(11-20-2020 08:19 AM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 06:15 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 03:05 PM)DaSaintFan Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 01:56 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  Some courts even specify different ways to STAPLE documents when filing...I'm not kidding. Any of you ever ACTUALLY READ the RULES of even ONE COURT (which is different form the various statutes, by the way, which also need to be followed to prevail), let alone 100 different courts at different levels? I doubt many of you have, unless you are lawyers, and then it is likely you let your staff figure it out. Now for those who ARE lawyers, how many times have you filed documents with multiple errors (scrivener's or otherwise) then had to amend when pointed out or caught, and how many of those errors pass through to cases as adjudicated.

I can vouch for this!! Particularly Texas.... I've had legal secretaries on the phone in tears because they had to start ALL over, because someone stapled one of their documents wrong, and since it now had hole punches from where the staples were removed.... the document was worthless.

Texas is one of the worst.

You think Texas is one of the worst? At least all of their courts are able to efile now. Michigan is worse than Texas by far. Not all of the courts do efiling, and if they do, they use different third party vendors.

Have to ask, since it's Michigan: Dominion or Smartmatic?

(11-20-2020 12:25 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 08:19 AM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 06:15 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 03:05 PM)DaSaintFan Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 01:56 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  Some courts even specify different ways to STAPLE documents when filing...I'm not kidding. Any of you ever ACTUALLY READ the RULES of even ONE COURT (which is different form the various statutes, by the way, which also need to be followed to prevail), let alone 100 different courts at different levels? I doubt many of you have, unless you are lawyers, and then it is likely you let your staff figure it out. Now for those who ARE lawyers, how many times have you filed documents with multiple errors (scrivener's or otherwise) then had to amend when pointed out or caught, and how many of those errors pass through to cases as adjudicated.

I can vouch for this!! Particularly Texas.... I've had legal secretaries on the phone in tears because they had to start ALL over, because someone stapled one of their documents wrong, and since it now had hole punches from where the staples were removed.... the document was worthless.

Texas is one of the worst.

You think Texas is one of the worst? At least all of their courts are able to efile now. Michigan is worse than Texas by far. Not all of the courts do efiling, and if they do, they use different third party vendors.

Have to ask, since it's Michigan: Dominion or Smartmatic?

good question... I will have to do some more digging.

(11-20-2020 09:44 AM)DtownBronco Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:28 AM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:24 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:20 AM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:15 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Womp...womp!

Byron York's Daily Memo: Growing concern about Trump legal fight

I think skepticism is warranted.

There is no reason to pass judgement until they either don't file in court or the evidence is presented publicly.

Attacking them now might prove very counter-productive. It might even bolster a weak case to the point of popular acceptance.

I'll put this politely, You're being used. Used to sow doubt in a free and fair election with the sole purpose of delegitimizing the incoming administration.

It's the same thing you guys claimed with Russia Russia Russia.

Wake up and smell the coffee.

They. Have. Squat!

They have the statistics. Some of them are quite damning. I have no idea what else they have.

I'll put it this way. The kind of stats they have would have any corporate accountant escorted from the premises.

They have this...



Trace showing when the software intervened after the algorithm had run long enough and the AI learned what correction factor to apply. That is when the curve goes linear in vote swapping for Biden.

It worked in Georgia.

Same software was in place in MI and WI but the software couldn't solve the massive lead Trump had. Hence physical ballot vote dumps needed.

The ballots delivered to the TCF Center in Detroit had only circles darkened for Biden. No other votes down ballot.

All you are showing is if they allowed the mail in ballots to be counted ahead of time there would be no argument.

(11-20-2020 01:42 AM)ODU BBALL Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 01:27 AM)TripleA Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 02:21 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 02:18 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 02:10 PM)TripleA Wrote:  Karl Rove is saying the charges that Rudy and Powell made are extremely serious, but that the legal team has been late, lacking proof, and losing so far in court.

To be fair, I doubt Karl has any clue what they have. Given the death threats, you wont have a witness left if you expose the witness's to the public where the crazies can get involved.

Rove is unfortunately biased as his "guys" lost the primary in 2016 to trump. not sure his butt-hurt has healed enough to trust him. More like Swampity Swamp sez it's over, even though it is far from decided.

That's odd. I have watched Rove multiple times a week on Fox for 4 years, and he has been 100% supportive of Trump the whole time, afaik.

Today, he was reacting to Rudy's presser, nothing more or less. That's all he can react to.

