(12-09-2019 07:35 PM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 04:01 PM)griffin Wrote:  1) He has a complete plan in place
2) He already knows what his staff is going to look like, has them ready to go once he gets the head knod

Do you think it is his job to lose? Or is it still too early to say?

Things can change within a few weeks but at one time the administration already had a couple of top choices in mind but would still interview others including Silverfield.

Per source
Silverfield. Memphis. LOCK

(12-08-2019 09:33 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(12-08-2019 07:09 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  So they are NOT going to use the search committee that found us Fuente and then Norvell?

Brilliant. Who the hell made that effing decision?

Veatch is a new AD. Him 'leading' the search process is a big red flag for me.

One, why do you and a couple of others insist that we used a search committee for Norvell? We didn't. Two, why use a search committee if you already have identified the top 1, 2 or at most 3 candidates?

So to answer your question; the same group that identified and hired Norvell. Them.

Schools that hired firms in 2016

School Coach Search firm Total cost
UCF Scott Frost Parker Executive Search $120,000
Iowa State Matt Campbell Parker Executive Search $97,553
Missouri Barry Odom College Sports Solutions $84,721
South Car. Will Muschamp Eastman & Beaudine $80,000
Rutgers Chris Ash Eastman & Beaudine $80,000
Memphis Mike Norvell Eastman & Beaudine $75,000
Texas State Everett Withers Parker Executive Search $61,130

There were others on the list but I truncated it here.

Your second point is valid if in fact the decision makers have already narrowed the FIELD (pun intended) that far.

Gary Parrish

@GaryParrishCBS

FYI: I’m told Memphis is not going to use the search firm that helped it land both Justin Fuente and Mike Norvell. That could be because the school has a new athletic director. Or it could be because Memphis already has a good idea of how it's going to replace Norvell.

(12-09-2019 08:39 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  Gary Parrish

@GaryParrishCBS

FYI: I’m told Memphis is not going to use the search firm that helped it land both Justin Fuente and Mike Norvell. That could be because the school has a new athletic director. Or it could be because Memphis already has a good idea of how it's going to replace Norvell.

We had the search firm on retainer to aid in the process, but they did not LOCATE Fuente or Norvell. The search firm would have been activated for a national search if these hires didnt occur.

This is not insider information. It was well documented in the media as it was playing out at the time.

Gotta figure S&C coach Storms will go to FSU. He's been with Norvell a while.

(12-09-2019 09:06 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 08:39 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  Gary Parrish

@GaryParrishCBS

FYI: I’m told Memphis is not going to use the search firm that helped it land both Justin Fuente and Mike Norvell. That could be because the school has a new athletic director. Or it could be because Memphis already has a good idea of how it's going to replace Norvell.

We had the search firm on retainer to aid in the process, but they did not LOCATE Fuente or Norvell. The search firm would have been activated for a national search if these hires didnt occur.

This is not insider information. It was well documented in the media as it was playing out at the time.

There have been links provided showing that we did use a firm. Does anyone have a well-documented link showing they were on retainer only?

(12-10-2019 04:25 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 09:06 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 08:39 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  Gary Parrish

@GaryParrishCBS

FYI: I’m told Memphis is not going to use the search firm that helped it land both Justin Fuente and Mike Norvell. That could be because the school has a new athletic director. Or it could be because Memphis already has a good idea of how it's going to replace Norvell.

We had the search firm on retainer to aid in the process, but they did not LOCATE Fuente or Norvell. The search firm would have been activated for a national search if these hires didnt occur.

This is not insider information. It was well documented in the media as it was playing out at the time.

There have been links provided showing that we did use a firm. Does anyone have a well-documented link showing they were on retainer only?

Noones denying we had a firm on retainer. But there are no links showing we used a firm to LOCATE the candidates. I believe thats the issue thats being conflated. The search firm did not come up with the names of the past 4 candidates. We put the same search firm on retainer for both hires, but the internal committees already had these candidates lined up.

And yes, there are media links from back when he hired Norvell that stated this exact process; that the firm would, once again, be put on retainer, but would not be activated for a national search unless one was needed. This was very common knowledge from reporting on the process while it was playing out.

(12-10-2019 05:03 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 04:25 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 09:06 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 08:39 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  Gary Parrish

@GaryParrishCBS

FYI: I’m told Memphis is not going to use the search firm that helped it land both Justin Fuente and Mike Norvell. That could be because the school has a new athletic director. Or it could be because Memphis already has a good idea of how it's going to replace Norvell.

