(01-09-2020 10:13 AM)templefootballfan Wrote:  ESPN making the call, if you want the same money you have to replace Conn.
Need large market, proximity to NYC, sell lots of ESPN+ subscriptions, decent OOC sch, flexible starts
Biggest obstacle, which a lot people underestimate is ESPN is located in Conn

ESPN Being located in CT doesn't mean much at all, or absolutely ZERO. Sentiment means nothing to ESPN, ESPN is all about $$$$$ and market control.

The BIG EAST made ESPN, and ESPN made the BIG EAST... How did that end?

The ideal get for this conference is Army/VCU... If Fordham University were better i athletics they would be a great fit or Stony Brook University (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stony_Brook_University) if they were at the FBS level or even Hofstra University (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hofstra_University) if they were playing FBS and maintained Basketball relevance ...Hofstra participated in football from 1937 to 2009, compiling an all-time record of 403–268–11. On December 3, 2009, the university announced it was terminating the football program.

(01-08-2020 05:29 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  

(01-08-2020 01:31 PM)Coach Bonez89 Wrote:  I'm all in on the VCU for all sports but football, since they don't have a squad. I wasn't before, but didn't realize how large their endowment is, in addition to having a medical school. In the end, all that doesn't matter as much to me, but their basketball squad is obviously the main reason.

So you like them well endowed.

lol, you know it

The only 2 teams in or near the state of New York that can replace UConn are...

1. Army/VCU
2. Buffalo (Buffalo is a better academic institution overall than UConn is)

I still think that ignoring Buffalo and Georgia State would be a mistake.

(01-09-2020 10:56 AM)GoOwls111 Wrote:  I still think that ignoring Buffalo and Georgia State would be a mistake.

I agree. I personally believe Buffalo would be a great fit for the AAC.

(01-09-2020 11:03 AM)HiddenDragon Wrote:  

(01-09-2020 10:56 AM)GoOwls111 Wrote:  I still think that ignoring Buffalo and Georgia State would be a mistake.

I agree. I personally believe Buffalo would be a great fit for the AAC.

Boo. They just canned baseball back in 2017. As much as UConn stunk it up everywhere else, I will miss their baseball squad.

(01-09-2020 10:56 AM)GoOwls111 Wrote:  The only 2 teams in or near the state of New York that can replace UConn are...

1. Army/VCU
2. Buffalo (Buffalo is a better academic institution overall than UConn is)

I still think that ignoring Buffalo and Georgia State would be a mistake.

Eh. The people of New York and Georgia seem to think its ok to ignore them. There are better choices....

Juan, 50% of G4 has more eyeballs than Conn
There 3 at most. BYU, Army, AF.
Huge business get tax breaks from state their located in.
How about zoning varinces.

Every school in conf is ignored

(01-09-2020 12:11 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  Juan, 50% of G4 has more eyeballs than Conn - I just said that
There 3 at most. BYU, Army, AF. - 3 at most what?
Huge business get tax breaks from state their located in. - How do ESPN's local tax incentives factor into conference expansion?
How about zoning varinces. - What about them?

Spelling ignored, that one made the squint

(01-09-2020 11:28 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(01-09-2020 10:56 AM)GoOwls111 Wrote:  The only 2 teams in or near the state of New York that can replace UConn are...

1. Army/VCU
2. Buffalo (Buffalo is a better academic institution overall than UConn is)

I still think that ignoring Buffalo and Georgia State would be a mistake.

Eh. The people of New York and Georgia seem to think its ok to ignore them. There are better choices....

Here, here!

So, it looks like the new deal will pay each MW school not named Boise about 3.9 million each. A football only deal with the AAC would pay roughly 4.9 million. The exposure of the new deal is also much improved.
I suspect this deal is probably good enough that MW schools are likely off the table as replacement options at this point. The only exception might be if schools were tired of Boise getting a bigger share. That said, Thompsons comments about this being the last time Boise rights were negotiated separately might be a signal to his members that the "Boise special deal" wont be part of the next contract. So, its possible even that motivation may not exist if the membership has already been told the Boise special deal is being phased out.