And McCarthy said practically the same thing today, too. Do you guys not trust McCarthy, either? Come on...

If you watched the press conference then you know that Rudy, Sidney, etc. have a lot of evidence. I seriously doubt that either Rove or McCarthy know the full extent of the evidence since they are like us - on the outside looking in. It's not a question of trust or belief. Everyone has an opinion.

Don't understand how MSM and some folks can accept two years of unfounded and debunked accusations with zero evidence leading to a fake impeachment (which should be reserved for actual crimes, not personal dislikes) and then at the same time turn around and claim there is no merit to , for example, 234 publicly filed affidavits by separate individuals who can all face significant jail time if they are found to be lying about what they saw, along with the statistical analyses showing anomaly after anomaly and simply ignore it, because instead of two years it's been, (my goodness!) two Weeks!? I also fail to understand how anyone, any judge or official who is remotely honest or trustworthy would deem to allow "results" which were shown to be fraudulent to stand regardless and irrespective of any 'deadline". Because if that is true, then you are saying that votes don't matter and elections don't matter and our democracy doesn't matter since what is important is arbitrary and honesty is not necessary to fulfill that. That is just nonsense, and no way the US Constitution and all those people died to defend corruption in a major election.

But again, when it came to Russia!Russia!Russia! we "had to pursue it to its end no matter what--why the double-standard here? Let's look into these ballots (not simply re-scan them, as yes, the result is likely to be the same (it actually was different, but Dems say who cares?), but examine each and every ballot in disputed states/areas no matter how long it takes and ask: 1. who is the person voting, 2. are they legally allowed to, 3. did they execute the ballot properly and 4. what anomalies exist on the actual ballots--at least for states fortunate to have paper trails? Most any reasonable person would assume that those are the basic standards, but it seems they are not, and that is a big problem for voters who care about secure and trustworthy elections, which we didn't seem to have (Willfully tossing envelopes so ballots cannot be verified, anyone? Sounds pretty commie dictator shady to me.)

What is the great harm in seeking to get it right? In GA, for example, a state of more than 8 million (and a few million illegals hanging out and about) for only 12,000 some-odd votes to decide the outcome seems worth being sure to protect the rights of those who voted legally, and expose those who did not. If ballots cannot be verified, then throw them out, as any teacher in a classroom school election surely would do, and/or have a re-do where everyone is held to the same standard- ID, legal status and proper form--or allow everyone to stuff as many as they can get in in the allotted time- Trump voters as well--so they can have the EQUAL opportunity to stuff the boxes with carts of extra ballots too, since that is now the apparent rule (Laws be damned, except the precious "deadline!")

(11-20-2020 12:42 PM)tennis2k4 Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:44 AM)DtownBronco Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:28 AM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:24 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:20 AM)Claw Wrote:  I think skepticism is warranted.

There is no reason to pass judgement until they either don't file in court or the evidence is presented publicly.

Attacking them now might prove very counter-productive. It might even bolster a weak case to the point of popular acceptance.

I'll put this politely, You're being used. Used to sow doubt in a free and fair election with the sole purpose of delegitimizing the incoming administration.

It's the same thing you guys claimed with Russia Russia Russia.

Wake up and smell the coffee.

They. Have. Squat!

They have the statistics. Some of them are quite damning. I have no idea what else they have.

I'll put it this way. The kind of stats they have would have any corporate accountant escorted from the premises.

They have this...



Trace showing when the software intervened after the algorithm had run long enough and the AI learned what correction factor to apply. That is when the curve goes linear in vote swapping for Biden.

It worked in Georgia.

Same software was in place in MI and WI but the software couldn't solve the massive lead Trump had. Hence physical ballot vote dumps needed.

The ballots delivered to the TCF Center in Detroit had only circles darkened for Biden. No other votes down ballot.

All you are showing is if they allowed the mail in ballots to be counted ahead of time there would be no argument.

Georgia has physical ballots to back up their numbers. We know that because of the recount and the audit.

Do we have these graphs for Georgia? We shouldn't. If we do this whole line of argument seems suspect.

But if Georgia does NOT show these trends, then we need the Georgia recount and audit procedures applied to the states that do show them.

(11-20-2020 09:44 AM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:36 AM)DFWMINER Wrote:  They said some precincts had up to 300% of their registered voters vote. Whatever evidence they have, it will be shown soon enough. I just don't think it will be in time. But again it sets the stage for the next election.

What state and what county had this?

They tried saying this about WI right after the election and it was complete BS and the source was a propaganda network built to influence the election by looking like a local paper.

