless reasons that have nothing to do with being "woke", and obviously I'm not rooting for Desantis because he doesn't actually care about the power they have just that they dare to have an opposing opinion on his gay bill. If they came out and supported it he'd be praising them and offering them more goodies.

(04-26-2023 12:06 PM)oruvoice Wrote:  

(03-30-2023 09:50 AM)TIGERCITY Wrote:  

(03-30-2023 09:37 AM)shere khan Wrote:  

(03-30-2023 09:32 AM)TIGERCITY Wrote:  I just did a quick overview so half of this could be wrong or not completely right for what it's worth. But my understanding is that we had a Disney controlled board which understanding that it would soon be dissolved voted to forfeit all its powers to Disney. Under that forfeit Disney now has those powers for the reign of King Charles III + 21 years. The new board created by DeSantis, for whatever reason, has just discovered this.

try again in English

I'll try to put it in language you might understand.

So you and your underage kid are sharing a case of beer on the front porch. Your common law wife has put your son in charge and she has asked him to limit you to 12 beers. Problem is is that the boy still listens to you. Your common law wife understands the problem here and decides that she's going to bring in a new watchdog.... the next door neighbor's underage beer drinking kid to watch you. Him and his pregnant girlfriend lived in the trailer next door. Before that happens though you and your son hide the case of beer (without telling your common law squeeze) so that you can drink all you want. So here's the issue... Does the next door neighbor's kid get any beer? and does he have to give you more than 12? Or are you in sole control of the beer since your boy, who was in charge when it happened, helped you hide it?

You really do seem to know a LOT about trailer park life.

I was ShereKlan's slumlord for 5 or 6 years.

(04-26-2023 05:00 PM)TIGERCITY Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 12:06 PM)oruvoice Wrote:  You really do seem to know a LOT about trailer park life.

I was ShereKlan's slumlord for 5 or 6 years.

Only the slumlords stay in the trailer park for that long.

(04-26-2023 12:55 PM)fsquid Wrote:  We pretty much knew this was headed to the courts.

You’ve posted before as if this was over and Disney won.

(04-26-2023 05:37 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 12:55 PM)fsquid Wrote:  We pretty much knew this was headed to the courts.

You’ve posted before as if this was over and Disney won.

They probably will win, funnily enough because of decades of federalist society judges ruling in favor of corporations being free to do pretty much anything they want and weakening any ability to limit their “speech”. I’d be perfectly fine with a right wing rethink of protecting corporate speech, but good luck finding judges who agree with that anywhere.

(04-26-2023 04:56 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  I wish there was a way for both of these groups to have this blow up in their face. I'm not rooting for Disney, because obviously F them they awful for countless reasons that have nothing to do with being "woke", and obviously I'm not rooting for Desantis because he doesn't actually care about the power they have just that they dare to have an opposing opinion on his gay bill. If they came out and supported it he'd be praising them and offering them more goodies.

Florida offered Disney a passel of treats and free goodies to do business in Florida.

When Disney goes on a media storm about dissing that state, they absolutely have the 1st Amendment right to do so.

But seemingly, they forgot the basic economic issue that it is not really a good idea to bit the hand of the group that actually provides all those treats and freebies.

(04-26-2023 06:37 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 05:37 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 12:55 PM)fsquid Wrote:  We pretty much knew this was headed to the courts.

You’ve posted before as if this was over and Disney won.

They probably will win, funnily enough because of decades of federalist society judges ruling in favor of corporations being free to do pretty much anything they want and weakening any ability to limit their “speech”. I’d be perfectly fine with a right wing rethink of protecting corporate speech, but good luck finding judges who agree with that anywhere.

The issue isnt a restraint of speech as Disney seems to be throwing this.

The fact that Disney got a huge amount of sustenance *from* the state via the special district is very glaringly absent in their filing.

Kind of stupid to accept a ton and a half of economic benefits specially granted to you, then turn around and openly diss that government that hands out those treats.

Florida should not be able to restrict Disney's speech. But, Florida should not have to be forced to treat Disney to all the special economic treats that it hands out when Disney in fact rips the state in a very public manner.

