(12-27-2022 04:55 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  How would the ACC react if ESPN and the SEC approached them with this deal:

SEC gets Florida St, Clemson, UNC, and UVA in 2024/25
ESPN continues to pay the other 10+1 the same rates for their rights for the remainder of the contract despite the absence of these 4 big brands.
ACC gets exit fees from the 4 departing members but agrees to waive their GOR claim.
The SEC agrees to set number of OOC games with the ACC per year.

The ACC technically doesn’t lose out—they lose some top brands that they are probably going to lose anyway but they don’t have to take a financial haircut and the 10 schools remaining get an easier route to the CFP.

Maybe they even throw in a pro rata clause for 2-4 additions (USF/UConn, UCF, Cincinnati, WVU).

The ACC schools would want more money for their votes.

If you hold the cards (and the GoR is a strong hand to hold), you use that in negotiation.

That said, if espn were to get these schools to join the SEC, I could imagine espn inviting in fox or someone else to be a revenue partner for the ACC.

FSU and Clemson leaving would be the easiest to get votes, I think.

Though I wonder if the rest of the conference would miss NC being in a "power position" in the conference.

And with NC gone, the eastern B12 replacements would be more likely to get accepted.

For the 4th, your choice of Va, VT, Duke, NC state, Miami, or even Kansas.

And I think that UCF might stay with the B12, so they add USF as a travel partner.

To SEC: FSU, Clemson, NC, and 1 other.

To ACC UConn, Cin, WV, Memphis

(12-27-2022 02:06 PM)JRsec Wrote:  The board has a short memory. When the news broke about Texas and Oklahoma in July of 2021 I told you guys that the SEC offices were visited within 3 days by "unofficial" but recognizable ambassadors of North Carolina and Clemson and that these people spoke "allegedly" for other interested parties.

By Fall of 2021 Finebaum had the rumor out that the SEC was looking at Virginia, UNC, Clemson and FSU. Actually, this was merely Finebaum's response to an article released by one of the beat writers (can't remember which one right now but the article is likely still on the WEB) which also included Miami.

What I heard was that it was North Carolina, Clemson, with Clemson speaking for Florida State where the President denied reaching out, and that North Carolina was looking at who they might bring. The assumption was that it could be Duke, or N.C. State, or Virginia.

Four schools were mentioned, but a different 4th by several different commentors. I do know that in 2011 it was Duke which UNC inquired about coming with them to the SEC should the ACC suffer more defections following Maryland.

My personal opinion is that it would be Duke, like before, but the dynamics of the NC System might well have other ideas.

So, I do not find Fluguar's assertion to be erroneous, nor do I find it to be original. These things have been out for a year and half, it's just that so many refuse to believe anything that doesn't fit their own script, or hopes, or which hasn't been endorsed by a talking head.

To think no talks have happened between the top ACC schools and the SEC / Big 10 offices is simply naive. Of course, they have spoken! How serious they are and how far down the road they've gone are the more pertinent questions. In some cases, these discussions are 11 years old.

Will the SEC expand again and out of the ACC? Quite possibly. But only if there are schools in the ACC which absolutely will leave. In that case the SEC will be open to inquiries simply as a matter of defense if not for more palpable reasons.

We'll see. But I would not be shocked (given the money at stake) if something were to happen. I can see a foursome in which UNC and FSU are the gestalt additions and concede that #3 and #4 could be any two of Duke, N.C. State, Virginia, Clemson, Miami or Kansas.

Add VT to that list, and I agree.

Remarks by Seminoles AD Michael Alford a month ago have some relevance here, I think.

https://www.tomahawknation.com/florida-s...sec-big-10

(12-27-2022 05:08 PM)CardinalJim Wrote:  ESPN is not going to allow The Big Ten into the Southeast. If FSU goes anywhere early it will be to The SEC. The truth is ESPN could put all of this nonsense to bed by encouraging a merger of The SEC and The ACC.

