I'm on the "give them a vote" side.

(09-19-2016 06:21 PM)northcoastRocket Wrote:  FCS teams haveat least 8 wins over FBS teams this year. In addition to Iowa & Iowa St, Northwestern, Washington State and Virginia have all lost to FCS teams. Kent, Buffalo & Miami also. Add to that that highly ranked Tennessee had to go to OT to beat Appalachian St, top 10 ranked Georgia had to come from behind to beat Nichols State by 2, and Arizona trailed by more than 2 TDs in the 2nd half before coming back to win against ... umm, I forget who. Also, BG was very, very lucky to win by 1 over ND, and there have been a few other games that were much closer than might be expected.

So it isn't clear to me that FCS is a lower tier than FBS this season. Since NDSU is likely the best again in FCS, I might think that not only do they deserve to get votes, but they might be at least top 20 team this season.

App state has been FBS since 2014.

(09-20-2016 09:36 AM)adunifon Wrote:  

(09-19-2016 06:21 PM)northcoastRocket Wrote:  FCS teams haveat least 8 wins over FBS teams this year. In addition to Iowa & Iowa St, Northwestern, Washington State and Virginia have all lost to FCS teams. Kent, Buffalo & Miami also. Add to that that highly ranked Tennessee had to go to OT to beat Appalachian St, top 10 ranked Georgia had to come from behind to beat Nichols State by 2, and Arizona trailed by more than 2 TDs in the 2nd half before coming back to win against ... umm, I forget who. Also, BG was very, very lucky to win by 1 over ND, and there have been a few other games that were much closer than might be expected.

So it isn't clear to me that FCS is a lower tier than FBS this season. Since NDSU is likely the best again in FCS, I might think that not only do they deserve to get votes, but they might be at least top 20 team this season.

App state has been FBS since 2014.

Doh. Ah well, that's one more in the FBS column. BTW it was Grambling that lead Arizona up until the end of the 3rd quarter.

(09-19-2016 02:34 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  NDSU's Big FBS WINS:
2011 NDSU 37 MINNESOTA(3-9) 24
2012 NDSU 22 COLORADO STATE(3-9) 7
2013 NDSU 24 KANSAS STATE(8-5) 21
2014 NDSU 34 IOWA STATE(2-10) 14
2015 NONE
2016 NDSU 23 IOWA(2-0 WINS OVER MIAMI O AND IOWA STATE) 21

LOSSES(2011-PRESENT):
2011 YOUNGSTOWN STATE 24-27
2012 INDIANA STATE 14-17
2013 NO LOSSES
2014 NORTHERN IOWA 3-23
2015 MONTANA 35-38 SOUTH DAKOTA 21-24
2014 NO LOSSES, BUT A COUPLE OF HOME OT WINS OVER CHARLESTON SOUTHERN AND SOUTH DAKOTA.

NOT DESERVING OF FBS POLL VOTES.

So you list losses, but feel the need to list a couple of close wins? That should tell you everything you need to know about your outlook.

As another poster said, NDSU would beat 75% of the MAC. Sure, it's a hypo, but it's accurate. I think CMU/WMU/UT are the only teams capable of beating NDSU and I wouldn't be confident in any of those games.

They deserve votes. They have done more than CMU/WMU/UT if we want to be fair here. They beat the highest ranked team along with 2 FCS teams that would also beat plenty of MAC teams. Iowa went 12-2 last year and made it to the B10 CG, sure trash their schedule, that's fine. It's a new season and you can basically nitpick any team.

I find it odd how us MAC fans get annoyed when we are all grouped together as "MAC teams" but do the same to FCS.

