(04-09-2020 05:45 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Historical records show Notre Dame playing Northwestern 50 times and Nebraska/Indiana/Iowa/Wisconsin >15 times.

Your historical total may be correct, but the Devil is in the Details.


Nebraska ?

ND played them in a two game series in 2000 (I was at that game) and 2001.

Before that? 1973. Before that? 1947.

Almost no history.


Iowa?

ND last played Iowa in 1968.

Wisconsin?

The last game was in 1964, the third year in a row that they played.

Before that? 1944.

(they do play the next two years).

Indiana?

The last time that they played ND was in 1991.

Before that? 1958.


Northwestern?

ND has played them the most, the Wildcats being only 90 miles away.

Since 1976, they played four times in the 1990's and again in 2014 and 2018.

Six games in 44 years.........


Bottom line: Siberia. ND would have zero interest in this setup.

(This is one of the reasons that ND keeps turning the Big Ten down)




https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/sch...-head.html

(04-10-2020 12:06 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 05:45 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Historical records show Notre Dame playing Northwestern 50 times and Nebraska/Indiana/Iowa/Wisconsin >15 times.

Your historical total may be correct, but the Devil is in the Details.


Nebraska ?

ND played them in a two game series in 2000 (I was at that game) and 2001.

Before that? 1973. Before that? 1947.

Almost no history.


Iowa?

ND last played Iowa in 1968.

Wisconsin?

The last game was in 1964, the third year in a row that they played.

Before that? 1944.

(they do play the next two years).

Indiana?

The last time that they played ND was in 1991.

Before that? 1958.


Northwestern?

ND has played them the most, the Wildcats being only 90 miles away.

Since 1976, they played four times in the 1990's and again in 2014 and 2018.

Six games in 44 years.........


Bottom line: Siberia. ND would have zero interest in this setup.

(This is one of the reasons that ND keeps turning the Big Ten down)




https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/sch...-head.html

Well you do know that NBC changed Notre Dame's schedule. In the 60s/70s they used to play Northwestern, Purdue, Pitt, Michigan St. along with Navy and USC nearly every year. Then Michigan and BC came on the schedule. It was a very regional schedule with 6 to 9 games from Chicago to Boston. With all the schools joining conferences, Air Force and Georgia Tech became regulars. Then NBC came in and created a mish-mash and schools like Tulsa and Western Michigan got on the schedule during the NBC/independent era before the ACC/NBC era.

(04-10-2020 08:00 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 12:06 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 05:45 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Historical records show Notre Dame playing Northwestern 50 times and Nebraska/Indiana/Iowa/Wisconsin >15 times.

Your historical total may be correct, but the Devil is in the Details.


Nebraska ?

ND played them in a two game series in 2000 (I was at that game) and 2001.

Before that? 1973. Before that? 1947.

Almost no history.


Iowa?

ND last played Iowa in 1968.

Wisconsin?

The last game was in 1964, the third year in a row that they played.

Before that? 1944.

(they do play the next two years).

Indiana?

The last time that they played ND was in 1991.

Before that? 1958.


Northwestern?

ND has played them the most, the Wildcats being only 90 miles away.

Since 1976, they played four times in the 1990's and again in 2014 and 2018.

Six games in 44 years.........


Bottom line: Siberia. ND would have zero interest in this setup.

(This is one of the reasons that ND keeps turning the Big Ten down)




https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/sch...-head.html

Well you do know that NBC changed Notre Dame's schedule. In the 60s/70s they used to play Northwestern, Purdue, Pitt, Michigan St. along with Navy and USC nearly every year. Then Michigan and BC came on the schedule. It was a very regional schedule with 6 to 9 games from Chicago to Boston. With all the schools joining conferences, Air Force and Georgia Tech became regulars. Then NBC came in and created a mish-mash and schools like Tulsa and Western Michigan got on the schedule during the NBC/independent era before the ACC/NBC era.

I don't think that is true, at least as far as the schools in my post.

ND signed the NBC deal in 1991.

ND hasn't played some of the teams listed since back in the Sixties.

NBC had nothing to do with that.

ND just didn't want to play those schools. It sees little benefit to do so.

