The unofficial online home for fans of the University of Cincinnati Bearcats. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

(05-28-2021 11:10 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(05-28-2021 08:59 AM)Edgebrookjeff Wrote:  One easy solution to all of this:

Get rid of Twitter, or stop looking at it. I have an account that I look at maybe 3 times a year.

Yep, I only use it to follow Cincinnati recruiting and in the press box on Fridays during the quarter/halftime delay to check other scores from the area.

I have a twitter account that I almost never look at. I got rid of my FB account before the election and haven't missed it after the first week, and I don't have any other social media. I guess the closest thing that I have is a linked in account, that I look at about once a month. I can't say that I miss any of it now.

I use my Twitter account strictly just to keep up with Jose Canseco. Let's just say that rawhide he took off the dome years back did more damage than we all thought.

Have not logged into FB since like 2011. I have a linked in account I have not looked at since perhaps 2015. Never signed up for Twitter or IG. I swear most of it is designed to expose mental illness.

Happily, this place is as close to social media as I come anymore.

(05-28-2021 09:32 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  Have not logged into FB since like 2011. I have a linked in account I have not looked at since perhaps 2015. Never signed up for Twitter or IG. I swear most of it is designed to expose mental illness.

Happily, this place is as close to social media as I come anymore.

As a law student many years ago our class was warned about social media and how it would change profession. Outside of marketing a business I don’t see any real benefit. I stayed away from social outside of the Bearcat forums for good reason.

It’s like giving the other side free easy to find discovery or at best giving away private details that shouldn’t be shared.

(05-26-2021 06:27 AM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  

(05-25-2021 09:22 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  I think he’s nuts. Like pet bunny cooker one night stand chick looney.

She's supposed to represent a few others here with the whole irrational obsession attack thing, right?

(05-26-2021 06:51 AM)the_dude Wrote:  

(05-25-2021 12:19 PM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  

(05-24-2021 01:43 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  I did and do. Feel free to reference me to any specific instances where medical staff was ignored if I missed it. If you don't want to quote something you could refer to article and paragraph.

I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for or not but this article notes quite a few instances where Brannen was either ignoring the medical staff, undermining them, or at least creating divisions between himself and the likes of Bob Mangine.

There are just a few medical-related ones but there's quite a bit more in that article.

Quote:The assistant coach “states that sports medicine is not behind Coach Brannen and his methodology and that it is ‘bull crap,’” and that the assistant coach “believes it is a problem that Bob doesn’t agree with the head coach’s methods,” according to the document.

Quote:On Oct. 16, 2020, Brannen allegedly told the author of the document to keep an eye on an athletic trainer “as he doesn’t trust him,” according to the document, and Brannen allegedly said that the author of the document needed to stay “a step ahead” of the trainer and report back to Brannen.

Quote:At a team breakfast on Oct. 26, 2020, Cincinnati players were reportedly upset because Brannen had allegedly told them in a huddle in practice the previous day, “**** the heart rate monitors, I know what in-shape is,” according to the document.

Quote:Under a heading titled “Other meetings,” the author of the document wrote, “John Brannen has stated that the administration and sports medicine [staff] could not be trusted.” Brannen allegedly told men’s basketball staff members that they should only talk to him or the other staff members, and to do so in his office only, according to the document.

Well bearhawkeye.... There is your answer... If anyone can defend brannen at this point, well you are basically on a level of antivaxxer, flat earthen types. At this point no one can change your mind and you're just being stubborn for the sake of being stubborn and not wanting to admit that you were wrong.

OK. Actually, I don't know any flat-earthers and the most strident anti-vaxxer on this board is also probably the most vocal redundant name-caller at Brannen on the entire board. I'm happy to discuss and debate actual points and facts but you didn't make any - preferring to try to slime me instead. Seems to be a lot of that going around...

(05-26-2021 08:25 AM)levydl Wrote:  

(05-26-2021 12:22 AM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  

(05-25-2021 12:19 PM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  

(05-24-2021 01:43 PM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  I did and do. Feel free to reference me to any specific instances where medical staff was ignored if I missed it. If you don't want to quote something you could refer to article and paragraph.

I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for or not but this article notes quite a few instances where Brannen was either ignoring the medical staff, undermining them, or at least creating divisions between himself and the likes of Bob Mangine.

