(07-25-2020 05:19 PM)schmolik Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:09 PM)JRsec Wrote:  A&M fits the SEC just fine and if you were playing a predominantly West division schedule that would be apparent. My best friends son, who graduated at Auburn and is now a CPA, fell in love with College Station after visiting. Kids out of Mississippi and Louisiana do as well. One of my daughter's best friends married an Aggie from Oklahoma. The one nobody talks about is Missouri. The SEC is going to have to eventually snag more midwestern schools if they are ever going to fully integrate Mizzou and then we are probably talking about 2 essentially different conferences under the SEC banner instead of 2 divisions. But quite frankly from talking to some Missouri people at Auburn events they aren't sure outside of the old Big 8 exactly where they belong. They probably fit the Big 10 West a bit better but not wholly. Who they fit were Colorado, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas, and Iowa State and had a nice crossover rivalry with Illinois where they got a great many students.

I wonder if Missouri would fit in better with the SEC West with Arkansas and Texas A&M than the SEC East where they have no geographical rivals. Assuming no expansion, someone would have to go to the East to replace them. Auburn's the obvious choice but that means Alabama and Auburn would be split up and the permanent rivals would have to be shuffled meaning Alabama and Tennessee can't play every year and would only play twice every 12 years. I highly doubt 'Bama signs on for that. Assuming the SEC can't eliminate divisions altogether, I would move Alabama and Auburn to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt to the West although that would make the East way stronger than the West. The other solution if the "division rule" is still in place would be to grab Oklahoma and Texas and then the East is Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vanderbilt and the West is Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Missouri, Mississippi, Mississippi State (or you can do rotating quads).

There's nothing wrong with your analysis, but the real issue is divisions. No conference forced to have divisions can solve the problem of additions. Every school in a conference has schools they feel they must play annually. Divisions inevitably get in the way of maintaining those games.

The best move would be to add two from the West move Missouri West and move Alabama and Auburn over to the East. But even that isn't perfect as Mississippi State has been an opponent of both Alabama and Auburn since forever. Ole Miss has a long standing history with Vanderbilt, and L.S.U. has one with Alabama. The solution will be to eventually go division-less and let each school save 5 annual games and rotate the rest.

the Big 10, SEC, ACC, and to a certain extent the PAC all have divisional issues.

(07-25-2020 01:55 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 07:25 AM)Thiefery Wrote:  

(07-22-2020 01:13 AM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  Arizona, Arizona State and Utah are former WAC schools who got their golden ticket to a major conference because they want/like their affiliation with the California schools and recruiting in L.A.

They won’t give up any of that for the Big XII no matter what the California state assembly does.

(07-24-2020 01:05 PM)Sicembear11 Wrote:  

(07-19-2020 05:53 AM)Thiefery Wrote:  Big 12 will not be adding BYU, they passed on them already. They also will not be adding Cincinnati or Louisville. I was very pro Big 12 expansion west or some type of merger. But as Covid continues to change the landscape, I think the best interest for the Big 12 is to stay at 10.

The AZ schools are tempting, but I doubt there is any real smoke there since they will stick with SC and friends.

I like BYU a lot, and I think they are good add at any time. That said, the best thing would be to go back to 12 by adding Arkansas, Missouri, and Nebraska back in the fold. Those programs have all suffered under their moves away from the SWC and Big 12. I think Arkansas in particular stands to immensely grow their program in a place where they can win and actually compete for a conference title and a shot at the playoffs. The SEC is obviously an excellent conference, but it is just a straight meat grinder with the number of elite programs in it. The gauntlet in a reconfigured Big 12 south is much less daunting.

Edit: in this situation I would see WVU going to the ACC with their peers, or maybe the SEC.

Mizzu and Nebraska would never comeback because it wasn't about competing when they left, it was all about the money. And they are happy cashing in on that, Mizzu apparently needs every dollar because they still are close to going belly up. [b][b]Arkansas has been in the SEC too long to want to comeback.[/b][/b]

It is what it is, which is why 10 is a good number for the conference. In a hypothetical situation, maybe Arkansas and WV swap? But Mizzu for WV? Pass.