Also, ND decided that it wanted to be the national Catholic university.

Playing all over the country became an important part of that goal.

A regional schedule is the very last thing ND wants.

(ND is also convinced that the Big Ten will shove them into a Western Division, which is one reason why ND rejects it)

TerryD, I have a dream (although a minor one!) that Notre Dame one day gets with the elite private schools and says to heck with the massive public schools. No, some will not make as much as if they were tied to a P5 any longer, but they would no longer be trying to keep up with institutions that are simply not operationally similar to them (why is a whole other post), and they would get the national exposure and ties that elite private schools desperately want and need. Our top private institutions are smart enough to figure out economical logistics, like how to stick most of the visiting school's spring sports on a plane and have a weekend bonanza of Olympic sports at the home school, and football has never been a travel issue. These schools do not even have to form a conference; they can just be aligned through independent contracts and have their own "Cup" akin to the Army/Navy/Air Force relationship. Part of this is how much I immensely enjoyed watching Vandy play Notre Dame a few years ago. It is the first Vandy game I watched all the way through since James Franklin left.

These schools would all compete with each other with plenty of room to spare for public school rivals and other competition:

(West to East)
Stanford
USC
TCU
Northwestern
Notre Dame
Vanderbilt
Miami
Duke
Syracuse
Boston College

As the original post stated, this is a "null and void" situation for all competing universities, and I think this arrangement would have alumni and students much more excited about athletic competition than how things are currently composed. Logistically, this could have never worked decades ago when these private schools naturally joined regional conferences, but now may be a conducive environment (post-COVID, of course). Thoughts?

(04-10-2020 09:03 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  TerryD, I have a dream (although a minor one!) that Notre Dame one day gets with the elite private schools and says to heck with the massive public schools. No, some will not make as much as if they were tied to a P5 any longer, but they would no longer be trying to keep up with institutions that are simply not operationally similar to them (why is a whole other post), and they would get the national exposure and ties that elite private schools desperately want and need. Our top private institutions are smart enough to figure out economical logistics, like how to stick most of the visiting school's spring sports on a plane and have a weekend bonanza of Olympic sports at the home school, and football has never been a travel issue. These schools do not even have to form a conference; they can just be aligned through independent contracts and have their own "Cup" akin to the Army/Navy/Air Force relationship. Part of this is how much I immensely enjoyed watching Vandy play Notre Dame a few years ago. It is the first Vandy game I watched all the way through since James Franklin left.

These schools would all compete with each other with plenty of room to spare for public school rivals and other competition:

(West to East)
Stanford
USC
TCU
Northwestern
Notre Dame
Vanderbilt
Miami
Duke
Syracuse
Boston College

As the original post stated, this is a "null and void" situation for all competing universities, and I think this arrangement would have alumni and students much more excited about athletic competition than how things are currently composed. Logistically, this could have never worked decades ago when these private schools naturally joined regional conferences, but now may be a conducive environment (post-COVID, of course). Thoughts?

You missed Wake and Pitt. And Baylor.

(04-10-2020 09:20 AM)IHAVETRIED Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 09:03 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  TerryD, I have a dream (although a minor one!) that Notre Dame one day gets with the elite private schools and says to heck with the massive public schools. No, some will not make as much as if they were tied to a P5 any longer, but they would no longer be trying to keep up with institutions that are simply not operationally similar to them (why is a whole other post), and they would get the national exposure and ties that elite private schools desperately want and need. Our top private institutions are smart enough to figure out economical logistics, like how to stick most of the visiting school's spring sports on a plane and have a weekend bonanza of Olympic sports at the home school, and football has never been a travel issue. These schools do not even have to form a conference; they can just be aligned through independent contracts and have their own "Cup" akin to the Army/Navy/Air Force relationship. Part of this is how much I immensely enjoyed watching Vandy play Notre Dame a few years ago. It is the first Vandy game I watched all the way through since James Franklin left.