We had the search firm on retainer to aid in the process, but they did not LOCATE Fuente or Norvell. The search firm would have been activated for a national search if these hires didnt occur.

This is not insider information. It was well documented in the media as it was playing out at the time.

There have been links provided showing that we did use a firm. Does anyone have a well-documented link showing they were on retainer only?

Noones denying we had a firm on retainer. But there are no links showing we used a firm to LOCATE the candidates. I believe thats the issue thats being conflated. The search firm did not come up with the names of the past 4 candidates. We put the same search firm on retainer for both hires, but the internal committees already had these candidates lined up.

And yes, there are media links from back when he hired Norvell that stated this exact process; that the firm would, once again, be put on retainer, but would not be activated for a national search unless one was needed. This was very common knowledge from reporting on the process while it was playing out.

Do you have any links that clarify that? I'm honestly curious because I followed the entire process very closely at the time and recall the search firm being mentioned.

If you try Googling anything about Norvell now about all you can get is FSU stuff.

I seriously doubt that the AD / University President at that time pulled a list out of their pocket and pointed at Norvell's name and said, "Go get me that guy". It was probably the agent, the search firm, and the search committee and all the intertwined relationships that got it rolling. I don't know for sure because I wasn't in the room but neither was anyone else in this board.

I recall in both the Fuente and Norvell hires that neither name came up almost to the day they were announced. Seemed pretty hush-hush.

(12-10-2019 04:25 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 09:06 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 08:39 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  Gary Parrish

@GaryParrishCBS

FYI: I’m told Memphis is not going to use the search firm that helped it land both Justin Fuente and Mike Norvell. That could be because the school has a new athletic director. Or it could be because Memphis already has a good idea of how it's going to replace Norvell.

We had the search firm on retainer to aid in the process, but they did not LOCATE Fuente or Norvell. The search firm would have been activated for a national search if these hires didnt occur.

This is not insider information. It was well documented in the media as it was playing out at the time.

There have been links provided showing that we did use a firm. Does anyone have a well-documented link showing they were on retainer only?

One if the boosters confirmed they were only on retainer. When will people learn that what you read is not always true. Especially where GP is concerned.

(12-10-2019 05:20 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:03 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 04:25 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 09:06 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 08:39 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  Gary Parrish

@GaryParrishCBS

FYI: I’m told Memphis is not going to use the search firm that helped it land both Justin Fuente and Mike Norvell. That could be because the school has a new athletic director. Or it could be because Memphis already has a good idea of how it's going to replace Norvell.

We had the search firm on retainer to aid in the process, but they did not LOCATE Fuente or Norvell. The search firm would have been activated for a national search if these hires didnt occur.

This is not insider information. It was well documented in the media as it was playing out at the time.

There have been links provided showing that we did use a firm. Does anyone have a well-documented link showing they were on retainer only?

Noones denying we had a firm on retainer. But there are no links showing we used a firm to LOCATE the candidates. I believe thats the issue thats being conflated. The search firm did not come up with the names of the past 4 candidates. We put the same search firm on retainer for both hires, but the internal committees already had these candidates lined up.

And yes, there are media links from back when he hired Norvell that stated this exact process; that the firm would, once again, be put on retainer, but would not be activated for a national search unless one was needed. This was very common knowledge from reporting on the process while it was playing out.

Do you have any links that clarify that? I'm honestly curious because I followed the entire process very closely at the time and recall the search firm being mentioned.

If you try Googling anything about Norvell now about all you can get is FSU stuff.

I seriously doubt that the AD / University President at that time pulled a list out of their pocket and pointed at Norvell's name and said, "Go get me that guy". It was probably the agent, the search firm, and the search committee and all the intertwined relationships that got it rolling. I don't know for sure because I wasn't in the room but neither was anyone else in this board.

I recall in both the Fuente and Norvell hires that neither name came up almost to the day they were announced. Seemed pretty hush-hush.

Yea, thats the issue with search engines. They'll give you everything you dont really want.

I'll go back later this evening and search Wolken and Calkins twitter feeds. I'm fairly certain it was one of those guys that laid out the process.

(12-10-2019 05:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:20 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:03 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 04:25 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 09:06 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  We had the search firm on retainer to aid in the process, but they did not LOCATE Fuente or Norvell. The search firm would have been activated for a national search if these hires didnt occur.

