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Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
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Stugray2 Online
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Post: #11
RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
None of you guys have a clue about the CSU system. If you knew what it was, you'd realize it is a miracle there are three FBS schools from their ranks.

These various Cal States are not comparable to the likes of Mississippi State, Kansas State, Oregon State, Colorado State, or even Utah State. They are not residential schools (Cal Poly the lone exception), they are by and large commuter schools, with a majority of community college transfers finishing their degrees. They are drive-by schools with all the school spirit of a community college - yes these places are dead. They don't have any Carnegie R1 or R2 ratings (SDSU an exception).

We sometimes say, in California we have the best tier-1 system (UC) in the nation, and a below average tier-3 system (CSU). The gap is massive and greater than any other state I can think of with two statewide systems.

On the west coast, probably more than anywhere else in the nation, to have strong support you need to draw from the alumni and the students. The students must attend in large number (school spirit) and it must be part of the culture, which gets carried over to their later life as alumni. Beyond Cal Poly and San Diego State that is largely missing in the CSU system, but is abundant in the UC system. This corresponds to high graduation rates and younger average student age. If you don't have that you struggle. The reason you go to a Cal State is because you did your first couple years of GE and you can;t get in (or dropped out of) a UC. So you go to the one nearest home and get the degree you need to go to work. Not surprising donation rates are lower, and the low research rankings result in many fewer corporate sponsors and alliances. I am exaggerating a bit for dramatic effect, but the numbers back up the basic description.

If UC Davis ever gets sound leadership (right now it has very weak leadership), it is the one school in the Sacramento (and frankly all of California) that could move up to FBS. The CSU schools are as far up the latter as they can go. None are moving up in the next quarter century.
05-14-2017 01:55 AM
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_C2_ Online
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Post: #12
RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
I highly doubt Fresno State has little school spirit. Look at the size of their basketball arena and football fan support.
05-14-2017 03:05 AM
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IWokeUpLikeThis Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
Hornets Nest is the 351st best D1 hoops arena.

But the 1st best name.
05-14-2017 03:06 AM
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DavidSt Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
(05-14-2017 01:55 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  None of you guys have a clue about the CSU system. If you knew what it was, you'd realize it is a miracle there are three FBS schools from their ranks.

These various Cal States are not comparable to the likes of Mississippi State, Kansas State, Oregon State, Colorado State, or even Utah State. They are not residential schools (Cal Poly the lone exception), they are by and large commuter schools, with a majority of community college transfers finishing their degrees. They are drive-by schools with all the school spirit of a community college - yes these places are dead. They don't have any Carnegie R1 or R2 ratings (SDSU an exception).

We sometimes say, in California we have the best tier-1 system (UC) in the nation, and a below average tier-3 system (CSU). The gap is massive and greater than any other state I can think of with two statewide systems.

On the west coast, probably more than anywhere else in the nation, to have strong support you need to draw from the alumni and the students. The students must attend in large number (school spirit) and it must be part of the culture, which gets carried over to their later life as alumni. Beyond Cal Poly and San Diego State that is largely missing in the CSU system, but is abundant in the UC system. This corresponds to high graduation rates and younger average student age. If you don't have that you struggle. The reason you go to a Cal State is because you did your first couple years of GE and you can;t get in (or dropped out of) a UC. So you go to the one nearest home and get the degree you need to go to work. Not surprising donation rates are lower, and the low research rankings result in many fewer corporate sponsors and alliances. I am exaggerating a bit for dramatic effect, but the numbers back up the basic description.

If UC Davis ever gets sound leadership (right now it has very weak leadership), it is the one school in the Sacramento (and frankly all of California) that could move up to FBS. The CSU schools are as far up the latter as they can go. None are moving up in the next quarter century.


Carnegie last year updated their classification which is now 3 tiers of the Research schools.
Now here is what is listed for none P5 schools.

CalTech R1
UC-Davis R1
UC-Riverside R1
UC-San Diego R1
UC-Santa Barbara R1
UC-Santa Cruz R1

Claremont R2
San Diego State R2
UC-Merced R2

Azusa Pacific R3
Biola R3
Fresno State R3
Fullerton State R3
Pepperdine R3
San Francisco State R3
U. Of San Diego R3
U. Of San Francisco R3
Pacific R3

California Baptist T4
Cal. Lutheran T4
Cal. Poly T4
Cal. Poly- Pomona T4
Cal. State- Bakersfield T4
Chico State T4
Cal. State-Dominguez Hills T4
East Bay State T4
Long Beach State T4
Los Angeles State T4
Northridge State T4
Sacramento State T4
San Bernardino State T4
Cal. State-Stanislaus T4
Concordia Irvine T4
Fresno Pacific T4
Golden Gate U. T4
Loyola Marymount T4
Mills College T4
Point Loma Nazarene T4
Saint Mary's T4
San Jose State T4
Santa Clara T4
Sonoma State T4