(09-21-2016 12:28 PM)george14 Wrote:  

(09-19-2016 02:34 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  NDSU's Big FBS WINS:
2011 NDSU 37 MINNESOTA(3-9) 24
2012 NDSU 22 COLORADO STATE(3-9) 7
2013 NDSU 24 KANSAS STATE(8-5) 21
2014 NDSU 34 IOWA STATE(2-10) 14
2015 NONE
2016 NDSU 23 IOWA(2-0 WINS OVER MIAMI O AND IOWA STATE) 21

LOSSES(2011-PRESENT):
2011 YOUNGSTOWN STATE 24-27
2012 INDIANA STATE 14-17
2013 NO LOSSES
2014 NORTHERN IOWA 3-23
2015 MONTANA 35-38 SOUTH DAKOTA 21-24
2014 NO LOSSES, BUT A COUPLE OF HOME OT WINS OVER CHARLESTON SOUTHERN AND SOUTH DAKOTA.

NOT DESERVING OF FBS POLL VOTES.

So you list losses, but feel the need to list a couple of close wins? That should tell you everything you need to know about your outlook.

As another poster said, NDSU would beat 75% of the MAC. Sure, it's a hypo, but it's accurate. I think CMU/WMU/UT are the only teams capable of beating NDSU and I wouldn't be confident in any of those games.

They deserve votes. They have done more than CMU/WMU/UT if we want to be fair here. They beat the highest ranked team along with 2 FCS teams that would also beat plenty of MAC teams. Iowa went 12-2 last year and made it to the B10 CG, sure trash their schedule, that's fine. It's a new season and you can basically nitpick any team.

I find it odd how us MAC fans get annoyed when we are all grouped together as "MAC teams" but do the same to FCS.

I wouldnt care if it was FAU who beat Iowa. It's Iowa... A team, much like NW who is beatable because of their style and overranked because of their conference. I wasn't impressed with WMU's win over NW either and wouldnt vote for them because of that win soley. GoSo is the toughest team on their OOC slate and that will tell us more about the Broncos.

I am not grouping NDSU with FCS. Im grouping them with the amount of teams capable of beating Iowa. IMO it's 30+ teams. That win plus two "even good FCS teams" would not grant a top 25 Vote from me. If they run the table and Iowa gets a good win somewhere like Wisconsin or Michigan? boom, I'd throw NDSU in there.

To me Iowa isn't a top 25 team and neither is NDSU.

CMU is the only MAC team I would have in the top25 right now. I believe WMU and Toledo have the talent to be a top25 team, but I can't grant them that vote until they do something more to prove it. There are 37 unbeaten teams right now, and some teams with losses that deserve to be in the top25 still. FSU being one of them.

I think Western has the best resume to be in top 25 with wins over two Power 5 schools. Perhaps if Toledo beats BYU and both Western and Central are undefeated heading into October we may see two MAC schools in the top 25

(09-21-2016 12:28 PM)george14 Wrote:  

(09-19-2016 02:34 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  NDSU's Big FBS WINS:
2011 NDSU 37 MINNESOTA(3-9) 24
2012 NDSU 22 COLORADO STATE(3-9) 7
2013 NDSU 24 KANSAS STATE(8-5) 21
2014 NDSU 34 IOWA STATE(2-10) 14
2015 NONE
2016 NDSU 23 IOWA(2-0 WINS OVER MIAMI O AND IOWA STATE) 21

LOSSES(2011-PRESENT):
2011 YOUNGSTOWN STATE 24-27
2012 INDIANA STATE 14-17
2013 NO LOSSES
2014 NORTHERN IOWA 3-23
2015 MONTANA 35-38 SOUTH DAKOTA 21-24
2014 NO LOSSES, BUT A COUPLE OF HOME OT WINS OVER CHARLESTON SOUTHERN AND SOUTH DAKOTA.

NOT DESERVING OF FBS POLL VOTES.

So you list losses, but feel the need to list a couple of close wins? That should tell you everything you need to know about your outlook.

As another poster said, NDSU would beat 75% of the MAC. Sure, it's a hypo, but it's accurate. I think CMU/WMU/UT are the only teams capable of beating NDSU and I wouldn't be confident in any of those games.