This is not insider information. It was well documented in the media as it was playing out at the time.

There have been links provided showing that we did use a firm. Does anyone have a well-documented link showing they were on retainer only?

Noones denying we had a firm on retainer. But there are no links showing we used a firm to LOCATE the candidates. I believe thats the issue thats being conflated. The search firm did not come up with the names of the past 4 candidates. We put the same search firm on retainer for both hires, but the internal committees already had these candidates lined up.

And yes, there are media links from back when he hired Norvell that stated this exact process; that the firm would, once again, be put on retainer, but would not be activated for a national search unless one was needed. This was very common knowledge from reporting on the process while it was playing out.

Do you have any links that clarify that? I'm honestly curious because I followed the entire process very closely at the time and recall the search firm being mentioned.

If you try Googling anything about Norvell now about all you can get is FSU stuff.

I seriously doubt that the AD / University President at that time pulled a list out of their pocket and pointed at Norvell's name and said, "Go get me that guy". It was probably the agent, the search firm, and the search committee and all the intertwined relationships that got it rolling. I don't know for sure because I wasn't in the room but neither was anyone else in this board.

I recall in both the Fuente and Norvell hires that neither name came up almost to the day they were announced. Seemed pretty hush-hush.

Yea, thats the issue with search engines. They'll give you everything you dont really want.

I'll go back later this evening and search Wolken and Calkins twitter feeds. I'm fairly certain it was one of those guys that laid out the process.

Only real reason to use a search firm is so you can remain somewhat anonymous and can deny that you have contacted a candidate.

(12-10-2019 05:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:20 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:03 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 04:25 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(12-09-2019 09:06 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  We had the search firm on retainer to aid in the process, but they did not LOCATE Fuente or Norvell. The search firm would have been activated for a national search if these hires didnt occur.

This is not insider information. It was well documented in the media as it was playing out at the time.

There have been links provided showing that we did use a firm. Does anyone have a well-documented link showing they were on retainer only?

Noones denying we had a firm on retainer. But there are no links showing we used a firm to LOCATE the candidates. I believe thats the issue thats being conflated. The search firm did not come up with the names of the past 4 candidates. We put the same search firm on retainer for both hires, but the internal committees already had these candidates lined up.

And yes, there are media links from back when he hired Norvell that stated this exact process; that the firm would, once again, be put on retainer, but would not be activated for a national search unless one was needed. This was very common knowledge from reporting on the process while it was playing out.

Do you have any links that clarify that? I'm honestly curious because I followed the entire process very closely at the time and recall the search firm being mentioned.

If you try Googling anything about Norvell now about all you can get is FSU stuff.

I seriously doubt that the AD / University President at that time pulled a list out of their pocket and pointed at Norvell's name and said, "Go get me that guy". It was probably the agent, the search firm, and the search committee and all the intertwined relationships that got it rolling. I don't know for sure because I wasn't in the room but neither was anyone else in this board.

I recall in both the Fuente and Norvell hires that neither name came up almost to the day they were announced. Seemed pretty hush-hush.

Yea, thats the issue with search engines. They'll give you everything you dont really want.

I'll go back later this evening and search Wolken and Calkins twitter feeds. I'm fairly certain it was one of those guys that laid out the process.

Ever find anything definitive? I am curious to know exactly how MN ended up with the job.

I guess it could be as simple as his agent called to express interest and he killed the interview.

However we got Fuente and however we got Norvell - I'd like to repeat the process...….

(12-12-2019 03:43 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:20 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:03 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 04:25 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  There have been links provided showing that we did use a firm. Does anyone have a well-documented link showing they were on retainer only?

Noones denying we had a firm on retainer. But there are no links showing we used a firm to LOCATE the candidates. I believe thats the issue thats being conflated. The search firm did not come up with the names of the past 4 candidates. We put the same search firm on retainer for both hires, but the internal committees already had these candidates lined up.

And yes, there are media links from back when he hired Norvell that stated this exact process; that the firm would, once again, be put on retainer, but would not be activated for a national search unless one was needed. This was very common knowledge from reporting on the process while it was playing out.

Do you have any links that clarify that? I'm honestly curious because I followed the entire process very closely at the time and recall the search firm being mentioned.

If you try Googling anything about Norvell now about all you can get is FSU stuff.