These schools would all compete with each other with plenty of room to spare for public school rivals and other competition:

(West to East)
Stanford
USC
TCU
Northwestern
Notre Dame
Vanderbilt
Miami
Duke
Syracuse
Boston College

As the original post stated, this is a "null and void" situation for all competing universities, and I think this arrangement would have alumni and students much more excited about athletic competition than how things are currently composed. Logistically, this could have never worked decades ago when these private schools naturally joined regional conferences, but now may be a conducive environment (post-COVID, of course). Thoughts?

You missed Wake and Pitt. And Baylor.

Pitt's a public university.

Why stop at 10. Go to 16 with divisions. Cuts down on travel, especially for olympic sports.

East Division:

Notre Dame
Northwestern
Vandy
Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest
Miami

West Division:

USC
Stanford
BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU
Rice
Tulane

(04-10-2020 09:20 AM)IHAVETRIED Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 09:03 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  TerryD, I have a dream (although a minor one!) that Notre Dame one day gets with the elite private schools and says to heck with the massive public schools. No, some will not make as much as if they were tied to a P5 any longer, but they would no longer be trying to keep up with institutions that are simply not operationally similar to them (why is a whole other post), and they would get the national exposure and ties that elite private schools desperately want and need. Our top private institutions are smart enough to figure out economical logistics, like how to stick most of the visiting school's spring sports on a plane and have a weekend bonanza of Olympic sports at the home school, and football has never been a travel issue. These schools do not even have to form a conference; they can just be aligned through independent contracts and have their own "Cup" akin to the Army/Navy/Air Force relationship. Part of this is how much I immensely enjoyed watching Vandy play Notre Dame a few years ago. It is the first Vandy game I watched all the way through since James Franklin left.

These schools would all compete with each other with plenty of room to spare for public school rivals and other competition:

(West to East)
Stanford
USC
TCU
Northwestern
Notre Dame
Vanderbilt
Miami
Duke
Syracuse
Boston College

As the original post stated, this is a "null and void" situation for all competing universities, and I think this arrangement would have alumni and students much more excited about athletic competition than how things are currently composed. Logistically, this could have never worked decades ago when these private schools naturally joined regional conferences, but now may be a conducive environment (post-COVID, of course). Thoughts?

You missed Wake and Pitt. And Baylor.

I intentionally left out Baylor and Wake, and Pitt is a public. If you make it a 12 school arrangement, it leaves very little wiggle room for other scheduling. Opinions will vary, but if I had to choose nine private schools to join with Notre Dame, it would be the nine I listed. Why Notre Dame as the hub? 1) They have proven they can pull off this kind of arrangement. 2) They are by far the highest revenue earners among the private schools over the last three years at an average of $150 million. Stanford is next closest earning $16 million less per year, and USC is behind that at almost $35 million less per year. 3)

So, think like Notre Dame. If you have three schedule openings, would Baylor or Wake be beneficial? From Notre Dame's perspective, TCU and Duke are upgrades in almost every category over Baylor and Wake. Yes, Baylor has been on an athletic tear recently, but recency bias is not in the vocabulary of Notre Dame nor most of the private schools in my list of 10. The 10 listed schools have particular athletic, academic, metropolitan, and/or cultural qualities that are highly desirable among each other. This does not mean that schools like Baylor and Wake will be exempt from playing N.D. or these other schools; it just means it would not be all of them annually. Thanks for the thought and feedback.

(04-10-2020 09:35 AM)texoma Wrote:  Why stop at 10. Go to 16 with divisions. Cuts down on travel, especially for olympic sports.

East Division:

Notre Dame
Northwestern
Vandy
Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest
Miami

West Division:

USC
Stanford
BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU
Rice
Tulane

I thought about it, but USC and Stanford have little incentive for this arrangement. I expounded more in a recent comment, but the 10 schools I chose are mutually beneficial to each other for numerous reasons. Baylor, Rice, Tulane, BYU, Wake, and SMU have a number of qualities that are beneficial for some of the other 10 but not enough to justify annual competition, especially at the expense of playing other rivals.

