(01-02-2023 01:40 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-01-2023 06:25 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  For some, using a secret ballot is just a tad better than throwing a riot to keep power, mind you.

And if you want to bring up the 'Trump wuz cheeted' line --- my response is some objective proof as opposed to simple screaming might garner more support from some.

There is tons of proof. There have been a number of people arrested. You people just ignore it.

Not 'ignored'. There isnt nearly enough to say 'the election was flipped'. Since there have been a "number of people arrested" for perpetrating a Biden vote fraud, care to tell us how many? Or is that just you waving your hands furiously over a general statement, a statement that is sloughed off of being "ignore[d]' by "[y]ou people".

Please be specific in how much has been 'ignored' by 'us people'.

(01-02-2023 04:25 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 03:17 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 01:51 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 01:38 PM)WKUApollo Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 01:31 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  Misery turns the electorate pretty darn fast. That said, I also believe the Republicans will lose if they dont sink significant money and effort into using the next two years to build a ballot harvesting machine that rivals the Democrats. The midterms show Republicans are already very close to winning in all the swing states as it currently stands---if the GOP can just build a ballot harvesting effort that nets HALF of what the Democrats are getting from theirs---its all over for the Democrats.

The challenge Republicans have with your scenario is that most of the Dem harvesting occurs in densely populated urban areas. It's much easier to hit high rise apartment complex after high rise apartment complex. The Republicans are in the suburbs and rural areas in larger numbers and it takes far more effort and resources to reach the same level the dems have achieved.

I dont think it is because what harvesting is really about is getting votes from a demographic that basically doesnt give a crap about politics and normally wouldnt vote at all. Its the 40-50% of the nation that is completely checked out of politics and its literally just like an untapped pool of proxy votes. If you make the voting process super simple with "no effort required" and give these super low information potential voters just enough information to support your guy---you can easily get their vote. BUT---you have to go to them and you have to do ALL the work---because they dont care and they arent going to go one inch out of their way to vote. Thats what ballot harvesting REALLY is. You dont necessarily need Republican voters---you just need voters who dont care----and there are many more of those than you might think.

And I dont see the huge difference between your explanation above and normal GOTV efforts. The difference is that one is far more highly effective than the other.

Do you support curtailing the normal status of GOTV efforts, which have the same goal, and same target as those you depict above?

Cut out community shuttles to vote?

I would suggest doing whatever the Democrats are doing. I would suggest ending the reliance on using a one day turnout model to counter a 60 day ballot harvesting effort by the Democrats. I would suggest doing anything legal that closes the gap between the GOP ballot harvesting ground game and the Democrat ballot harvesting ground game. I would suggest embracing the new election rules rather than just griping about them. Its like refusing to use the forward pass because you dont like the rule.

Agreed. Republicans should go all in on this.

And, for the record, I am in favor of disallowing harvesting in general. And of drop off voting with no control at the drop off point (i.e. bare boxes).

I would have zero issue in legislatures reversing some of the more egregious and lessened security modes of voting that have come into vogue.

Honestly, I love the way Texas approaches it. Early voting galore in person. Almost no drop off (may in fact be zero). Very limited mail voting, very limited group of people who can mail in a ballot for another.

(01-02-2023 04:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 04:25 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 03:17 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 01:51 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 01:38 PM)WKUApollo Wrote:  The challenge Republicans have with your scenario is that most of the Dem harvesting occurs in densely populated urban areas. It's much easier to hit high rise apartment complex after high rise apartment complex. The Republicans are in the suburbs and rural areas in larger numbers and it takes far more effort and resources to reach the same level the dems have achieved.

I dont think it is because what harvesting is really about is getting votes from a demographic that basically doesnt give a crap about politics and normally wouldnt vote at all. Its the 40-50% of the nation that is completely checked out of politics and its literally just like an untapped pool of proxy votes. If you make the voting process super simple with "no effort required" and give these super low information potential voters just enough information to support your guy---you can easily get their vote. BUT---you have to go to them and you have to do ALL the work---because they dont care and they arent going to go one inch out of their way to vote. Thats what ballot harvesting REALLY is. You dont necessarily need Republican voters---you just need voters who dont care----and there are many more of those than you might think.

