(11-30-2022 06:45 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  No---they arent "the same". MAGA is literally the entire Republican Party. Trump simply voiced many of the common sense things these people always knew.

Despite all the attempts to spin it into something it is not----MAGA is nothing more than "Make America Great Again". Its about common sense governing.

I would argue that not only is this not true, it's the opposite of the truth. MAGA is about victimhood, just a different type of it. They use the same authoritarian tactics as the far left that they despise and in many cases hold extreme positions that don't stand up to scrutiny and can't be defended by any reasonable people, not the least of which being that the 2020 election was stolen.

Quote:Dont let violent criminal with multiple pending charges walk free on personal recognizance bonds. Have a secure border and make ALL immigrants go through the proper legal process for entrance (giving preference to immigrants with skills or talents we need). Make America energy independent. Have a foreign policy that treats loyal friendly nations better than we treat our enemies. Have a fiar trade policy that doesnt penalize US workers and companies. Use common sense in environmental policies. Dont sign a climate change agreement that hamstrings you own economy while it ignores the biggest polluters on the planet---thats just dumb.

I don't believe any of that is MAGA. What you're doing would be the same as me saying, "being woke just means not being racist". You're expanding the meaning of the term to the point of untruth. MAGA is the cult of Trump. It, like it's woke counterpoint, believes violence is a perfectly reasonable tool to achieve a desired outcome. It has not time for discourse, no interest in constitutional freedoms, and cares nothing at all about anything other than achieving and maintaining power.

Quote:Frankly---Im not much of a social conservative. I dont care about who can marries who or what your pro-nouns. You do you and leave me and mine alone. Even on abortion---while I have no ethical basis to defend it (either your killing a baby or your not)---Im fine with a reasonable compromise on abortion and believe complete abolition of the procedure is a bad idea for our society.

Its not brain science. Its just competence. Fight for Americans and remember that most Americans are traditional---kinda little patriotic---and reside in the Center Right---not the hard left.

There's nothing competent about the MAGA movement. With reasonable, competent Republican candidates, they win the Senate and Governor elections in Arizona and Pennsylvania. They win the Senate seats in Georgia and New Hampshire and the Governorship in Michigan. And let's be abundantly clear, there is nothing remotely patriotic about trying to overturn a free and fair election. Nothing.

(11-30-2022 03:33 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 03:21 PM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  See this is just idiotic. The GOP needs to wake up. Leaders, voters, RNC, etc. The only way to change anything is to vote.

By the way, one party rule is disastrous for any country long term. Having two mega parties keeps the other in check when it comes to abusing power and creating a dictatorship.

Also, the Left and the Right both want a dictatorship but through different means. The Left wants a State dictatorship like in China, while the Right wants a Religious dictatorship. Lauren Boebert said the separation of church and state is junk.

Speaking of junk...

(11-30-2022 05:47 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 03:04 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  If the midterms were any indication of where the Right is heading into the future, I suggest that it's time to stop voting. Why should they bother with it anymore? Our elections are compromised, and no matter who's put forward, they're a terrible candidate. Even if said candidate does somehow get elected, they stab you in the back every time. How does the Right in Alaska put up with Murkowski? What's the point anymore?

You're a far left Democrat. Stop the vile, disgusting propaganda. Attitudes like that are why Georgia elected 2 Democratic senators last time around.

Every thread he starts is a major troll job.

(11-30-2022 06:14 PM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 04:32 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  America desperately needs a competent right to handle serious social issues like the interconnected epidemic of homelessness/mental illness/drug abuse. Republicans will be on the right side of history when it comes to teaching five year olds about sexuality, but you have to shut up about kids identifying as cats. The truth is bad enough, when you lie about it you just make voters not trust you. And when you're the party who stormed the Capitol in an attempt to overturn a free and fair election, you don't have trust to waste. You lost on abortion, gay marriage, and weed. Stop fighting those battles and you will do much better among young voters. Be the party of fair trade that protects American workers. Be the party of fiscal responsibility. The MAGA mob and the woke mob are different sides of the same coin. Put the adults back in charge. Stop listening to the culture warrior wing of your party, America is sick of it and they think everybody who is fighting it is screwed up in the head one way or another. No Trump, No Boebert, No MTG, no DeSantis. Nominate Chris Sununu for President, campaign like reasonable people, win 400 electoral votes. Get out of your own way.