They deserve votes. They have done more than CMU/WMU/UT if we want to be fair here. They beat the highest ranked team along with 2 FCS teams that would also beat plenty of MAC teams. Iowa went 12-2 last year and made it to the B10 CG, sure trash their schedule, that's fine. It's a new season and you can basically nitpick any team.

I find it odd how us MAC fans get annoyed when we are all grouped together as "MAC teams" but do the same to FCS.

Do you really think the EMU and Buffalo football programs () are on equal terms as Toledo??? That all three should be grouped together???

What will it take for Toledo to break the top 25???
Blowout win over stAte, blowout win over good FCS MAINE, blowout win over Fresno. BYE. Win over BYU, and blowout win over EMU... MAYBE!! Thats 5-0 after 6 weeks and Toledo still might not be ranked!

It could only take NDSU to have close win over FCS charleston southern, close win over good FCS Eastern Washington, close win over THEN #13Iowa, and close win over good FCS Illinois State this week. That's 4-0 after 4 weeks.
1. Their shedule IS NOT tougher than ours to this point.

(09-21-2016 02:42 PM)Rocket_Fanatic Wrote:  I think Western has the best resume to be in top 25 with wins over two Power 5 schools. Perhaps if Toledo beats BYU and both Western and Central are undefeated heading into October we may see two MAC schools in the top 25

i'd be more impressed by western if they beat navy and san diego st. P5 wins area important but as we know they better G5 teams are as good as the bottom half of P5 teams.

(09-21-2016 12:28 PM)george14 Wrote:  

(09-19-2016 02:34 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  NDSU's Big FBS WINS:
2011 NDSU 37 MINNESOTA(3-9) 24
2012 NDSU 22 COLORADO STATE(3-9) 7
2013 NDSU 24 KANSAS STATE(8-5) 21
2014 NDSU 34 IOWA STATE(2-10) 14
2015 NONE
2016 NDSU 23 IOWA(2-0 WINS OVER MIAMI O AND IOWA STATE) 21

LOSSES(2011-PRESENT):
2011 YOUNGSTOWN STATE 24-27
2012 INDIANA STATE 14-17
2013 NO LOSSES
2014 NORTHERN IOWA 3-23
2015 MONTANA 35-38 SOUTH DAKOTA 21-24
2014 NO LOSSES, BUT A COUPLE OF HOME OT WINS OVER CHARLESTON SOUTHERN AND SOUTH DAKOTA.

NOT DESERVING OF FBS POLL VOTES.

So you list losses, but feel the need to list a couple of close wins? That should tell you everything you need to know about your outlook.

As another poster said, NDSU would beat 75% of the MAC. Sure, it's a hypo, but it's accurate. I think CMU/WMU/UT are the only teams capable of beating NDSU and I wouldn't be confident in any of those games.

They deserve votes. They have done more than CMU/WMU/UT if we want to be fair here. They beat the highest ranked team along with 2 FCS teams that would also beat plenty of MAC teams. Iowa went 12-2 last year and made it to the B10 CG, sure trash their schedule, that's fine. It's a new season and you can basically nitpick any team.

I find it odd how us MAC fans get annoyed when we are all grouped together as "MAC teams" but do the same to FCS.

Close home wins over marginal opponents tells a lot about the strength of a team.

(09-21-2016 03:51 PM)Terry Wrote:  Do you really think the EMU and Buffalo football programs () are on equal terms as Toledo??? That all three should be grouped together???

Not sure if you are being sarcastic or completely misread my post.

(09-21-2016 05:03 PM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  What will it take for Toledo to break the top 25???
Blowout win over stAte, blowout win over good FCS MAINE, blowout win over Fresno. BYE. Win over BYU, and blowout win over EMU... MAYBE!! Thats 5-0 after 6 weeks and Toledo still might not be ranked!

It could only take NDSU to have close win over FCS charleston southern, close win over good FCS Eastern Washington, close win over THEN #13Iowa, and close win over good FCS Illinois State this week. That's 4-0 after 4 weeks.
1. Their shedule IS NOT tougher than ours to this point.