Thinking about that the other day. You would have to be 46 to have been at Penn St. when they weren't a Big 10 member. You would have to be 47 to have been at Arkansas or South Carolina when they weren't an SEC member. Now the average age of a college football fan is 52, but it won't be long until most fans don't remember those days. (average age: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-sp...2017-06-30)

I'm 40, and I still remember Arkansas being in the SWC. The Tom Penders vs Nolan Richardson games were huge

(07-25-2020 05:33 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:19 PM)schmolik Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:09 PM)JRsec Wrote:  A&M fits the SEC just fine and if you were playing a predominantly West division schedule that would be apparent. My best friends son, who graduated at Auburn and is now a CPA, fell in love with College Station after visiting. Kids out of Mississippi and Louisiana do as well. One of my daughter's best friends married an Aggie from Oklahoma. The one nobody talks about is Missouri. The SEC is going to have to eventually snag more midwestern schools if they are ever going to fully integrate Mizzou and then we are probably talking about 2 essentially different conferences under the SEC banner instead of 2 divisions. But quite frankly from talking to some Missouri people at Auburn events they aren't sure outside of the old Big 8 exactly where they belong. They probably fit the Big 10 West a bit better but not wholly. Who they fit were Colorado, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas, and Iowa State and had a nice crossover rivalry with Illinois where they got a great many students.

I wonder if Missouri would fit in better with the SEC West with Arkansas and Texas A&M than the SEC East where they have no geographical rivals. Assuming no expansion, someone would have to go to the East to replace them. Auburn's the obvious choice but that means Alabama and Auburn would be split up and the permanent rivals would have to be shuffled meaning Alabama and Tennessee can't play every year and would only play twice every 12 years. I highly doubt 'Bama signs on for that. Assuming the SEC can't eliminate divisions altogether, I would move Alabama and Auburn to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt to the West although that would make the East way stronger than the West. The other solution if the "division rule" is still in place would be to grab Oklahoma and Texas and then the East is Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vanderbilt and the West is Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Missouri, Mississippi, Mississippi State (or you can do rotating quads).

There's nothing wrong with your analysis, but the real issue is divisions. No conference forced to have divisions can solve the problem of additions. Every school in a conference has schools they feel they must play annually. Divisions inevitably get in the way of maintaining those games.

The best move would be to add two from the West move Missouri West and move Alabama and Auburn over to the East. But even that isn't perfect as Mississippi State has been an opponent of both Alabama and Auburn since forever. Ole Miss has a long standing history with Vanderbilt, and L.S.U. has one with Alabama. The solution will be to eventually go division-less and let each school save 5 annual games and rotate the rest.

the Big 10, SEC, ACC, and to a certain extent the PAC all have divisional issues.

The SEC and ACC have IMO bigger issues because they have 8 game conference schedules and permanent rivals so Auburn only plays SEC East teams other than Georgia (their permanent rival) 2 times in 12 years. But the SEC (and ACC) probably wouldn't want to do away with permanent rivals. I have discussed in threads about the ACC divisions in doing away with permanent rivals (or keeping just one) which would allow teams in opposite divisions to play more often. If Alabama and Auburn go to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt I think the only permanent rival necessary would be Tennessee-Vanderbilt.

The Big Ten plays a nine game conference schedule and the only permanent rivals are Indiana-Purdue. Illinois plays three East Division teams a year and they rotate more often. So the divisions aren't as big a deal to Big Ten as they are to the SEC/ACC as Illinois will play Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan more than Auburn will play Florida.

(07-25-2020 06:49 PM)schmolik Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:33 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:19 PM)schmolik Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:09 PM)JRsec Wrote:  A&M fits the SEC just fine and if you were playing a predominantly West division schedule that would be apparent. My best friends son, who graduated at Auburn and is now a CPA, fell in love with College Station after visiting. Kids out of Mississippi and Louisiana do as well. One of my daughter's best friends married an Aggie from Oklahoma. The one nobody talks about is Missouri. The SEC is going to have to eventually snag more midwestern schools if they are ever going to fully integrate Mizzou and then we are probably talking about 2 essentially different conferences under the SEC banner instead of 2 divisions. But quite frankly from talking to some Missouri people at Auburn events they aren't sure outside of the old Big 8 exactly where they belong. They probably fit the Big 10 West a bit better but not wholly. Who they fit were Colorado, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas, and Iowa State and had a nice crossover rivalry with Illinois where they got a great many students.