There are just a few medical-related ones but there's quite a bit more in that article.

Quote:The assistant coach “states that sports medicine is not behind Coach Brannen and his methodology and that it is ‘bull crap,’” and that the assistant coach “believes it is a problem that Bob doesn’t agree with the head coach’s methods,” according to the document.

Quote:On Oct. 16, 2020, Brannen allegedly told the author of the document to keep an eye on an athletic trainer “as he doesn’t trust him,” according to the document, and Brannen allegedly said that the author of the document needed to stay “a step ahead” of the trainer and report back to Brannen.

Quote:At a team breakfast on Oct. 26, 2020, Cincinnati players were reportedly upset because Brannen had allegedly told them in a huddle in practice the previous day, “**** the heart rate monitors, I know what in-shape is,” according to the document.

Quote:Under a heading titled “Other meetings,” the author of the document wrote, “John Brannen has stated that the administration and sports medicine [staff] could not be trusted.” Brannen allegedly told men’s basketball staff members that they should only talk to him or the other staff members, and to do so in his office only, according to the document.

Thanks. I can certainly accept that Brannen didn't always see eye-to-eye with the entire medical/athletic staff. That's far from ideal but I'm sure it happens quite a bit at many many places. In fact, a little tension might be a good thing although this anonymous version certainly makes it seem like there were probably multiple very broken relationships and things may well have become dysfunctional. Ideally, they all work it out and part of that responsibility is certainly Brannen's. But it also sounds like there were even some big divisions within the medical/athletic training staff:

Quote:For example, the athletic trainer tells Coach Brannen on January 18, 2021 @ 9:27 pm that his players have a “if you don’t feel good, don’t practice” mentality and then says “these guys just encourage each other not to practice if they don’t feel good or something hurts.” There are other text messages from the trainer to Coach Brannen with similar observations about the team as a whole and certain individual players.

But they all have a job to do. Even if Brannen did once say "F the heart monitors" according to that great source "anonymous", there's no evidence that he banned them or stopped them from being worn. In fact, it's been reported several times it was being worn by the one player who went down hard during a drill. The bottom line is there isn't even an anonymous source alleging that the medical staff was ignored or overruled.

You believe that the reasons UC gave for firing Brannen are BS. What do you think the real reasons are?

I don't claim to have the definitive answer, but I wouldn't rule out the simplest one. The AD and the HC he inherited didn't get along and the AD decided he wanted his own guy in there. Happens all the time at different programs.

(05-26-2021 10:30 AM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  

(05-26-2021 12:22 AM)Bearhawkeye Wrote:  Thanks. I can certainly accept that Brannen didn't always see eye-to-eye with the entire medical/athletic staff. That's far from ideal but I'm sure it happens quite a bit at many many places. In fact, a little tension might be a good thing although this anonymous version certainly makes it seem like there were probably multiple very broken relationships and things may well have become dysfunctional. Ideally, they all work it out and part of that responsibility is certainly Brannen's. But it also sounds like there were even some big divisions within the medical/athletic training staff:

Quote:For example, the athletic trainer tells Coach Brannen on January 18, 2021 @ 9:27 pm that his players have a “if you don’t feel good, don’t practice” mentality and then says “these guys just encourage each other not to practice if they don’t feel good or something hurts.” There are other text messages from the trainer to Coach Brannen with similar observations about the team as a whole and certain individual players.

But they all have a job to do. Even if Brannen did once say "F the heart monitors" according to that great source "anonymous", there's no evidence that he banned them or stopped them from being worn. In fact, it's been reported several times it was being worn by the one player who went down hard during a drill. The bottom line is there isn't even an anonymous source alleging that the medical staff was ignored or overruled.

If you're looking for a specific instance to point to, a "smoking gun" if you will, of Brannen forcing Player A to do something and medical staffer B attempting to step in and Brannen pushing them away to make the player do it anyways, I honestly don't think you're going to find it.

That was the essence of a claim made by a poster/mod here. Thank you for acknowledging the accuracy of my objection. It appears he was being purposefully ignorant himself and unsuccessfully attempted to project it onto me.

Quote:But as we've seen bits and pieces come out, there's overwhelming evidence that Brannen ran an authoritarian program who created divisions between himself, the vast majority of his players, his support staff, the medical staff (even such figures as Bob Mangine, who's highly-regarded at the school), and the administration.

