(11-23-2013 09:47 PM)solohawks Wrote:  I see UMASS as all sports being attractive to the MAC due to their basketball. For JMU that attraction does not exist, so if they are willing to come football only, why not balance out your divisions

But UMass & JMU as a pair are attractive to the MAC BBall ... JMU would be just about an average MAC school in BBall, and adding a competitive school in the middle of the conference ladder dilutes the dead weight of the fairly long term doormats like EMU and NIU. UMass, as a school that would slot into the top half of the ladder would be more attractive, but even there, the formal ability to issue the ultimatum, that the MAC seems to have in hand, is only made real if there is a 14th available to be added all-sports.

(11-23-2013 09:49 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  I have the same fears about JMU's administration. They seem to think an ACC invite is on the way or something, and seem content to wait on it.

If they were going to wait on that report they commissioned, they missed the annual deadline to get an FBS invite and start the transition then. It'll be until well after BBall season is over that the next annual deadline rolls around. So whether they take their sweet time jawboning the decision or ram it through roughshod, they are on basically the same timetable either way.

(11-23-2013 09:58 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 09:47 PM)solohawks Wrote:  I see UMASS as all sports being attractive to the MAC due to their basketball. For JMU that attraction does not exist, so if they are willing to come football only, why not balance out your divisions

But UMass & JMU as a pair are attractive to the MAC BBall ... JMU would be just about an average MAC school in BBall, and adding a competitive school in the middle of the conference ladder dilutes the dead weight of the fairly long term doormats like EMU and NIU. UMass, as a school that would slot into the top half of the ladder would be more attractive, but even there, the formal ability to issue the ultimatum, that the MAC seems to have in hand, is only made real if there is a 14th available to be added all-sports.

(11-23-2013 09:49 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  I have the same fears about JMU's administration. They seem to think an ACC invite is on the way or something, and seem content to wait on it.

If they were going to wait on that report they commissioned, they missed the annual deadline to get an FBS invite and start the transition then. It'll be until well after BBall season is over that the next annual deadline rolls around. So whether they take their sweet time jawboning the decision or ram it through roughshod, they are on basically the same timetable either way.

Sort of. That depends on how fast the SBC moves. The league is bound and determined to have a Championship Game by 2015, that means we have to add someone by June 1st.

If another team comes in and says they are ready to move immediately. I could see the SBC telling JMU no and inviting that team instead.

the MAC meanwhile, is in no hurry to expand. They can wait as long or as little as they would like.

(11-23-2013 10:10 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 09:58 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 09:47 PM)solohawks Wrote:  I see UMASS as all sports being attractive to the MAC due to their basketball. For JMU that attraction does not exist, so if they are willing to come football only, why not balance out your divisions

But UMass & JMU as a pair are attractive to the MAC BBall ... JMU would be just about an average MAC school in BBall, and adding a competitive school in the middle of the conference ladder dilutes the dead weight of the fairly long term doormats like EMU and NIU. UMass, as a school that would slot into the top half of the ladder would be more attractive, but even there, the formal ability to issue the ultimatum, that the MAC seems to have in hand, is only made real if there is a 14th available to be added all-sports.

(11-23-2013 09:49 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  I have the same fears about JMU's administration. They seem to think an ACC invite is on the way or something, and seem content to wait on it.

If they were going to wait on that report they commissioned, they missed the annual deadline to get an FBS invite and start the transition then. It'll be until well after BBall season is over that the next annual deadline rolls around. So whether they take their sweet time jawboning the decision or ram it through roughshod, they are on basically the same timetable either way.

Sort of. That depends on how fast the SBC moves. The league is bound and determined to have a Championship Game by 2015, that means we have to add someone by June 1st.

If another team comes in and says they are ready to move immediately. I could see the SBC telling JMU no and inviting that team instead.

the MAC meanwhile, is in no hurry to expand. They can wait as long or as little as they would like.

If the TV deal for the MAC is running through 2016-17 what is the point of expanding with a 14th to have another mouth to feed?

The MAC realistically has 2-3 years (June 2016) before they almost have to pull the trigger on a 14th. By that point some more realignment could occur because CUSA's TV deal is also only good through 2015-16 and the league may not last beyond the current deal.