They’ve already started combining some elements of both with The ACC / Big Ten challenge ending and becoming The ACC / SEC challenge.

Agree to an extent. As I have said before, I can see Florida State in the SEC. It is their dream conference after all, so if they finally did get that coveted invite would they turn it down out of spite?? I think not, especially after FSU's ACC experience.

UNC I have already discussed multiple times. Basically, I agree with JRsec on UNC.

Virginia is the interesting one though, and I can see them going to the B1G or the SEC. I do believe that would be the furthest south that the B1G would go.

(12-27-2022 02:30 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  It just seems unlikely for even 8 teams to break it----and certainly very difficult for just a couple of teams to get out of it. Texas and Oklahoma are basically having to move heaven and earth just to get out one year early (and while likely---even that one year early exit is not certain at this point). My understanding is the Big12 GOR structure was largely based the ACC GOR. If so---the the only way to get out roughly 15 years early is via negotiations----and I dont see anyone leaving the ACC early without the ACC getting something really big in return.

It's the other way around. The ACC grant of rights document was modelled on the B12's. The ACC was the last P5 to seek such a grant. Before the departure of Maryland the ACC relied solely on exit fees to discourage exits.

FWIW: For many years the SEC did the opposite. The SEC had a grants of rights agreement in effect but no exit fees. This quietly changed a few years ago, between the arrivals of Texas A&M and Texas. The SEC now has exit penalties in place, too, as other leagues do.

--

Those looking at Texas and Oklahoma for evidence of the 'ironclad' nature of a GoR agreement tend to skate past a few interesting variables. We may as well put a few of them face up on the table. They are also part of our set of givens.

The ACC has a conference network enabled in part by the participation of Notre Dame. In the case of anyone wanting to leave soon—Clemson, North Carolina, Florida State, etc—if ND is cool with it, ESPN is persuadable. Life in the ACC can go on. This arrangement makes some dealing possible that was not available to Texas with the B12.

Also, 2021 is not 2023. Things are changing rapidly. We've had major decisions made recently about CFP structure and media contracts, with more decisions looming about pay for players, collective bargaining, NIL and portal. As we recently saw in California, universities overall are facing new financial pressures, as campus personnel expect more and demand it via collective action.

University presidents are in a mood to skate to where the puck is going to be, not to where it is.

Remember when all the message board chatter said the UV regents would try to 'block' UCLA's move to the B1G... and it turned out that they actually wanted two UC schools to go?

Remember when all the message board chatter said university presidents 'impede' postseason progress... and it was university presidents who got the expanded CFP happening as soon as possible?

University officials are looking at some big new bills arriving in the mail. They want The Next Big Thing, in place and working, and they want it asap.

Let's turn all those cards up, too. Keep them in sight next to that dog-eared 'ironclad GoR' card.

(12-27-2022 11:33 PM)Gitanole Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 02:30 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  It just seems unlikely for even 8 teams to break it----and certainly very difficult for just a couple of teams to get out of it. Texas and Oklahoma are basically having to move heaven and earth just to get out one year early (and while likely---even that one year early exit is not certain at this point). My understanding is the Big12 GOR structure was largely based the ACC GOR. If so---the the only way to get out roughly 15 years early is via negotiations----and I dont see anyone leaving the ACC early without the ACC getting something really big in return.

It's the other way around. The ACC grant of rights document was modelled on the B12's. The ACC was the last P5 to seek one. Until then it relied solely on exit fees to put teeth into any departures.

FWIW: For many years the SEC had a grants of rights agreement in effect but no exit fees. This quietly changed a few years ago, between the arrivals of Texas A&M and Texas. The SEC now has exit penalties in place, as other leagues do.

--

Those looking at Texas and Oklahoma for evidence of the 'ironclad' nature of a GoR agreement tend to overlook a few variables. We may as well put a few of these on the table. They are part of our set of givens.