Given the available eastern options---it looks like we could be an 11 team conference for a long time. I say add VCU to bolster the lost UConn basketball inventory---and lets soldier on with 11 for football.

MW TV deal details
https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.sites/m..._Sheet.pdf

Air Force/VCU starting to look even better now.

(01-09-2020 10:29 AM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  

(01-09-2020 10:13 AM)templefootballfan Wrote:  .

ESPN making the call, if you want the same money you have to replace Conn.

Need large market, proximity to NYC, sell lots of ESPN+ subscriptions, decent OOC sch, flexible starts

Jedidiah Clampett's reply:

According to Commissioner Aresco, who has stated that ESPN has gone along with the AAC's decisions, the AAC will be making the call. However, it may be true that ESPN has discussions with the AAC during the process and provides various kinds of viewership data or market analysis that end up guiding development of a short list.

Agree that the AAC and ESPN will both have to replace UConn, either within two years, or before 2026, in order to insure the conference against the devastating consequences of dropping to 9 teams, if two AAC teams jump to the P5 during a potential 2025-26 realignment.

If the conference should drop to 9 teams, the terms of the contract with ESPN could dissolve the broadcasting relationship, or at least allow ESPN to renegotiate it on more favorable terms.

Doubt that ESPN would insist on adding a northeastern FB-only or all-sports school to tap into the NYC market region. However, they might be inclined to give SUNY Buffalo a bump up in the discussions.

From their standpoint, a package of AF and VCU would probably generate the most income over the long term.


CoastalJuan Wrote:
.
At the bare minimum, you just have to replace the eyeballs/subscriptions that UConn would have drawn, which about 50% of G4 programs do. So replacing UConn money would just require picking from the top 50%.

Most of us, however, would rather make an improvement than just replace low hanging fruit.

From both ESPN's and the AAC's viewpoint, failing to replace the UConn viewership within the next 2-6 years would be fiscally irresponsible. ESPN would realize >5% less revenue from losing most of the northeastern U.S., including metro NYC (over life of contract, that would amount to a loss of >$50,000,000 by ESPN).

The fiscal problem for the AAC would be that the value of their broadcasting rights would diminish, which would tend to lower the ceiling on future contract negotiations. Such negotiations might end up taking place as early as 2005 or 2006, if the AAC loses another team or two.

Making an improvement (in FB, at least) is essential, rather than adding a mediocre FB and BB school, and it would be mandated by the AAC members and heavily supported by ESPN. Assuming that BYU and Boise St. are off the board, Air Force and SDSU would each boost the AAC's FB viewership, as well as the national profile of the conference. Colorado State might, as well, albeit to a slightly lesser extent, due to medium level FB program and smaller viewership base.

Whether it's possible to improve on UConn MBB and WBB's viewership, with their location in the Boston-NYC megalopolis, would be difficult.

However, a school like VCU would tap into the middle atlantic region viewership, and has over 10 million potential viewers living within two hours driving time of their location. It's also located near the eastern seaboard, within an hour's drive of the greater "Bos-Wash (Boston to Washington) megalopolis," so it's more relevant to the northeastern region than western basketball schools are.

I don't get the love for Colorado state, cute stadium, hell even App state is better than CSU

(01-09-2020 08:55 PM)GoOwls111 Wrote:  I don't get the love for Colorado state, cute stadium, hell even App state is better than CSU

It’s the potential, their fans show up when they’re winning, great facilities, huge budget, etc. I watched their basketball game against Colorado, and it was packed even though CSU isn’t very good at basketball. A couple good hires and it’d be a very solid addition.

(01-09-2020 08:59 PM)BraveKnight Wrote:  

(01-09-2020 08:55 PM)GoOwls111 Wrote:  I don't get the love for Colorado state, cute stadium, hell even App state is better than CSU

It’s the potential, their fans show up when they’re winning, great facilities, huge budget, etc. I watched their basketball game against Colorado, and it was packed even though CSU isn’t very good at basketball. A couple good hires and it’d be a very solid addition.