I wonder if Missouri would fit in better with the SEC West with Arkansas and Texas A&M than the SEC East where they have no geographical rivals. Assuming no expansion, someone would have to go to the East to replace them. Auburn's the obvious choice but that means Alabama and Auburn would be split up and the permanent rivals would have to be shuffled meaning Alabama and Tennessee can't play every year and would only play twice every 12 years. I highly doubt 'Bama signs on for that. Assuming the SEC can't eliminate divisions altogether, I would move Alabama and Auburn to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt to the West although that would make the East way stronger than the West. The other solution if the "division rule" is still in place would be to grab Oklahoma and Texas and then the East is Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vanderbilt and the West is Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Missouri, Mississippi, Mississippi State (or you can do rotating quads).

There's nothing wrong with your analysis, but the real issue is divisions. No conference forced to have divisions can solve the problem of additions. Every school in a conference has schools they feel they must play annually. Divisions inevitably get in the way of maintaining those games.

The best move would be to add two from the West move Missouri West and move Alabama and Auburn over to the East. But even that isn't perfect as Mississippi State has been an opponent of both Alabama and Auburn since forever. Ole Miss has a long standing history with Vanderbilt, and L.S.U. has one with Alabama. The solution will be to eventually go division-less and let each school save 5 annual games and rotate the rest.

the Big 10, SEC, ACC, and to a certain extent the PAC all have divisional issues.

The SEC and ACC have IMO bigger issues because they have 8 game conference schedules and permanent rivals so Auburn only plays SEC East teams other than Georgia (their permanent rival) 2 times in 12 years. But the SEC (and ACC) probably wouldn't want to do away with permanent rivals. I have discussed in threads about the ACC divisions in doing away with permanent rivals (or keeping just one) which would allow teams in opposite divisions to play more often. If Alabama and Auburn go to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt I think the only permanent rival necessary would be Tennessee-Vanderbilt.

The Big Ten plays a nine game conference schedule and the only permanent rivals are Indiana-Purdue. Illinois plays three East Division teams a year and they rotate more often. So the divisions aren't as big a deal to Big Ten as they are to the SEC/ACC as Illinois will play Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan more than Auburn will play Florida.

Except that the Big 10 West is weak. The Mizzou Vandy swap won't work. That puts too many contenders in the East (Alabama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia) and too few in the West (L.S.U., Texas A&M). Now add Texas and Oklahoma and we have balance.

11 is and always has been the magic number.

Eleven team conferences playing a 10 conference game schedule. 2 OOC games at least one of which has to be played against another P6 (11 x6) team.

PAC
USC, UCLA, Cal, Stanford, Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State, Utah, Arizona, Arizona State

Big 12
Colorado, Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Missouri, Iowa State

B1G
Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Nebraska, Iowa

SEC
Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Ole Miss, Mississippi State, Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Florida State, Miami

ACC
UVa, Carolina, NC State, Wake Forest, Duke, Clemson, South Carolina, Vanderbilt, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia Tech

EAST
Notre Dame, Virginia Tech, Louisville, Cincinnati, West Virginia, Pitt, Penn State, Boston College, Syracuse, Rutgers, Maryland

This re-unites a lot of old rivals, and allows for many other rivalries to continue to play OOC, like:
Tennessee v. Alabama
Kentucky v Louisville
Georgia v Georgia Tech
yes, even Texas v Texas A&M
UVa v Virginia Tech
Vanderbilt v Ole Miss
Nebraska v Oklahoma

(07-26-2020 07:22 AM)XLance Wrote:  11 is and always has been the magic number.

Eleven team conferences playing a 10 conference game schedule. 2 OOC games at least one of which has to be played against another P6 (11 x6) team.

PAC
USC, UCLA, Cal, Stanford, Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State, Utah, Arizona, Arizona State

Big 12
Colorado, Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Missouri, Iowa State

B1G
Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Nebraska, Iowa

SEC
Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Ole Miss, Mississippi State, Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Florida State, Miami

ACC
UVa, Carolina, NC State, Wake Forest, Duke, Clemson, South Carolina, Vanderbilt, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia Tech

EAST
Notre Dame, Virginia Tech, Louisville, Cincinnati, West Virginia, Pitt, Penn State, Boston College, Syracuse, Rutgers, Maryland

This re-unites a lot of old rivals, and allows for many other rivalries to continue to play OOC, like:
Tennessee v. Alabama
Kentucky v Louisville
Georgia v Georgia Tech
yes, even Texas v Texas A&M
UVa v Virginia Tech
Vanderbilt v Ole Miss
Nebraska v Oklahoma

You just mandated a maximum of 6 home games at least every other year.

