Just get it over with....


WEST

UTEP
UTSA
Rice
North Texas
Arkansas State
Louisiana Tech
Louisiana
Southern Miss


EAST

UAB
Middle Tennessee
Western Kentucky
Marshall
Old Dominion
Charlotte
Florida Atlantic
FIU

(01-16-2013 01:20 PM)CAJUNNATION Wrote:  Just get it over with....


WEST

UTEP
UTSA
Rice
North Texas
Arkansas State
Louisiana Tech
Louisiana
Southern Miss


EAST

UAB
Middle Tennessee
Western Kentucky
Marshall
Old Dominion
Charlotte
Florida Atlantic
FIU

Would not be at all surprised to see that, or something very close to it, happen. If that exact conference did happen that would leave the Sun Belt with:

Troy, ULM, S. Alabama, Georgia St and Texas St for FB. They would need 3 more to remain an FBS conference. NMSU, Georgia Southern and App St? Maybe Idaho for football only as insurance.

For the C-USA folks, I have a question that I haven't seen brought up here much. If you look at how colleges are defined (e.g. national, regional, etc.), every single C-USA member except Marshall is classified as a "national university."

Every single new addition is classified as a "national university."

A good number of what's left if there was any desire to add any other schools are "regional" universities. Does this matter to you? And does this matter to your school? Tulsa excluded because we already know how their adminstration feels about this from an academic perspective. Here's a quick run down of the remaing Belt schools and a few others I've seen mentioned including their classification...

Regional
Troy
Western Kentucky
UL Monroe
Ark. State

National
South Alabama
UL Lafayette

Others
**All MAC schools are national except Eastern Michigan
**UMass and Delaware are national
**James Madison (Regional)
**Georgia State (National)
**NMSU (National)
**Texas State (Regional)

What if the BEAST and MWC go beyond 12? There would be just about enough teams left to make one 16 team conference.

Markets seem to matter more than anything else to CUSA.

(01-16-2013 01:36 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  For the C-USA folks, I have a question that I haven't seen brought up here much. If you look at how colleges are defined (e.g. national, regional, etc.), every single C-USA member except Marshall is classified as a "national university."

Every single new addition is classified as a "national university."

A good number of what's left if there was any desire to add any other schools are "regional" universities. Does this matter to you? And does this matter to your school? Tulsa excluded because we already know how their adminstration feels about this from an academic perspective. Here's a quick run down of the remaing Belt schools and a few others I've seen mentioned including their classification...

Regional
Troy
Western Kentucky
UL Monroe
Ark. State

National
South Alabama
UL Lafayette

Others
**All MAC schools are national except Eastern Michigan
**UMass and Delaware are national
**James Madison (Regional)
**Georgia State (National)
**NMSU (National)
**Texas State (Regional)

it doesn't matter that much to me. I just want any new member to have a good sports set up, and respectable academic standards, or be in the process of upgrading themselves in those areas. I personally favor adding Louisiana Lafayette, but that is just me.

(01-16-2013 01:36 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  For the C-USA folks, I have a question that I haven't seen brought up here much. If you look at how colleges are defined (e.g. national, regional, etc.), every single C-USA member except Marshall is classified as a "national university."

Every single new addition is classified as a "national university."

A good number of what's left if there was any desire to add any other schools are "regional" universities. Does this matter to you? And does this matter to your school? Tulsa excluded because we already know how their adminstration feels about this from an academic perspective. Here's a quick run down of the remaing Belt schools and a few others I've seen mentioned including their classification...

Regional
Troy
Western Kentucky
UL Monroe
Ark. State

National
South Alabama
UL Lafayette

Others
**All MAC schools are national except Eastern Michigan
**UMass and Delaware are national
**James Madison (Regional)
**Georgia State (National)
**NMSU (National)
**Texas State (Regional)

Where are you getting these classifications from? I did a quick google search and didn't see anything. If it is just a matter of opinion, then I'd say it is subjective. There are several C-USA schools that I would say are just as "regional" as WKU.

I know the admin at WKU doesn't see us as regional. Our tagline for the past several years has been "A Leading American University with International Reach".

Sans a few execptions its basically the difference between universities with professional schools, Ph.d, etc. vs those without.

I don't really see it being an issue, because some regional schools are better academically than the national universities. I just know there are some school adminstrations that are hung up on this. Here's the overview...

