(08-03-2020 10:01 AM)memphisike Wrote:  Good luck to the Dudes that refuse to participate, they should not be removed from school however, their
Scholly should be removed and they can pay their tuition like so many other students.
After a semester they'll have a idea what the value of a free ride is costing the university.

What does the street think of this idea?

I agree with you. Their actions don't warrant removal from school, but if they don't play then they can foot the bill for their own education.

you guys just need some gladiators at your beck and call.

Should universities really be conscripting unpaid athletes just to keep hundreds of millions of dollars flowing into athletic departments’ coffers by making them largely assume whatever risks come with Covid-19, and the diseases caused by the virus??? And let's not forget these athletes are being asked to sign contracts that waive all liability.

There are no N.C.A.A.-wide standards on the frequency of testing or other protocols, which some schools could resist straight across the board...just because they would be too costly. (The N.C.A.A. has made recommendations but decisions have been left up to the universities themselves.)

The players standing up for the rights of all football players include Oregon safety Jevon Holland, considered a possible first-round N.F.L. draft pick, and Washington linebacker Joe Tryon, a preseason All-American.

The players “are very concerned with the risks COVID-19 poses to our personal health and the health of our families and communities, " Holland said.


“The people who are deciding whether we are going to play football are going to prioritize money over health and safety 10 times out of 10,” Jaydon Grant, a senior defensive back at Oregon State who graduated with a degree in digital communication arts said in an interview.

On the list of demands is this:

End lavish facility expenditures and use some endowment funds to preserve all sports*

*As an example, Stanford University should reinstate all sports discontinued by tapping into their 27.7 Billion dollar endowment

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/08/02/p...-and-more/


Is Pro Football gonna happen this year? --asking for a friend

(08-03-2020 11:01 AM)snowtiger Wrote:  you guys just need some gladiators at your beck and call.

Should universities really be conscripting unpaid athletes just to keep hundreds of millions of dollars flowing into athletic departments’ coffers by making them largely assume whatever risks come with Covid-19, and the diseases caused by the virus??? And let's not forget these athletes are being asked to sign contracts that waive all liability.

There are no N.C.A.A.-wide standards on the frequency of testing or other protocols, which some schools could resist straight across the board...just because they would be too costly. (The N.C.A.A. has made recommendations but decisions have been left up to the universities themselves.)

The players standing up for the rights of all football players include Oregon safety Jevon Holland, considered a possible first-round N.F.L. draft pick, and Washington linebacker Joe Tryon, a preseason All-American.

The players “are very concerned with the risks COVID-19 poses to our personal health and the health of our families and communities, " Holland said.


“The people who are deciding whether we are going to play football are going to prioritize money over health and safety 10 times out of 10,” Jaydon Grant, a senior defensive back at Oregon State who graduated with a degree in digital communication arts said in an interview.

On the list of demands is this:

End lavish facility expenditures and use some endowment funds to preserve all sports*

*As an example, Stanford University should reinstate all sports discontinued by tapping into their 27.7 Billion dollar endowment

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/08/02/p...-and-more/


Is Pro Football gonna happen this year? --asking for a friend

No one is conscripted. They're all free to walk.

They did ask for some things that make sense, but 50% of revenue is laughable and only shows that they need to spend more time in business classes and less on twitter.

(08-03-2020 11:01 AM)snowtiger Wrote:  you guys just need some gladiators at your beck and call.

Should universities really be conscripting unpaid athletes just to keep hundreds of millions of dollars flowing into athletic departments’ coffers by making them largely assume whatever risks come with Covid-19, and the diseases caused by the virus??? And let's not forget these athletes are being asked to sign contracts that waive all liability.

There are no N.C.A.A.-wide standards on the frequency of testing or other protocols, which some schools could resist straight across the board...just because they would be too costly. (The N.C.A.A. has made recommendations but decisions have been left up to the universities themselves.)

The players standing up for the rights of all football players include Oregon safety Jevon Holland, considered a possible first-round N.F.L. draft pick, and Washington linebacker Joe Tryon, a preseason All-American.

The players “are very concerned with the risks COVID-19 poses to our personal health and the health of our families and communities, " Holland said.


“The people who are deciding whether we are going to play football are going to prioritize money over health and safety 10 times out of 10,” Jaydon Grant, a senior defensive back at Oregon State who graduated with a degree in digital communication arts said in an interview.