The ACC has a conference network enabled in part by the participation of Notre Dame. In the case of anyone wanting to leave soon—Clemson, North Carolina, Florida State, etc—if ND is cool with it, ESPN is persuadable.Life in the ACC can go on. The arrangement makes some dealing possible that was not available to Texas with the B12.

Also, 2021 is not 2023. Things are changing rapidly. We've had major decisions made recently about CFP structure and media contracts, with more decisions looming about pay for players, collective bargaining, NIL and portal. As we recently saw in California, universities overall are facing new financial pressures as campus personnel expect more and demand it via collective action. University presidents are in a mood to skate to where the puck is going to be, not to where it is.

Remember when all the message board chatter said the UV regents would try to 'block' UCLA's move to the B1G... and it turned out that they actually wanted two UC schools to go?

Remember when all the message board chatter said university presidents slow down postseason progress... and it was university presidents who got the expanded CFP happening as soon as possible?

University officials are looking at some big new bills arriving in the mail. They want The Next Big Thing, in place and working, and they want it asap.

Let's turn all those cards up as well and keep them in sight next to the dog-eared 'ironclad GoR' card.

The bolded part is true but is not defined as it should be and therefore is unintentionally misleading. The exit fees for the SEC were installed in conjunction with a loan from the conference to the schools to cover lost ticket sales due to COVID restrictions. Each school received an advance against our new media deal. That advance was ~ 23 million per school. The exit fee was established at 25 million in order to cover money already disbursed but not earned. It is my understanding that when the first annual check under the new contract is received by the schools that this advance will be paid back and the exit fee will be dropped. We'll see.

But even if they were not dropped, the 25 million would be miniscule compared to what other conferences are requesting. The GOR was not a conference mandate but rather a network mandate.

I definitely agree that administrations are now on board and have cleared some hurdles which were not addressed by the Playoff Committee or the ADs.

(12-27-2022 07:48 PM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 03:35 PM)AuzGrams Wrote:  What does Florida State bring that Florida doesn’t.

I've talked about this before, but now that others (like you) are bringing it up, I did another "deep dive" ("deep" being relative lol - google has its limitations : )

Looking over all the SEC schools, not just AAU, and "fit", and basketball prowess, but also any past interest or lack of interest either together or as part of a gouping. Including actual statements and rumours. (For example: whether "no" was repeatedly said by Texas or the B10, either way, they seem unlikely to join.)

And keeping in mind that people can and do lie, and also that circumstances can and do change, as do opinions, as do leadership positions in schools.

whew.

Ok, so in the end I grouped the schools that could possibly decide to leave the SEC into 2 groups:

1.) Schools that big media money forces might incentivize their leaving the SEC in some way:

Arkansas, Kentucky, Mississippi state, Missouri, South Carolina, Vanderbilt

2.) Potential differences in southern cultures/history

Florida, Louisiana state, Appalachia schools, and the western schools.

Florida's Spanish background and Louisiana's French background, means they bring more and varied cultures to the table. (There has, of course, been a blending of cultures over time). And also similarly with Appalachia and the West.

----
Would any of these leave?

It would depend a lot upon circumstances.

There's another possibility too - If Alabama decided to leave with top performing schools to start a new conference, and leave the rest behind.

So looking all of these over, and also based upon what the B10 seems to want in new members, Florida just seems to top the list.

And though not as likely, Florida "could" bring along a few rivals as a package - like Georgia, Tennessee, and Louisiana state. (And maybe Texas A&M)

Those plus AAU Missouri and Vanderbilt are, in my opinion, the schools that the B10 would look at first for realignment

All that said, I don't think the circumstances are anywhere near all or any of those yet, possible though they may be.

But Florida?

I'm going to keep watching news about Florida. At this point, I don't think it would take much of a circumstantial shift for them to join the B10.

But who knows.