(04-10-2020 09:03 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  TerryD, I have a dream (although a minor one!) that Notre Dame one day gets with the elite private schools and says to heck with the massive public schools. No, some will not make as much as if they were tied to a P5 any longer, but they would no longer be trying to keep up with institutions that are simply not operationally similar to them (why is a whole other post), and they would get the national exposure and ties that elite private schools desperately want and need. Our top private institutions are smart enough to figure out economical logistics, like how to stick most of the visiting school's spring sports on a plane and have a weekend bonanza of Olympic sports at the home school, and football has never been a travel issue. These schools do not even have to form a conference; they can just be aligned through independent contracts and have their own "Cup" akin to the Army/Navy/Air Force relationship. Part of this is how much I immensely enjoyed watching Vandy play Notre Dame a few years ago. It is the first Vandy game I watched all the way through since James Franklin left.

These schools would all compete with each other with plenty of room to spare for public school rivals and other competition:

(West to East)
Stanford
USC
TCU
Northwestern
Notre Dame
Vanderbilt
Miami
Duke
Syracuse
Boston College

As the original post stated, this is a "null and void" situation for all competing universities, and I think this arrangement would have alumni and students much more excited about athletic competition than how things are currently composed. Logistically, this could have never worked decades ago when these private schools naturally joined regional conferences, but now may be a conducive environment (post-COVID, of course). Thoughts?

Paying the players and other considerations possibly may result in something like this.

The Holy Cross Fathers who run ND love the money and exposure, but for decades have resented that football overshadows academics at ND, at least in the public eye.

They have never been really comfortable with too much football success.

They forced out "too successful" coaches like Frank Leahy and Lou Holtz.

They used to internally cut football scholarships and raise the academic requirements beyond what the NCAA required.

They have de-emphasized football a number of times in the past, and still put internal hurdles on football that other schools do not.

One day, ND may decide it no longer wants to be in the athletics arms race.

I am not ready to predict something like that, but you can never rule it out with the people who run Notre Dame.

Southeastern Super
Mid-Atlantic: Virginia, Virginia Tech, North Carolina, NC State, Duke, Wake Forest
South Atlantic: Clemson, South Carolina, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Auburn, Florida State
Gulf Coast: Miami, Florida, Alabama, Ole Miss, Miss State, LSU
Cumberland: Cincinnati, Louisville, Kentucky, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Memphis


Great Lakes Super
Erie: Syracuse, Boston College, Penn State, Pittsburgh, West Virginia, Maryland
Huron: Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State, Indiana, Purdue, Notre Dame
Superior: Wisconsin, Northwestern, Illinois, Minnesota, Iowa State, Iowa
Heartland: Missouri, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska, NDSU, SDSU


Southwestern Super
South Pacific: UCLA, Southern Cal, UNLV, Arizona, Arizona State, SDSU
Lone Star: Texas, Texas A&M, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Arkansas
North Pacific: Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State, California, Stanford
Front Range: TCU, Texas Tech, New Mexico, Colorado, Colorado State, Wyoming



Don't laugh too hard on my two most obvious call ups. They do have a larger enrollment than some of their peers listed and arguably a higher drive to athletic success. There ya go ... 3 conferences of 24 to land at 72 teams.

(04-10-2020 02:47 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Southeastern Super
Mid-Atlantic: Virginia, Virginia Tech, North Carolina, NC State, Duke, Wake Forest
South Atlantic: Clemson, South Carolina, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Auburn, Florida State
Gulf Coast: Miami, Florida, Alabama, Ole Miss, Miss State, LSU
Cumberland: Cincinnati, Louisville, Kentucky, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Memphis


Great Lakes Super
Erie: Syracuse, Boston College, Penn State, Pittsburgh, West Virginia, Maryland
Huron: Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State, Indiana, Purdue, Notre Dame
Superior: Wisconsin, Northwestern, Illinois, Minnesota, Iowa State, Iowa
Heartland: Missouri, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska, NDSU, SDSU


Southwestern Super
South Pacific: UCLA, Southern Cal, UNLV, Arizona, Arizona State, SDSU
Lone Star: Texas, Texas A&M, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Arkansas
North Pacific: Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State, California, Stanford
Front Range: TCU, Texas Tech, New Mexico, Colorado, Colorado State, Wyoming



Don't laugh too hard on my two most obvious call ups. They do have a larger enrollment than some of their peers listed and arguably a higher drive to athletic success. There ya go ... 3 conferences of 24 to land at 72 teams.