On the list of demands is this:

End lavish facility expenditures and use some endowment funds to preserve all sports*

*As an example, Stanford University should reinstate all sports discontinued by tapping into their 27.7 Billion dollar endowment

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/08/02/p...-and-more/


Is Pro Football gonna happen this year? --asking for a friend

Nothing like comparing completely free citizens with the freedom to make any decision they like and receiving world class educations to slaves...

Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

Giving into their demands would be a de facto secession from the NCAA.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...conference

Quote:Huma said the players are aware that if the Pac-12 met their demands that the conference would not be eligible to participate in NCAA-sanctioned competitions or championships.

"Right now, it's clear that the conferences don't need the NCAA. Each conference is an industry unto itself," Huma said. "[The players are saying,] 'We're fine if our conference doesn't belong to the NCAA at all. We need to be treated fairly.'"

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

None of that is free.. its in exchange for their services. Most of it is a necessity of their "job". It would be like calling your work laptop a "free laptop" or calling your job training "free school".

(08-03-2020 12:52 PM)tkgrrett Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

None of that is free.. its in exchange for their services. Most of it is a necessity of their "job". It would be like calling your work laptop a "free laptop" or calling your job training "free school".

Semantics. But yes, technically you are correct. They get all that stuff, in exchange for playing sports.

My POINT is that to call a college athlete "exploited" or "modern day slavery" is a fuggin' joke.

(08-03-2020 11:01 AM)snowtiger Wrote:  you guys just need some gladiators at your beck and call.

Should universities really be conscripting unpaid athletes just to keep hundreds of millions of dollars flowing into athletic departments’ coffers by making them largely assume whatever risks come with Covid-19, and the diseases caused by the virus??? And let's not forget these athletes are being asked to sign contracts that waive all liability.

There are no N.C.A.A.-wide standards on the frequency of testing or other protocols, which some schools could resist straight across the board...just because they would be too costly. (The N.C.A.A. has made recommendations but decisions have been left up to the universities themselves.)

The players standing up for the rights of all football players include Oregon safety Jevon Holland, considered a possible first-round N.F.L. draft pick, and Washington linebacker Joe Tryon, a preseason All-American.

The players “are very concerned with the risks COVID-19 poses to our personal health and the health of our families and communities, " Holland said.


“The people who are deciding whether we are going to play football are going to prioritize money over health and safety 10 times out of 10,” Jaydon Grant, a senior defensive back at Oregon State who graduated with a degree in digital communication arts said in an interview.

On the list of demands is this:

End lavish facility expenditures and use some endowment funds to preserve all sports*

*As an example, Stanford University should reinstate all sports discontinued by tapping into their 27.7 Billion dollar endowment

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/08/02/p...-and-more/


Is Pro Football gonna happen this year? --asking for a friend

Sounds like they need to be educated about the risks of COVID-19.

They have a greater chance of dying from pneumonia than COVID-19. If you extrapolate the numbers for 15-24 year olds dying from COVID, they would also have a greater chance of dying from an alcohol related injury. I hope they have all stopped drinking.

Im so sick of this damn virus being used as political fodder... and cover to push agendas.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

I got all of that in school except the free gear. If I wanted some gear I guess I'd spend about $200. I didn't make the university millions of dollars either.

(08-03-2020 01:44 PM)Crazier Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

I got all of that in school except the free gear. If I wanted some gear I guess I'd spend about $200. I didn't make the university millions of dollars either.

Interesting. I'm just going off of my experience with a small time place (ORU). All of the athletes were given shoes, bags, clothes, etc., every year. Not to mention, the stipends and travel money, which they would pocket, because most of the meals were also provided.

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

I know. It’s freaking unbelievable!

(08-03-2020 01:48 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 01:44 PM)Crazier Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

I got all of that in school except the free gear. If I wanted some gear I guess I'd spend about $200. I didn't make the university millions of dollars either.

Interesting. I'm just going off of my experience with a small time place (ORU). All of the athletes were given shoes, bags, clothes, etc., every year. Not to mention, the stipends and travel money, which they would pocket, because most of the meals were also provided.

I worked in IT for the Athletic department during the Calipari years, and they even gave ME a free pair of size 12 Reeboks one year.

(08-03-2020 12:54 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:52 PM)tkgrrett Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

None of that is free.. its in exchange for their services. Most of it is a necessity of their "job". It would be like calling your work laptop a "free laptop" or calling your job training "free school".