Personally, I'm fine with that - but you need to recognize that the perceived need to have a 7th home game (in order to compete with other teams with 7 home games) is the root cause of many, many scheduling issues. If you could get everyone to agree to split the 12 games into 6 home/6 away every year, you'd have it solved - but I don't see an obvious way to get everyone to agree to that.

(07-27-2020 05:58 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 07:22 AM)XLance Wrote:  11 is and always has been the magic number.

Eleven team conferences playing a 10 conference game schedule. 2 OOC games at least one of which has to be played against another P6 (11 x6) team.

PAC
USC, UCLA, Cal, Stanford, Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State, Utah, Arizona, Arizona State

Big 12
Colorado, Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Missouri, Iowa State

B1G
Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Nebraska, Iowa

SEC
Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Ole Miss, Mississippi State, Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Florida State, Miami

ACC
UVa, Carolina, NC State, Wake Forest, Duke, Clemson, South Carolina, Vanderbilt, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia Tech

EAST
Notre Dame, Virginia Tech, Louisville, Cincinnati, West Virginia, Pitt, Penn State, Boston College, Syracuse, Rutgers, Maryland

This re-unites a lot of old rivals, and allows for many other rivalries to continue to play OOC, like:
Tennessee v. Alabama
Kentucky v Louisville
Georgia v Georgia Tech
yes, even Texas v Texas A&M
UVa v Virginia Tech
Vanderbilt v Ole Miss
Nebraska v Oklahoma

You just mandated a maximum of 6 home games at least every other year.

Personally, I'm fine with that - but you need to recognize that the perceived need to have a 7th home game (in order to compete with other teams with 7 home games) is the root cause of many, many scheduling issues. If you could get everyone to agree to split the 12 games into 6 home/6 away every year, you'd have it solved - but I don't see an obvious way to get everyone to agree to that.

Well this is my 6x11 plan which shuffles a lot of the conferences but puts many of the traditional rivals you list in the same conference so teams wouldn't need permanent non conference games.

Big Ten: Boston College, Syracuse, Penn State, Pittsburgh, Rutgers, Maryland, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State

ACC: North Carolina, Duke, NC State, Wake Forest, Clemson, South Carolina, Kentucky, Louisville, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, West Virginia

SEC: Florida, Florida State, Miami, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Alabama, Auburn, Mississippi, Mississippi State, LSU, Arkansas

Great Midwest (lack of a better name): Indiana, Purdue, Notre Dame, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Iowa State, Missouri

Big 12: Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Arizona, Arizona State, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska

Pac: UCLA, USC, California, Stanford, Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State, Utah, BYU, Colorado

(07-27-2020 07:00 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(07-27-2020 05:58 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  [quote='XLance' pid='16917970' dateline='1595766151']

Big 12: Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Arizona, Arizona State, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska

That would be fun to see.
Big 12 North
TCU
ou
osu
neb
ku
ksu

Big 12 South
UT
aggy
Tech
Baylor
ASU
AZ

Whoops, my "Big 12" was supposed to only supposed to only have 11 teams. My "Great Midwest" was supposed to have 11 but only had 10. So Nebraska has to go to the Great Midwest to even it out.

Big Ten: Boston College, Syracuse, Penn State, Pittsburgh, Rutgers, Maryland, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State

ACC: North Carolina, Duke, NC State, Wake Forest, Clemson, South Carolina, Kentucky, Louisville, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, West Virginia

SEC: Florida, Florida State, Miami, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Alabama, Auburn, Mississippi, Mississippi State, LSU, Arkansas

Great Midwest (lack of a better name): Indiana, Purdue, Notre Dame, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Iowa State, Missouri, Nebraska

Big 12: Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Arizona, Arizona State, Kansas, Kansas State

Pac: UCLA, USC, California, Stanford, Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State, Utah, BYU, Colorado

I never heard what 6X11 they were planning. I wouldn't worry about ooc rivalries. Those can be fun.
Pac UCLA, USC, Cal, Stanford, Washington, Washington St., Oregon, Oregon St., Utah, Arizona, Arizona St.
Big 12 Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma St., Kansas, Kansas St., BYU, Colorado
Big 10 Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Ohio ST., Michigan, Michigan St., Nebraska
SEC LSU, Arkansas, Mississippi, Mississippi St., Alabama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Tennessee, Vanderbilt
ACC Miami, FSU, Georgia Tech, Clemson, UNC, North Carolina St., Virginia Tech, Virginia, Wake Forest, Duke, South Carolina
New Big East Boston College, Syracuse, Rutgers, Pitt, Notre Dame, West Virginia, Louisville, Iowa St., Missouri, Maryland, Penn St.