Guess if can sustain what they are doing for a couple of years they could be a nice threesome with AF and SDSU if the AAC decides to go to 14.

(01-09-2020 03:20 AM)GoOwls111 Wrote:  

(01-08-2020 09:51 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(01-08-2020 08:21 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  

(01-08-2020 12:17 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  

(01-08-2020 12:12 PM)The Grape King Wrote:  UConn's departure has a negative impact on the basketball side and a positive impact on football. Basketball is the side that needs a patch to make up for that value, not football.

Add VCU and get it over with.

jed clampett's reply:

Yes, add VCU, and do it quickly. But to stay with 11 FB schools would be irresponsible, because the only way to ensure the conference's well-being beyond 2026 is to replace UConn FB with a better FB school. Otherwise, the AAC could face the prospects of having only 9 FB programs, given the very real possibility that two AAC schools could be stolen by the Big-12 by 2026.


geosnooker's reply:

Because then we start to creep closer and closer to what the old BigEast was. A laughing stock amongst the power conferences. A Frankenstein conference of basketball-onlys over here, and football-onlys over there. Voting imbalances. Jealousies not easily reconciled. A mess.

.
The alarming suggestion that adding 1 FB and 1 BB/olympic school would cause the AAC to follow the path that the old Big East took, or "a Frankenstein conference of basketball-onlys and football-onlys," seems overly hyperbolic, to put it mildly.

The old Big East was entirely different. The fundamental reason why the old BE broke up - - after 12 extremely successful seasons - - was that the interests and objectives of their FB/BB schools (mostly large State-affiliated universities) were vastly different from those of the private non-FB schools (a.k.a. the "catholic 7").

Navy (FB only) and Wichita State (non-FB) both consider it to be, by far, in their best interests to play in the AAC. The arrangement has worked out spectacularly well for both schools, and for the AAC as a whole.

The conversation here has focused on following the Navy/Wichita approach to replace UConn with a FB and BB/olympic school, or possibly, another all-sports school (e.g., Colorado State).

There haven't been any indications that the AAC intends to replicate the old Big East's model.

So there wasn't a "Navy/Wichita approach"

Navy and the Big East signed membership paperwork in January of 2012. Navy vocally staying the course when the C7 schools left and Boise reneged made Navy one of the most valuable brands and members years before the midshipmen played a game in conference.

The move to add Wichita State came five years later and was based on the inherent value of adding Wichita State sans football, not on any need to match twelve football playing schools with a twelfth all sports school.

This is true, but the model worked so well that it is worth repeating if either of the other Service Academy is willing to follow that model.

I would only propose adding a Football only and Olympic only addition if it involved one or both of the service Academies, it would be a mistake to do that with any other additions.

Regarding the model that the BIG EAST had I never liked having football only additions.

Football expansion:

"About a decade after the conference's inception, Big East members decided to become a major football conference and thus added five schools including Rutgers, Miami, Temple, Virginia Tech, and West Virginia – though only Miami would be offered full all-sports membership immediately. The inaugural Big East football season launched in 1991.[9] West Virginia and Rutgers were offered admission to the Big East as full members starting in the 1995–96 academic year,[10] and Notre Dame, committed to its football independence, was offered a non-football membership effective the same year.[11] Virginia Tech would be forced to wait until 2000–01 for full admission,[12] and Temple remained a football-only member until 2004, when it was voted out of the conference due to poor attendance figures, lack of playing success, and inadequate facilities'.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_East_C..._expansion

I don't understand... DECIDED??? I mean... We did too, right?

(01-09-2020 09:17 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  A one - off western school makes no sense. It's a made for TV pipe dream that will not provide added conference interest for fans or add $$ TV value unless it's BYU. Bring 4 in from the west or none at all - & only then if it adds $$.

You mean 3, right? Right now we are at 11, not 10.

(01-09-2020 07:00 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  So, it looks like the new deal will pay each MW school not named Boise about 3.9 million each. A football only deal with the AAC would pay roughly 4.9 million. The exposure of the new deal is also much improved.
I suspect this deal is probably good enough that MW schools are likely off the table as replacement options at this point. The only exception might be if schools were tired of Boise getting a bigger share. That said, Thompsons comments about this being the last time Boise rights were negotiated separately might be a signal to his members that the "Boise special deal" wont be part of the next contract. So, its possible even that motivation may not exist if the membership has already been told the Boise special deal is being phased out.