Only two? I count at least four schools listed for which Temple and UConn probably have a more realistic chance of getting called up. I'm assuming the two you're saying are the Dakota ones but who wants Wyoming and New Mexico (and UNLV's only benefit is their location)?

(04-10-2020 03:00 PM)schmolik Wrote:  Only two? I count at least four schools listed for which Temple and UConn probably have a more realistic chance of getting called up. I'm assuming the two you're saying are the Dakota ones but who wants Wyoming and New Mexico (and UNLV's only benefit is their location)?

The Dakotas. That's a call up from a lower division entirely. Wyoming has an entire state behind it and it's an easy rival and travel partner with the Colorado schools. The West is empty compared to the east, you're just going to have to accept some call ups out of the west if you go with 3 supers, and that's with me giving them Texas.

Temple and UCONN cannot be slotted in for anybody in the Great Lakes I selected without making it less attractive and less lucrative. They are a definitively less desirable choice than anybody in the Huron or Erie division and that's the only place they could go in my setup.

(04-10-2020 11:21 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 09:35 AM)texoma Wrote:  Why stop at 10. Go to 16 with divisions. Cuts down on travel, especially for olympic sports.

East Division:

Notre Dame
Northwestern
Vandy
Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest
Miami

West Division:

USC
Stanford
BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU
Rice
Tulane

I thought about it, but USC and Stanford have little incentive for this arrangement. I expounded more in a recent comment, but the 10 schools I chose are mutually beneficial to each other for numerous reasons. Baylor, Rice, Tulane, BYU, Wake, and SMU have a number of qualities that are beneficial for some of the other 10 but not enough to justify annual competition, especially at the expense of playing other rivals.

OK then how about four 4 team pods.

Notre Dame
Northwestern
USC
Stanford

Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest

Vandy
Miami
Tulane
Rice

BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU

Play three teams in your pod every year and rotate four games against teams in other pods. Seven conference games and five non-conference games. That should make every one happy, especially Notre Dame.

(04-10-2020 03:59 PM)texoma Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 11:21 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 09:35 AM)texoma Wrote:  Why stop at 10. Go to 16 with divisions. Cuts down on travel, especially for olympic sports.

East Division:

Notre Dame
Northwestern
Vandy
Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest
Miami

West Division:

USC
Stanford
BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU
Rice
Tulane

I thought about it, but USC and Stanford have little incentive for this arrangement. I expounded more in a recent comment, but the 10 schools I chose are mutually beneficial to each other for numerous reasons. Baylor, Rice, Tulane, BYU, Wake, and SMU have a number of qualities that are beneficial for some of the other 10 but not enough to justify annual competition, especially at the expense of playing other rivals.

OK then how about four 4 team pods.

Notre Dame
Northwestern
USC
Stanford

Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest

Vandy
Miami
Tulane
Rice

BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU

Play three teams in your pod every year and rotate four games against teams in other pods. Seven conference games and five non-conference games. That should make every one happy, especially Notre Dame.

At least with that lineup all the honks here will finally get over the Domer obsession and realign according to what their actual needs are.

New Big Ten:
West: Nebraska, Iowa State, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Illinois, Purdue, Indiana, Kansas, Missouri
East: Ohio State, Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland, Connecticut, Virginia, North Carolina, Pittsburgh, Michigan, Michigan State

New SEC:
Texas A&M, Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Tennessee, Louisville, Kentucky, Cincinnati, West Virginia
Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, Florida, Georgia
South Carolina, Clemson, North Carolina State, Virginia Tech, Georgia Tech

New PAC:
Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State
California, UCLA, Arizona, Arizona State
Utah, Colorado, Colorado State, Kansas State
Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State

(04-10-2020 04:30 PM)Transic_nyc Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 03:59 PM)texoma Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 11:21 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 09:35 AM)texoma Wrote:  Why stop at 10. Go to 16 with divisions. Cuts down on travel, especially for olympic sports.