I could very well see the MAC trying to poach CUSA first before looking at another FCS upgrade, IMO.

(11-23-2013 10:10 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 09:58 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 09:47 PM)solohawks Wrote:  I see UMASS as all sports being attractive to the MAC due to their basketball. For JMU that attraction does not exist, so if they are willing to come football only, why not balance out your divisions

But UMass & JMU as a pair are attractive to the MAC BBall ... JMU would be just about an average MAC school in BBall, and adding a competitive school in the middle of the conference ladder dilutes the dead weight of the fairly long term doormats like EMU and NIU. UMass, as a school that would slot into the top half of the ladder would be more attractive, but even there, the formal ability to issue the ultimatum, that the MAC seems to have in hand, is only made real if there is a 14th available to be added all-sports.

(11-23-2013 09:49 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  I have the same fears about JMU's administration. They seem to think an ACC invite is on the way or something, and seem content to wait on it.

If they were going to wait on that report they commissioned, they missed the annual deadline to get an FBS invite and start the transition then. It'll be until well after BBall season is over that the next annual deadline rolls around. So whether they take their sweet time jawboning the decision or ram it through roughshod, they are on basically the same timetable either way.

Sort of. That depends on how fast the SBC moves. The league is bound and determined to have a Championship Game by 2015, that means we have to add someone by June 1st.

If another team comes in and says they are ready to move immediately. I could see the SBC telling JMU no and inviting that team instead.

the MAC meanwhile, is in no hurry to expand. They can wait as long or as little as they would like.

If the Sun Belt wants a school immediately, it will almost certainly be Liberty. Therefore, it will come down to whether or not the Sun Belt will stomach accepting Liberty.

App State just added Liberty to their football schedule for next year if I'm not mistaken. Maybe they are warming up to the idea of playing Liberty in the bigger sports or just need an easy win.

(11-23-2013 12:52 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:47 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:44 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:40 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  JMU is posturing for CUSA or the MAC to make a move. They are not an ideal fit in the SBC. My guess is they have an SBC invite in hand should they want it, but the longer they sit, the more likely it is that Missouri State or Eastern Kentucky sneak into the picture.

I agree....except on EKU and MSU.

If it's not JMU, it WILL be Liberty.

Liberty appears to be out. Too much baggage. There has been a lot of communication between SBC West Members and Missouri State of late, and the hope is to convince the Bears to take an invite.

EKU is pushing hard for an invite, though they have some work to do.

If Karl Benson had a choice, Liberty would already be in the league.

Benson said it will be an eastern team.

EKU is way way way far away from FBS.

MSU is in play, of course, but convincing a basketball school to become a football school is tough.

So after that, who? Neither EKU or MSU are likely to move. No Southland schools will be invited....so who?

Liberty

There are at least four solid no votes on Liberty in the Sun Belt. Only takes three to block expansion. The Sun Belt will stay at 11 unless JMU or Missouri State choose to apply.

(11-23-2013 08:58 PM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 08:05 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 07:35 PM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 07:24 PM)solohawks Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:35 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  The MAC won't take any more football-only teams. It's all or nothing.

Wouldn't the MAC want a 14th football member without having to send the volleyball team to VA

NO, we want a full-member for all sports. We would still be the most compact FBS conference in the nation.

There is no appetite for any more football-only memberships. Causes too much problems and wrecked the Big East. No other FBS conference except the Sun-Belt offers anything less than all sports.

SBC would not do football only with JMU either. Football only was a deal for NMSU and Idaho simply to give our former conference brethren a temporary home.

Lol..No

It was done in the hopes of creating a championship game. Nothing more.

Damn near busted up the league.

The western teams are still extremely unhappy that NMSU did not get an all sports invite. You have five Sun Belt members in the west who wanted NMSU all sports (maybe six, I'm not sure where ULM was on the vote).

If you think they are going to just say okey-dokey to Liberty or agree to add JMU football only after that debacle I think you seriously mis-judge the mood in the league. The strongest advocate for a football title game from the schools is a president who doesn't even have a vote in Sun Belt matters any more because his school is leaving.

