(04-13-2018 10:54 AM)UofMemphis Wrote:  I like the idea of both Paul Hewitt and John Brady because both coached a team to the Final Four...that is not an easy task

if not Brown then Hewitt would be my solid 2nd choice. recruited some top players to GA Tech who made it to NBA, coached in national championship game and coached for USA Basketball.

(04-13-2018 06:03 PM)450bench Wrote:  Paul Westhead

This dude liked running and gunning.

Reckon JT3 would want to move off the camera back into coaching?

I havent looked in here in a long time due to health issues and didnt realize that in the interim people had lost their minds and decided we “need” to risk having any future wins vacated after an inevitable cheating investigation that would certainly come right after hiring him. I see in the initial post of this thread and others a default position that the preference would be to have him here if somebody wasn’t preventing it. (Thank god if someone sane in the administration *is* preventing it.)

You actually want to invite an investigation here during an current major FBI probe of top NCAA teams? You have forgotten our past history that no one else outside our school has forgotten with vacated championships and Calipari and Dana Kirk?

LB would be a fabulous idea if he hadn’t had a career that included NCAA investigations and sanctions of his last teams at Kansas and SMU. But unfortunately he’s got that history and it assures he will be scrutinized intensely in any NCAA coaching. We need to maintain high standards rather than demonstrate we have none other than wanting to win. Any advancements and championships we win will be lost and vacated if we wind up in a scandal and we will be a bigger laughing stock than we are by having a past low attendance problem.

Just find someone to help who can do it without inviting scandal! It’s not impossible. It’s being lazy to only look to the easy dark side path. And the consequences to making mistake like that are to lose everything you thought you were gaining. Not worth it! It’s a bad look for the school and adds baggage we don’t need. It doesn’t help Brown either. He needs to try to go out with some dignity and he won’t gain that by inviting scandal. If he wants to work in basketball in his twilight years for some reason (given he doesn’t need the money) he should stick with the NBA and avoid the NCAA.

Please don’t beg for vacated championships, baggage, and recruiting violations! Steer the ship clear of that. Penny doesn’t yet have any of that and the school needs to stay clear of it.

I hope you do think of someone great other than Brown to assist Penny. It can’t be true that we have no choice but to sell our souls to find anyone else useful. It’s begging for problems. It’s the administration’s job and Penny’s to find the right person, not ours. If Penny is truly the savior then he will know who to get. The problem to me is that he even entertained the idea of inviting scandal even for one minute — it’s not like other schools wouldn’t have grabbed Brown already since the SMU problem if they didn’t know what would come next. Please don’t court disaster. Penny’s name is clean; let’s keep it that way. It will help Brown too to go out doing something without negative assumptions about him dogging his heels. Brown doesn’t need to be dragged into reliving his NCAA baggage. He and we all deserve better.

(04-13-2018 10:52 AM)Shooters Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 11:40 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 11:22 PM)Shooters Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 11:03 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 09:45 PM)HometownTiger Wrote:  I’m not arguing that RC left a mess. He absolutely did. Is Bowen better than RC? Yes.

That doesn’t change the fact that he’s been in charge while the basketball program has been decimated. The University’s cash cow. He’s responsible for that. Not RC.

Decimated only because of one bad basketball hire. Bowen had input but there is no way that he was solely responsible for hiring Tubby. As far as everything else goes, the admin and boosters as a whole got the practice facility built and got Laurie on board for a $10 million donation with a promise of more, all on Bowen's watch.

Also, the Tubby hire wasn't done on the cheap, so you can't accuse the admin of not paying and you can't accuse them of not advancing the state of the program as a whole during Bowen's watch.

You can’t divide things that happened under Bowen’s watch and say he did this but others made this decision. HE RUNS THE ATHLETIC DEPARTMENT. He has overseen the greatest drop in basketball revenue in NCAA history and probably attendance too in 3-4 years. Then Penny is hired under his watch and WANTS Larry Brown as asst head Coach. He is turned down even though he has generated approx $2M in new revenue in 3 weeks and probably kept double that amount from GIVING UP THEIR SEATS.

That will be his legacy.