And, just for fun, here's what the B10 would look like if they added those 7 plus Kansas for a total of 24. (You could also add Virginia and Duke for 26, and Stanford and Washington to for 28, and NC and Oregon for 30, and, FSU and GT for 32, and Pitt and Syracuse for 34, and Colorado and Cal for 36, and, and, and...)

(There are no divisions, but just dividing by region, for ease of reading)

Florida, Georgia, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Louisiana state, Texas A&M

Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland

Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State

Kansas, Missouri, Illinois, Indiana, Purdue

Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Nebraska, Northwestern

USC, UCLA

Enjoy : )

Skyhawk, I definitely respect and admire all of the work that you put in your posts. Even though we may not agree, you are definitely earning my respect. Love your analysis, and who knows? The SEC and B1G might merge some day.

(12-27-2022 11:50 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 11:33 PM)Gitanole Wrote:  It's the other way around. The ACC grant of rights document was modelled on the B12's. The ACC was the last P5 to seek one. Until then it relied solely on exit fees to put teeth into any departures.

FWIW: For many years the SEC had a grants of rights agreement in effect but no exit fees. This quietly changed a few years ago, between the arrivals of Texas A&M and Texas. The SEC now has exit penalties in place, as other leagues do.

....

The bolded part is true but is not defined as it should be and therefore is unintentionally misleading. The exit fees for the SEC were installed in conjunction with a loan from the conference to the schools to cover lost ticket sales due to COVID restrictions. Each school received an advance against our new media deal. That advance was ~ 23 million per school. The exit fee was established at 25 million in order to cover money already disbursed but not earned. It is my understanding that when the first annual check under the new contract is received by the schools that this advance will be paid back and the exit fee will be dropped. We'll see.

But even if they were not dropped, the 25 million would be miniscule compared to what other conferences are requesting. The GOR was not a conference mandate but rather a network mandate.

I definitely agree that administrations are now on board and have cleared some hurdles which were not addressed by the Playoff Committee or the ADs.

Thanks. It was an aside. I didn't know the particulars of the decision and was only suggesting the time frame. No implication is intended other than a general observation that over time the P5 conferences have come to conduct business in increasingly similar ways.

(12-28-2022 12:26 AM)Gitanole Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 11:50 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 11:33 PM)Gitanole Wrote:  It's the other way around. The ACC grant of rights document was modelled on the B12's. The ACC was the last P5 to seek one. Until then it relied solely on exit fees to put teeth into any departures.

FWIW: For many years the SEC had a grants of rights agreement in effect but no exit fees. This quietly changed a few years ago, between the arrivals of Texas A&M and Texas. The SEC now has exit penalties in place, as other leagues do.

....

The bolded part is true but is not defined as it should be and therefore is unintentionally misleading. The exit fees for the SEC were installed in conjunction with a loan from the conference to the schools to cover lost ticket sales due to COVID restrictions. Each school received an advance against our new media deal. That advance was ~ 23 million per school. The exit fee was established at 25 million in order to cover money already disbursed but not earned. It is my understanding that when the first annual check under the new contract is received by the schools that this advance will be paid back and the exit fee will be dropped. We'll see.

But even if they were not dropped, the 25 million would be miniscule compared to what other conferences are requesting. The GOR was not a conference mandate but rather a network mandate.

I definitely agree that administrations are now on board and have cleared some hurdles which were not addressed by the Playoff Committee or the ADs.

Thanks. It was an aside. I didn't know the particulars of the decision and was only suggesting the time frame. No implication is intended other than a general observation that over time the P5 conferences have come to conduct business in increasingly similar ways.

Yes, they are lining up like tumblers in a lock to open the door to previously protected NCAA treasures. I do think because of the natural differences in the organizing principles of the Big 10 and SEC that whatever cooperation they may have athletically that they will remain distinct. And that's good business since the juxtaposition of the two creates must see television. Geography and history will likely dictate the final construct.