(11-24-2013 02:51 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 08:58 PM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 08:05 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 07:35 PM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 07:24 PM)solohawks Wrote:  Wouldn't the MAC want a 14th football member without having to send the volleyball team to VA

NO, we want a full-member for all sports. We would still be the most compact FBS conference in the nation.

There is no appetite for any more football-only memberships. Causes too much problems and wrecked the Big East. No other FBS conference except the Sun-Belt offers anything less than all sports.

SBC would not do football only with JMU either. Football only was a deal for NMSU and Idaho simply to give our former conference brethren a temporary home.

Lol..No

It was done in the hopes of creating a championship game. Nothing more.

Damn near busted up the league.

The western teams are still extremely unhappy that NMSU did not get an all sports invite. You have five Sun Belt members in the west who wanted NMSU all sports (maybe six, I'm not sure where ULM was on the vote).

If you think they are going to just say okey-dokey to Liberty or agree to add JMU football only after that debacle I think you seriously mis-judge the mood in the league. The strongest advocate for a football title game from the schools is a president who doesn't even have a vote in Sun Belt matters any more because his school is leaving.

This is correct. The West Division of the league is very unhappy with the NMSU and Idaho situation. The thing to remember about the SBC West is that all of the programs get along really well. We all also get along well with NMSU.

You want the one scenario that doesn't involve crazy amounts of movement out of another league that would break up the Sun Belt? Isolate the West schools enough that they finally get bored and start talking about reforming in their own league with a couple of nearby move ups.

As it is, the two divisions get along well enough to maintain a healthy relationship. But neither division has the votes to just add whoever they want right now.

(11-23-2013 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  If the TV deal for the MAC is running through 2016-17 what is the point of expanding with a 14th to have another mouth to feed?

Its simple arithmetic that the MAC, with such tiny TV revenues leading to such a small conference payout, are a conference were the "more mouths to feed" argument is a very small downside if they see an expansion move that they believe is a good deal for the conference. Its a change of less than $100,000. A single season in the coming decade with two NCAA tournament bids or an extra NCAA tournament win would wipe that out, as would a single season with the conference FB standing among Go5 schools higher than it would have otherwise been.

And it would also take only a small benefit per school to the move in the next TV contract to wipe out the loss.

So it comes down to whether its a good move for the MAC's long term interests or not.

(11-24-2013 02:20 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  If the TV deal for the MAC is running through 2016-17 what is the point of expanding with a 14th to have another mouth to feed?

Its simple arithmetic that the MAC, with such tiny TV revenues leading to such a small conference payout, are the conference the least effected by the "more mouths to feed" argument if they see an expansion move that they believe is a good deal for the conference.

In the G5 travel savings and developing rivalries that sell tickets can easily be profitable despite a decrease in shared TV or CFP dollars.

(11-24-2013 02:24 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  In the G5 travel savings and developing rivalries that sell tickets can easily be profitable despite a decrease in shared TV or CFP dollars.

Travel savings is not on the table for the MAC, which has a quite compact footprint, but developing rivalries could be on the table.

Which is another FB-only adds are not popular among fans, since for a number of MAC schools, rivalries stretch from October to February. It would be a lot easier to care about playing UMass in football if they were also one of the contenders chasing the MAC East leader in BBall season.

(11-24-2013 02:43 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:52 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:47 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:44 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:40 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  JMU is posturing for CUSA or the MAC to make a move. They are not an ideal fit in the SBC. My guess is they have an SBC invite in hand should they want it, but the longer they sit, the more likely it is that Missouri State or Eastern Kentucky sneak into the picture.

I agree....except on EKU and MSU.

If it's not JMU, it WILL be Liberty.

Liberty appears to be out. Too much baggage. There has been a lot of communication between SBC West Members and Missouri State of late, and the hope is to convince the Bears to take an invite.

EKU is pushing hard for an invite, though they have some work to do.

If Karl Benson had a choice, Liberty would already be in the league.

Benson said it will be an eastern team.

EKU is way way way far away from FBS.

MSU is in play, of course, but convincing a basketball school to become a football school is tough.

So after that, who? Neither EKU or MSU are likely to move. No Southland schools will be invited....so who?