Michigan has turnout by precinct and county on their site, so if MI should be easy to verify. WI let’s you download it as an excel.

Lol, I just saw this. They claim it’s Michigan data that shows more votes in certain precincts than registered voters. Analysis of the affidavit shows the precincts are actually in Minnesota and in areas that overwhelmingly voted for Trump. And Minnesota allows same day registration so it wouldn’t be unheard of to have more votes than the number of registered voters if you took the number of registered voters prior to the election.

(11-20-2020 09:24 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:20 AM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:15 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Womp...womp!

Quote:GROWING CONCERN ABOUT TRUMP LEGAL FIGHT: Thursday's news conference by Trump lawyers Rudy Giuliani, Sidney Powell, and Jenna Ellis marked a turning point of sorts in the way some Republicans view the president's challenge to election results around the country. Among those Republicans -- Trump supporters all -- there is concern that the attorneys' sensational theories of election fraud are hurting the president's cause rather than helping it.

Most worrisome was Powell's presentation. The lawyer -- who had earned the admiration of many for her bold and determined representation of former Trump national security adviser Michael Flynn -- told reporters that Joe Biden's wins in some key states was the result of "the massive influence of communist money through Venezuela, Cuba, and likely China in the interference with our elections here in the United States." The Dominion voting system and Smartmatic software used in the interference, Powell continued, was "created in Venezuela at the direction of Hugo Chavez" to corrupt elections there. "President Trump won by a landslide," Powell concluded. "We are going to prove it."

But Powell did not prove it. She did not even allege with any specificity what she believes actually happened in the election. Powell said the Venezuelan software has the "ability to flip votes" and "can set and run an algorithm that probably ran all over the country to take a certain percentage of votes from President Trump and flip them to President [sic] Biden, which we might never have uncovered had the votes for President Trump not been so overwhelming in so many of these states that it broke the algorithm that had been plugged into the system, and that's what caused them to have to shut down in the states they shut down in."

But Powell offered nothing to prove what she said happened. Her case appeared to be that it could have happened. Nor has Powell or the rest of the Trump team filed a lawsuit alleging that it actually occurred. In an interview Thursday night with Fox Business Network's Lou Dobbs, Powell said the Trump team is "still in the process of collecting evidence. It's coming in in massive amounts...I would think we would have fraud complaints ready sometime by late next week at the latest."

A few hours later, Fox News' Tucker Carlson said that he had invited Powell to be on his program. "We would have given her the whole hour," Carlson said. "But she never sent us any evidence, despite a lot of requests, polite requests. Not a page.

Byron York's Daily Memo: Growing concern about Trump legal fight

I think skepticism is warranted.

There is no reason to pass judgement until they either don't file in court or the evidence is presented publicly.

Attacking them now might prove very counter-productive. It might even bolster a weak case to the point of popular acceptance.

I'll put this politely, You're being used. Used to sow doubt in a free and fair election with the sole purpose of delegitimizing the incoming administration.

It's the same thing you guys claimed with Russia Russia Russia.

Wake up and smell the coffee.

They. Have. Squat!

Why do you insist on wrongly claiming "that there is no evidence"? Do you know what evidence is? In a court of law, a witness is evidence. A sworn affidavit is basically an eye witness testimony. There is clearly evidence.

I would agree with you that at this point there may be insufficient evidence to PROVE enough fraud to change the election outcome, but I have consistently maintained that I would expect that the evidence would be insufficient at this point. Fraud cases take time and few experienced DA's could investigate, file, and convict such a case in a couple of weeks (and they would have far more resources). A DA would typically take a year or more to assemble their case. What I would expect to see is the typical burden of proof for injunctive relief. They need to show enough evidence to prove they have at least some reasonable chance of prevailing later. The time issue is why I continue to believe, even if we assume wide spread fraud exists, the Trump legal fight is is probably a futile effort because the time constraints probably are insufficient to gather enough evidence to prove the case.

Lets remember, it took over 2 and half years for the Russia Russia Russia fake case to be completely debunked---and that was with the aide of 17 intelligence agencies, real time electronic monitoring, bugged phones, human intelligence inside the Trump campaign, and full subpoena power. Frankly, the Trump legal team hasn't even been allowed to look into the most likely source of wide spread fraud---ie, the verification/signature matching of each mail in ballot. Again, just looking into the ballots that only have Biden marked---with no other down ballot races selected---is where I'd start with that process.