(07-27-2020 08:59 AM)schmolik Wrote:  Whoops, my "Big 12" was supposed to only supposed to only have 11 teams. My "Great Midwest" was supposed to have 11 but only had 10. So Nebraska has to go to the Great Midwest to even it out.

Big Ten: Boston College, Syracuse, Penn State, Pittsburgh, Rutgers, Maryland, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State

ACC: North Carolina, Duke, NC State, Wake Forest, Clemson, South Carolina, Kentucky, Louisville, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, West Virginia

SEC: Florida, Florida State, Miami, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Alabama, Auburn, Mississippi, Mississippi State, LSU, Arkansas

Great Midwest (lack of a better name): Indiana, Purdue, Notre Dame, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Iowa State, Missouri, Nebraska

Big 12: Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Arizona, Arizona State, Kansas, Kansas State

Pac: UCLA, USC, California, Stanford, Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State, Utah, BYU, Colorado

Culturally, this setup is hard to beat. Well done! You could maybe switch BYU and Arizona to give BYU more cultural buddies and the state of Arizona a foot in both conferences because they are a pretty culturally split state, but that is minor.

(07-26-2020 07:22 AM)XLance Wrote:  11 is and always has been the magic number.

Eleven team conferences playing a 10 conference game schedule. 2 OOC games at least one of which has to be played against another P6 (11 x6) team.

PAC
USC, UCLA, Cal, Stanford, Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State, Utah, Arizona, Arizona State

Big 12
Colorado, Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Missouri, Iowa State

B1G
Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Nebraska, Iowa

SEC
Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Ole Miss, Mississippi State, Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Florida State, Miami

ACC
UVa, Carolina, NC State, Wake Forest, Duke, Clemson, South Carolina, Vanderbilt, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia Tech

EAST
Notre Dame, Virginia Tech, Louisville, Cincinnati, West Virginia, Pitt, Penn State, Boston College, Syracuse, Rutgers, Maryland

This re-unites a lot of old rivals, and allows for many other rivalries to continue to play OOC, like:
Tennessee v. Alabama
Kentucky v Louisville
Georgia v Georgia Tech
yes, even Texas v Texas A&M
UVa v Virginia Tech
Vanderbilt v Ole Miss
Nebraska v Oklahoma

Or there is always the 10, 10, 11, 11, 12, 12 which may work even better:

East
BC, Syracuse, Pitt, Rutgers, Penn State, Maryland, Temple, Louisville,Cincinnati, West Virginia
*Notre Dame as a partial (so thy won't ever have to play at West Virginia)

B1G
Ohio State,Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue, Indiana,Illinois,Northwestern, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa

ACC
UVa, VT, Carolina, Wake Forest, Duke, NCSU, Clemson, South Carolina
Georgia Tech, Florida State, Miami

SEC
Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, MSU, Ole Miss LSU, Arkansas, Kentucky, Tennessee, Vanderbilt

Big 12
Nebraska, Iowa State, Missouri, Kansas, KSU, Oklahoma, OSU, Texas, TT, Bayor, TCU, A&M.

PAC 12
Wash, WSU, Oregon, OSU, Cal, Stanford, UCLA, USC, Arizona State, Arizona, Utah, Colorado

The problem is: than in the last "land grab" too many ties were severed.
The idea that a conference could work with more than 12 was tested and found to be lacking.
The challenge is: with the money so big, how do we return to something that is manageable without massive legal challenges, hurt feelings, or killing the goose.

(07-25-2020 05:19 PM)schmolik Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:09 PM)JRsec Wrote:  A&M fits the SEC just fine and if you were playing a predominantly West division schedule that would be apparent. My best friends son, who graduated at Auburn and is now a CPA, fell in love with College Station after visiting. Kids out of Mississippi and Louisiana do as well. One of my daughter's best friends married an Aggie from Oklahoma. The one nobody talks about is Missouri. The SEC is going to have to eventually snag more midwestern schools if they are ever going to fully integrate Mizzou and then we are probably talking about 2 essentially different conferences under the SEC banner instead of 2 divisions. But quite frankly from talking to some Missouri people at Auburn events they aren't sure outside of the old Big 8 exactly where they belong. They probably fit the Big 10 West a bit better but not wholly. Who they fit were Colorado, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas, and Iowa State and had a nice crossover rivalry with Illinois where they got a great many students.