Quote:You can’t divide things that happened under Bowen’s watch and say he did this but others made this decision.

That is a bizarre thing to say. You can absolutely say that Bowen was responsible for fixing the athletic department from an administrative and financial viewpoint and you can absolutely say that many people had a hand in Tubby being hired.

You can also say correctly (as I did) that the only bad thing about the basketball program was hiring Tubby. During Bowen's watch the practice facility was built and Laurie and others came back into the fold. Of course many were responsible for those things happening also.

Let's say that Rudd, Graf, Bronczek, and Laurie all wanted Brown. What do you think would happen?

Quote:He is turned down even though he has generated approx $2M in new revenue in 3 weeks and probably kept double that amount from GIVING UP THEIR SEATS.

You don't give a **** about the school's reputation. We all understand that.

You don’t know fact from fiction. Bowen is a joke. I don’t care what the media thinks or writes. So many of you are wringing you hands over something that will not be headline news; it will be secondary news and 99.9% of America will forget about it in two minutes. But go on with the over analyzing everything for media’s sake; much like this board. Someone starts a thread about a POTENTIAL problem between Millers sons and Penny. They are not even out of high school yet. Geez.

Quote:You don't give a **** about the school's reputation. We all understand that.

You will lose blue chip recruits, who will run in the opposite direction of potential scandal during an NCAA probe nationally of late, if you insist on hiring Brown. The five stars and four stars who can pick and choose are dropping off their lists of what schools to consider any schools involved in the current probes. That has come up in numerous articles in publications around the country about what schools the top players left are still considering.

What exactly do you gain by hiring LB? A reputation for us of renewed sleazy priorities (after trying to put Cal and Kirk behind us), a headache of extra scrutiny on us, and unnecessary headaches for Brown, who doesn’t need it. All out of laziness and lack of integrity. Not the right move.

(04-14-2018 02:39 AM)HoopsGal Wrote:  You will lose blue chip recruits, who will run in the opposite direction of potential scandal during an NCAA probe nationally of late, if you insist on hiring Brown. The five stars and four stars who can pick and choose are dropping off their lists of what schools to consider any schools involved in the current probes. That has come up in numerous articles in publications around the country about what schools the top players left are still considering.

What exactly do you gain by hiring LB? A reputation for us of renewed sleazy priorities (after trying to put Cal and Kirk behind us), a headache of extra scrutiny on us, and unnecessary headaches for Brown, who doesn’t need it. All out of laziness and lack of integrity. Not the right move.

As you said, you haven't been keeping up. We already have a reputation for renewed sleazy priorities since we fired the Tub. Fine with me. Bring on LB and who cares about the corrupt, cheating, NCAA.

(04-14-2018 02:52 AM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(04-14-2018 02:39 AM)HoopsGal Wrote:  You will lose blue chip recruits, who will run in the opposite direction of potential scandal during an NCAA probe nationally of late, if you insist on hiring Brown. The five stars and four stars who can pick and choose are dropping off their lists of what schools to consider any schools involved in the current probes. That has come up in numerous articles in publications around the country about what schools the top players left are still considering.

What exactly do you gain by hiring LB? A reputation for us of renewed sleazy priorities (after trying to put Cal and Kirk behind us), a headache of extra scrutiny on us, and unnecessary headaches for Brown, who doesn’t need it. All out of laziness and lack of integrity. Not the right move.

As you said, you haven't been keeping up. We already have a reputation for renewed sleazy priorities since we fired the Tub. Fine with me. Bring on LB and who cares about the corrupt, cheating, NCAA.

No we do not have a renewed bad ethics reputation yet since Tubby was our last coach. Penny has no baggage. He should keep it that way. We do not need Brown’s past ethics violations baggage to have a future. It won’t help Brown, Penny or us to invite scrutiny. It will make blue chip players run the other way. The biggest programs involved in the current probe are being marked off the lists of what schools to consider by the best players. We are risking heightened scrutiny by dragging Brown here.