You were off on three of the Cal. State schools when they moved into R3. R3 is now Research at the lower levels.
05-14-2017 03:30 AM
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templefootballfan Offline
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Post: #15
RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
i always tought Sac St could be sleeping giant
859 for BB game, in Cal that outta be bus stop
05-14-2017 07:54 AM
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NoDak Online
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Post: #16
RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
When/if the Sacramento Republic get their new MLS stadium, the Hornets should look into FBS and playing there. It might be a race then between Sac St and UC Davis to establish themselves in FBS.
05-14-2017 08:11 AM
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NoDak Online
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RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
(05-14-2017 07:54 AM)templefootballfan Wrote:  i always tought Sac St could be sleeping giant
859 for BB game, in Cal that outta be bus stop

In their gym, thats about capacity. Maybe average 200 real people max.

The school has been talking forever about a new arena, but never gets it done.
(This post was last modified: 05-14-2017 08:14 AM by NoDak.)
05-14-2017 08:12 AM
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Sactowndog Offline
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Post: #18
RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
(05-13-2017 05:19 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I've always wondered why Sacramento St doesn't have FBS level support and an FBS level program. It's in a decent television market and it's only professional sports competition is the NBA. The Cal St system is much easier to get into than the UC system so you would think they would have a broader appeal to Northern California audiences. The stadium isn't a terrible size.why has there never been a push to join fellow Cal St programs San Jose St, Fresno St, and San Diego St in FBS.

anyone on the west coast have some insights? Is it all budget related?

Sacramento likes to think of its self as a major city on par with other major cities in the state. Major league is P5 or at least FBS. Neither Sac State or Davis as FCS get much pub. That fact is true for college sports in general. Lots of coverage on high school sports and pro sports on the TV and papers but little on college sports. It's as if college sports don't exist here.
05-14-2017 09:35 AM
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Sactowndog Offline
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Post: #19
RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
(05-13-2017 10:23 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  The better question is when will Sacramento St. drop football?
Overall, California is a basketball state, not a football state.

What? No California is a stronger football state than basketball state.
05-14-2017 09:40 AM
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Sactowndog Offline
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Post: #20
RE: Why doesn't Sacramento St enjoy FBS level support?
(05-14-2017 01:55 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  None of you guys have a clue about the CSU system. If you knew what it was, you'd realize it is a miracle there are three FBS schools from their ranks.

These various Cal States are not comparable to the likes of Mississippi State, Kansas State, Oregon State, Colorado State, or even Utah State. They are not residential schools (Cal Poly the lone exception), they are by and large commuter schools, with a majority of community college transfers finishing their degrees. They are drive-by schools with all the school spirit of a community college - yes these places are dead. They don't have any Carnegie R1 or R2 ratings (SDSU an exception).

We sometimes say, in California we have the best tier-1 system (UC) in the nation, and a below average tier-3 system (CSU). The gap is massive and greater than any other state I can think of with two statewide systems.

On the west coast, probably more than anywhere else in the nation, to have strong support you need to draw from the alumni and the students. The students must attend in large number (school spirit) and it must be part of the culture, which gets carried over to their later life as alumni. Beyond Cal Poly and San Diego State that is largely missing in the CSU system, but is abundant in the UC system. This corresponds to high graduation rates and younger average student age. If you don't have that you struggle. The reason you go to a Cal State is because you did your first couple years of GE and you can;t get in (or dropped out of) a UC. So you go to the one nearest home and get the degree you need to go to work. Not surprising donation rates are lower, and the low research rankings result in many fewer corporate sponsors and alliances. I am exaggerating a bit for dramatic effect, but the numbers back up the basic description.

If UC Davis ever gets sound leadership (right now it has very weak leadership), it is the one school in the Sacramento (and frankly all of California) that could move up to FBS. The CSU schools are as far up the latter as they can go. None are moving up in the next quarter century.

UC Davis has no chance. They have no stepping stone up at this point as the MWC schools (particularly Fresno) would never allow them to join the MWC. I think your comment also ignores Fresno which historically has relied much less on institutional funding than SJSU or SD State. Because Fresno is the only game in town and they are already FBS they enjoy a level of support not usually seen for Cal States. Particularly when the can beat and/or challenge the PAC-12 schools which was common in the Pat Hill era. Fresno will spend to get back there (witness the buy- out of DeRuyter and payment to Tedford.)
05-14-2017 09:52 AM
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