(11-20-2020 12:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 12:42 PM)tennis2k4 Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:44 AM)DtownBronco Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:28 AM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:24 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  I'll put this politely, You're being used. Used to sow doubt in a free and fair election with the sole purpose of delegitimizing the incoming administration.

It's the same thing you guys claimed with Russia Russia Russia.

Wake up and smell the coffee.

They. Have. Squat!

They have the statistics. Some of them are quite damning. I have no idea what else they have.

I'll put it this way. The kind of stats they have would have any corporate accountant escorted from the premises.

They have this...



Trace showing when the software intervened after the algorithm had run long enough and the AI learned what correction factor to apply. That is when the curve goes linear in vote swapping for Biden.

It worked in Georgia.

Same software was in place in MI and WI but the software couldn't solve the massive lead Trump had. Hence physical ballot vote dumps needed.

The ballots delivered to the TCF Center in Detroit had only circles darkened for Biden. No other votes down ballot.

All you are showing is if they allowed the mail in ballots to be counted ahead of time there would be no argument.

Georgia has physical ballots to back up their numbers. We know that because of the recount and the audit.

Do we have these graphs for Georgia? We shouldn't. If we do this whole line of argument seems suspect.

But if Georgia does NOT show these trends, then we need the Georgia recount and audit procedures applied to the states that do show them.

The top graph is Georgia to illustrate how the algorithm works. The plot isn't time dependent. The X-axis is the total votes cast. The Y-axis is percentage of votes received. The counties are ordered from least votes cast to most votes cast. The red line is Trump, dark blue is Biden, light blue is Jorgensen. Note how Jorgensen’s line is horizontal. The attempt is to show that the results from the smaller counties tend to be an indicator of where the total will end up. Historically, once 20-30% of the votes are tabulated, the statistics will tell you the odds of a candidate winning a particular race are 98% and all the news people will project a winner at that point.

The anomaly is that this data set goes nearly linear as the larger counties are added. As you move along the X-axis, after over one million votes, the curves show almost a one-to-one (0.9815) vote add for Biden and resulting delete for Trump as a part of the whole. Now I get it that larger suburban counties surrounding large cities tend to favor the Dems, but it shouldn't be this clean of trend. The claim is that this was accomplished by a correction factor in the software, hence the need for extra time to tabulate.

The software was either transferring votes from Trump to Biden or dumping votes to 3rd party or non-Trump / non-Biden candidates. Overnight counts were stopped in certain states when it was mathematically impossible to dump enough votes to allow Biden to catch up necessitating the need for physical ballot dumps. The numbers had to made to look "plausible" or close and when it wasn't possible they needed more physical ballots.

Plots below show irregularities of non-repub / non-dem votes increasing over time. States include Georgia, Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and others. See sideways bell shaped trend.

(11-20-2020 01:02 PM)DtownBronco Wrote:  The top graph is Georgia to illustrate how the algorithm works. The plot isn't time dependent. The X-axis is the total votes cast. The Y-axis is percentage of votes received. The counties are ordered from least votes cast to most votes cast. The red line is Trump, dark blue is Biden, light blue is Jorgensen. Note how Jorgensen’s line is horizontal. The attempt is to show that the results from the smaller counties tend to be an indicator of where the total will end up. Historically, once 20-30% of the votes are tabulated, the statistics will tell you the odds of a candidate winning a particular race are 98% and all the news people will project a winner at that point.

The anomaly is that this data set goes nearly linear as the larger counties are added. As you move along the X-axis, after over one million votes, the curves show almost a one-to-one (0.9815) vote add for Biden and resulting delete for Trump as a part of the whole. Now I get it that larger suburban counties surrounding large cities tend to favor the Dems, but it shouldn't be this clean of trend. The claim is that this was accomplished by a correction factor in the software, hence the need for extra time to tabulate.

The software was either transferring votes from Trump to Biden or dumping votes to 3rd party or non-Trump / non-Biden candidates. Overnight counts were stopped in certain states when it was mathematically impossible to dump enough votes to allow Biden to catch up necessitating the need for physical ballot dumps. The numbers had to made to look "plausible" or close and when it wasn't possible they needed more physical ballots.

Plots below show irregularities of non-repub / non-dem votes increasing over time. States include Georgia, Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and others. See sideways bell shaped trend.