Common sense like that isn't going to get very far here.

True as hell, especially if you're a democrat. You loons eschew the very ethos you advise us to embrace. Rank hypocrisy...

(11-30-2022 07:17 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 06:14 PM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 04:32 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  America desperately needs a competent right to handle serious social issues like the interconnected epidemic of homelessness/mental illness/drug abuse. Republicans will be on the right side of history when it comes to teaching five year olds about sexuality, but you have to shut up about kids identifying as cats. The truth is bad enough, when you lie about it you just make voters not trust you. And when you're the party who stormed the Capitol in an attempt to overturn a free and fair election, you don't have trust to waste. You lost on abortion, gay marriage, and weed. Stop fighting those battles and you will do much better among young voters. Be the party of fair trade that protects American workers. Be the party of fiscal responsibility. The MAGA mob and the woke mob are different sides of the same coin. Put the adults back in charge. Stop listening to the culture warrior wing of your party, America is sick of it and they think everybody who is fighting it is screwed up in the head one way or another. No Trump, No Boebert, No MTG, no DeSantis. Nominate Chris Sununu for President, campaign like reasonable people, win 400 electoral votes. Get out of your own way.

Common sense like that isn't going to get very far here.

True as hell, especially if you're a democrat. You loons eschew the very ethos you advise us to embrace. Rank hypocrisy...

The left is going to inevitably eat itself alive. There are only so many categories that you can divide yourself into as you sort out who is the greatest victim of whatever systemic ism or phobia they come up with next. Add in the belief that violence is an acceptable tool to achieve your political end goal and you have a recipe for disaster. Wokism isn't a sustainable social movement. While the left implodes one of two things are going to happen. Either it is going to destroy the country alongside itself, or the right rediscovers competency and puts together an agenda that Americans can get behind and drags the country, and perhaps the West, back from the abyss. I desperately want it to be the latter, but I'm not getting my hopes up.

(11-30-2022 07:01 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 06:45 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  No---they arent "the same". MAGA is literally the entire Republican Party. Trump simply voiced many of the common sense things these people always knew.

Despite all the attempts to spin it into something it is not----MAGA is nothing more than "Make America Great Again". Its about common sense governing.

I would argue that not only is this not true, it's the opposite of the truth. MAGA is about victimhood, just a different type of it. They use the same authoritarian tactics as the far left that they despise and in many cases hold extreme positions that don't stand up to scrutiny and can't be defended by any reasonable people, not the least of which being that the 2020 election was stolen.

Quote:Dont let violent criminal with multiple pending charges walk free on personal recognizance bonds. Have a secure border and make ALL immigrants go through the proper legal process for entrance (giving preference to immigrants with skills or talents we need). Make America energy independent. Have a foreign policy that treats loyal friendly nations better than we treat our enemies. Have a fiar trade policy that doesnt penalize US workers and companies. Use common sense in environmental policies. Dont sign a climate change agreement that hamstrings you own economy while it ignores the biggest polluters on the planet---thats just dumb.

I don't believe any of that is MAGA. What you're doing would be the same as me saying, "being woke just means not being racist". You're expanding the meaning of the term to the point of untruth. MAGA is the cult of Trump. It, like it's woke counterpoint, believes violence is a perfectly reasonable tool to achieve a desired outcome. It has not time for discourse, no interest in constitutional freedoms, and cares nothing at all about anything other than achieving and maintaining power.

Quote:Frankly---Im not much of a social conservative. I dont care about who can marries who or what your pro-nouns. You do you and leave me and mine alone. Even on abortion---while I have no ethical basis to defend it (either your killing a baby or your not)---Im fine with a reasonable compromise on abortion and believe complete abolition of the procedure is a bad idea for our society.

Its not brain science. Its just competence. Fight for Americans and remember that most Americans are traditional---kinda little patriotic---and reside in the Center Right---not the hard left.

There's nothing competent about the MAGA movement. With reasonable, competent Republican candidates, they win the Senate and Governor elections in Arizona and Pennsylvania. They win the Senate seats in Georgia and New Hampshire and the Governorship in Michigan. And let's be abundantly clear, there is nothing remotely patriotic about trying to overturn a free and fair election. Nothing.

lol----what an absolutely glorious fail. You can throw shade at folks all you like---but that doesnt make it true. You dont get to define what others believe. They get to to do that--independent thought being a concept that absolutely mystifies the lockstep totalitarian getsapo leftwing clonebots. I just told you what MAGA believes--and your reaction is to vomit some ridiculous argument that MAGA isnt what MAGA people think it is---as if the MSNBC caricature painted for the consumption of group think progressives is the last word in what MAGA folks actually believe. No wonder you guys are so afraid of free speech.