I seriously doubt that the AD / University President at that time pulled a list out of their pocket and pointed at Norvell's name and said, "Go get me that guy". It was probably the agent, the search firm, and the search committee and all the intertwined relationships that got it rolling. I don't know for sure because I wasn't in the room but neither was anyone else in this board.

I recall in both the Fuente and Norvell hires that neither name came up almost to the day they were announced. Seemed pretty hush-hush.

Yea, thats the issue with search engines. They'll give you everything you dont really want.

I'll go back later this evening and search Wolken and Calkins twitter feeds. I'm fairly certain it was one of those guys that laid out the process.

Ever find anything definitive? I am curious to know exactly how MN ended up with the job.

I guess it could be as simple as his agent called to express interest and he killed the interview.

However we got Fuente and however we got Norvell - I'd like to repeat the process...….

I'm trying to stay out of this, but I'm fairly decent at using Google. Here's a paper from Marquette on search firms and whether or not they're worth the money. It claims that we hired Eastman and Beaudine, Inc for $75,000 to get Mike Norvell. The source article for that paper claimed the contract cost was $70,000 and there were $5,000 in additional expenses. Here is the link to the source:

https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...the-money/

Just for fun, here is the link to the PDF that quoted the source article:
Search Firms - Marquette University Law School
https://law.marquette.edu/assets/sports-...FINAL).pdf

I have yet to see any references for being "on retainer" with specific restrictions tied to that.

When asked about the coaching search, Bowen was tight-lipped:

Quote:Memphis athletic director Tom Bowen had promised confidentiality when he held a press conference after Fuente’s departure to briefly speak about the search for a new coach. He wasn’t going to feed the Twitter beast.

“Remember what Bowen said at the press conference? ‘I’m going dark,’” said Charlie Smithers, 67, a Highland Hundred board member and the booster club’s 2012 president. “He kept his mouth shut.”

Later, speaking to The Memphis News after the formal portion of Norvell’s introductory press conference, Bowen continued to hold the details of the search close. What he would concede: Norvell was one of three serious candidates, and Bowen and his team interviewed Norvell in New Orleans at an undisclosed location while Norvell was in the area on a recruiting trip for Arizona State.

Odom obviously was one of the other two candidates, but Bowen wouldn’t say if the third was a sitting head coach. He even bristled at being asked.

“Anybody at our level, whether they’ve been a sitting head coach or a coordinator, can coach the game,” Bowen said. “It’s got nothing to do about coaching the game. That can’t be the only criteria. The criteria has to be around leadership, recruiting, fit, style.”

And “fit” was the word most often used to describe this marriage. Norvell used it, Bowen used it and U of M president M. David Rudd used it.

What that meant exactly, however, Bowen did not say.

“End of story,” Bowen said. “He was the right fit. That’s what I get paid to do. He was the right fit.”

https://www.memphisdailynews.com/news/20...-fit/print

(12-12-2019 04:09 PM)aardWolf Wrote:  

(12-12-2019 03:43 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:20 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:03 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  Noones denying we had a firm on retainer. But there are no links showing we used a firm to LOCATE the candidates. I believe thats the issue thats being conflated. The search firm did not come up with the names of the past 4 candidates. We put the same search firm on retainer for both hires, but the internal committees already had these candidates lined up.

And yes, there are media links from back when he hired Norvell that stated this exact process; that the firm would, once again, be put on retainer, but would not be activated for a national search unless one was needed. This was very common knowledge from reporting on the process while it was playing out.

Do you have any links that clarify that? I'm honestly curious because I followed the entire process very closely at the time and recall the search firm being mentioned.

If you try Googling anything about Norvell now about all you can get is FSU stuff.

I seriously doubt that the AD / University President at that time pulled a list out of their pocket and pointed at Norvell's name and said, "Go get me that guy". It was probably the agent, the search firm, and the search committee and all the intertwined relationships that got it rolling. I don't know for sure because I wasn't in the room but neither was anyone else in this board.

I recall in both the Fuente and Norvell hires that neither name came up almost to the day they were announced. Seemed pretty hush-hush.

Yea, thats the issue with search engines. They'll give you everything you dont really want.

I'll go back later this evening and search Wolken and Calkins twitter feeds. I'm fairly certain it was one of those guys that laid out the process.

Ever find anything definitive? I am curious to know exactly how MN ended up with the job.