(04-14-2018 02:59 AM)HoopsGal Wrote:  

(04-14-2018 02:52 AM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(04-14-2018 02:39 AM)HoopsGal Wrote:  You will lose blue chip recruits, who will run in the opposite direction of potential scandal during an NCAA probe nationally of late, if you insist on hiring Brown. The five stars and four stars who can pick and choose are dropping off their lists of what schools to consider any schools involved in the current probes. That has come up in numerous articles in publications around the country about what schools the top players left are still considering.

What exactly do you gain by hiring LB? A reputation for us of renewed sleazy priorities (after trying to put Cal and Kirk behind us), a headache of extra scrutiny on us, and unnecessary headaches for Brown, who doesn’t need it. All out of laziness and lack of integrity. Not the right move.

As you said, you haven't been keeping up. We already have a reputation for renewed sleazy priorities since we fired the Tub. Fine with me. Bring on LB and who cares about the corrupt, cheating, NCAA.

No we do not have a renewed bad ethics reputation yet since Tubby was our last coach. Penny has no baggage. He should keep it that way. We do not need Brown’s past ethics violations baggage to have a future. It won’t help him or us to invite scrutiny. It will make blue chip players run the other way. The biggest programs involved in the current probe are being marked off the lists of what schools to consider by the best players. We are risking heightened scrutiny by dragging Brown here.

The scrutiny is already here. That is a fact. All the AAU connections have brought the scrutiny. According to some people the NCAA has already sent investigators asking questions.

(04-14-2018 03:02 AM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(04-14-2018 02:59 AM)HoopsGal Wrote:  

(04-14-2018 02:52 AM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(04-14-2018 02:39 AM)HoopsGal Wrote:  You will lose blue chip recruits, who will run in the opposite direction of potential scandal during an NCAA probe nationally of late, if you insist on hiring Brown. The five stars and four stars who can pick and choose are dropping off their lists of what schools to consider any schools involved in the current probes. That has come up in numerous articles in publications around the country about what schools the top players left are still considering.

What exactly do you gain by hiring LB? A reputation for us of renewed sleazy priorities (after trying to put Cal and Kirk behind us), a headache of extra scrutiny on us, and unnecessary headaches for Brown, who doesn’t need it. All out of laziness and lack of integrity. Not the right move.

As you said, you haven't been keeping up. We already have a reputation for renewed sleazy priorities since we fired the Tub. Fine with me. Bring on LB and who cares about the corrupt, cheating, NCAA.

No we do not have a renewed bad ethics reputation yet since Tubby was our last coach. Penny has no baggage. He should keep it that way. We do not need Brown’s past ethics violations baggage to have a future. It won’t help him or us to invite scrutiny. It will make blue chip players run the other way. The biggest programs involved in the current probe are being marked off the lists of what schools to consider by the best players. We are risking heightened scrutiny by dragging Brown here.

The scrutiny is already here. That is a fact. All the AAU connections have brought the scrutiny. According to some people the NCAA has already sent investigators asking questions.

Then only a fool would invite more, for crying out loud. Penny hasn’t ever been found guilty of any violations, unlike Brown, and will survive scrutiny of HIS own actions. He doesn’t need to add baggage from someone else, and Brown doesn’t need it either. If Brown cared about Penny he would simply point Penny to the best person to hire. That is how Brown can “help” if helping is truly what he wants to do. Coming here as Penny’s assistant coach will not help Penny or Brown.

(04-14-2018 03:02 AM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(04-14-2018 02:59 AM)HoopsGal Wrote:  

(04-14-2018 02:52 AM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(04-14-2018 02:39 AM)HoopsGal Wrote:  You will lose blue chip recruits, who will run in the opposite direction of potential scandal during an NCAA probe nationally of late, if you insist on hiring Brown. The five stars and four stars who can pick and choose are dropping off their lists of what schools to consider any schools involved in the current probes. That has come up in numerous articles in publications around the country about what schools the top players left are still considering.

What exactly do you gain by hiring LB? A reputation for us of renewed sleazy priorities (after trying to put Cal and Kirk behind us), a headache of extra scrutiny on us, and unnecessary headaches for Brown, who doesn’t need it. All out of laziness and lack of integrity. Not the right move.