Going undefeated through the CMU game. A loss to BYU and/or CMU and I don't think they're ranked before the end of the season.

Rockets are 38 in the latest composite computer rankings, but honestly, I don't know why they are remotely that high. Three wins over an FCS team, 104th ranked FSU and 112th ranked stAte. Not exactly an impressive strength of schedule. In the individual computer polls, UT is ranked as high as 18 and as low as 63. Nice to see Rockets ahead of Notre Dame, who is currently at 56.

BYU currently at 48.

WMU is 29, CMU 62, UA 80 ... and the rest. 6 MAC teams below 100, and yet still for some unexplainable reason, the MAC conference ranks ahead of the Sun Belt and Conference USA.

http://www.masseyratings.com/cf/compare.htm

Rockets drop to 4 votes in the coaches poll, to put them at 44th.

WMU has 25 votes for 32nd.

There are 7 MAC coaches who vote in the coaches poll (Candle isn't one). They must not think much of UT yet.

To be fair, our resume is less impressive after this weekend. BYU will show us who we are.

Rockets with 1 vote in the AP poll for 41st.

WMU with 14, for 37th.

Another blow out win by the Rockets and they might not have any votes.

(09-25-2016 01:35 PM)Carolina Rocket Wrote:  To be fair, our resume is less impressive after this weekend. BYU will show us who we are.

Yep.

I think a handful of MAC teams could have gone 3-0 against the schedule we've played so far. The good news is all 3 wins have been in convincing fashion, with no real let downs.

(09-22-2016 07:51 AM)george14 Wrote:  

(09-21-2016 03:51 PM)Terry Wrote:  Do you really think the EMU and Buffalo football programs () are on equal terms as Toledo??? That all three should be grouped together???

Not sure if you are being sarcastic or completely misread my post.

perhaps I misread.....

(09-19-2016 05:13 PM)Rocket A Wrote:  

(09-19-2016 02:34 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  

(09-19-2016 12:31 PM)T-Town Wrote:  

(09-19-2016 12:03 PM)Rocket_Tree Wrote:  I don't get the AP poll, how can an FCS team receive 47 votes in the FBS rankings? I know they pulled an upset over #7 Iowa, but it is only week 4 rankings. How can they leap frog so many undefeated FBS teams to #27? Iowa to date has beaten two winless teams. They haven't done anything to prove that they deserved a #7 ranking in the week 3 polls.

It is probably the Bison's good luck that AP sports writers can vote for whomever the like and also the fact the Iowa, being in the BiG was seriously overrated. Besides one's recent history over the past several year also influences voting in current polls and NDSU has a very strong recent history---their win over Iowa was not an isolated event.

NDSU's Big FBS WINS:
2011 NDSU 37 MINNESOTA(3-9) 24
2012 NDSU 22 COLORADO STATE(3-9) 7
2013 NDSU 24 KANSAS STATE(8-5) 21
2014 NDSU 34 IOWA STATE(2-10) 14
2015 NONE
2016 NDSU 23 IOWA(2-0 WINS OVER MIAMI O AND IOWA STATE) 21

LOSSES(2011-PRESENT):
2011 YOUNGSTOWN STATE 24-27
2012 INDIANA STATE 14-17
2013 NO LOSSES
2014 NORTHERN IOWA 3-23
2015 MONTANA 35-38 SOUTH DAKOTA 21-24
2014 NO LOSSES, BUT A COUPLE OF HOME OT WINS OVER CHARLESTON SOUTHERN AND SOUTH DAKOTA.

NOT DESERVING OF FBS POLL VOTES.

I would throw them a vote. They are better than 75% of the MAC.

Agreed, NDSU has beaten Ball State as well at Muncie in the recent past. Having watch North Dakota football back in my days stationed with the AF, both ND and NDSU are quality football which on a given day could beat the Rockets. They are much better then New Hampshire, Maine, LibertyU, recent Rocket opponents.