East Division:

Notre Dame
Northwestern
Vandy
Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest
Miami

West Division:

USC
Stanford
BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU
Rice
Tulane

I thought about it, but USC and Stanford have little incentive for this arrangement. I expounded more in a recent comment, but the 10 schools I chose are mutually beneficial to each other for numerous reasons. Baylor, Rice, Tulane, BYU, Wake, and SMU have a number of qualities that are beneficial for some of the other 10 but not enough to justify annual competition, especially at the expense of playing other rivals.

OK then how about four 4 team pods.

Notre Dame
Northwestern
USC
Stanford

Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest

Vandy
Miami
Tulane
Rice

BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU

Play three teams in your pod every year and rotate four games against teams in other pods. Seven conference games and five non-conference games. That should make every one happy, especially Notre Dame.

At least with that lineup all the honks here will finally get over the Domer obsession and realign according to what their actual needs are.

New Big Ten:
West: Nebraska, Iowa State, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Illinois, Purdue, Indiana, Kansas, Missouri
East: Ohio State, Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland, Connecticut, Virginia, North Carolina, Pittsburgh, Michigan, Michigan State

New SEC:
Texas A&M, Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Tennessee, Louisville, Kentucky, Cincinnati, West Virginia
Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, Florida, Georgia
South Carolina, Clemson, North Carolina State, Virginia Tech, Georgia Tech

New PAC:
Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State
California, UCLA, Arizona, Arizona State
Utah, Colorado, Colorado State, Kansas State
Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State

Cincinnati is a no go for the SEC. Besides Louisville would give us enough of that market.

The West division of the SEC is fine.
There is no balance or history with the rest.
And before you reconfigure you need to decide on a replacement for Cincinnati. I would think that Texas Christian would be preferable to Cincinnati and would accomplish an SEC aim w/o UT or OU.

So perhaps the West becomes:
Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Texas A&M, T.C.U.


Alabama needs to be with either Tennessee or Auburn and Auburn needs to be with either Georgia or Alabama. And everyone wants access to the state of Florida for recruiting. So for the next Division I would suggest this:
Alabama, Florida State, Kentucky, Mississippi State, Tennessee

For Auburn & Georgia:
Auburn, Florida, Georgia, Georgia Tech, South Carolina

Then you have for the final division this:
Clemson, Louisville, N.C. State, Virginia Tech, West Virginia

This way you have a solid contender in every division greater access to Florida for the two more easterly divisions, and the Northern Division can swap playing Texas and Florida Schools in rotation to maintain access to recruiting hotbeds.

(04-10-2020 05:04 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 04:30 PM)Transic_nyc Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 03:59 PM)texoma Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 11:21 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 09:35 AM)texoma Wrote:  Why stop at 10. Go to 16 with divisions. Cuts down on travel, especially for olympic sports.

East Division:

Notre Dame
Northwestern
Vandy
Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest
Miami

West Division:

USC
Stanford
BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU
Rice
Tulane

I thought about it, but USC and Stanford have little incentive for this arrangement. I expounded more in a recent comment, but the 10 schools I chose are mutually beneficial to each other for numerous reasons. Baylor, Rice, Tulane, BYU, Wake, and SMU have a number of qualities that are beneficial for some of the other 10 but not enough to justify annual competition, especially at the expense of playing other rivals.

OK then how about four 4 team pods.

Notre Dame
Northwestern
USC
Stanford

Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest

Vandy
Miami
Tulane
Rice

BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU

Play three teams in your pod every year and rotate four games against teams in other pods. Seven conference games and five non-conference games. That should make every one happy, especially Notre Dame.

At least with that lineup all the honks here will finally get over the Domer obsession and realign according to what their actual needs are.

New Big Ten:
West: Nebraska, Iowa State, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Illinois, Purdue, Indiana, Kansas, Missouri
East: Ohio State, Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland, Connecticut, Virginia, North Carolina, Pittsburgh, Michigan, Michigan State

New SEC:
Texas A&M, Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Tennessee, Louisville, Kentucky, Cincinnati, West Virginia
Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, Florida, Georgia
South Carolina, Clemson, North Carolina State, Virginia Tech, Georgia Tech

New PAC:
Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State
California, UCLA, Arizona, Arizona State
Utah, Colorado, Colorado State, Kansas State
Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State

Cincinnati is a no go for the SEC. Besides Louisville would give us enough of that market.