The issue is that the extra added ballots that were not lawfully cast by actual voters need to be removed. recounting the fraudulently added ballots still gives you the wrong result, although they also "found" ballots that had been 'forgotten, misplaced, etc..." that were for president Trump, when they originally swore there would be no such issues. As you correctly point out, the MATH and Statistical Analysis shows that the ballots the way the numbers and the re-count show, don;t make sense for an election of this kind in this state with these parameters. But eventually, someone has to be willing to go through all the actual paper ballots (GA just added a paper trail this year, supposedly for this very reason-but it's no good if you don't use it!) and do it where everyone can see plainly what was indicated, as well as get rid of things that don;t make sense for mail-in ballots, like the lady worker who filed a sworn affidavit stating she was given stacks of maili-in ballots without signatures and that were newly flat, rather than creased with a fold as would be necessary and normal if they had actually been mailed in or dropped off in a secure envelope, and not hurriedly manufactured and dumped to bring Biden's physical ballot totals up to enough to counter the enormous increase in actual Trump voters ballots they were getting.

Long story short: I KNEW there was something suspicious and deceitful going on in Fulton County when they announced a water main "was broken" that happened to be located in the very same room where they were counting election ballots on election night. yes, is WAS broken--by someone who wanted to find an excuse to stop the counting and the poll watching while they figured out how to add in a bunch of fake ballots since they saw Biden was losing statewide and not getting the expected number of votes from voters in Fulton County--since trump actually got 50% more Black folks' and Latino folks' votes, and that meant Biden got less. They freaked out (Atlanta-home of Freaknik, after all) and started panicking and then started dumping extra ballots in. Take those fake ballots out- which all anyone has to do is just LOOK AT EVERY DAM n BALLOT! and you have your correct totals for GA: trump won the State and probably one of the Senate races went to Purdue outright as well.

Dominion, who has claimed there is absolutely nothing to see here and was all set to defend their good name at a Pennsylvania State House hearing today---instead suddenly canceled their appearance last night......lol---Cant wait until Netflix drops the next episode.

https://mattlautnercattle.com/dominion-v...ring-hmmm/

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/11...ingbuttons

(11-20-2020 01:29 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  Dominion was all set to defend their good name at a Pennsylvania State House hearing---and then they cancelled their appearance......

https://mattlautnercattle.com/dominion-v...ring-hmmm/

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/11...ingbuttons

Maduro having issues getting his visa, or just holding out for more cash?

Also, WTF is no one investigating or mentioning exactly what/where/and in what manner the Atlanta Fulton "Water main" was broken in the vote-counting room in the downtown arena on election night? Media has been silent since mentioning it as the reason they had to "stop counting" even though counting apparently went on for hours after poll watchers were told to leave. Why no report on the repairs, why no interviews with the repairmen, why no evaluation from the Atlanta Water Authority on pressure, condition/age of those pipes (it was in a relatively new building), etc....What are they hiding?

(11-20-2020 01:02 PM)DtownBronco Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 12:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 12:42 PM)tennis2k4 Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:44 AM)DtownBronco Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:28 AM)Claw Wrote:  They have the statistics. Some of them are quite damning. I have no idea what else they have.

I'll put it this way. The kind of stats they have would have any corporate accountant escorted from the premises.

They have this...



Trace showing when the software intervened after the algorithm had run long enough and the AI learned what correction factor to apply. That is when the curve goes linear in vote swapping for Biden.

It worked in Georgia.

Same software was in place in MI and WI but the software couldn't solve the massive lead Trump had. Hence physical ballot vote dumps needed.

The ballots delivered to the TCF Center in Detroit had only circles darkened for Biden. No other votes down ballot.

All you are showing is if they allowed the mail in ballots to be counted ahead of time there would be no argument.

Georgia has physical ballots to back up their numbers. We know that because of the recount and the audit.

Do we have these graphs for Georgia? We shouldn't. If we do this whole line of argument seems suspect.

But if Georgia does NOT show these trends, then we need the Georgia recount and audit procedures applied to the states that do show them.

The top graph is Georgia to illustrate how the algorithm works. The plot isn't time dependent. The X-axis is the total votes cast. The Y-axis is percentage of votes received. The counties are ordered from least votes cast to most votes cast. The red line is Trump, dark blue is Biden, light blue is Jorgensen. Note how Jorgensen’s line is horizontal. The attempt is to show that the results from the smaller counties tend to be an indicator of where the total will end up. Historically, once 20-30% of the votes are tabulated, the statistics will tell you the odds of a candidate winning a particular race are 98% and all the news people will project a winner at that point.