(11-30-2022 07:57 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  lol----what an absolutely glorious fail. You can throw shade at folks all you like---but that doesnt make it true. You dont get to define what others believe. They get to to do that--independent thought being a concept that absolutely mystifies the lockstep totalitarian getsapo leftwing clonebots. I just told you what MAGA believes--and your reaction is to vomit some ridiculous argument that MAGA isnt what MAGA people think it is---as if the MSNBC caricature painted for the consumption of group think progressives is the last word in what MAGA folks actually believe. No wonder you guys are so afraid of free speech.

Your argument is that since I don't identify as MAGA, I can't define the term? By that "logic" you aren't able to define liberal, progressive, moderate, Democrat, centrist, woke, and any other term that you don't identify as. Does that make any sense to you at all? How would you react is some far left nutjob said that you aren't allowed to define anti-fascist, only antifa members can do that? Would you find that to be a perfectly reasonable thing to think? Of course you wouldn't. And yes, MAGA isn't what MAGA people claim it is, the same way that woke isn't what woke people claim it is, the same way that the Proud Boys aren't what they claim to be, and the same way Antifa isn't what it claims to be. People have the ability to observe and interact with all these groups of people and objectively determine that they are extremists.

What you described in your previous post is completely typical conservative points of view. MAGA is not synonymous with conservative, it is defined by two characteristics, the belief that the 2020 election was stolen and the belief that using violence as a tool to achieve political goals is acceptable. Words and terms and phrases have meanings. You are somehow arguing otherwise and that is completely ridiculous. I also think it's amusing that your idea of independent thought is to lob personal attacks at people that have no basis in reality. No reasonable person has ever called me leftwing. And I would love for you to provide any evidence that I am. I would love to see any evidence that I fear or dislike free speech. I'll wait.

(11-30-2022 03:04 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  If the midterms were any indication of where the Right is heading into the future, I suggest that it's time to stop voting. Why should they bother with it anymore? Our elections are compromised, and no matter who's put forward, they're a terrible candidate. Even if said candidate does somehow get elected, they stab you in the back every time. How does the Right in Alaska put up with Murkowski? What's the point anymore?

Alaska Republicans are different than the Southern Republicans. They do not tolerate certain types of Republicans. That is why Sarah Palin lost to a Democrat because the Republicans there do not like the crazy stuff that those Republicans in the race BS that they spew.

(11-30-2022 08:34 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  MAGA is not synonymous with conservative, it is defined by two characteristics, the belief that the 2020 election was stolen and the belief that using violence as a tool to achieve political goals is acceptable.

Nope. MAGA predated 2020 by at least 4 years, so your first point is clearly a lie. As for the second, that seems to be far more an attribute of the Antifa thugs who took over parts of Minneapolis, Seattle, Portland, and other cities.

(11-30-2022 06:45 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 04:32 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  America desperately needs a competent right to handle serious social issues like the interconnected epidemic of homelessness/mental illness/drug abuse. Republicans will be on the right side of history when it comes to teaching five year olds about sexuality, but you have to shut up about kids identifying as cats. The truth is bad enough, when you lie about it you just make voters not trust you. And when you're the party who stormed the Capitol in an attempt to overturn a free and fair election, you don't have trust to waste. You lost on abortion, gay marriage, and weed. Stop fighting those battles and you will do much better among young voters. Be the party of fair trade that protects American workers. Be the party of fiscal responsibility. The MAGA mob and the woke mob are different sides of the same coin. Put the adults back in charge. Stop listening to the culture warrior wing of your party, America is sick of it and they think everybody who is fighting it is screwed up in the head one way or another. No Trump, No Boebert, No MTG, no DeSantis. Nominate Chris Sununu for President, campaign like reasonable people, win 400 electoral votes. Get out of your own way.

No---they arent "the same". MAGA is literally the entire Republican Party. Trump simply voiced many of the common sense things these people always knew.

MAGA extremist are in no way the entire republican party. That's delusional.

The more I think about it, the more I want Trump's ideas without Trump.