I wonder if Missouri would fit in better with the SEC West with Arkansas and Texas A&M than the SEC East where they have no geographical rivals. Assuming no expansion, someone would have to go to the East to replace them. Auburn's the obvious choice but that means Alabama and Auburn would be split up and the permanent rivals would have to be shuffled meaning Alabama and Tennessee can't play every year and would only play twice every 12 years. I highly doubt 'Bama signs on for that. Assuming the SEC can't eliminate divisions altogether, I would move Alabama and Auburn to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt to the West although that would make the East way stronger than the West. The other solution if the "division rule" is still in place would be to grab Oklahoma and Texas and then the East is Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vanderbilt and the West is Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Missouri, Mississippi, Mississippi State (or you can do rotating quads).

As long as they keep 8 conference games, there's plenty of room for Alabama to play either Tennessee or Auburn ooc. Saban has been a proponent of 9 game conference schedules.

(08-03-2020 11:52 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:19 PM)schmolik Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:09 PM)JRsec Wrote:  A&M fits the SEC just fine and if you were playing a predominantly West division schedule that would be apparent. My best friends son, who graduated at Auburn and is now a CPA, fell in love with College Station after visiting. Kids out of Mississippi and Louisiana do as well. One of my daughter's best friends married an Aggie from Oklahoma. The one nobody talks about is Missouri. The SEC is going to have to eventually snag more midwestern schools if they are ever going to fully integrate Mizzou and then we are probably talking about 2 essentially different conferences under the SEC banner instead of 2 divisions. But quite frankly from talking to some Missouri people at Auburn events they aren't sure outside of the old Big 8 exactly where they belong. They probably fit the Big 10 West a bit better but not wholly. Who they fit were Colorado, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas, and Iowa State and had a nice crossover rivalry with Illinois where they got a great many students.

I wonder if Missouri would fit in better with the SEC West with Arkansas and Texas A&M than the SEC East where they have no geographical rivals. Assuming no expansion, someone would have to go to the East to replace them. Auburn's the obvious choice but that means Alabama and Auburn would be split up and the permanent rivals would have to be shuffled meaning Alabama and Tennessee can't play every year and would only play twice every 12 years. I highly doubt 'Bama signs on for that. Assuming the SEC can't eliminate divisions altogether, I would move Alabama and Auburn to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt to the West although that would make the East way stronger than the West. The other solution if the "division rule" is still in place would be to grab Oklahoma and Texas and then the East is Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vanderbilt and the West is Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Missouri, Mississippi, Mississippi State (or you can do rotating quads).

As long as they keep 8 conference games, there's plenty of room for Alabama to play either Tennessee or Auburn ooc. Saban has been a proponent of 9 game conference schedules.

No divisions, 10 conference games, one OOC rivalry,one cupcake.
Maximizes revenue for the conference and for ESPN ($$$)
SEC
Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, MSU, Ole Miss LSU, Arkansas, Kentucky, Tennessee, Vanderbilt

(08-04-2020 05:11 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 11:52 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:19 PM)schmolik Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:09 PM)JRsec Wrote:  A&M fits the SEC just fine and if you were playing a predominantly West division schedule that would be apparent. My best friends son, who graduated at Auburn and is now a CPA, fell in love with College Station after visiting. Kids out of Mississippi and Louisiana do as well. One of my daughter's best friends married an Aggie from Oklahoma. The one nobody talks about is Missouri. The SEC is going to have to eventually snag more midwestern schools if they are ever going to fully integrate Mizzou and then we are probably talking about 2 essentially different conferences under the SEC banner instead of 2 divisions. But quite frankly from talking to some Missouri people at Auburn events they aren't sure outside of the old Big 8 exactly where they belong. They probably fit the Big 10 West a bit better but not wholly. Who they fit were Colorado, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas, and Iowa State and had a nice crossover rivalry with Illinois where they got a great many students.

I wonder if Missouri would fit in better with the SEC West with Arkansas and Texas A&M than the SEC East where they have no geographical rivals. Assuming no expansion, someone would have to go to the East to replace them. Auburn's the obvious choice but that means Alabama and Auburn would be split up and the permanent rivals would have to be shuffled meaning Alabama and Tennessee can't play every year and would only play twice every 12 years. I highly doubt 'Bama signs on for that. Assuming the SEC can't eliminate divisions altogether, I would move Alabama and Auburn to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt to the West although that would make the East way stronger than the West. The other solution if the "division rule" is still in place would be to grab Oklahoma and Texas and then the East is Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vanderbilt and the West is Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Missouri, Mississippi, Mississippi State (or you can do rotating quads).