I guess it could be as simple as his agent called to express interest and he killed the interview.

However we got Fuente and however we got Norvell - I'd like to repeat the process...….

I'm trying to stay out of this, but I'm fairly decent at using Google. Here's a paper from Marquette on search firms and whether or not they're worth the money. It claims that we hired Eastman and Beaudine, Inc for $75,000 to get Mike Norvell. The source article for that paper claimed the contract cost was $70,000 and there were $5,000 in additional expenses. Here is the link to the source:

https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...the-money/

Just for fun, here is the link to the PDF that quoted the source article:
Search Firms - Marquette University Law School
https://law.marquette.edu/assets/sports-...FINAL).pdf

I have yet to see any references for being "on retainer" with specific restrictions tied to that.

Yeah I found that one several days ago myself. That's how I confirmed that we did in fact use a search committee despite being yelled at several times that we didn't use a search committee.

Now, the exact role / level of input the search committee had in identifying / hiring Norvell is the question.

I don't think we paid them $75,000 to do nothing though......

(12-12-2019 03:43 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:36 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:20 PM)bluebacker Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 05:03 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(12-10-2019 04:25 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  There have been links provided showing that we did use a firm. Does anyone have a well-documented link showing they were on retainer only?

Noones denying we had a firm on retainer. But there are no links showing we used a firm to LOCATE the candidates. I believe thats the issue thats being conflated. The search firm did not come up with the names of the past 4 candidates. We put the same search firm on retainer for both hires, but the internal committees already had these candidates lined up.

And yes, there are media links from back when he hired Norvell that stated this exact process; that the firm would, once again, be put on retainer, but would not be activated for a national search unless one was needed. This was very common knowledge from reporting on the process while it was playing out.

Do you have any links that clarify that? I'm honestly curious because I followed the entire process very closely at the time and recall the search firm being mentioned.

If you try Googling anything about Norvell now about all you can get is FSU stuff.

I seriously doubt that the AD / University President at that time pulled a list out of their pocket and pointed at Norvell's name and said, "Go get me that guy". It was probably the agent, the search firm, and the search committee and all the intertwined relationships that got it rolling. I don't know for sure because I wasn't in the room but neither was anyone else in this board.

I recall in both the Fuente and Norvell hires that neither name came up almost to the day they were announced. Seemed pretty hush-hush.

Yea, thats the issue with search engines. They'll give you everything you dont really want.

I'll go back later this evening and search Wolken and Calkins twitter feeds. I'm fairly certain it was one of those guys that laid out the process.

Ever find anything definitive? I am curious to know exactly how MN ended up with the job.

I guess it could be as simple as his agent called to express interest and he killed the interview.

However we got Fuente and however we got Norvell - I'd like to repeat the process...….

Yeah, crickets on the whole "well-documented" thing.

All local media, as well as USA Today, have indicated we used E&B search firm during the Norvell hire. Nothing about "retainer status" only. Heck, even Rudd & Veatch alluded to doing it differently this time and placing the work with Veatch instead.

If we simply had Odom and Norvell on a list in the AD's pocket, then we would have NEVER paid E&B $75k. Not with what the dept was going through financially at that time.

No one has said we contracted out the entire hiring process to them. Obviously Rudd, Bowen, Martin, and a couple of others made the final decision. But the firm was used during the opening days of the search to some extent. (And not just background checks - that wasn't even needed for Odom.)

If the UofM is paying people $75,000 for four days of work and doesn't even care what you tell them, sign me up!!!

There are those who get their information from googling things on the internet which is fine and relevant to an extent.

There are those who are told directly in one on one conversation from the participants of what occurred, in this case Tom Bowen and Mike Norvell.

Not knowing is ok but it doesn't mean those that know the answer are incorrect just because you don't know.

I trust Stammers on what he outlined here for the most part. I am fully aware myself of what occurred based on direct conversations from the players who played.

(12-12-2019 05:49 PM)griffin Wrote:  There are those who get their information from googling things on the internet which is fine and relevant to an extent.

There are those who are told directly in one on one conversation from the participants of what occurred, in this case Tom Bowen and Mike Norvell.

Not knowing is ok but it doesn't mean those that know the answer are incorrect just because you don't know.

I trust Stammers on what he outlined here for the most part. I am fully aware myself of what occurred based on direct conversations from the players who played.

On what basis are you trusting Stammers?

That seems really, really odd.