And I dont see the huge difference between your explanation above and normal GOTV efforts. The difference is that one is far more highly effective than the other.

Do you support curtailing the normal status of GOTV efforts, which have the same goal, and same target as those you depict above?

Cut out community shuttles to vote?

I would suggest doing whatever the Democrats are doing. I would suggest ending the reliance on using a one day turnout model to counter a 60 day ballot harvesting effort by the Democrats. I would suggest doing anything legal that closes the gap between the GOP ballot harvesting ground game and the Democrat ballot harvesting ground game. I would suggest embracing the new election rules rather than just griping about them. Its like refusing to use the forward pass because you dont like the rule.

Agreed. Republicans should go all in on this.

And, for the record, I am in favor of disallowing harvesting in general. And of drop off voting with no control at the drop off point (i.e. bare boxes).

I would have zero issue in legislatures reversing some of the more egregious and lessened security modes of voting that have come into vogue.

Honestly, I love the way Texas approaches it. Early voting galore in person. Almost no drop off (may in fact be zero). Very limited mail voting, very limited group of people who can mail in a ballot for another.

Couldnt agree more.

(01-02-2023 05:00 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 04:49 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 04:25 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 03:17 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(01-02-2023 01:51 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  I dont think it is because what harvesting is really about is getting votes from a demographic that basically doesnt give a crap about politics and normally wouldnt vote at all. Its the 40-50% of the nation that is completely checked out of politics and its literally just like an untapped pool of proxy votes. If you make the voting process super simple with "no effort required" and give these super low information potential voters just enough information to support your guy---you can easily get their vote. BUT---you have to go to them and you have to do ALL the work---because they dont care and they arent going to go one inch out of their way to vote. Thats what ballot harvesting REALLY is. You dont necessarily need Republican voters---you just need voters who dont care----and there are many more of those than you might think.

And I dont see the huge difference between your explanation above and normal GOTV efforts. The difference is that one is far more highly effective than the other.

Do you support curtailing the normal status of GOTV efforts, which have the same goal, and same target as those you depict above?

Cut out community shuttles to vote?

I would suggest doing whatever the Democrats are doing. I would suggest ending the reliance on using a one day turnout model to counter a 60 day ballot harvesting effort by the Democrats. I would suggest doing anything legal that closes the gap between the GOP ballot harvesting ground game and the Democrat ballot harvesting ground game. I would suggest embracing the new election rules rather than just griping about them. Its like refusing to use the forward pass because you dont like the rule.

Agreed. Republicans should go all in on this.

And, for the record, I am in favor of disallowing harvesting in general. And of drop off voting with no control at the drop off point (i.e. bare boxes).

I would have zero issue in legislatures reversing some of the more egregious and lessened security modes of voting that have come into vogue.

Honestly, I love the way Texas approaches it. Early voting galore in person. Almost no drop off (may in fact be zero). Very limited mail voting, very limited group of people who can mail in a ballot for another.

Couldnt agree more.

it's so simple ... 'cept that darn 10A gets in the way in too many blue states...

hence, the conundrum...

(01-01-2023 07:31 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(01-01-2023 07:18 PM)450bench Wrote:  You libs can’t help yourselves, can you?

The obsession with Trump is beyond creepy, it’s unhealthy.

Funny, not a lib. Kneejerk comment, one size fits all issues there?

I also surmise that apparently you did not notice that the topic *is* Trump, mind you. Lolz.

Are you stable, Ace? Seriously…you ok? Of course I know the thread is about Trump. Hence my comment. Seriously, you good?

Mass early voting is a terrible idea, once your ballot is cast some something big comes out about a candidate your ballot is already cast.

We never needed any of this mail in and mass early voting before but suddenly overnight we have to have it? BS

People will make excuses for it, you can make excuses for ANYTHING if you want to bad enough. Any issue can be spun hard enough to make an argument.

I understand the logic of republicans needing to play by the new rules on mass mail in and harvesting, but at the same time it just means our votes are watered down to being almost meaningless and our democracy is just a joke. Its not going to work anyway imo.

Old geezer Biden has already won in 2024. We are all screwed.