(11-30-2022 08:41 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 08:34 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  MAGA is not synonymous with conservative, it is defined by two characteristics, the belief that the 2020 election was stolen and the belief that using violence as a tool to achieve political goals is acceptable.

Nope. MAGA predated 2020 by at least 4 years, so your first point is clearly a lie. As for the second, that seems to be far more an attribute of the Antifa thugs who took over parts of Minneapolis, Seattle, Portland, and other cities.

And the meaning of terms shift. MAGA started as an anti-establishment movement that had little to do with anything ideologically. That's why the Bernie/Trump crossover appeal existed. It was vaguely anti-immigrant and anti-free trade, but there was nothing specific, unless you want to count "Build the Wall". The meaning of the term evolved, as has happened with many other words and phrases, anti-fascist being a prime example on the left, into something less desirable and acceptable in the opinion of most Americans. Mainstream, reasonable conservatives walked away from MAGA, if they hadn't already, on January 6th. The attack American democracy itself was a bridge too far.

Edit: And I do attribute violence to Antifa thugs who terrorized multiple American cities. I also attribute it to MAGA thugs who stormed the American Capitol. That's why I've been saying they are opposite sides of the same coin. Both are quasi-religious movements made up of people who can't be reasoned with and who think their goals are so righteous that anything, up to and including the use of violence, is justified.

(11-30-2022 03:04 PM)andybible1995 Wrote:  If the midterms were any indication of where the Right is heading into the future, I suggest that it's time to stop voting. Why should they bother with it anymore? Our elections are compromised, and no matter who's put forward, they're a terrible candidate. Even if said candidate does somehow get elected, they stab you in the back every time. How does the Right in Alaska put up with Murkowski? What's the point anymore?

Well..The GOP could put forth a candidate that has true conservative values and policies and acts like a leader of the free world instead of a self consumed bully with a bank account..Someone like Mike Pence for example. Take that candidate and put the money behind them. The Democrats are very weak in regard to candidates at this time. I can't think of a time since Carter that they were so vulnerable.

(11-30-2022 08:45 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  The more I think about it, the more I want Trump's ideas without Trump.

No doubt. I was talking yesterday to a black owner/operator from Fayetteville NC of a flatbed we were loading. He is great hard working fellow and I always shoot the schit with hime when he comes and picks up a load. He clearly stated that he had no problem with Trumps policies..but..He had a huge problem with his bashing of John McCain and also that the called the NFL players that kneeled during the national anthem SOBs. In case anyone does not know...Black men in South take that slur literally...meaning...Trump called those guys mothers b****** and that is a NO NO with them. If you bash their people in this way...they don't forget it evidently. He said..as many of us have said...If Trump had just kept his mouth shut he would be POTUS now.

(11-30-2022 07:31 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 07:17 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 06:14 PM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 04:32 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  America desperately needs a competent right to handle serious social issues like the interconnected epidemic of homelessness/mental illness/drug abuse. Republicans will be on the right side of history when it comes to teaching five year olds about sexuality, but you have to shut up about kids identifying as cats. The truth is bad enough, when you lie about it you just make voters not trust you. And when you're the party who stormed the Capitol in an attempt to overturn a free and fair election, you don't have trust to waste. You lost on abortion, gay marriage, and weed. Stop fighting those battles and you will do much better among young voters. Be the party of fair trade that protects American workers. Be the party of fiscal responsibility. The MAGA mob and the woke mob are different sides of the same coin. Put the adults back in charge. Stop listening to the culture warrior wing of your party, America is sick of it and they think everybody who is fighting it is screwed up in the head one way or another. No Trump, No Boebert, No MTG, no DeSantis. Nominate Chris Sununu for President, campaign like reasonable people, win 400 electoral votes. Get out of your own way.

Common sense like that isn't going to get very far here.

True as hell, especially if you're a democrat. You loons eschew the very ethos you advise us to embrace. Rank hypocrisy...

The left is going to inevitably eat itself alive. There are only so many categories that you can divide yourself into as you sort out who is the greatest victim of whatever systemic ism or phobia they come up with next. Add in the belief that violence is an acceptable tool to achieve your political end goal and you have a recipe for disaster. Wokism isn't a sustainable social movement. While the left implodes one of two things are going to happen. Either it is going to destroy the country alongside itself, or the right rediscovers competency and puts together an agenda that Americans can get behind and drags the country, and perhaps the West, back from the abyss. I desperately want it to be the latter, but I'm not getting my hopes up.