Liberty

There are at least four solid no votes on Liberty in the Sun Belt. Only takes three to block expansion. The Sun Belt will stay at 11 unless JMU or Missouri State choose to apply.

The only way I see Liberty getting an invite would be for Football Only. I know Benson says that it will be an all-sports school but with JMU not ready to commit the only good option in the East is Liberty and I don't think most would like them on board in all sports.

If Liberty does get the invite as football only the Belt could then invite NMSU for all sports to make it 12 in Olympic sports and 12 for football.

For Football (with all-sports schools in bold)
East would be:
Appalachian St
Georgia St
Georgia Southern
Troy
South Alabama
Liberty

West would be:
Louisiana-Monroe
Louisiana-Lafayette
Arkansas St
Texas St
New Mexico St
Idaho

For Olympic sports Arkansas-Little Rock could be in the East and Texas-Arlington in the West

(11-23-2013 01:04 AM)cleburneslim Wrote:  Doesn't sound like jmu is going the way of the SBC. The repeated need for a conference that they would fit academically seems to eliminate that option.
Sounds a little like they are floating a plan to join the Mac.

IMO the only way they could have made the point clearer would have said "We want to join the MAC".

(11-24-2013 10:59 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 01:04 AM)cleburneslim Wrote:  Doesn't sound like jmu is going the way of the SBC. The repeated need for a conference that they would fit academically seems to eliminate that option.
Sounds a little like they are floating a plan to join the Mac.

IMO the only way they could have made the point clearer would have said "We want to join the MAC".

With NIU cruising to a second BCS bowl this season its makes sense to see whether they can pick off a couple of CUSA schools like Old Dominion who is already in the MAC for wrestling and would have a built in conference rival in JMU.

Movement at the G5 level is coming down increasingly to align rivalries over the marginal media market value pop.

(11-24-2013 02:43 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:52 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:47 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:44 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:40 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  JMU is posturing for CUSA or the MAC to make a move. They are not an ideal fit in the SBC. My guess is they have an SBC invite in hand should they want it, but the longer they sit, the more likely it is that Missouri State or Eastern Kentucky sneak into the picture.

I agree....except on EKU and MSU.

If it's not JMU, it WILL be Liberty.

Liberty appears to be out. Too much baggage. There has been a lot of communication between SBC West Members and Missouri State of late, and the hope is to convince the Bears to take an invite.

EKU is pushing hard for an invite, though they have some work to do.

If Karl Benson had a choice, Liberty would already be in the league.

Benson said it will be an eastern team.

EKU is way way way far away from FBS.

MSU is in play, of course, but convincing a basketball school to become a football school is tough.

So after that, who? Neither EKU or MSU are likely to move. No Southland schools will be invited....so who?

Liberty

There are at least four solid no votes on Liberty in the Sun Belt. Only takes three to block expansion. The Sun Belt will stay at 11 unless JMU or Missouri State choose to apply.

I can understand the four SBC teams feeling the way they do about Liberty. Almost the entire CUSA feels the same way about ASU

(11-24-2013 11:44 PM)Rabonchild Wrote:  

(11-24-2013 02:43 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:52 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:47 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:44 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  I agree....except on EKU and MSU.

If it's not JMU, it WILL be Liberty.

Liberty appears to be out. Too much baggage. There has been a lot of communication between SBC West Members and Missouri State of late, and the hope is to convince the Bears to take an invite.

EKU is pushing hard for an invite, though they have some work to do.

If Karl Benson had a choice, Liberty would already be in the league.

Benson said it will be an eastern team.

EKU is way way way far away from FBS.

MSU is in play, of course, but convincing a basketball school to become a football school is tough.

So after that, who? Neither EKU or MSU are likely to move. No Southland schools will be invited....so who?

Liberty

There are at least four solid no votes on Liberty in the Sun Belt. Only takes three to block expansion. The Sun Belt will stay at 11 unless JMU or Missouri State choose to apply.

I can understand the four SBC teams feeling the way they do about Liberty. Almost the entire CUSA feels the same way about ASU

Don't give a damn. We aren't trying to get in CUSA.