National Universities: There are 280 national universities in the country (172 public, 101 private, and 7 are for-profits), based on categories developed by the Carnegie Foundation for the Advancement of Teaching. The universities offer a full range of undergraduate majors, as well as master's and doctoral degrees; many strongly emphasize research, defined by the Carnegie Foundation as Research Universities (very high research activity), Research Universities (high research activity), and Doctoral/Research Universities.

National Liberal Arts Colleges: The 251 national liberal arts colleges emphasize undergraduate education and award at least 50 percent of their degrees in the liberal arts (defined by the Carnegie Foundation as baccalaureate colleges-arts and sciences).

Regional Universities: Like the national universities, regional universities (as defined by the Carnegie Foundation as universities-master's larger, medium and smaller programs) provide a full range of undergraduate programs and some master's level programs. They offer few, if any, doctoral programs. The 626 total regional universities are ranked within four geographic areas: North, South, Midwest, and West.

Regional Colleges: These institutions (defined by the Carnegie Foundation as Baccalaureate Colleges-Diverse; Baccalaureate/Associate Colleges; Associate's—Public 4-year, Primarily Associate's; Associate's-Private Not-for-profit 4-year, Primarily Associate's; and Associate's—Private For-profit 4-year, Primarily Associate's) focus primarily on undergraduate education, just as the liberal arts colleges do, but grant fewer than 50 percent of their degrees in liberal arts disciplines. At these schools, at least 10 percent of undergraduate degrees awarded are bachelor's degrees. There are a total of 370 regional colleges, ranked within four regions: North, South, Midwest, and West.

Specialty Schools: Looking for a school that specializes in textile arts or instrumental music? Colleges and universities that offer most or all of their degrees in fine arts, performing arts, business, and engineering are listed in this category. None of these schools are ranked, but pertinent data for each school are provided. There are a total of 81 specialty colleges.

If there is any benefit to going to 16, I'm all ears. Doubt I'll hear anything that makes sense. Sure, WKU/stAte/Cajuns along with USA are the best schools left in the Sun Belt IMO, but I don't see a reason to add them unless it's replacing a current member.

Although it isn't out of the realm of possibility, the more times you say it on a message board doesn't make it any more likely that it will happen.

Louisiana is a state not a university, and this would be a nightmare for Tech fans who want nothing to do with ULL or ULM.

(01-16-2013 01:36 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  For the C-USA folks, I have a question that I haven't seen brought up here much. If you look at how colleges are defined (e.g. national, regional, etc.), every single C-USA member except Marshall is classified as a "national university."

Every single new addition is classified as a "national university."

A good number of what's left if there was any desire to add any other schools are "regional" universities. Does this matter to you? And does this matter to your school? Tulsa excluded because we already know how their adminstration feels about this from an academic perspective. Here's a quick run down of the remaing Belt schools and a few others I've seen mentioned including their classification...

Regional
Troy
Western Kentucky
UL Monroe
Ark. State

National
South Alabama
UL Lafayette

Others
**All MAC schools are national except Eastern Michigan
**UMass and Delaware are national
**James Madison (Regional)
**Georgia State (National)
**NMSU (National)
**Texas State (Regional)

If the National University trend is maintained, I think the bold plus Ohio University would be the most likely candidates for expansion.

(01-16-2013 02:20 PM)pilot172000 Wrote:  Louisiana is a state not a university, and this would be a nightmare for Tech fans who want nothing to do with ULL or ULM.

Thank you for your interest in Louisiana Ragin Cajun athletics, and, yes, we all know how the thought of playing ULM in a bowl had y'all running for the tall grass, screaming like little girls.

Carry on.

(01-16-2013 02:17 PM)MTowho Wrote:  If there is any benefit to going to 16, I'm all ears. Doubt I'll hear anything that makes sense. Sure, WKU/stAte/Cajuns along with USA are the best schools left in the Sun Belt IMO, but I don't see a reason to add them unless it's replacing a current member.

Although it isn't out of the realm of possibility, the more times you say it on a message board doesn't make it any more likely that it will happen.

The best reason I can figure is that you simultaneously gut a competitor (Sun Belt) and create two really strong divisions in your own conference. Your CCG winner is going to have a leg up in the computers going into the postseason. If all you have to do is be the best of the rest to get a spot, then you want to do everything you can to make sure your conference has the best chance it can get at filling that spot.

(01-16-2013 02:20 PM)pilot172000 Wrote:  Louisiana is a state not a university, and this would be a nightmare for Tech fans who want nothing to do with ULL or ULM.

