(06-24-2022 02:08 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  Pretty sure contraception and pregnancy is a 2 way street. Are we going to have an extreme rethinking of the mans financial role in all this from the point of conception? [b]So men should owe child support the day of conception now right?[/b]

I certainly hope so. Better yet I hope this makes degenerate men and women consider voluntary sterilization.

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(06-24-2022 02:22 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  I am fully in favor of making the "sperm donors" 50% financially responsible for raising their children from confirmation of their parentage and 70% responsible if they don't want to participate in the child's life.

Most of the problems we face in this country are related to too many men shirking their responsibilities as men.

This is actually what I'm more interested in. There's no real point for me in debating abortion, no one on any side is ever changing anyone's mind. If you are a state that outlaws abortion, what next? Obviously I'm not a Rick Scott fan but at least he addresses it in his "Rescue America" plan.

https://rescueamerica.com/steps/8-family/

"Abortions are a tragedy. We must make adoption accessible and affordable.
We currently make it very expensive for prospective parents to adopt, even though many kids desperately need families. This is insane and we will change it.
We will help low-income single women who are considering abortion choose life instead, by paying all costs associated with carrying the child to term and placing the child for adoption."

At least that's a plan, but do all of those who are "pro-life" support paying all costs associated with carrying children to term and placing them for adoption?

(06-24-2022 02:35 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  At least that's a plan, but do all of those who are "pro-life" support paying all costs associated with carrying children to term and placing them for adoption?

**** no! We can barely get them to fund preschool, head start, and school lunches!

(06-24-2022 02:23 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:17 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:08 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 12:50 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 09:40 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  Considerably more than zero, 861 in the US in 2020 -

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/hestat/mat...s-2020.htm

This will surely go up now, if women who die from unsafe back-alley abortions are classified as maternal deaths.

861 versus millions of dead babies? I'll still take those odds.

Tell me Satan, how many of them would still be alive if they only used contraception during sex? Probably all of them, huh?

Congratulations, you are a proud member of the "Bola de Pendejos Club".

Pretty sure contraception and pregnancy is a 2 way street. Are we going to have an extreme rethinking of the mans financial role in all this from the point of conception? So men should owe child support the day of conception now right?

Yup. You should also now be able to claim a tax deduction for your fetus as well.

Fair point, if life starts at conception that's a dependent the second an egg is fertilized.

it is at this point where 'can't get any stupider' turns into reality .... that's some serious arse pik-a-pak logic, brah...

#streetvalue

(06-24-2022 12:35 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 12:31 PM)BlueDragon Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 10:15 AM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 09:33 AM)BobcatEngineer Wrote:  What happens next? Women will die. Others will be forced to carry unwanted pregnancies to term. Children will be born into households that cannot and do not want to take care of them.

Approximately 70 million babies have died under Roe v Wade.

I find it disturbing that people can be concerned about women dying (that's not even factual, it hypothetical) or carrying babies to full term yet not speak on the horror of 70 million ACTUAL aborted babies.

Hypocrisy is just not a big enough word here.

You wither care about life or you don't. You can't pick and choose which lives matter and which do not.

More people die in automobile accidents each year. Let’s hurry up and pass laws to ban automobiles and crush all of them.

There are risks every day we step out the door of our house. Is the number of women dying from childbirth even 1/1000? Probably more like 1/100,000. Weak and sad justification for murder.


Just fool’s talk.

Yes, bringing up banning cars, is fool's talk. Nice self-own...lol

And, you're off. By a lot.

Quote:The maternal mortality rate for 2020 was 23.8 deaths per 100,000 live births compared with a rate of 20.1 in 2019

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/hestat/mat...s-2020.htm

By your numbers 99.9% of all pregnancies are NOT life threatening. Go spread your ignorance to those gullible enough to take the bait.

(06-24-2022 02:35 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:22 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  I am fully in favor of making the "sperm donors" 50% financially responsible for raising their children from confirmation of their parentage and 70% responsible if they don't want to participate in the child's life.

Most of the problems we face in this country are related to too many men shirking their responsibilities as men.

This is actually what I'm more interested in. There's no real point for me in debating abortion, no one on any side is ever changing anyone's mind. If you are a state that outlaws abortion, what next? Obviously I'm not a Rick Scott fan but at least he addresses it in his "Rescue America" plan.

https://rescueamerica.com/steps/8-family/

"Abortions are a tragedy. We must make adoption accessible and affordable.
We currently make it very expensive for prospective parents to adopt, even though many kids desperately need families. This is insane and we will change it.
We will help low-income single women who are considering abortion choose life instead, by paying all costs associated with carrying the child to term and placing the child for adoption."

At least that's a plan, but do all of those who are "pro-life" support paying all costs associated with carrying children to term and placing them for adoption?

First thing that needs to happen after this is for the adoption process to get a major facelift. There are over 2 million couples waiting to adopt a baby right now. If you've ever been through infertility you know how devastating it can be. Then the double whammy knowing the uphill battle and competition to adopt a baby.

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(06-24-2022 02:35 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:22 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  I am fully in favor of making the "sperm donors" 50% financially responsible for raising their children from confirmation of their parentage and 70% responsible if they don't want to participate in the child's life.