(11-24-2013 11:44 PM)Rabonchild Wrote:  

(11-24-2013 02:43 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:52 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:47 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:44 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  I agree....except on EKU and MSU.

If it's not JMU, it WILL be Liberty.

Liberty appears to be out. Too much baggage. There has been a lot of communication between SBC West Members and Missouri State of late, and the hope is to convince the Bears to take an invite.

EKU is pushing hard for an invite, though they have some work to do.

If Karl Benson had a choice, Liberty would already be in the league.

Benson said it will be an eastern team.

EKU is way way way far away from FBS.

MSU is in play, of course, but convincing a basketball school to become a football school is tough.

So after that, who? Neither EKU or MSU are likely to move. No Southland schools will be invited....so who?

Liberty

There are at least four solid no votes on Liberty in the Sun Belt. Only takes three to block expansion. The Sun Belt will stay at 11 unless JMU or Missouri State choose to apply.

I can understand the four SBC teams feeling the way they do about Liberty. Almost the entire CUSA feels the same way about ASU

I hate to break it to you...but we don't have any interest in CUSA either.

(11-25-2013 02:11 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-24-2013 11:44 PM)Rabonchild Wrote:  

(11-24-2013 02:43 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:52 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:47 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  Liberty appears to be out. Too much baggage. There has been a lot of communication between SBC West Members and Missouri State of late, and the hope is to convince the Bears to take an invite.

EKU is pushing hard for an invite, though they have some work to do.

If Karl Benson had a choice, Liberty would already be in the league.

Benson said it will be an eastern team.

EKU is way way way far away from FBS.

MSU is in play, of course, but convincing a basketball school to become a football school is tough.

So after that, who? Neither EKU or MSU are likely to move. No Southland schools will be invited....so who?

Liberty

There are at least four solid no votes on Liberty in the Sun Belt. Only takes three to block expansion. The Sun Belt will stay at 11 unless JMU or Missouri State choose to apply.

I can understand the four SBC teams feeling the way they do about Liberty. Almost the entire CUSA feels the same way about ASU

I hate to break it to you...but we don't have any interest in CUSA either.

MAC???

Wherever JMU goes it will be under a different HC. JMU released their HC of 15yrs. Mickey Mathews who took JMU to a national championship and a huge win over VaTech, will not be finishing his contract out.

(11-23-2013 12:52 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:47 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:44 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  

(11-23-2013 12:40 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  JMU is posturing for CUSA or the MAC to make a move. They are not an ideal fit in the SBC. My guess is they have an SBC invite in hand should they want it, but the longer they sit, the more likely it is that Missouri State or Eastern Kentucky sneak into the picture.

I agree....except on EKU and MSU.

If it's not JMU, it WILL be Liberty.

Liberty appears to be out. Too much baggage. There has been a lot of communication between SBC West Members and Missouri State of late, and the hope is to convince the Bears to take an invite.

EKU is pushing hard for an invite, though they have some work to do.

If Karl Benson had a choice, Liberty would already be in the league.

Benson said it will be an eastern team.

EKU is way way way far away from FBS.

MSU is in play, of course, but convincing a basketball school to become a football school is tough.

So after that, who? Neither EKU or MSU are likely to move. No Southland schools will be invited....so who?

Liberty

Liberty is unlikely to get a SBC bid. Even if we need to sit on 11 teams. I say the Belt should publically offer the bid and say to JMU, you have 2 weeks. After that, we're done with you.

FootballScoop Staff ‏@footballscoop 3h
There will be huge interest in the James Madison job. Huge.

FootballScoop Staff ‏@footballscoop 3h
I tweeted a minute ago there would be huge interest in the JMU job…just got a text from a very well known FBS asst “I’d kill for JMU job"

FootballScoop Staff ‏@footballscoop 3h
JMU: Facilities, commitment, location, competition, ability to win big, etc. RT @irishjay: @footballscoop What makes that job so attractive?

David Hill ‏@CoachDavidHill 2h
@irishjay @footballscoop it's a good area to recruit as well. Any coach could go there and win.

David Hill ‏@CoachDavidHill 2h
@footballscoop @irishjay if you've ever been to JMU, you would understand. Special place.