The anomaly is that this data set goes nearly linear as the larger counties are added. As you move along the X-axis, after over one million votes, the curves show almost a one-to-one (0.9815) vote add for Biden and resulting delete for Trump as a part of the whole. Now I get it that larger suburban counties surrounding large cities tend to favor the Dems, but it shouldn't be this clean of trend. The claim is that this was accomplished by a correction factor in the software, hence the need for extra time to tabulate.

The software was either transferring votes from Trump to Biden or dumping votes to 3rd party or non-Trump / non-Biden candidates. Overnight counts were stopped in certain states when it was mathematically impossible to dump enough votes to allow Biden to catch up necessitating the need for physical ballot dumps. The numbers had to made to look "plausible" or close and when it wasn't possible they needed more physical ballots.

Plots below show irregularities of non-repub / non-dem votes increasing over time. States include Georgia, Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and others. See sideways bell shaped trend.

Georgia executed a hand recount of paper ballots that was fundamentally the same outside of the poorly run counties that lost the cards. They finished wed and certified yesterday.

How did the algorithm change the election by adding votes or miscounting votes, when the paper count matches with the electronic count?

(11-20-2020 12:47 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:24 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:20 AM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:15 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Womp...womp!

Quote:GROWING CONCERN ABOUT TRUMP LEGAL FIGHT: Thursday's news conference by Trump lawyers Rudy Giuliani, Sidney Powell, and Jenna Ellis marked a turning point of sorts in the way some Republicans view the president's challenge to election results around the country. Among those Republicans -- Trump supporters all -- there is concern that the attorneys' sensational theories of election fraud are hurting the president's cause rather than helping it.

Most worrisome was Powell's presentation. The lawyer -- who had earned the admiration of many for her bold and determined representation of former Trump national security adviser Michael Flynn -- told reporters that Joe Biden's wins in some key states was the result of "the massive influence of communist money through Venezuela, Cuba, and likely China in the interference with our elections here in the United States." The Dominion voting system and Smartmatic software used in the interference, Powell continued, was "created in Venezuela at the direction of Hugo Chavez" to corrupt elections there. "President Trump won by a landslide," Powell concluded. "We are going to prove it."

But Powell did not prove it. She did not even allege with any specificity what she believes actually happened in the election. Powell said the Venezuelan software has the "ability to flip votes" and "can set and run an algorithm that probably ran all over the country to take a certain percentage of votes from President Trump and flip them to President [sic] Biden, which we might never have uncovered had the votes for President Trump not been so overwhelming in so many of these states that it broke the algorithm that had been plugged into the system, and that's what caused them to have to shut down in the states they shut down in."

But Powell offered nothing to prove what she said happened. Her case appeared to be that it could have happened. Nor has Powell or the rest of the Trump team filed a lawsuit alleging that it actually occurred. In an interview Thursday night with Fox Business Network's Lou Dobbs, Powell said the Trump team is "still in the process of collecting evidence. It's coming in in massive amounts...I would think we would have fraud complaints ready sometime by late next week at the latest."

A few hours later, Fox News' Tucker Carlson said that he had invited Powell to be on his program. "We would have given her the whole hour," Carlson said. "But she never sent us any evidence, despite a lot of requests, polite requests. Not a page.

Byron York's Daily Memo: Growing concern about Trump legal fight

I think skepticism is warranted.

There is no reason to pass judgement until they either don't file in court or the evidence is presented publicly.

Attacking them now might prove very counter-productive. It might even bolster a weak case to the point of popular acceptance.

I'll put this politely, You're being used. Used to sow doubt in a free and fair election with the sole purpose of delegitimizing the incoming administration.

It's the same thing you guys claimed with Russia Russia Russia.

Wake up and smell the coffee.

They. Have. Squat!

Why do you insist on wrongly claiming "that there is no evidence"? Do you know what evidence is? In a court of law, a witness is evidence. A sworn affidavit is basically an eye witness testimony. There is clearly evidence.

I would agree with you that at this point there may be insufficient evidence to PROVE enough fraud to change the election outcome, but I have consistently maintained that I would expect that the evidence would be insufficient at this point. Fraud cases take time and few experience DA's could investigate, file, and convict such a case in a couple of weeks. A DA would typically take a year or more to assemble their case. What I would expect to see is the typical burden of proof for injunctive relief. They need to show enough evidence to prove they have at least some reasonable chance of prevailing later. The time issue is why I continue to believe, even if we assume wide spread fraud exists, the Trump legal fight is is probably a futile effort because the time constraints probably are insufficient to gather enough evidence to prove your case.