Is all of that enough to fire him on the spot? No, obviously not.

So now we are getting more into the crux of the issue at this point: was there "cause" for firing so that UC doesn't have to live up to the termination clause in their contract? It sounds like we may not be too far away from each other on that issue. As far as him being authoritarian, isn't that the nature of the beast at this level? Is Huggins authoritarian? How about Saban in college football or Belicheck in the NFL? Do you think those guys take team votes over whether to run sprints at the end of practice? Or you think Cronin let guys decide for themselves if they wanted to get deflections? I think there's a point pretty early on where most coaches decide I'd rather fail/succeed doing it my way than fail because I tried to do it somebody else's way. I'm not saying Brannen isn't also partly authoritarian, but I think there are a lot of others who are much more so (and not fired for cause being "authoritarian"). And iirc, both DDJ and Vogt (still the only 2 players from last year to speak on the record and both strongly supporting Brannen btw) talked about Brannen making modifications based upon feedback from the players. (And why is not surprising that the very same poster/mod I mentioned above for making a dubious claim as fact is also seeking to delegitimize their experiences by comparing them to people in abusive romantic relationships who refuse to admit it. Real classy stuff there.)

Quote:If that were the case, this mess would've been behind us months ago and we wouldn't be sitting here waiting for Brannen and UC's attorneys to throw offers and counteroffers back-and-forth as they whittle their way to a figure that both can agree to.

But did he create a situation that was detrimental to the long term stability and success of a storied UC basketball program? My opinion is "yes"; his roster after all the transfers was three holdovers, a converted walk-on, and an emergency 2021 signee who's now at Liberty. Plus, his handpicked strength and conditioning coach (who I'm of the opinion is the "source" in the original article) up and left and, based on comments from Chad Brendel in one of his recent podcasts, at least a few AAU coaches had no intention of sending their players to play for Brannen.

The guys entering the portal becomes less unusual by the day across college basketball. Heck %age wise it's a bigger epidemic than COVID here (not to make light of those seriously afflicted). Similarly, Chad mentioned a couple of AAU coaches not liking Brannen as an aside, not a theme. I'm guessing you could find a couple who don't like any coach. It's not cause for firing. I do agree that it sounds like there was some real dysfunction across the medical and athletic staff and Brannen and it's fair to put some of that on him especially IF he handpicked the new S&C coach. But it sounds like some were also on Brannen's side based upon the texts about players encouraging others not to practice, etc.

(05-28-2021 02:29 PM)the_dude Wrote:  

(05-27-2021 02:43 PM)namrag Wrote:  Not buying it.

There is nothing in my previous posts to suggest that I didn’t want tari to come back to UC.

Quite the contrary. When Saunders recommitted I posted that it was “nice, but the big prize (tari) was still out there”.

The inference I took is that “certain posters are of course going to not like an outspoken black female.”

And I still think that was the inference.

But I don’t care enough to continue pissing over it.

That's what you got out of it??? I reread so many times trying to figure out different hidden meanings.... But never once thought of "outspoken black female", that is a huuuge stretch

Actually it isn’t a huge stretch at all on this board.

Like was mentioned previously, if you have been involved in threads on the main board that turned political, or pretty much any thread on the political board, it happens, and it happens frequently.

And I have never said anything even closely resembling a comment that suggested I did not want tari to return.

(05-27-2021 03:53 PM)levydl Wrote:  

(05-27-2021 02:43 PM)namrag Wrote:  Not buying it.

There is nothing in my previous posts to suggest that I didn’t want tari to come back to UC.

Nothing to suggest it, huh?

(05-26-2021 08:14 AM)namrag Wrote:  Glad to have that nonsensical distraction (momzilla) be someone else's problem....

Yes, exactly, NOTHING to suggest it.

Been very quiet. Hopefully UC ponies up at least $4 large to get this into the rear view.

Nah

(06-08-2021 05:52 AM)doss2 Wrote:  Been very quiet. Hopefully UC ponies up at least $4 large to get this into the rear view.

Apparently Brannen's lawyer is now posting on the board. I mean if UC was completely 100% wrong they owe $5 mil; with all the stuff that's come out there's absolutely no reason to settle for 80% of that. UC is dominating the PR war so no reason to not go the distance unless Brannen agrees to a more favorable settlement.