Dont.

Or I swear by God and Sonny Jesus I will lock every thread that goes down this path and warn those who keep it up. Keep the name issues out of here.

Well if ULL fans would stop trolling it would no longer be pointed out. I agree. It's insulting.

That said, I doubt LaTech would have the power to stop it (ULL admission). Tulane fought against LaTech and lost and LaTech wields less conf. power than TU did. It's $ now.

(01-16-2013 02:20 PM)pilot172000 Wrote:  Louisiana is a state not a university, and this would be a nightmare for Tech fans who want nothing to do with ULL or ULM.

well not to get bogged down in the name thing since I too long suffered through the Southern College slurs after USM became a university, then the tv announcers confusing us with Old Mess or Miss. State, I would prefer to not go into that stuff. I hated it when Old Mess said they were dropping USM from their schedule to upgrade it and scheduled games like Tenn.-Chat. and such.

I would say I could understand not wanting to have to share a conference with a school that you already have to combat in recruiting and fan support. However, I am not too impressed with the attitude of looking down on the other since USM has long been in that position with Old Mess and Miss. State even when we had shown we could not only play with them, but beat them. I am excited about playing La. Tech and respect the long history we have with Tech, but we also have a long history with La. Lafayette and respect for that program that is making improvements just as Tech.

(01-16-2013 02:53 PM)SgtGoldenEagle Wrote:  

(01-16-2013 02:20 PM)pilot172000 Wrote:  Louisiana is a state not a university, and this would be a nightmare for Tech fans who want nothing to do with ULL or ULM.

well not to get bogged down in the name thing since I too long suffered through the Southern College slurs after USM became a university, then the tv announcers confusing us with Old Mess or Miss. State, I would prefer to not go into that stuff. I hated it when Old Mess said they were dropping USM from their schedule to upgrade it and scheduled games like Tenn.-Chat. and such.

I would say I could understand not wanting to have to share a conference with a school that you already have to combat in recruiting and fan support. However, I am not too impressed with the attitude of looking down on the other since USM has long been in that position with Old Mess and Miss. State even when we had shown we could not only play with them, but beat them. I am excited about playing La. Tech and respect the long history we have with Tech, but we also have a long history with La. Lafayette and respect for that program that is making improvements just as Tech.

I've heard talk of the Cajuns expanding their stadium to 50k. And you have to flat out applaud the huge number of fans they brought to the New Orleans Bowl last month, even if it was just down the road. They just seem to be moving in the right direction right now.

To my knowledge, only two Sun Belt schools will admit a student unconditionally if they were to apply meeting the minimum standards for NCAA initial eligibility. ULM and Troy.

Which begs another question. If far and away the majority of FBS schools wouldn't admit a non-athlete who only meets the NCAA initial eligibility standard, isn't it time to raise the NCAA standard?

(01-16-2013 02:13 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  Sans a few execptions its basically the difference between universities with professional schools, Ph.d, etc. vs those without.

I don't really see it being an issue, because some regional schools are better academically than the national universities. I just know there are some school adminstrations that are hung up on this. Here's the overview...

National Universities: There are 280 national universities in the country (172 public, 101 private, and 7 are for-profits), based on categories developed by the Carnegie Foundation for the Advancement of Teaching. The universities offer a full range of undergraduate majors, as well as master's and doctoral degrees; many strongly emphasize research, defined by the Carnegie Foundation as Research Universities (very high research activity), Research Universities (high research activity), and Doctoral/Research Universities.

National Liberal Arts Colleges: The 251 national liberal arts colleges emphasize undergraduate education and award at least 50 percent of their degrees in the liberal arts (defined by the Carnegie Foundation as baccalaureate colleges-arts and sciences).

Regional Universities: Like the national universities, regional universities (as defined by the Carnegie Foundation as universities-master's larger, medium and smaller programs) provide a full range of undergraduate programs and some master's level programs. They offer few, if any, doctoral programs. The 626 total regional universities are ranked within four geographic areas: North, South, Midwest, and West.