As long as they keep 8 conference games, there's plenty of room for Alabama to play either Tennessee or Auburn ooc. Saban has been a proponent of 9 game conference schedules.

No divisions, 10 conference games, one OOC rivalry,one cupcake.
Maximizes revenue for the conference and for ESPN ($$$)
SEC
Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, MSU, Ole Miss LSU, Arkansas, Kentucky, Tennessee, Vanderbilt

Problem is then Florida and Georgia would never be able to play any significant non conference teams other than their in state rivals ever again.

If you want 11 team conferences and 10 game conference schedules, you want to minimize the number of "required" non conference games as much as possible.

Here's a 7x10 plan so all teams play 9 conference games and have room for 3 non conference games so 2 legit games.

Big Ten: Boston College, Syracuse, Penn State, Pittsburgh, Temple, Rutgers, Ohio State, Cincinnati, Michigan, Michigan State

ACC: Maryland, Virginia, Virginia Tech, North Carolina, Duke, NC State, Wake Forest, Clemson, South Carolina, West Virginia

SEC: Florida, Florida State, Miami, UCF, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Alabama, Auburn, Mississippi, Mississippi State

Great Midwest: Indiana, Purdue, Notre Dame, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Kentucky, Louisville, Tennessee, Vanderbilt

Big 8: Utah, BYU, Colorado, Nebraska, Kansas, Kansas State, Missouri, Iowa, Iowa State, Minnesota

SWC: Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, TCU, Houston, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, LSU, Arkansas

Pac: UCLA, USC, California, Stanford, Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State, Arizona, Arizona State

(08-04-2020 05:27 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(08-04-2020 05:11 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 11:52 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:19 PM)schmolik Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:09 PM)JRsec Wrote:  A&M fits the SEC just fine and if you were playing a predominantly West division schedule that would be apparent. My best friends son, who graduated at Auburn and is now a CPA, fell in love with College Station after visiting. Kids out of Mississippi and Louisiana do as well. One of my daughter's best friends married an Aggie from Oklahoma. The one nobody talks about is Missouri. The SEC is going to have to eventually snag more midwestern schools if they are ever going to fully integrate Mizzou and then we are probably talking about 2 essentially different conferences under the SEC banner instead of 2 divisions. But quite frankly from talking to some Missouri people at Auburn events they aren't sure outside of the old Big 8 exactly where they belong. They probably fit the Big 10 West a bit better but not wholly. Who they fit were Colorado, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas, and Iowa State and had a nice crossover rivalry with Illinois where they got a great many students.

I wonder if Missouri would fit in better with the SEC West with Arkansas and Texas A&M than the SEC East where they have no geographical rivals. Assuming no expansion, someone would have to go to the East to replace them. Auburn's the obvious choice but that means Alabama and Auburn would be split up and the permanent rivals would have to be shuffled meaning Alabama and Tennessee can't play every year and would only play twice every 12 years. I highly doubt 'Bama signs on for that. Assuming the SEC can't eliminate divisions altogether, I would move Alabama and Auburn to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt to the West although that would make the East way stronger than the West. The other solution if the "division rule" is still in place would be to grab Oklahoma and Texas and then the East is Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vanderbilt and the West is Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Missouri, Mississippi, Mississippi State (or you can do rotating quads).

As long as they keep 8 conference games, there's plenty of room for Alabama to play either Tennessee or Auburn ooc. Saban has been a proponent of 9 game conference schedules.

No divisions, 10 conference games, one OOC rivalry,one cupcake.
Maximizes revenue for the conference and for ESPN ($$$)
SEC
Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, MSU, Ole Miss LSU, Arkansas, Kentucky, Tennessee, Vanderbilt

Problem is then Florida and Georgia would never be able to play any significant non conference teams other than their in state rivals ever again.

If you want 11 team conferences and 10 game conference schedules, you want to minimize the number of "required" non conference games as much as possible.

So?
Florida hardly ever plays outside of Florida anyway, and the more SEC games played the more the SEC and ESPN make.
Then, believe it or not, bowl games may actually take on some meaning.....and guess what? ESPN makes even more money!