The West division of the SEC is fine.
There is no balance or history with the rest.
And before you reconfigure you need to decide on a replacement for Cincinnati. I would think that Texas Christian would be preferable to Cincinnati and would accomplish an SEC aim w/o UT or OU.

So perhaps the West becomes:
Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Texas A&M, T.C.U.


Alabama needs to be with either Tennessee or Auburn and Auburn needs to be with either Georgia or Alabama. And everyone wants access to the state of Florida for recruiting. So for the next Division I would suggest this:
Alabama, Florida State, Kentucky, Mississippi State, Tennessee

For Auburn & Georgia:
Auburn, Florida, Georgia, Georgia Tech, South Carolina

Then you have for the final division this:
Clemson, Louisville, N.C. State, Virginia Tech, West Virginia

This way you have a solid contender in every division greater access to Florida for the two more easterly divisions, and the Northern Division can swap playing Texas and Florida Schools in rotation to maintain access to recruiting hotbeds.

The premise is that the major private schools in Division I form their own conference, which would leave out Texas Christian in your alignment, per texoma's post that I replied to. So with that factor in place, I have a lot of trouble finding a second TX public program that the membership might accept. And with no Oklahoma to further balance the West, I would have to look to FL again to find a replacement

Therefore, I decided to place Alabama, Auburn and Tennessee in the same division as Florida and Georgia. Rough division for sure that also allows for more regionally sensible divisions in the last two.


Texas A&M, Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Louisville, Kentucky, Virginia Tech, North Carolina State, West Virginia
Alabama, Auburn, Tennessee, Florida, Georgia
South Carolina, Clemson, Florida State, Central Florida, Georgia Tech

I have to "graduate" a G school in order to keep the geographical integrity intact. Orlando doesn't have the pro sports issues that Tampa has and Central Florida has a huge enrollment with a growing football fan base. With no Miami to worry about it shouldn't be much of an issue.

I could, if I want to, mix up the final two divisions without regard to geography but keep the TAMU/LSU and AL/GA/FL divisions:

Louisville, Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Kentucky

Virginia Tech, West Virginia, North Carolina State, Central Florida, South Carolina

Here I split the other two FL schools, so that FSU won't be forced to play UCF every year but allow others to access the FL market on a regular basis. The cost of that is Louisville and Kentucky becomes an annual contest and VT/WVU becomes an annual contest but Clemson/SC and FL/FSU would have to be cross-divisional protected.

(04-10-2020 05:59 PM)Transic_nyc Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 05:04 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 04:30 PM)Transic_nyc Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 03:59 PM)texoma Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 11:21 AM)bigblueblindness Wrote:  I thought about it, but USC and Stanford have little incentive for this arrangement. I expounded more in a recent comment, but the 10 schools I chose are mutually beneficial to each other for numerous reasons. Baylor, Rice, Tulane, BYU, Wake, and SMU have a number of qualities that are beneficial for some of the other 10 but not enough to justify annual competition, especially at the expense of playing other rivals.

OK then how about four 4 team pods.

Notre Dame
Northwestern
USC
Stanford

Syracuse
B.C.
Duke
Wake Forrest

Vandy
Miami
Tulane
Rice

BYU
TCU
Baylor
SMU

Play three teams in your pod every year and rotate four games against teams in other pods. Seven conference games and five non-conference games. That should make every one happy, especially Notre Dame.

At least with that lineup all the honks here will finally get over the Domer obsession and realign according to what their actual needs are.

New Big Ten:
West: Nebraska, Iowa State, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Illinois, Purdue, Indiana, Kansas, Missouri
East: Ohio State, Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland, Connecticut, Virginia, North Carolina, Pittsburgh, Michigan, Michigan State

New SEC:
Texas A&M, Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Tennessee, Louisville, Kentucky, Cincinnati, West Virginia
Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, Florida, Georgia
South Carolina, Clemson, North Carolina State, Virginia Tech, Georgia Tech

New PAC:
Washington, Washington State, Oregon, Oregon State
California, UCLA, Arizona, Arizona State
Utah, Colorado, Colorado State, Kansas State
Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State

Cincinnati is a no go for the SEC. Besides Louisville would give us enough of that market.