I just don't see the momentum toward that being broken by reticence or past protocol, or a GOR. The administrations I hope see the wisdom in completing this transition now, so that fans and alums have a chance to relax and reinvest in their programs. And allow roots to grow in the new system rather than treating consolidation like a recurring cancer which weakens the whole body.

It's time for the patient to recover fully and get on with life!

This thread is stickied to accurately reflect that Flug is the #1 source in realignment.

Stay tuned…

(12-28-2022 12:08 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 07:48 PM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 03:35 PM)AuzGrams Wrote:  What does Florida State bring that Florida doesn’t.

I've talked about this before, but now that others (like you) are bringing it up, I did another "deep dive" ("deep" being relative lol - google has its limitations : )

Looking over all the SEC schools, not just AAU, and "fit", and basketball prowess, but also any past interest or lack of interest either together or as part of a gouping. Including actual statements and rumours. (For example: whether "no" was repeatedly said by Texas or the B10, either way, they seem unlikely to join.)

And keeping in mind that people can and do lie, and also that circumstances can and do change, as do opinions, as do leadership positions in schools.

whew.

Ok, so in the end I grouped the schools that could possibly decide to leave the SEC into 2 groups:

1.) Schools that big media money forces might incentivize their leaving the SEC in some way:

Arkansas, Kentucky, Mississippi state, Missouri, South Carolina, Vanderbilt

2.) Potential differences in southern cultures/history

Florida, Louisiana state, Appalachia schools, and the western schools.

Florida's Spanish background and Louisiana's French background, means they bring more and varied cultures to the table. (There has, of course, been a blending of cultures over time). And also similarly with Appalachia and the West.

----
Would any of these leave?

It would depend a lot upon circumstances.

There's another possibility too - If Alabama decided to leave with top performing schools to start a new conference, and leave the rest behind.

So looking all of these over, and also based upon what the B10 seems to want in new members, Florida just seems to top the list.

And though not as likely, Florida "could" bring along a few rivals as a package - like Georgia, Tennessee, and Louisiana state. (And maybe Texas A&M)

Those plus AAU Missouri and Vanderbilt are, in my opinion, the schools that the B10 would look at first for realignment

All that said, I don't think the circumstances are anywhere near all or any of those yet, possible though they may be.

But Florida?

I'm going to keep watching news about Florida. At this point, I don't think it would take much of a circumstantial shift for them to join the B10.

But who knows.

And, just for fun, here's what the B10 would look like if they added those 7 plus Kansas for a total of 24. (You could also add Virginia and Duke for 26, and Stanford and Washington to for 28, and NC and Oregon for 30, and, FSU and GT for 32, and Pitt and Syracuse for 34, and Colorado and Cal for 36, and, and, and...)

(There are no divisions, but just dividing by region, for ease of reading)

Florida, Georgia, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Louisiana state, Texas A&M

Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland

Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State

Kansas, Missouri, Illinois, Indiana, Purdue

Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Nebraska, Northwestern

USC, UCLA

Enjoy : )

Skyhawk, I definitely respect and admire all of the work that you put in your posts. Even though we may not agree, you are definitely earning my respect. Love your analysis, and who knows? The SEC and B1G might merge some day.

A full merger is certainly possible, but his fantasy scenario wherein the B1G takes 1/2 the SEC teams? Not only is it a fantasy, but it's not even consistent with the alleged reality of its fantasy world. If those 6 schools left then certainly Texas and OU would want to join that party and follow Big Brother A&M again.

(12-28-2022 02:06 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  This thread is stickied to accurately reflect that Flug is the #1 source in realignment.

Stay tuned…

What a world.

(12-28-2022 12:08 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 07:48 PM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 03:35 PM)AuzGrams Wrote:  What does Florida State bring that Florida doesn’t.

I've talked about this before, but now that others (like you) are bringing it up, I did another "deep dive" ("deep" being relative lol - google has its limitations : )

Looking over all the SEC schools, not just AAU, and "fit", and basketball prowess, but also any past interest or lack of interest either together or as part of a gouping. Including actual statements and rumours. (For example: whether "no" was repeatedly said by Texas or the B10, either way, they seem unlikely to join.)

