You don't brandish a gun (toy or not) in public. This is where the child messes up

Where are his parents and why didn't they instruct the child not to play with this in public. ??


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(11-26-2014 06:07 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(11-26-2014 05:56 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  

(11-26-2014 05:52 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  This is the actual gun that Rice had



Now in seconds determine if that is a BB gun or a 1911 style pistol like this

These guns are too realistic. My son has two and I won't let him shoot them unless I'm there. I fear a situation similar to this one where a cop rolls up and my son freezes with gun in hand.

I don't know how this kid come to possess this gun, but shame on his parents if they bought it for him and didn't keep it stored so he couldn't get to if without their knowing.

I read elsewhere it was an airsoft gun and it comes from the factory with the bright orange tip, but it had been removed. Typically only two types of people remove the orange tip from these guns......the people who routinely play Rambo with the airsoft guns remove them for the camouflage factor when you are hiding in the bushes waiting to light up your pal's butt and the wannabe thug who hasn't access to a real pistol who doesn't want his mark to know the gun he is pointing in their face isn't real.

Airsoft does, CO2 does not come with orange tip. This looks more like the CO2

(11-26-2014 06:10 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  Airsoft does, CO2 does not come with orange tip. This looks more like the CO2

right, but that is because they are to be TREATED just like a regular gun... and if that is the case (that it was this co2 gun) unfortunately it was.

This is heartbreaking because I felt both the police and the child were wrong in this case. My issue w/ the police is that they arrived on the grass 3 feet from him when they could've rode up on the street itself. The 911 recording had the elderly woman telling the dispatcher that she wasn't able to tell if the gun was real or fake. Maybe if they arrived on the street they would've been able to walk up to the boy and had a better chance to distinguish if the gun was real/fake.

One thing I've learned, even at an early age, never reach/point a gun if you don't plan on shooting.

Such a tragedy.

(11-26-2014 06:08 PM)South Carolina Duke Wrote:  You don't brandish a gun (toy or not) in public. This is where the child messes up

Where are his parents and why didn't they instruct the child not to play with this in public. ??


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Always the victims fault.

There's some responsibility to be had.

MB was not a victim merely the deceased.

Trayvon same.


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(11-26-2014 06:10 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  

(11-26-2014 06:07 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(11-26-2014 05:56 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  

(11-26-2014 05:52 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  This is the actual gun that Rice had



Now in seconds determine if that is a BB gun or a 1911 style pistol like this

These guns are too realistic. My son has two and I won't let him shoot them unless I'm there. I fear a situation similar to this one where a cop rolls up and my son freezes with gun in hand.

I don't know how this kid come to possess this gun, but shame on his parents if they bought it for him and didn't keep it stored so he couldn't get to if without their knowing.

I read elsewhere it was an airsoft gun and it comes from the factory with the bright orange tip, but it had been removed. Typically only two types of people remove the orange tip from these guns......the people who routinely play Rambo with the airsoft guns remove them for the camouflage factor when you are hiding in the bushes waiting to light up your pal's butt and the wannabe thug who hasn't access to a real pistol who doesn't want his mark to know the gun he is pointing in their face isn't real.

Airsoft does, CO2 does not come with orange tip. This looks more like the CO2

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-30181338

Quote:Police said the orange safety indicator on the replica gun Tamir Rice was carrying, which resembled a semi-automatic pistol, had been removed.

The kid, as far as I can tell, was not breaking any laws by carrying a replica gun. I've read that he failed to raise his hands when demanded by the officers. In less than 2 seconds? That's not reasonable. The kid may have been a jerk and/or an idiot, but it seems like the primary cause of the shooting here was cops who pulled up so close that they were forced to "defend" themselves. They couldn't have approached more slowly or stopped at a distance that could have given them greater security?

How in the world did we become so political. Twenty years ago we would have had mass condemnation from both sides on trigger happy cops.

I'm not even sure about two seconds. The kid drops within a second. The cop had to be in car still you think. Such a horrible tragedy.

(11-26-2014 06:39 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  How in the world did we become so political. Twenty years ago we would have had mass condemnation from both sides on trigger happy cops.

I blamed the cops for pulling up 5 feet from him next to that gazebo when they should've pulled up on the street and approached him from 20 feet away.