(04-26-2023 06:37 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 05:37 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 12:55 PM)fsquid Wrote:  We pretty much knew this was headed to the courts.

You’ve posted before as if this was over and Disney won.

They probably will win, funnily enough because of decades of federalist society judges ruling in favor of corporations being free to do pretty much anything they want and weakening any ability to limit their “speech”. I’d be perfectly fine with a right wing rethink of protecting corporate speech, but good luck finding judges who agree with that anywhere.

American law as it applies to corporations has been a continual work-in-progress since the 1790s, and probably always will be so long as “American law” is a thing.

But the legal issue here in this “Disney v. DeSantis” battle is not the act of a corporation. Rather, the act of a state. In 1967 (and no doubt amended since then), the State of Florida granted some very broad and special legal privileges to one of its largest and richest landowners. Privileges that were not and are not given to (virtually) any other landowner. Some ~56 years later, is the State of Florida allowed to revoke any/all of those privileges? I think when it’s all said and done, we are going to find out the answer to that question is an absolute “Yes”. But we shall see.

Quote:Florida Governor Ron DeSantis' battles with Walt Disney Co over a state law banning public school lessons on sexual orientation and gender identity could boost his support among U.S. Republican voters as he mulls a possible White House bid, a Reuters/Ipsos poll found. ...

Forty-four percent of Republican respondents in the two-day poll ended Tuesday said they had a more favorable view of DeSantis because of the fight with Disney ...

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/desanti...023-04-26/

TO THINE OWN SELF BE TRUE

Disney is going to lose this fight. They have the legislature and governor against them. The stuff they pulled with Reedy Creek will be corrected by the courts and the legislature. It's crazy that Disney did all this to so it could continue to sexualize children.

(04-26-2023 05:37 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 12:55 PM)fsquid Wrote:  We pretty much knew this was headed to the courts.

You’ve posted before as if this was over and Disney won.

I just said that I favor the lawyers with the large hourly fees over the government ones.

FL will have a new governor elect in 2026 taking office in 2027.

Disney can probably tie DeSantis up in court until then, then the next governor lets them go back to bringing billions of dollars in tourist money to FL.

(04-26-2023 07:14 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 04:56 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  I wish there was a way for both of these groups to have this blow up in their face. I'm not rooting for Disney, because obviously F them they awful for countless reasons that have nothing to do with being "woke", and obviously I'm not rooting for Desantis because he doesn't actually care about the power they have just that they dare to have an opposing opinion on his gay bill. If they came out and supported it he'd be praising them and offering them more goodies.

Florida offered Disney a passel of treats and free goodies to do business in Florida.

When Disney goes on a media storm about dissing that state, they absolutely have the 1st Amendment right to do so.

But seemingly, they forgot the basic economic issue that it is not really a good idea to bit the hand of the group that actually provides all those treats and freebies.

It's a two way street. Disney also brings in billions in revenue for Florida plus hundreds of thousands of jobs.

Iger and Desantis need to meet and bang out a solution.

Desantis is running for President. He'll want support.
Disney needs to have this dropped.

(04-26-2023 07:18 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 06:37 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 05:37 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 12:55 PM)fsquid Wrote:  We pretty much knew this was headed to the courts.

You’ve posted before as if this was over and Disney won.

They probably will win, funnily enough because of decades of federalist society judges ruling in favor of corporations being free to do pretty much anything they want and weakening any ability to limit their “speech”. I’d be perfectly fine with a right wing rethink of protecting corporate speech, but good luck finding judges who agree with that anywhere.

The issue isnt a restraint of speech as Disney seems to be throwing this.

The fact that Disney got a huge amount of sustenance *from* the state via the special district is very glaringly absent in their filing.

Kind of stupid to accept a ton and a half of economic benefits specially granted to you, then turn around and openly diss that government that hands out those treats.

Florida should not be able to restrict Disney's speech. But, Florida should not have to be forced to treat Disney to all the special economic treats that it hands out when Disney in fact rips the state in a very public manner.

You are correct, that the issue isn't just a restraint of speech. They are also saying the actions violate the Contracts Clause and the Takings Clause. Upon rethinking this I think as a leftist I would actually like Desantis to beat Disney on this somehow and start setting some judicial precedent limiting corporate power in some ways even if it's for the most pointless and petty of reasons. So yay Pudding Ron I guess!