And keeping in mind that people can and do lie, and also that circumstances can and do change, as do opinions, as do leadership positions in schools.

whew.

Ok, so in the end I grouped the schools that could possibly decide to leave the SEC into 2 groups:

1.) Schools that big media money forces might incentivize their leaving the SEC in some way:

Arkansas, Kentucky, Mississippi state, Missouri, South Carolina, Vanderbilt

2.) Potential differences in southern cultures/history

Florida, Louisiana state, Appalachia schools, and the western schools.

Florida's Spanish background and Louisiana's French background, means they bring more and varied cultures to the table. (There has, of course, been a blending of cultures over time). And also similarly with Appalachia and the West.

----
Would any of these leave?

It would depend a lot upon circumstances.

There's another possibility too - If Alabama decided to leave with top performing schools to start a new conference, and leave the rest behind.

So looking all of these over, and also based upon what the B10 seems to want in new members, Florida just seems to top the list.

And though not as likely, Florida "could" bring along a few rivals as a package - like Georgia, Tennessee, and Louisiana state. (And maybe Texas A&M)

Those plus AAU Missouri and Vanderbilt are, in my opinion, the schools that the B10 would look at first for realignment

All that said, I don't think the circumstances are anywhere near all or any of those yet, possible though they may be.

But Florida?

I'm going to keep watching news about Florida. At this point, I don't think it would take much of a circumstantial shift for them to join the B10.

But who knows.

And, just for fun, here's what the B10 would look like if they added those 7 plus Kansas for a total of 24. (You could also add Virginia and Duke for 26, and Stanford and Washington to for 28, and NC and Oregon for 30, and, FSU and GT for 32, and Pitt and Syracuse for 34, and Colorado and Cal for 36, and, and, and...)

(There are no divisions, but just dividing by region, for ease of reading)

Florida, Georgia, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Louisiana state, Texas A&M

Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland

Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State

Kansas, Missouri, Illinois, Indiana, Purdue

Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Nebraska, Northwestern

USC, UCLA

Enjoy : )

Skyhawk, I definitely respect and admire all of the work that you put in your posts. Even though we may not agree, you are definitely earning my respect. Love your analysis, and who knows? The SEC and B1G might merge some day.

Thank you. Kind of you to say.

Ok, so what if it's only FSU that moves from the ACC to the SEC. Let's presume that the other schools that the SEC might want, don't have the votes to leave.

Let's also presume it's announced early 2023, to happen in time for the 2024 season.

What would the dominos look like.

Well first, the SEC needs to add a school for even numbered membership. Kansas is the most likely, outside the ACC.

Then, the ACC needs to backfill. The smart move is to add 3 in this case. It helps give espn reasons and cover to give them more money.

Cincinnati and WV are on most ACC expansion lists. They should try for Uconn for the third. If UConn decides for some reason to stay in the BigEast, then I think Memphis is third. All new/different states/markets.

The Big12 then adds USF as a travel partner to UCF. This gets them to 10. They could then add non-football Gonzaga and Wichita state, for 12. (This move is fun because the "per school" payout would presumably increase, without getting more media money.)

The smart move, I think, would be to also add SDSU, Colorado, AZ, and AZ state, for 16. Again, to give reasons/cover for more money.

The PAC just lost 3, bringing them to 7. They'll likely add an MWC school for 8.

And that covers P5 realignment - the Big 10 being left out.

(12-27-2022 08:01 PM)EdwordL Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 01:27 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 01:22 PM)SouthEastAlaska Wrote:  I take everything they put out at "Peek around the corner" with a heavy dose of salt, but I will concede they definitely have some sort of "insider" contact. As all of us should know by now, even insider contacts can give out wrong information but to Flu's credit he tried to back out of the convo not wanting to discuss the details which in my opinion lends a little more credibility to the man and his sources. This story should definitely be followed closely over the next couple months.