Lets remember, it took over 2 and half years for the Russia Russia Russia fake case to be completed debunked---and that was with the aide of 17 intelligence agencies, real time electronic monitoring, bugged phones, human intelligence inside the Trump campaign, and full subpoena power. Frankly, the Trump legal team hasn't even been allowed to look into the most likely source of wide spread fraud---ie, the verification/signature matching of each mail in ballot. Again, just looking into the ballots that only have Biden marked---with no other down ballot races selected---is where I'd start with that process.

RWT is dead wrong, as usual, when he says they have squat.

No, they have lots of sworn affidavits claiming specific acts of wrong-doing by election workers in the suspect counties, and they have all these statistical anomalies that are impossible to achieve in an honest election, just like a coin can't come up heads every time in 100,000 tries.

The problem is they can't attach any of that to a specific number of votes to be thrown out for certain, and no court is going to throw out all the ballots.

But, there WAS plenty of evidence of enough cheating to sway the election (you can see it in the number of ballots dumped in the middle of the night, which was also sworn to), but no way to remedy it now. As AC said, you have to catch them before they empty the trucks.

I'm sure the Dems responsible are laughing their asses off. But for half the country, it's a scary and untenable situation to think our national election can most likely be stolen like this.

(11-20-2020 09:15 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Womp...womp!

Quote:GROWING CONCERN ABOUT TRUMP LEGAL FIGHT: Thursday's news conference by Trump lawyers Rudy Giuliani, Sidney Powell, and Jenna Ellis marked a turning point of sorts in the way some Republicans view the president's challenge to election results around the country. Among those Republicans -- Trump supporters all -- there is concern that the attorneys' sensational theories of election fraud are hurting the president's cause rather than helping it.

Most worrisome was Powell's presentation. The lawyer -- who had earned the admiration of many for her bold and determined representation of former Trump national security adviser Michael Flynn -- told reporters that Joe Biden's wins in some key states was the result of "the massive influence of communist money through Venezuela, Cuba, and likely China in the interference with our elections here in the United States." The Dominion voting system and Smartmatic software used in the interference, Powell continued, was "created in Venezuela at the direction of Hugo Chavez" to corrupt elections there. "President Trump won by a landslide," Powell concluded. "We are going to prove it."

But Powell did not prove it. She did not even allege with any specificity what she believes actually happened in the election. Powell said the Venezuelan software has the "ability to flip votes" and "can set and run an algorithm that probably ran all over the country to take a certain percentage of votes from President Trump and flip them to President [sic] Biden, which we might never have uncovered had the votes for President Trump not been so overwhelming in so many of these states that it broke the algorithm that had been plugged into the system, and that's what caused them to have to shut down in the states they shut down in."

But Powell offered nothing to prove what she said happened. Her case appeared to be that it could have happened. Nor has Powell or the rest of the Trump team filed a lawsuit alleging that it actually occurred. In an interview Thursday night with Fox Business Network's Lou Dobbs, Powell said the Trump team is "still in the process of collecting evidence. It's coming in in massive amounts...I would think we would have fraud complaints ready sometime by late next week at the latest."

A few hours later, Fox News' Tucker Carlson said that he had invited Powell to be on his program. "We would have given her the whole hour," Carlson said. "But she never sent us any evidence, despite a lot of requests, polite requests. Not a page.

Byron York's Daily Memo: Growing concern about Trump legal fight

“We are going to prove it” doesn’t mean “here, today, at this podium” at a damn press conference in front of news-stooges.

Is time running short? Yes, so they’d better hot foot it to wherever these filings need to be done, and if things like more votes came in than people that can vote, then present the obvious cases first.

We can get those jurisdictions corrected first then deal with the commie interference going forward.

if you want a circular argument, keep responding to PayolaTom. Otherwise, the smart thing is to simply put him on ignore. He can't get paid if he has no posts to respond to.

(11-20-2020 01:56 PM)TheOriginalBigApp Wrote:  if you want a circular argument, keep responding to PayolaTom. Otherwise, the smart thing is to simply put him on ignore. He can't get paid if he has no posts to respond to.

Thats exactly what I did and its working splendid!

(11-20-2020 01:56 PM)TheOriginalBigApp Wrote:  if you want a circular argument, keep responding to PayolaTom. Otherwise, the smart thing is to simply put him on ignore. He can't get paid if he has no posts to respond to.