Very well said. I think we are farther along toward a true tipping point as a viable republic than at any time in our history and we are in for a rough decade. There are dynamics at play now that were unimaginable a mere 20 years ago. Who ever heard of multiple genders back then? Identity politics was limited to democrats and republicans. Marxism was something the Russians and Cubans dealt with but could never take root here.
The left has so fragmented itself it's a curiosity how it has held together thus far and how it can continue going forward. But as you say, if they destroy themselves they'll take everything and everyone they can with them.

(11-30-2022 08:53 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  MAGA started as an anti-establishment movement that had little to do with anything ideologically.

As a pragmatic, populist, libertarian conservative, I was very much a MAGA person because of the anti-establishment element. I don't agree with your two defining characteristics, as I still consider myself to be a MAGA person.

I do not insist that the2020 election was stolen. I don't know whether it was or not, and neither do you, nor does anyone else, because our election integrity controls are so inadequate that it is impossible to know.

(11-30-2022 10:57 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  As a pragmatic, populist, libertarian conservative, I was very much a MAGA person because of the anti-establishment element. I don't agree with your two defining characteristics, as I still consider myself to be a MAGA person.

I do not insist that the2020 election was stolen. I don't know whether it was or not, and neither do you, nor does anyone else, because our election integrity controls are so inadequate that it is impossible to know.

Okay, in your opinion, what is the difference between conservative and MAGA?

And I insist that the 2020 election was not stolen. Stealing a presidential election isn't something a couple of guys do on a whim. It would be a humongous, highly coordinated, highly efficient affair managed and carried out by dozens of extremely focused, extremely competent actors. Coordinated, efficient, focused, and especially competent are not words that can be accurately used to describe any part of the Democratic Party. People capable of such an act are certainly not going to stumble around aimlessly like the Democrats have the past several years.

(11-30-2022 07:31 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 07:17 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 06:14 PM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 04:32 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  America desperately needs a competent right to handle serious social issues like the interconnected epidemic of homelessness/mental illness/drug abuse. Republicans will be on the right side of history when it comes to teaching five year olds about sexuality, but you have to shut up about kids identifying as cats. The truth is bad enough, when you lie about it you just make voters not trust you. And when you're the party who stormed the Capitol in an attempt to overturn a free and fair election, you don't have trust to waste. You lost on abortion, gay marriage, and weed. Stop fighting those battles and you will do much better among young voters. Be the party of fair trade that protects American workers. Be the party of fiscal responsibility. The MAGA mob and the woke mob are different sides of the same coin. Put the adults back in charge. Stop listening to the culture warrior wing of your party, America is sick of it and they think everybody who is fighting it is screwed up in the head one way or another. No Trump, No Boebert, No MTG, no DeSantis. Nominate Chris Sununu for President, campaign like reasonable people, win 400 electoral votes. Get out of your own way.

Common sense like that isn't going to get very far here.

True as hell, especially if you're a democrat. You loons eschew the very ethos you advise us to embrace. Rank hypocrisy...

The left is going to inevitably eat itself alive. There are only so many categories that you can divide yourself into as you sort out who is the greatest victim of whatever systemic ism or phobia they come up with next. Add in the belief that violence is an acceptable tool to achieve your political end goal and you have a recipe for disaster. Wokism isn't a sustainable social movement. While the left implodes one of two things are going to happen. Either it is going to destroy the country alongside itself, or the right rediscovers competency and puts together an agenda that Americans can get behind and drags the country, and perhaps the West, back from the abyss. I desperately want it to be the latter, but I'm not getting my hopes up.

This country has already chosen its fate. Americans don’t want independence and freedom they want to listen to Big Brother tell them all the freebies they will get. It’s a lie but the young swallows it. 31 plus trillion in debt and climbing and a nation that clearly has turned its back on God for its own lusts and self indulgence.

Perversion abounds with the Democrats and there is no moral compass for this country. We are sliding into the abyss and no one will care until it’s too late.

And, yes trying to find one Progressive Democrat voter to think for himself herself or actually criticize their Religious Party is a monumental task. These brainwashed zombies are going to take America down a path of no return. It’s a cult.

I’m to the point where I would go back to if you don’t work and pay taxes or own property you don’t get a vote. If you have nothing to lose what do you care as long as your handouts keep coming.