Just saw it on the national news. ABC

(11-26-2014 06:39 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  The kid, as far as I can tell, was not breaking any laws by carrying a replica gun. I've read that he failed to raise his hands when demanded by the officers. In less than 2 seconds? That's not reasonable. The kid may have been a jerk and/or an idiot, but it seems like the primary cause of the shooting here was cops who pulled up so close that they were forced to "defend" themselves. They couldn't have approached more slowly or stopped at a distance that could have given them greater security?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-30181338

Quote:Tamir Rice was shot twice by police in Cleveland after he allegedly failed to obey an order to raise his hands.

The city's police chief said it was a "split second" decision and the gun was indistinguishable from a real firearm.

Quote:Deputy police chief Ed Tomba said one of the two officers involved shot the boy after he pulled the gun from the waistband of his trousers.

He did not make any verbal threats nor point the gun towards the officers, the police added.

Quote:Surveillance video of the shooting is "very clear" about what happened, Mr Tomba said, adding it would not be made public at this stage.

He said the officer who fired the shots was "distraught".

"Our officers at times are required to make critical decisions in a split second," Mr Williams told reporters. "Unfortunately this is one of those times."

As for the many law enforcement experts we have around here, Cleveland is hiring.

http://www.city.cleveland.oh.us/CityofCl...velandJobs

The way some of you act around here they could use someone of your expertise.

(11-26-2014 06:39 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  How in the world did we become so political. Twenty years ago we would have had mass condemnation from both sides on trigger happy cops.

20 years ago, we didn't fear 12 year olds would use real guns and toy guns looked like toy guns. A cop shooting a 12 year old WOULD have been trigger happy.

(11-26-2014 06:42 PM)ClairtonPanther Wrote:  I blamed the cops for pulling up 5 feet from him next to that gazebo when they should've pulled up on the street and approached him from 20 feet away.

Fair criticism. I wonder if he did that based on the 'toy' assumption, expecting that a layperson wouldn't know to look for the orange cap... and it wasn't until he saw the gun and didn't see the cap that suddenly he is surprised, thinking its real and making mistakes. If not; if he thought the gun might be real and pulled up that close anyway, then that might make him more culpable. I don't know what 'procedure' is for approaching someone with a gun, but it SEEMS that your description makes sense.

Even when we have concrete evidence of unreasonable police actions we still have defenders. Things have to change boys. I think the gun is in his waist. They wouldn't have seen the Orange cap anyways. They rolled up trigger happy.

He forgot his primary duty. Protect and Serve. We have too many people who are going in to this line of work forgetting that pledge.

(11-26-2014 06:51 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Even when we have concrete evidence of unreasonable police actions we still have defenders. Things have to change boys. I think the gun is in his waist. They wouldn't have seen the Orange cap anyways. They rolled up trigger happy.

Like what?


Again, Cleveland is hiring police officers. Since you are an expert on law enforcement procedures and tactics go give them a hand.
http://www.city.cleveland.oh.us/CityofCl...velandJobs

(11-26-2014 06:51 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Even when we have concrete evidence of unreasonable police actions we still have defenders. Things have to change boys. I think the gun is in his waist. They wouldn't have seen the Orange cap anyways. They rolled up trigger happy.

Wow... Unless they show other angles later in the video, you have FAR FAR FAR better eyes than I.

If what you say is true, I don't think there would be defenders. The reason for the 'defense' is merely because we weren't there and don't really know. You assume one thing, but that doesn't mean that everyone assumes the same thing.

The BIGGEST thing I assume is that having a gun of ANY kind around police is a danger... Maybe the kid just panicked and was going to throw the gun on the ground...

Yeah, I'd say that cops responding to a 911 report of someone brandishing a gun at people ARE going to show up ready to deal with someone with a gun.

Tragic, absolutely. Proof of some sort of 'trigger happy' cops? How would you show up to that scene? How do you think they are trained to show up to such a report?

I'm a Reagan/Goldwater Republican, and I'm VERY pro-business. But I wish the manufacturers wouldn't make toy guns, BB guns, and pellet guns look so much like large caliber guns. And if the orange tip can be easily taken off, what good is it?

We have lost our way.