That's no fun. He says a lot of stupid things that are easy to shoot down. Plus, I was responding to AttackCoog. :)

The trick is to make your points one time, then get out of the ensuing spiral debate before it happens. In my case, often he never responds back, anyway. But at least the room gets to see the points.

(11-20-2020 02:01 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 01:56 PM)TheOriginalBigApp Wrote:  if you want a circular argument, keep responding to PayolaTom. Otherwise, the smart thing is to simply put him on ignore. He can't get paid if he has no posts to respond to.

That's no fun. He says a lot of stupid things that are easy to shoot down. Plus, I was responding to AttackCoog. :)

The trick is to make your points one time, then get out of the ensuing spiral debate before it happens. In my case, often he never responds back, anyway. But at least the room gets to see the points.

Every village needs a Tom

(11-20-2020 01:59 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 01:56 PM)TheOriginalBigApp Wrote:  if you want a circular argument, keep responding to PayolaTom. Otherwise, the smart thing is to simply put him on ignore. He can't get paid if he has no posts to respond to.

Thats exactly what I did and its working splendid!

It works best if people would stop quoting him.

(11-20-2020 01:47 PM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 01:02 PM)DtownBronco Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 12:46 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 12:42 PM)tennis2k4 Wrote:  

(11-20-2020 09:44 AM)DtownBronco Wrote:  They have this...



Trace showing when the software intervened after the algorithm had run long enough and the AI learned what correction factor to apply. That is when the curve goes linear in vote swapping for Biden.

It worked in Georgia.

Same software was in place in MI and WI but the software couldn't solve the massive lead Trump had. Hence physical ballot vote dumps needed.

The ballots delivered to the TCF Center in Detroit had only circles darkened for Biden. No other votes down ballot.

All you are showing is if they allowed the mail in ballots to be counted ahead of time there would be no argument.

Georgia has physical ballots to back up their numbers. We know that because of the recount and the audit.

Do we have these graphs for Georgia? We shouldn't. If we do this whole line of argument seems suspect.

But if Georgia does NOT show these trends, then we need the Georgia recount and audit procedures applied to the states that do show them.

The top graph is Georgia to illustrate how the algorithm works. The plot isn't time dependent. The X-axis is the total votes cast. The Y-axis is percentage of votes received. The counties are ordered from least votes cast to most votes cast. The red line is Trump, dark blue is Biden, light blue is Jorgensen. Note how Jorgensen’s line is horizontal. The attempt is to show that the results from the smaller counties tend to be an indicator of where the total will end up. Historically, once 20-30% of the votes are tabulated, the statistics will tell you the odds of a candidate winning a particular race are 98% and all the news people will project a winner at that point.

The anomaly is that this data set goes nearly linear as the larger counties are added. As you move along the X-axis, after over one million votes, the curves show almost a one-to-one (0.9815) vote add for Biden and resulting delete for Trump as a part of the whole. Now I get it that larger suburban counties surrounding large cities tend to favor the Dems, but it shouldn't be this clean of trend. The claim is that this was accomplished by a correction factor in the software, hence the need for extra time to tabulate.

The software was either transferring votes from Trump to Biden or dumping votes to 3rd party or non-Trump / non-Biden candidates. Overnight counts were stopped in certain states when it was mathematically impossible to dump enough votes to allow Biden to catch up necessitating the need for physical ballot dumps. The numbers had to made to look "plausible" or close and when it wasn't possible they needed more physical ballots.

Plots below show irregularities of non-repub / non-dem votes increasing over time. States include Georgia, Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and others. See sideways bell shaped trend.

Georgia executed a hand recount of paper ballots that was fundamentally the same outside of the poorly run counties that lost the cards. They finished wed and certified yesterday.

How did the algorithm change the election by adding votes or miscounting votes, when the paper count matches with the electronic count?

Trump broke the algorithm. He had such a lead that the number of votes that the software calculated for Biden to take the lead exceeded the number of votes normally available in every other election in history. Explains why we are seeing reports of 99.9% voter turnout and in some strange instances over 100%. This is the reason why count stoppages occurred in the night, to manufacture more physical ballots. As GoodOwl pointed out above that is exactly why the ballots counted in the audit matches the machine count in Georgia. The AI identified the target and the ballots were created to meet it. This explains why you have all these reports of "mail-in" ballots not being folded, ballots with only one circle filled in for Biden and no other down ballot, etc. Also explains all the odd reasons we were told why the count had to stop whether it be a water main break or a break for dinner or whatever. Also explains the video of trucks driving up to the TCF center in the middle of the night in Detroit unloading wagons full of boxes.