(11-30-2022 08:34 PM)TheMackAttack Wrote:  

(11-30-2022 07:57 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  lol----what an absolutely glorious fail. You can throw shade at folks all you like---but that doesnt make it true. You dont get to define what others believe. They get to to do that--independent thought being a concept that absolutely mystifies the lockstep totalitarian getsapo leftwing clonebots. I just told you what MAGA believes--and your reaction is to vomit some ridiculous argument that MAGA isnt what MAGA people think it is---as if the MSNBC caricature painted for the consumption of group think progressives is the last word in what MAGA folks actually believe. No wonder you guys are so afraid of free speech.

Your argument is that since I don't identify as MAGA, I can't define the term? By that "logic" you aren't able to define liberal, progressive, moderate, Democrat, centrist, woke, and any other term that you don't identify as. Does that make any sense to you at all? How would you react is some far left nutjob said that you aren't allowed to define anti-fascist, only antifa members can do that? Would you find that to be a perfectly reasonable thing to think? Of course you wouldn't. And yes, MAGA isn't what MAGA people claim it is, the same way that woke isn't what woke people claim it is, the same way that the Proud Boys aren't what they claim to be, and the same way Antifa isn't what it claims to be. People have the ability to observe and interact with all these groups of people and objectively determine that they are extremists.

What you described in your previous post is completely typical conservative points of view. MAGA is not synonymous with conservative, it is defined by two characteristics, the belief that the 2020 election was stolen and the belief that using violence as a tool to achieve political goals is acceptable. Words and terms and phrases have meanings. You are somehow arguing otherwise and that is completely ridiculous. I also think it's amusing that your idea of independent thought is to lob personal attacks at people that have no basis in reality. No reasonable person has ever called me leftwing. And I would love for you to provide any evidence that I am. I would love to see any evidence that I fear or dislike free speech. I'll wait.

lol----the fail just continues to snow ball. You literally told me that MAGA doesnt mean what the people who make up MAGA think its means. Its literally like saying Jews dont really know what Judism is---you know better than they do.

Of course your welcome to your opinion on the MAGA movement (or anything else for that matter), but it doesnt mean your redefinition of their beliefs has any validity or basis in reality. In short, its incredibly arrogant to assume you know what others think and believe better than they do. That kind of presumptuous arrogance is really whats wrong the Progressive movement. Its a one size fits all kind of intolerant group think totalitarianism that fits more closely with the Chinese Communist Party dogma than American political tradition.

Yes what I described is traditional conservatism--because thats largely what MAGA is. Its a very common sense conservative political movement. The only real difference between MAGA and the old Republican Party is that MAGA looks to move away from the old Bretton Woods post WWII deal (which screws American workers with bad trade deals and has the US bear the cost of global trade security) and move more toward a world defined by "free and fair trade" (which appeals to many blue collar Americans and is less appealing to the Corporate country club types who like off shoring jobs for cost cutting). That MAGA thing means a more self reliant America with more manufacturing jobs----and likely less wars since we wont be the world's policeman of record. That philosophy bothers a lot of the country club wing of the Republican Party who did very well under the globalism model---but it holds tremendous appeal to a lot of people that used to vote Democrat. So--yeah---there is a political shuffle underway as the traditional coalitions that made up each party begin to change allegiances.

(11-30-2022 05:57 PM)CardinalJim Wrote:  When both parties suckle from the same teet it doesn’t matter who or what you vote for. With that being said, we must continue to exercise our right and hope Republicans can figure out how to cheat as well as the enemy has.

Mitch McConnell and Kevin McCarthy are just as crooked as Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer. Bush, Obama and the nimrod that presently calls 1600 Pennsylvania home are all the same.

That’s the difference in Republicans and these Democrat / Leftist / Communist / Socialist / Progressive types.

Republicans recognize ALL politicians are the enemy. The folks who vote Blue, like those who post here, would drink Nancy and Chuck’s bath water if they were told to.

I am yet to see a liberal here criticize a Democrat. That’s what being thicker than thieves means.

I have seen a bit of a different direction from McCarthy, and it is encouraging. You are dead on about McConnell and the others though. I'll be honest, I was seriously thinking about emigrating (leaving the US for good). I still contemplate it some, but I want to give McCarthy a chance.

One thing that I think would be huge for the next midterms would be term limits on congressmen/congresswomen and senators. High time for some new blood, and that’s what my current congressman (my district) ran on.