"IF" FSU does find a way out of the ACC GOR all hell is going to break loose, we'll see....

Florida State does have a way out of the ACC's GOR, it involves writing several really large checks.

X: Do you know if the exit fee can be paid over a long period of time, say, 10-12 years? If so, the fees may be manageable to a school that really, really wants to leave.

The ACC exit fee is currently around $120 Million.
If it were a sound economic move I would imagine that some entity would loan the leaving school the money (to be paid back over time with interest). I don't believe that the ACC would be willing to finance an exit fee.
The really big money would be what ever amount the ACC (or any GOR conference) was asking for. As Frank the Tank explained it: the conference could set any amount they wanted to (reasonable or not) for a school to get out of a GOR and there would be no recourse for the leaving school to negotiate the amount.

(12-28-2022 05:38 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 08:01 PM)EdwordL Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 01:27 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 01:22 PM)SouthEastAlaska Wrote:  I take everything they put out at "Peek around the corner" with a heavy dose of salt, but I will concede they definitely have some sort of "insider" contact. As all of us should know by now, even insider contacts can give out wrong information but to Flu's credit he tried to back out of the convo not wanting to discuss the details which in my opinion lends a little more credibility to the man and his sources. This story should definitely be followed closely over the next couple months.

"IF" FSU does find a way out of the ACC GOR all hell is going to break loose, we'll see....

Florida State does have a way out of the ACC's GOR, it involves writing several really large checks.

X: Do you know if the exit fee can be paid over a long period of time, say, 10-12 years? If so, the fees may be manageable to a school that really, really wants to leave.

The ACC exit fee is currently around $120 Million.
If it were a sound economic move I would imagine that some entity would loan the leaving school the money (to be paid back over time with interest). I don't believe that the ACC would be willing to finance an exit fee.
The really big money would be what ever amount the ACC (or any GOR conference) was asking for. As Frank the Tank explained it: the conference could set any amount they wanted to (reasonable or not) for a school to get out of a GOR and there would be no recourse for the leaving school to negotiate the amount.

yes, but under this unique situation where espn is the media partner for both conferences, I think a deal is possible.

Plus, if FSU stays they get zero.

So I don't think that they'll leave money on the table.

(12-27-2022 05:08 PM)CardinalJim Wrote:  ESPN is not going to allow The Big Ten into the Southeast. If FSU goes anywhere early it will be to The SEC. The truth is ESPN could put all of this nonsense to bed by encouraging a merger of The SEC and The ACC.

They’ve already started combining some elements of both with The ACC / Big Ten challenge ending and becoming The ACC / SEC challenge.

People forget that ESPN lackey, Jay Bilas, made this very suggestion the day after Texas and Oklahoma announced their intention to join the SEC.
I could see the combined conference adding two more schools to get to 32 and then circle the wagons.
Since ESPN and FOX have already decided to divide the Big 12 again, it would be advantageous for the Big 12 add a few PAC schools to give ESPN some late night inventory.
With that ESPN's inventory would be set. There would be three conferences as some have predicted. The SEC/ACC at 32 teams, the Big 12 at perhaps 16 teams (with media distribution split between FOX and ESPN) and the B1G at 20, plus Notre Dame still attached to the ACC until 2036.

(12-27-2022 12:57 PM)Tmac13 Wrote:  Other than "Being good at football" and being in Florida, there isn't anything about FSU that makes them a cultural fit in the B1G.

They aren't AAU, or even very close.
They aren't a state flagship.
They aren't a big research university.
They have a tiny(compared to most B1G schools) endowment of 650m..For example UCLA 9.8B USC 8B..

That's why these FSU to the B1G rumors seem unlikely to me, because B1G presidents care about these things much more than they do football..To contrast, schools like UNC and Virginia are perfect cultural fits in the B1G..