Most of the problems we face in this country are related to too many men shirking their responsibilities as men.

This is actually what I'm more interested in. There's no real point for me in debating abortion, no one on any side is ever changing anyone's mind. If you are a state that outlaws abortion, what next? Obviously I'm not a Rick Scott fan but at least he addresses it in his "Rescue America" plan.

https://rescueamerica.com/steps/8-family/

"Abortions are a tragedy. We must make adoption accessible and affordable.
We currently make it very expensive for prospective parents to adopt, even though many kids desperately need families. This is insane and we will change it.
We will help low-income single women who are considering abortion choose life instead, by paying all costs associated with carrying the child to term and placing the child for adoption."

At least that's a plan, but do all of those who are "pro-life" support paying all costs associated with carrying children to term and placing them for adoption?

There are already multiple laws and programs in place for them now.

And yes, I would support a lot of additional programs if it was used responsibly and eliminates most abortions.

Your terms are acceptable.

Wow. This has gone off the rails.

Child support during pregnancy? This decision says nothing about the start of life or the start of individual rights of a fetus. Nothing.

If you start child support during pregnancy you are going to have a lot of women claiming rich Joe is the daddy of poor John's baby.

(06-24-2022 02:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  Wow. This has gone off the rails.

Child support during pregnancy? This decision says nothing about the start of life or the start of individual rights of a fetus. Nothing.

If you start child support during pregnancy you are going to have a lot of women claiming rich Joe is the daddy of poor John's baby.

They just don't know what else to argue, they know full well this is the correct ruling.

Its not in the constitution and never was.

(06-24-2022 02:30 PM)b2b Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:23 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:17 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:08 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 12:50 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  861 versus millions of dead babies? I'll still take those odds.

Tell me Satan, how many of them would still be alive if they only used contraception during sex? Probably all of them, huh?

Congratulations, you are a proud member of the "Bola de Pendejos Club".

Pretty sure contraception and pregnancy is a 2 way street. Are we going to have an extreme rethinking of the mans financial role in all this from the point of conception? So men should owe child support the day of conception now right?

Yup. You should also now be able to claim a tax deduction for your fetus as well.

Fair point, if life starts at conception that's a dependent the second an egg is fertilized.

I'd have zero problem with that considering there is medical care needed for pregnant mothers.

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Considering the declining birth rate and rapid aging of the US population there needs to be a serious discussion about how to incentivize people to have more children. I'm 35, have been working full time for over a decade, and just now am in a position financially where I feel like I could afford to have and support a child, and that's really only because of a few promotions and being insanely fortunate to now have a rent free house to live in. When I was paying 1200 a month for a 1 bedroom apartment (and I don't even want to look at what my apartment would cost now) I couldn't have afforded that and I had a pretty solid job at the time. Conservatives love to pine for the days when women stayed home and took care of the children. I would be thrilled if that were an option but what kind of single salary would you need to make at this point to comfortably take care of a family of yourself, your wife and multiple children? To rent a place large enough for that family anywhere near Raleigh you'd be looking at a minimum of 2k a month, and to buy a house well good luck.

(06-24-2022 02:50 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  Wow. This has gone off the rails.

Child support during pregnancy? This decision says nothing about the start of life or the start of individual rights of a fetus. Nothing.

If you start child support during pregnancy you are going to have a lot of women claiming rich Joe is the daddy of poor John's baby.

They just don't know what else to argue, they know full well this is the correct ruling.

Its not in the constitution and never was.

Correct.

I am glad for the consequences for the same reason you are, but some of this stuff is just way out there. Having said that, some of the pro-choice states may enact this kind of stuff anyway and then try to have it enforced across state lines.

(06-24-2022 02:51 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:30 PM)b2b Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:23 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:17 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:08 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  Pretty sure contraception and pregnancy is a 2 way street. Are we going to have an extreme rethinking of the mans financial role in all this from the point of conception? So men should owe child support the day of conception now right?

Yup. You should also now be able to claim a tax deduction for your fetus as well.

Fair point, if life starts at conception that's a dependent the second an egg is fertilized.

I'd have zero problem with that considering there is medical care needed for pregnant mothers.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

Considering the declining birth rate and rapid aging of the US population there needs to be a serious discussion about how to incentivize people to have more children. I'm 35, have been working full time for over a decade, and just now am in a position financially where I feel like I could afford to have and support a child, and that's really only because of a few promotions and being insanely fortunate to now have a rent free house to live in. When I was paying 1200 a month for a 1 bedroom apartment (and I don't even want to look at what my apartment would cost now) I couldn't have afforded that and I had a pretty solid job at the time. Conservatives love to pine for the days when women stayed home and took care of the children. I would be thrilled if that were an option but what kind of single salary would you need to make at this point to comfortably take care of a family of yourself, your wife and multiple children? To rent a place large enough for that family anywhere near Raleigh you'd be looking at a minimum of 2k a month, and to buy a house well good luck.