Regional Colleges: These institutions (defined by the Carnegie Foundation as Baccalaureate Colleges-Diverse; Baccalaureate/Associate Colleges; Associate's—Public 4-year, Primarily Associate's; Associate's-Private Not-for-profit 4-year, Primarily Associate's; and Associate's—Private For-profit 4-year, Primarily Associate's) focus primarily on undergraduate education, just as the liberal arts colleges do, but grant fewer than 50 percent of their degrees in liberal arts disciplines. At these schools, at least 10 percent of undergraduate degrees awarded are bachelor's degrees. There are a total of 370 regional colleges, ranked within four regions: North, South, Midwest, and West.

Specialty Schools: Looking for a school that specializes in textile arts or instrumental music? Colleges and universities that offer most or all of their degrees in fine arts, performing arts, business, and engineering are listed in this category. None of these schools are ranked, but pertinent data for each school are provided. There are a total of 81 specialty colleges.

In boils down to the number of PhDs that you pump out.
Texas State is a Regional(West) has higher enrollment figures, admission standards, larger endowment, retention, and graduation rates yet are viewed as less than several "National" schools in Texas because we were late in the PhD game. Schools like Sam Houston State and Texas A&M-Commerce are smaller commuter colleges in East Texas but they push out 30 Education Administration PhDs a year so naturally USNWR ranks them higher than us.

However, we are listed as an Emerging Research University by the Texas Higher Education Coordinating Board (Peers with North Texas, TxTech, UTSA, UT-Arlington, Houston)

(01-16-2013 03:33 PM)chrisattsu Wrote:  

(01-16-2013 02:13 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  Sans a few execptions its basically the difference between universities with professional schools, Ph.d, etc. vs those without.

I don't really see it being an issue, because some regional schools are better academically than the national universities. I just know there are some school adminstrations that are hung up on this. Here's the overview...

National Universities: There are 280 national universities in the country (172 public, 101 private, and 7 are for-profits), based on categories developed by the Carnegie Foundation for the Advancement of Teaching. The universities offer a full range of undergraduate majors, as well as master's and doctoral degrees; many strongly emphasize research, defined by the Carnegie Foundation as Research Universities (very high research activity), Research Universities (high research activity), and Doctoral/Research Universities.

National Liberal Arts Colleges: The 251 national liberal arts colleges emphasize undergraduate education and award at least 50 percent of their degrees in the liberal arts (defined by the Carnegie Foundation as baccalaureate colleges-arts and sciences).

Regional Universities: Like the national universities, regional universities (as defined by the Carnegie Foundation as universities-master's larger, medium and smaller programs) provide a full range of undergraduate programs and some master's level programs. They offer few, if any, doctoral programs. The 626 total regional universities are ranked within four geographic areas: North, South, Midwest, and West.

Regional Colleges: These institutions (defined by the Carnegie Foundation as Baccalaureate Colleges-Diverse; Baccalaureate/Associate Colleges; Associate's—Public 4-year, Primarily Associate's; Associate's-Private Not-for-profit 4-year, Primarily Associate's; and Associate's—Private For-profit 4-year, Primarily Associate's) focus primarily on undergraduate education, just as the liberal arts colleges do, but grant fewer than 50 percent of their degrees in liberal arts disciplines. At these schools, at least 10 percent of undergraduate degrees awarded are bachelor's degrees. There are a total of 370 regional colleges, ranked within four regions: North, South, Midwest, and West.

Specialty Schools: Looking for a school that specializes in textile arts or instrumental music? Colleges and universities that offer most or all of their degrees in fine arts, performing arts, business, and engineering are listed in this category. None of these schools are ranked, but pertinent data for each school are provided. There are a total of 81 specialty colleges.

In boils down to the number of PhDs that you pump out.
Texas State is a Regional(West) has higher enrollment figures, admission standards, larger endowment, retention, and graduation rates yet are viewed as less than several "National" schools in Texas because we were late in the PhD game. Schools like Sam Houston State and Texas A&M-Commerce are smaller commuter colleges in East Texas but they push out 30 Education Administration PhDs a year so naturally USNWR ranks them higher than us.

However, we are listed as an Emerging Research University by the Texas Higher Education Coordinating Board (Peers with North Texas, TxTech, UTSA, UT-Arlington, Houston)

There's also a significant research component too, and that is what's keeping Marshall from being classified as National.

I'd love to see Louisiana-Lafayette in CUSA West. Their a perfect geographic fit, they have a good football program, competivive basketball and their fans travel. Why does Louisiana Tech have a problem with them? Arkansas State would be a good additon also.

I like the idea of going to 16 members. Lets just get it over with. While we're at it, lets push Tulane, ECU and Tulsa out for 2013.