(06-08-2021 05:52 AM)doss2 Wrote:  Been very quiet. Hopefully UC ponies up at least $4 large to get this into the rear view.

It’s the nature of civil litigation. Complaint was filed, 30-60 days from the defense will put on an answer putting on affirmative defenses, denying, not admitting to and making cross-claims. Requests and exchange for written discovery and interrogatories will the take plan for the next couple months after that. After each side gets that then they will line up discovery depositions of the parties and fact witnesses.

Nobody is going to offer any money anytime soon unless they were close to resolving it before suit was filed or one side completely caves.

(06-08-2021 07:00 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(06-08-2021 05:52 AM)doss2 Wrote:  Been very quiet. Hopefully UC ponies up at least $4 large to get this into the rear view.

It’s the nature of civil litigation. Complaint was filed, 30-60 days from the defense will put on an answer putting on affirmative defenses, denying, not admitting to and making cross-claims. Requests and exchange for written discovery and interrogatories will the take plan for the next couple months after that. After each side gets that then they will line up discovery depositions of the parties and fact witnesses.

Nobody is going to offer any money anytime soon unless they were close to resolving it before suit was filed or one side completely caves.

Uc may file to dismiss for lack of jurisdiction too. People don't fully grasp how slow civil litigation can be.

(06-08-2021 07:19 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(06-08-2021 07:00 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(06-08-2021 05:52 AM)doss2 Wrote:  Been very quiet. Hopefully UC ponies up at least $4 large to get this into the rear view.

It’s the nature of civil litigation. Complaint was filed, 30-60 days from the defense will put on an answer putting on affirmative defenses, denying, not admitting to and making cross-claims. Requests and exchange for written discovery and interrogatories will the take plan for the next couple months after that. After each side gets that then they will line up discovery depositions of the parties and fact witnesses.

Nobody is going to offer any money anytime soon unless they were close to resolving it before suit was filed or one side completely caves.

Uc may file to dismiss for lack of jurisdiction too. People don't fully grasp how slow civil litigation can be.

All so true. And, frankly, to me the litigation with Brannen is nothing more than a sideshow at this point. From all appearances Cunningham hired well, Wes Miller built an impressive staff, filled recruiting needs, and there seems to be a renewed sense of optimism that our basketball program can be a perennial NCAA participant again soon--even achieving more than in the recent past.

I'm 100% focused on that. Cincinnati.com will delight in the proceedings I'm sure and spin it against the hometown university. Thankfully, few pay much attention to the old Enquirer these days.

(06-08-2021 07:28 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  

(06-08-2021 07:19 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(06-08-2021 07:00 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(06-08-2021 05:52 AM)doss2 Wrote:  Been very quiet. Hopefully UC ponies up at least $4 large to get this into the rear view.

It’s the nature of civil litigation. Complaint was filed, 30-60 days from the defense will put on an answer putting on affirmative defenses, denying, not admitting to and making cross-claims. Requests and exchange for written discovery and interrogatories will the take plan for the next couple months after that. After each side gets that then they will line up discovery depositions of the parties and fact witnesses.

Nobody is going to offer any money anytime soon unless they were close to resolving it before suit was filed or one side completely caves.

Uc may file to dismiss for lack of jurisdiction too. People don't fully grasp how slow civil litigation can be.

All so true. And, frankly, to me the litigation with Brannen is nothing more than a sideshow at this point. From all appearances Cunningham hired well, Wes Miller built an impressive staff, filled recruiting needs, and there seems to be a renewed sense of optimism that our basketball program can be a perennial NCAA participant again soon--even achieving more than in the recent past.

I'm 100% focused on that. Cincinnati.com will delight in the proceedings I'm sure and spin it against the hometown university. Thankfully, few pay much attention to the old Enquirer these days.

Hoping for an additional suit for loss of consortium, like AK did, because it's fun to discuss.

That was the gift that quit giving..

Used to be an office gag about a bilateral arm amputee who had his two prosthetics damaged in an car accident who wanted additional money for the month it took him to replace his limbs.

(06-08-2021 09:02 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Used to be an office gag about a bilateral arm amputee who had his two prosthetics damaged in an car accident who wanted additional money for the month it took him to replace his limbs.

You are sick! Laughing at the disabled, that is low!