Everything is an option. I have a great friend who works, wife stays at home and they've got 7 kids. Didn't go to college. Went straight to work and married in their mid 20s. They have a mini farm and live partially off what they grow and raise. Now I'm not saying everybody needs to live like that but life is all about what you prioritize. Most people's priorities are all screwed up.

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(06-24-2022 02:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  Wow. This has gone off the rails.

Child support during pregnancy? This decision says nothing about the start of life or the start of individual rights of a fetus. Nothing.

If you start child support during pregnancy you are going to have a lot of women claiming rich Joe is the daddy of poor John's baby.

So why is the whole "personal responsibility" thing only 1 way for you? You can do a paternity test as early as 9 weeks. It's a life the second of conception, so why shouldn't the man be responsible for his child the second it's conceived?

(06-24-2022 02:50 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  Wow. This has gone off the rails.

Child support during pregnancy? This decision says nothing about the start of life or the start of individual rights of a fetus. Nothing.

If you start child support during pregnancy you are going to have a lot of women claiming rich Joe is the daddy of poor John's baby.

They just don't know what else to argue, they know full well this is the correct ruling.

Its not in the constitution and never was.

just like DJT announcing as a pub when they all thought otherwise .... yeah, bubby, sometimes being the sadist with a soul is a good thingy ... it flat out pickles their chocolate starfish...

(06-24-2022 02:32 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:24 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:21 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:18 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:15 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Breathing you say. Interesting. When do fetuses actually start breathing?

When do they have brains, and their hearts start beating? When do they feel pain?

When do they live on their own without breathing?

When they are born. Doesn't make them any less HUMAN that they must spend time growing inside their mothers. Only a sick or evil piece of **** can't acknowledge the humanity of another person based on needs.

I completely get it. That's why my position is that after a certain number of weeks when the baby can be born and breath on its own, no abortions unless the pregnancy was from rape/incest or if the life of the mother/baby is at stake under consultation from medical personnel.

And further, if it were me, being a guy who can't have one of course, I would never counsel anyone to have one outside of those qualifiers I mentioned above. But in the end, it's not up to me.

Are you putting this word salad together poorly or do you literally support infanticide? That reads as you believe in abortion all the way up to the baby can breath on it's own and even after that for your qualifiers.

(06-24-2022 02:58 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  Wow. This has gone off the rails.

Child support during pregnancy? This decision says nothing about the start of life or the start of individual rights of a fetus. Nothing.

If you start child support during pregnancy you are going to have a lot of women claiming rich Joe is the daddy of poor John's baby.

So why is the whole "personal responsibility" thing only 1 way for you? You can do a paternity test as early as 9 weeks. It's a life the second of conception, so why shouldn't the man be responsible for his child the second it's conceived?

"pick me teach, pick me!"

now, do ya have the balls to play this game in the land of legalese with the village idiot?!

#allearsdumbo

(06-24-2022 02:59 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:32 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:24 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:21 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:18 PM)49RFootballNow Wrote:  When do they have brains, and their hearts start beating? When do they feel pain?

When do they live on their own without breathing?

When they are born. Doesn't make them any less HUMAN that they must spend time growing inside their mothers. Only a sick or evil piece of **** can't acknowledge the humanity of another person based on needs.

I completely get it. That's why my position is that after a certain number of weeks when the baby can be born and breath on its own, no abortions unless the pregnancy was from rape/incest or if the life of the mother/baby is at stake under consultation from medical personnel.

And further, if it were me, being a guy who can't have one of course, I would never counsel anyone to have one outside of those qualifiers I mentioned above. But in the end, it's not up to me.

You literally support infanticide.

what's sad is he does ... the majority of the dippos don't have a fk'n clue 'why' they 'support'...

(06-24-2022 02:58 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  Wow. This has gone off the rails.

Child support during pregnancy? This decision says nothing about the start of life or the start of individual rights of a fetus. Nothing.

If you start child support during pregnancy you are going to have a lot of women claiming rich Joe is the daddy of poor John's baby.

So why is the whole "personal responsibility" thing only 1 way for you? You can do a paternity test as early as 9 weeks. It's a life the second of conception, so why shouldn't the man be responsible for his child the second it's conceived?

I don't think that is an unreasonable position at all.

If you can show paternity or the father voluntarily assumes it than you should be entitled to child support.

However, if you have an abortion after collecting child support, the funds you collected should be returned.

(06-24-2022 03:02 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:58 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(06-24-2022 02:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  Wow. This has gone off the rails.

Child support during pregnancy? This decision says nothing about the start of life or the start of individual rights of a fetus. Nothing.

If you start child support during pregnancy you are going to have a lot of women claiming rich Joe is the daddy of poor John's baby.

So why is the whole "personal responsibility" thing only 1 way for you? You can do a paternity test as early as 9 weeks. It's a life the second of conception, so why shouldn't the man be responsible for his child the second it's conceived?

"pick me teach, pick me!"

now, do ya have the balls to play this game in the land of legalese with the village idiot?!

#allearsdumbo

Please decode this into something readable.

The abortion shutdown in some states is happening now. In Arkansas, its in the state's constitution that life begins at conception, so we would be a state they would have to immediately shut abortions down in. Missouri took action this morning, as did Texas.