As you said, you haven't been keeping up. We already have a reputation for renewed sleazy priorities since we fired the Tub. Fine with me. Bring on LB and who cares about the corrupt, cheating, NCAA.

No we do not have a renewed bad ethics reputation yet since Tubby was our last coach. Penny has no baggage. He should keep it that way. We do not need Brown’s past ethics violations baggage to have a future. It won’t help him or us to invite scrutiny. It will make blue chip players run the other way. The biggest programs involved in the current probe are being marked off the lists of what schools to consider by the best players. We are risking heightened scrutiny by dragging Brown here.

The scrutiny is already here. That is a fact. All the AAU connections have brought the scrutiny. According to some people the NCAA has already sent investigators asking questions.

Really? Wow, incredible.

(04-13-2018 12:42 AM)Sundanceuiuc Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 10:07 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 10:02 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  Stan Jones looks to be a good choice and could truly benefit Penny and the program.

speaking of Stan's...what about Stan Heath?

he took Kent State to an Elite Eight, took Arkansas to a couple NCAAs, and even managed to take USF to the NCAA tourney.

he's a Head Coach in the G-League (old NBA D League)

I'd like to think Memphis asst HC is a better job than G-League HC.

I'm not sure if better or worse, but I'd call him.
I'll add him to the list...

(04-12-2018 10:55 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 10:48 PM)Julian Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 10:36 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 10:33 PM)Julian Wrote:  Really? No thanks. 4-14 and 5-13 in the Horizon league in his last two years.

he's proven he can not only make NCAA and NIT tourneys, but his teams can also advance...I'm not saying let's make him head coach or anything but he seems like a good pick to show Penny the ropes coaching NCAA college basketball. moreover, he was also named conference COY 3 times in his career.

The key is to hire a winner. Coaches with experience in D1 that has mediocre records are just going to be mediocre if they came here.

There are a lot of mediocre head coaches that are great assistant coaches.

Amen to Stam's comment, he's old (he retired from Cleveland St), but might be good in this role.
I'll add him to the first post.

(04-12-2018 11:14 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  what about Paul Hewitt? he coached GT to a NCAA runner-up spot.

(04-12-2018 11:25 PM)steves Wrote:  How about David Padgett ... he's looking for a #1 assistants job. Especially if Brown take the consultant job.
Or Murray Bartow ... again if Brown goes consultant. Great XO pedigree.

Padgett I'll pass on. 'Ville HC, probably earned a lower HC job anyway.
Murray Bartow would be fine with me, I'll add him to the first post

(04-12-2018 11:43 PM)WColt45 Wrote:  Jason Kidd
Scott Skiles
David Fizdale
Mike Davis
Pete Gillen
Kevin Ollie
Jim Calhoun

Kidd and Skiles both seem like psychopaths.
Fizdale will be an NBA HC again... sooner rather than later...
Gillen is fun, but it's been forever since he's coached.
Ollie? What's he going to teach us? How to win with Calhoun's players and not win with his?
Calhoun is something like a million years old.

These are actually all coaches that are fun and worth adding to A list, but not THIS list
(just my opinion).

And WColt already got a good vote on the first post with Roccaforte, so he's already made a great post

About Gary Waters. Someone earlier mentioned Stan Heath. If you know the history, Stan took over for Gary at Kent State and in his only season there, took Waters seniors to the Elite 8. Antonio Gates and Trevor Huffman. Stan gelled them, but that team was Gary's doing. Then at CSU, Gary had a few scary good teams. Late in his tenure there he lost 3 kids via transfer in April (to Louisville, Michigan State and Wichita State) and they stunk after that. Gary Waters is a helluva coach.

Here is an article, if you care to read about him. 21 seasons as a head coach.

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/2...from-three

(04-13-2018 08:13 PM)Joe1 Wrote:  

(04-13-2018 06:03 PM)450bench Wrote:  Paul Westhead

This dude liked running and gunning.

Love him, but he's 79 and been out of the game for a bit.
(Yes, I know Brown is 78).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Westhead

He's a legend, ah screw it, we can put him on the list I suppose...