(04-27-2023 08:14 AM)chess Wrote:  Iger and Desantis need to meet and bang out a solution.

Desantis is running for President. He'll want support.
Disney needs to have this dropped.

what do you think the possible terms of agreement would be?

I’ve asked other people that question before, but no one ever seems to give a serious answer.

(04-27-2023 08:09 AM)BobcatEngineer Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 07:14 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-26-2023 04:56 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  I wish there was a way for both of these groups to have this blow up in their face. I'm not rooting for Disney, because obviously F them they awful for countless reasons that have nothing to do with being "woke", and obviously I'm not rooting for Desantis because he doesn't actually care about the power they have just that they dare to have an opposing opinion on his gay bill. If they came out and supported it he'd be praising them and offering them more goodies.

Florida offered Disney a passel of treats and free goodies to do business in Florida.

When Disney goes on a media storm about dissing that state, they absolutely have the 1st Amendment right to do so.

But seemingly, they forgot the basic economic issue that it is not really a good idea to bit the hand of the group that actually provides all those treats and freebies.

It's a two way street. Disney also brings in billions in revenue for Florida plus hundreds of thousands of jobs.

Again, given the stake Disney has --- doesnt seem extraordinarily smart to bite the hand that can reform the special district you depend on.

As Native Georgian says, there is a small dose of 'corporate speech' at play. The vast majorty of this issue is whether a state can, under the explicit regulations of the special district, operate under those rules and throw in a new board. Regardless of the issue of Disney being muzzled or not.

If I had a landlord that gave him sweeping powers to change my lease at a whim and to whatever terms he wished, I dont know if I would go on television and rip him one.

(04-27-2023 09:36 AM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(04-27-2023 08:14 AM)chess Wrote:  Iger and Desantis need to meet and bang out a solution.

Desantis is running for President. He'll want support.
Disney needs to have this dropped.

what do you think the possible terms of agreement would be?

I’ve asked other people that question before, but no one ever seems to give a serious answer.

The problem with a real solution is the solution that Florida would want to have would put them precisely where they dont want to be, perhaps cannot be. That is, Florida wants to shut Disney up from being critical of state policies.

Realistically, Florida really cannot act as a private actor would do and throw in a non-disparagement clause.... The only alternative for Florida would be to retain a form of plenary control over the special district as a form of bargaining power to enforce a muzzle. I dont think Disney would be amenable to that stance. As a rational actor, no entity wants to be subject to a full plenary power.

I dont see a negotiated way out of this -- an easy path to one that is....

Good question though. Not one that a good answer seems really obvious.

(04-27-2023 09:51 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(04-27-2023 09:36 AM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(04-27-2023 08:14 AM)chess Wrote:  Iger and Desantis need to meet and bang out a solution.

Desantis is running for President. He'll want support.
Disney needs to have this dropped.

what do you think the possible terms of agreement would be?

I’ve asked other people that question before, but no one ever seems to give a serious answer.

The problem with a real solution is the solution that Florida would want to have would put [Disney] precisely where they don't want to be, perhaps cannot be. That is, Florida wants to shut Disney up from being critical of state policies.

From the time that Disney’s proxies began purchasing land in Florida in 1963, Disney managed to do precisely that for 50+ years.

Quote:I don’t see a negotiated way out of this -- an easy path to one that is....

Neither do I.

I find it funny that people are framing this as a DeSantis vs Disney thing when Disney has said they hate the ever loving guts of anyone on the right. From any state. They didn't fire Gina Carano because of anything to do with Desantis. They fired her for having views on the right while they allowed Pedro Pascal to write that anyone on the right is Nazi's and he's fine still working there. They have flat out stated that their mission is to bring through political propaganda in movies leftist viewpoints to the world. But, some people on the right are just hoping Disney wins to own Desantis. It's not just Florida that Disney has campaigned against. Other states with abortion billls. Other states that have pulled back on public funding for pride parades etc. Disney is acting more as a government institution with propaganda, and their own laws for their land, than a corporation.