Given the available eastern options---it looks like we could be an 11 team conference for a long time. I say add VCU to bolster the lost UConn basketball inventory---and lets soldier on with 11 for football.

MW TV deal details
https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.sites/m..._Sheet.pdf

Awesome. So no ESPN coverage. So now ESPN can go get Air Force, Colorado State, and Boise for $21MM per year, effectively kill off the MWC, get us an auto-birth to the Cotton bowl, and have 6 power conferences (5 1/2 if you're looking at money).

(01-09-2020 09:41 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  

(01-09-2020 03:20 AM)GoOwls111 Wrote:  

(01-08-2020 09:51 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(01-08-2020 08:21 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  

(01-08-2020 12:17 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  jed clampett's reply:

Yes, add VCU, and do it quickly. But to stay with 11 FB schools would be irresponsible, because the only way to ensure the conference's well-being beyond 2026 is to replace UConn FB with a better FB school. Otherwise, the AAC could face the prospects of having only 9 FB programs, given the very real possibility that two AAC schools could be stolen by the Big-12 by 2026.


geosnooker's reply:

Because then we start to creep closer and closer to what the old BigEast was. A laughing stock amongst the power conferences. A Frankenstein conference of basketball-onlys over here, and football-onlys over there. Voting imbalances. Jealousies not easily reconciled. A mess.

.
The alarming suggestion that adding 1 FB and 1 BB/olympic school would cause the AAC to follow the path that the old Big East took, or "a Frankenstein conference of basketball-onlys and football-onlys," seems overly hyperbolic, to put it mildly.

The old Big East was entirely different. The fundamental reason why the old BE broke up - - after 12 extremely successful seasons - - was that the interests and objectives of their FB/BB schools (mostly large State-affiliated universities) were vastly different from those of the private non-FB schools (a.k.a. the "catholic 7").

Navy (FB only) and Wichita State (non-FB) both consider it to be, by far, in their best interests to play in the AAC. The arrangement has worked out spectacularly well for both schools, and for the AAC as a whole.

The conversation here has focused on following the Navy/Wichita approach to replace UConn with a FB and BB/olympic school, or possibly, another all-sports school (e.g., Colorado State).

There haven't been any indications that the AAC intends to replicate the old Big East's model.

So there wasn't a "Navy/Wichita approach"

Navy and the Big East signed membership paperwork in January of 2012. Navy vocally staying the course when the C7 schools left and Boise reneged made Navy one of the most valuable brands and members years before the midshipmen played a game in conference.

The move to add Wichita State came five years later and was based on the inherent value of adding Wichita State sans football, not on any need to match twelve football playing schools with a twelfth all sports school.

This is true, but the model worked so well that it is worth repeating if either of the other Service Academy is willing to follow that model.

I would only propose adding a Football only and Olympic only addition if it involved one or both of the service Academies, it would be a mistake to do that with any other additions.

Regarding the model that the BIG EAST had I never liked having football only additions.

Football expansion:

"About a decade after the conference's inception, Big East members decided to become a major football conference and thus added five schools including Rutgers, Miami, Temple, Virginia Tech, and West Virginia – though only Miami would be offered full all-sports membership immediately. The inaugural Big East football season launched in 1991.[9] West Virginia and Rutgers were offered admission to the Big East as full members starting in the 1995–96 academic year,[10] and Notre Dame, committed to its football independence, was offered a non-football membership effective the same year.[11] Virginia Tech would be forced to wait until 2000–01 for full admission,[12] and Temple remained a football-only member until 2004, when it was voted out of the conference due to poor attendance figures, lack of playing success, and inadequate facilities'.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_East_C..._expansion

I don't understand... DECIDED??? I mean... We did too, right?

The BIG EAST was an ESPN "darling" at the time so the got the good press and herbage.