FSU is very much a big research university. They do not have a research-oriented medical school, but the rest of the university produces a very significant amount of research - $350m in 2020. And unlike some non-AAU universities ahead of them in research funding like Virginia Tech, Kentucky, and Georgia, they do not have massive Ag funding in the number. FSU isn't next in line for the AAU by any stretch, but it is rising quickly in academic rankings and research prowess. I would not underestimate them over the next decade+.

(12-28-2022 08:14 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 12:57 PM)Tmac13 Wrote:  Other than "Being good at football" and being in Florida, there isn't anything about FSU that makes them a cultural fit in the B1G.

They aren't AAU, or even very close.
They aren't a state flagship.
They aren't a big research university.
They have a tiny(compared to most B1G schools) endowment of 650m..For example UCLA 9.8B USC 8B..

That's why these FSU to the B1G rumors seem unlikely to me, because B1G presidents care about these things much more than they do football..To contrast, schools like UNC and Virginia are perfect cultural fits in the B1G..

FSU is very much a big research university. They do not have a research-oriented medical school, but the rest of the university produces a very significant amount of research - $350m in 2020. And unlike some non-AAU universities ahead of them in research funding like Virginia Tech, Kentucky, and Georgia, they do not have massive Ag funding in the number. FSU isn't next in line for the AAU by any stretch, but it is rising quickly in academic rankings and research prowess. I would not underestimate them over the next decade+.

Fair general points, but you might not be not up to date on the latest with FSU and it's medical school - which will very likely ramp up it's AAU timeline. I'm not going post every link related to FSU's med school expansion (including Panama City), infrastructure projects, and research initiatives...but things are changing rapidly. I'd expect FSU will have a very strong likelihood of being in the AAU (or on the cusp) in the next 10-13 years. It's an exciting time for FSU. I'm married to a Knight, wo will be rooting for them today. Go Knights Charge On!

PS I'm not even going to bother with the original poster's premise.

https://news.fsu.edu/news/university-new...s-in-2022/

(12-28-2022 08:59 AM)GarnetAndBlue Wrote:  

(12-28-2022 08:14 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(12-27-2022 12:57 PM)Tmac13 Wrote:  Other than "Being good at football" and being in Florida, there isn't anything about FSU that makes them a cultural fit in the B1G.

They aren't AAU, or even very close.
They aren't a state flagship.
They aren't a big research university.
They have a tiny(compared to most B1G schools) endowment of 650m..For example UCLA 9.8B USC 8B..

That's why these FSU to the B1G rumors seem unlikely to me, because B1G presidents care about these things much more than they do football..To contrast, schools like UNC and Virginia are perfect cultural fits in the B1G..

FSU is very much a big research university. They do not have a research-oriented medical school, but the rest of the university produces a very significant amount of research - $350m in 2020. And unlike some non-AAU universities ahead of them in research funding like Virginia Tech, Kentucky, and Georgia, they do not have massive Ag funding in the number. FSU isn't next in line for the AAU by any stretch, but it is rising quickly in academic rankings and research prowess. I would not underestimate them over the next decade+.

Fair general points, but you might not be not up to date on the latest with FSU and it's medical school - which will very likely ramp up it's AAU timeline. I'm not going post every link related to FSU's med school expansion (including Panama City), infrastructure projects, and research initiatives...but things are changing rapidly. I'd expect FSU will have a very strong likelihood of being in the AAU (or on the cusp) in the next 10-13 years. It's an exciting time for FSU. I'm married to a Knight, wo will be rooting for them today. Go Knights Charge On!

PS I'm not even going to bother with the original poster's premise.

https://news.fsu.edu/news/university-new...s-in-2022/

The 5 Florida schools of size and note remind me a lot of the California schools in the post war 40's and 50's. They are all going to blossom. Florida State and South Florida are the two the SEC should be eyeing, one near term, one 10 years out.