(04-14-2018 08:11 AM)dannyb73 Wrote:  

(04-13-2018 12:42 AM)Sundanceuiuc Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 10:07 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 10:02 PM)MemphisTigerPawr Wrote:  Stan Jones looks to be a good choice and could truly benefit Penny and the program.

speaking of Stan's...what about Stan Heath?

he took Kent State to an Elite Eight, took Arkansas to a couple NCAAs, and even managed to take USF to the NCAA tourney.

he's a Head Coach in the G-League (old NBA D League)

I'd like to think Memphis asst HC is a better job than G-League HC.

I'm not sure if better or worse, but I'd call him.
I'll add him to the list...

(04-12-2018 10:55 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 10:48 PM)Julian Wrote:  

(04-12-2018 10:36 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  he's proven he can not only make NCAA and NIT tourneys, but his teams can also advance...I'm not saying let's make him head coach or anything but he seems like a good pick to show Penny the ropes coaching NCAA college basketball. moreover, he was also named conference COY 3 times in his career.

The key is to hire a winner. Coaches with experience in D1 that has mediocre records are just going to be mediocre if they came here.

There are a lot of mediocre head coaches that are great assistant coaches.

Amen to Stam's comment, he's old (he retired from Cleveland St), but might be good in this role.
I'll add him to the first post.

(04-12-2018 11:14 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  what about Paul Hewitt? he coached GT to a NCAA runner-up spot.

(04-12-2018 11:25 PM)steves Wrote:  How about David Padgett ... he's looking for a #1 assistants job. Especially if Brown take the consultant job.
Or Murray Bartow ... again if Brown goes consultant. Great XO pedigree.

Padgett I'll pass on. 'Ville HC, probably earned a lower HC job anyway.
Murray Bartow would be fine with me, I'll add him to the first post

(04-12-2018 11:43 PM)WColt45 Wrote:  Jason Kidd
Scott Skiles
David Fizdale
Mike Davis
Pete Gillen
Kevin Ollie
Jim Calhoun

Kidd and Skiles both seem like psychopaths.
Fizdale will be an NBA HC again... sooner rather than later...
Gillen is fun, but it's been forever since he's coached.
Ollie? What's he going to teach us? How to win with Calhoun's players and not win with his?
Calhoun is something like a million years old.

These are actually all coaches that are fun and worth adding to A list, but not THIS list
(just my opinion).

And WColt already got a good vote on the first post with Roccaforte, so he's already made a great post

About Gary Waters. Someone earlier mentioned Stan Heath. If you know the history, Stan took over for Gary at Kent State and in his only season there, took Waters seniors to the Elite 8. Antonio Gates and Trevor Huffman. Stan gelled them, but that team was Gary's doing. Then at CSU, Gary had a few scary good teams. Late in his tenure there he lost 3 kids via transfer in April (to Louisville, Michigan State and Wichita State) and they stunk after that. Gary Waters is a helluva coach.

Here is an article, if you care to read about him. 21 seasons as a head coach.

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/2...from-three

Good stuff.

The bottom line is that this thread is showing that there are a ton of great assistants out there, many of whom not many people know about. Add the fact that even if we hire Brown he won't be on the road and it makes other candidates with no baggage almost as attractive as bench coaches.

We can take Murray Bartow off the board. Just accepted a position with Alford at UCLA.

https://www.diehards.com/ucla/ucla-hires...ray-bartow

(04-13-2018 09:53 AM)HometownTiger Wrote:  Stan Jones isn’t Stan Heath, FYI.

Stan Jones is the lead assistant for Leonard Hamilton at FSU. Been with him forever but he’s a Memphis alum/native I believe.

Stan has been the lead for Hamilton forever. He is a Tiger, local kid who played on the JV squad in 78-80 when they dropped the program. Considered an excellent x o guy

Might be off a year on when JV was dropped

Trust me ... when we start rolling we will be investigated ... just remember to hire the best lawyers this time and do not admit any wrong doing.

(04-13-2018 06:03 PM)450bench Wrote:  Paul Westhead

This would actually be a interesting hire to help mentor Penny and our staff. The guy knows what he is doing. Not sure if we could lure him out of retirement. Exactly the type tempo coach for the game Penny wants to play.