Semantics. But yes, technically you are correct. They get all that stuff, in exchange for playing sports.

My POINT is that to call a college athlete "exploited" or "modern day slavery" is a fuggin' joke.

It is not "Semantics".. "free" means something for nothing. Being paid for profit generating activities is generally known as "compensation".

Compensation is negotiated all the time in the private sector. These guys are negotiating. Its possible to say you arent being fairly compensated without it being slavery. If you look at basketball, recent data points from overseas leagues and the G-league basically for a fact that market value of a top-50 recruit is higher than cost of attendance even if you valued the scholarship at dollar cost (which you shouldn't).

Football is trickier since there is no comparable league and baseball has its own system of paying prospects already so their value is pretty clearly higher than cost of attendance

(08-03-2020 01:44 PM)Crazier Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

I got all of that in school except the free gear. If I wanted some gear I guess I'd spend about $200. I didn't make the university millions of dollars either.

Assuming you are referring to an academic scholarship in which case you are incorrect about not generating millions for the University. Between donations for scholarships, state and federal grants that are awarded for research and so on, the collective student body (especially the highly achieving academic students) generate millions upon millions for the University annually.
No students = No professors
No professors = No research
No research = No grants

Damn, now that I think about I need to go back and demand some money from the University for my time and research there...

(08-03-2020 11:01 AM)snowtiger Wrote:  Should universities really be conscripting unpaid athletes just to keep hundreds of millions of dollars flowing into athletic departments’ coffers by making them largely assume whatever risks come with Covid-19, and the diseases caused by the virus??? And let's not forget these athletes are being asked to sign contracts that waive all liability.

There are no N.C.A.A.-wide standards on the frequency of testing or other protocols, which some schools could resist straight across the board...just because they would be too costly. (The N.C.A.A. has made recommendations but decisions have been left up to the universities themselves.)

On the list of demands is this:

End lavish facility expenditures and use some endowment funds to preserve all sports*

*As an example, Stanford University should reinstate all sports discontinued by tapping into their 27.7 Billion dollar endowment

College athletes are not conscripted. They always have the option of playing or not, and even quitting the team.

These athletes assume risk every day. They are much more likely to suffer serious long-term harm from injury. Are they allowed to sue for a destroyed knee, back, or CTE? Or is that risk of playing the sport?

The conferences are setting the standards for testing and other guidelines. Fortunately, these guys all play for a "have" conference that can afford twice-weekly testing, which is sounding like it will be the P5 standard. I do agree the NCAA needs to be more assertive in setting football standards, but they sold their soul a long time ago in this sport. Final decisions won't be with the NCAA, conference, or even the universities - it will be with the local governments.

It's funny these players are demanding to end lavish facilities expenses, when these lavish facilities are one of the big reasons they signed with the school. Of course, the ones saying this are upperclassmen and don't have much remaining use for the facilities any longer.

Endowment money are not general funds that can just be redirected however someone wants to redirect.

Other than that, I agree.

EDIT: And to be clear, I am for Image and Likeness. But this 50% of REVENUES, and the threat to boycott takes it to another unnecessary level.

(08-03-2020 02:33 PM)tkgrrett Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:54 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:52 PM)tkgrrett Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

None of that is free.. its in exchange for their services. Most of it is a necessity of their "job". It would be like calling your work laptop a "free laptop" or calling your job training "free school".

Semantics. But yes, technically you are correct. They get all that stuff, in exchange for playing sports.

My POINT is that to call a college athlete "exploited" or "modern day slavery" is a fuggin' joke.

It is not "Semantics".. "free" means something for nothing. Being paid for profit generating activities is generally known as "compensation".

Compensation is negotiated all the time in the private sector. These guys are negotiating. Its possible to say you arent being fairly compensated without it being slavery. If you look at basketball, recent data points from overseas leagues and the G-league basically for a fact that market value of a top-50 recruit is higher than cost of attendance even if you valued the scholarship at dollar cost (which you shouldn't).

Football is trickier since there is no comparable league and baseball has its own system of paying prospects already so their value is pretty clearly higher than cost of attendance

If you are referring to the top 5% of student-athletes, then you have a point. The overwhelming majority of student-athletes are not revenue generators.

And, my original point still stands, even though you've taken the discussion down a different path. These young men are not being "exploited".