The West division of the SEC is fine.
There is no balance or history with the rest.
And before you reconfigure you need to decide on a replacement for Cincinnati. I would think that Texas Christian would be preferable to Cincinnati and would accomplish an SEC aim w/o UT or OU.

So perhaps the West becomes:
Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Texas A&M, T.C.U.


Alabama needs to be with either Tennessee or Auburn and Auburn needs to be with either Georgia or Alabama. And everyone wants access to the state of Florida for recruiting. So for the next Division I would suggest this:
Alabama, Florida State, Kentucky, Mississippi State, Tennessee

For Auburn & Georgia:
Auburn, Florida, Georgia, Georgia Tech, South Carolina

Then you have for the final division this:
Clemson, Louisville, N.C. State, Virginia Tech, West Virginia

This way you have a solid contender in every division greater access to Florida for the two more easterly divisions, and the Northern Division can swap playing Texas and Florida Schools in rotation to maintain access to recruiting hotbeds.

The premise is that the major private schools in Division I form their own conference, which would leave out Texas Christian in your alignment, per texoma's post that I replied to. So with that factor in place, I have a lot of trouble finding a second TX public program that the membership might accept. And with no Oklahoma to further balance the West, I would have to look to FL again to find a replacement

Therefore, I decided to place Alabama, Auburn and Tennessee in the same division as Florida and Georgia. Rough division for sure that also allows for more regionally sensible divisions in the last two.


Texas A&M, Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Louisville, Kentucky, Virginia Tech, North Carolina State, West Virginia
Alabama, Auburn, Tennessee, Florida, Georgia
South Carolina, Clemson, Florida State, Central Florida, Georgia Tech

I have to "graduate" a G school in order to keep the geographical integrity intact. Orlando doesn't have the pro sports issues that Tampa has and Central Florida has a huge enrollment with a growing football fan base. With no Miami to worry about it shouldn't be much of an issue.

I could, if I want to, mix up the final two divisions without regard to geography but keep the TAMU/LSU and AL/GA/FL divisions:

Louisville, Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Kentucky

Virginia Tech, West Virginia, North Carolina State, Central Florida, South Carolina

Here I split the other two FL schools, so that FSU won't be forced to play UCF every year but allow others to access the FL market on a regular basis. The cost of that is Louisville and Kentucky becomes an annual contest and VT/WVU becomes an annual contest but Clemson/SC and FL/FSU would have to be cross-divisional protected.

Then there isn't enough value in adding Florida State and Clemson to cover the other 6 additions.

Minus Vanderbilt the SEC would keep Missouri and only expand to 16 using Florida State, Clemson and one of North Carolina State or Virginia Tech. And quite frankly that would reduce the shares of the other 13 schools because the value isn't there. But it would be the best we could do. It is why Notre Dame, Texas, Oklahoma, and to lesser extents Florida State and Clemson have to spread out. If the SEC isn't receiving access to the DFW area through UT, OU, or TCU then Florida State and Clemson together would be a wash economically and neither Virginia Tech nor N.C. State would pay their way in let alone Louisville, West Virginia, or Georgia Tech.

But that's on me. I should have noted for the exercise that the constructs could not reduce the payouts of any of the conferences.

(04-10-2020 06:03 PM)JRsec Wrote:  But that's on me. I should have noted for the exercise that the constructs could not reduce the payouts of any of the conferences.

Well now that changes everything and makes equal conferences in size nearly impossible.

(04-10-2020 06:15 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(04-10-2020 06:03 PM)JRsec Wrote:  But that's on me. I should have noted for the exercise that the constructs could not reduce the payouts of any of the conferences.

Well now that changes everything and makes equal conferences in size nearly impossible.

No it doesn't because I'm not going to hold the competition accountable to it. But in the real world it would. But there are ways to move to 3 conference of 20 where every school gets a raise. I've figured it out a long time ago and it's still viable. And in the real world it would be the only way to escape the damages of the GOR's so I'll leave it to someone to figure that out. And since the PAC 12 and Big 12's GOR's expire in the same year, 2025, the only schools that this would be majorly important to are those of the ACC.