(08-04-2020 07:18 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-04-2020 05:27 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(08-04-2020 05:11 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 11:52 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-25-2020 05:19 PM)schmolik Wrote:  I wonder if Missouri would fit in better with the SEC West with Arkansas and Texas A&M than the SEC East where they have no geographical rivals. Assuming no expansion, someone would have to go to the East to replace them. Auburn's the obvious choice but that means Alabama and Auburn would be split up and the permanent rivals would have to be shuffled meaning Alabama and Tennessee can't play every year and would only play twice every 12 years. I highly doubt 'Bama signs on for that. Assuming the SEC can't eliminate divisions altogether, I would move Alabama and Auburn to the East and Missouri and Vanderbilt to the West although that would make the East way stronger than the West. The other solution if the "division rule" is still in place would be to grab Oklahoma and Texas and then the East is Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vanderbilt and the West is Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, LSU, Arkansas, Missouri, Mississippi, Mississippi State (or you can do rotating quads).

As long as they keep 8 conference games, there's plenty of room for Alabama to play either Tennessee or Auburn ooc. Saban has been a proponent of 9 game conference schedules.

No divisions, 10 conference games, one OOC rivalry,one cupcake.
Maximizes revenue for the conference and for ESPN ($$$)
SEC
Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, MSU, Ole Miss LSU, Arkansas, Kentucky, Tennessee, Vanderbilt

Problem is then Florida and Georgia would never be able to play any significant non conference teams other than their in state rivals ever again.

If you want 11 team conferences and 10 game conference schedules, you want to minimize the number of "required" non conference games as much as possible.

So?
Florida hardly ever plays outside of Florida anyway, and the more SEC games played the more the SEC and ESPN make.
Then, believe it or not, bowl games may actually take on some meaning.....and guess what? ESPN makes even more money!

So we'll take your 11 team SEC and my 11 team SEC and assume Florida plays Florida State annually no matter whether Florida State is in the SEC or not.

In yours Florida plays: Kentucky, Tennessee, and Vanderbilt
In mine Florida plays: Miami, Georgia Tech, and a rotating team

For Georgia, exchange Georgia Tech (who they would play every season no matter what) for Florida State.

Obviously to fit Florida State, Miami, and Georgia Tech into the SEC and to get down to 11 teams, more teams have to be moved out (especially if you want Kentucky and Louisville together). Would Florida/Georgia really miss Kentucky/Tennessee/Vanderbilt? I doubt anyone would really miss Vanderbilt. I think Alabama would be the SEC team that would miss Tennessee the most. If Miami was as good as they were back in the 90's, Florida vs. Miami would be huge (of course you would say the same for Florida vs. Tennessee which was huge).

My real ideal 11 team "SEC" for Florida would probably be Florida, Florida State, Miami, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Alabama, Auburn, LSU, Kentucky, Louisville, Tennessee. But that separates Tennessee and Vanderbilt and where else do you put the Mississippi schools?

(08-04-2020 05:37 AM)schmolik Wrote:  Here's a 7x10 plan so all teams play 9 conference games and have room for 3 non conference games so 2 legit games.

Big Ten: Boston College, Syracuse, Penn State, Pittsburgh, Temple, Rutgers, Ohio State, Cincinnati, Michigan, Michigan State

ACC: Maryland, Virginia, Virginia Tech, North Carolina, Duke, NC State, Wake Forest, Clemson, South Carolina, West Virginia

SEC: Florida, Florida State, Miami, UCF, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Alabama, Auburn, Mississippi, Mississippi State

Great Midwest: Indiana, Purdue, Notre Dame, Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Kentucky, Louisville, Tennessee, Vanderbilt

Big 8: Utah, BYU, Colorado, Nebraska, Kansas, Kansas State, Missouri, Iowa, Iowa State, Minnesota

SWC: Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, TCU, Houston, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, LSU, Arkansas

Pac: UCLA, USC, California, Stanford, Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State, Arizona, Arizona State

If you are going to 7X10, I'd go back to the old conferences, the Pac 10, the mathematically accurate Big 10, the SEC with 10, the ACC 9 + their 10th member Miami, a Reconstructed Big East w/o Miami but with Penn St., UConn and Cincinnati and then some split of the Big 12, Notre Dame and remaining schools into a Big 8 +2 and SWC.

ESPN hasn't learned. Their college football page is all about this. Trying to find information on the season and scheduling is much more difficult.