(08-03-2020 02:43 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 11:01 AM)snowtiger Wrote:  Should universities really be conscripting unpaid athletes just to keep hundreds of millions of dollars flowing into athletic departments’ coffers by making them largely assume whatever risks come with Covid-19, and the diseases caused by the virus??? And let's not forget these athletes are being asked to sign contracts that waive all liability.

There are no N.C.A.A.-wide standards on the frequency of testing or other protocols, which some schools could resist straight across the board...just because they would be too costly. (The N.C.A.A. has made recommendations but decisions have been left up to the universities themselves.)

On the list of demands is this:

End lavish facility expenditures and use some endowment funds to preserve all sports*

*As an example, Stanford University should reinstate all sports discontinued by tapping into their 27.7 Billion dollar endowment

College athletes are not conscripted. They always have the option of playing or not, and even quitting the team.

These athletes assume risk every day. They are much more likely to suffer serious long-term harm from injury. Are they allowed to sue for a destroyed knee, back, or CTE? Or is that risk of playing the sport?

The conferences are setting the standards for testing and other guidelines. Fortunately, these guys all play for a "have" conference that can afford twice-weekly testing, which is sounding like it will be the P5 standard. I do agree the NCAA needs to be more assertive in setting football standards, but they sold their soul a long time ago in this sport. Final decisions won't be with the NCAA, conference, or even the universities - it will be with the local governments.

It's funny these players are demanding to end lavish facilities expenses, when these lavish facilities are one of the big reasons they signed with the school. Of course, the ones saying this are upperclassmen and don't have much remaining use for the facilities any longer.

Endowment money are not general funds that can just be redirected however someone wants to redirect.

Other than that, I agree.

EDIT: And to be clear, I am for Image and Likeness. But this 50% of REVENUES, and the threat to boycott takes it to another unnecessary level.

Right, I read that part and got a good laugh. Demanding money and the redirecting of funds that they have absolutely no idea about...

(08-03-2020 03:00 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 02:33 PM)tkgrrett Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:54 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:52 PM)tkgrrett Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

None of that is free.. its in exchange for their services. Most of it is a necessity of their "job". It would be like calling your work laptop a "free laptop" or calling your job training "free school".

Semantics. But yes, technically you are correct. They get all that stuff, in exchange for playing sports.

My POINT is that to call a college athlete "exploited" or "modern day slavery" is a fuggin' joke.

It is not "Semantics".. "free" means something for nothing. Being paid for profit generating activities is generally known as "compensation".

Compensation is negotiated all the time in the private sector. These guys are negotiating. Its possible to say you arent being fairly compensated without it being slavery. If you look at basketball, recent data points from overseas leagues and the G-league basically for a fact that market value of a top-50 recruit is higher than cost of attendance even if you valued the scholarship at dollar cost (which you shouldn't).

Football is trickier since there is no comparable league and baseball has its own system of paying prospects already so their value is pretty clearly higher than cost of attendance

If you are referring to the top 5% of student-athletes, then you have a point. The overwhelming majority of student-athletes are not revenue generators.

And, my original point still stands, even though you've taken the discussion down a different path. These young men are not being "exploited".

Ummmm...

Some are...Some aren't.

They guys at Alabama are not getting anywhere near their worth.

The guy @ Vandy is probably getting more than he deserves.

(08-03-2020 02:36 PM)SeñorTiger Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 01:44 PM)Crazier Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 12:32 PM)oruvoice2 Wrote:  Let me get this straight...these guys get free college, free housing, free meals, free training, free health care, free clothing, free gear, and more, to do something that they love and some of you use terms like "exploited"?

P.T. Barnum was right.

I got all of that in school except the free gear. If I wanted some gear I guess I'd spend about $200. I didn't make the university millions of dollars either.

Assuming you are referring to an academic scholarship in which case you are incorrect about not generating millions for the University. Between donations for scholarships, state and federal grants that are awarded for research and so on, the collective student body (especially the highly achieving academic students) generate millions upon millions for the University annually.
No students = No professors
No professors = No research
No research = No grants

Damn, now that I think about I need to go back and demand some money from the University for my time and research there...

Me as an individual didn't bring as much revenue as a Zion Williamson for example. I paid my tuition and fees. The rest was refunded to me. I paid 3 thousand a semester back then. It increased to alot more as I graduated. Athletes not only bring in tv revenue, they also increase student enrollment. I remember after 07-08 basketball season you couldn't find a park on campus unless you came early.