This was the first time North Carolina has been in a major bowl since the 1949 season. Mack was telling his players the bowl was a big deal. The last time was before he was born.

This will likely be the first time Texas A&M has been ranked in the top 5 since 1956 when Bear Bryant was coach. The only other time was 1939 when they won an MNC.

(01-03-2021 11:11 AM)bullet Wrote:  This was the first time North Carolina has been in a major bowl since the 1949 season. Mack was telling his players the bowl was a big deal. The last time was before he was born.

This will likely be the first time Texas A&M has been ranked in the top 5 since 1956 when Bear Bryant was coach. The only other time was 1939 when they won an MNC.

Yes, it was 71 years to the day, January 2, 1951, when UNC had last played a major bowl. They still have never won one.

As for Mack, he looks older to me than he actually is. When I see him, I think he's 74-75, and in fact he hasn't quite hit 70 yet.

(01-03-2021 10:56 AM)esayem Wrote:  This was a great game, and TAMU definitely deserved to win. They made huge plays on offense when they needed to (usually on third down much to my chagrin) and have a great defense as well. I’m now wondering just how good Alabama really is considering what they did to the Aggies.

Carolina has a bright future and I admire Mack making the gutsy call at the end which ultimately didn’t work and lead to another TAMU touchdown.

I have no qualms with the opt-outs, but it sucks as a fan not to see them play one more time. Bowl games used to be the last opportunity for many players to showcase their ability on the grand stage before the draft. Now non-playoff bowl games are merely a preview of next season and should not even be considered an extension of the season.

I do.
The worst thing about them is that they robbed their teammates (the rest of the team that will never have the chance to sniff pro football) of an opportunity to be a major bowl champion, which would probably be the highlight of their college football career.
Collegiate athletics should be about developing leadership, the value of teamwork and overcoming adversity instead of greed and showmanship.
It reflects poorly on the character of the athletes recruited.
I'm embarrassed for my University.

(01-03-2021 11:26 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(01-03-2021 10:56 AM)esayem Wrote:  This was a great game, and TAMU definitely deserved to win. They made huge plays on offense when they needed to (usually on third down much to my chagrin) and have a great defense as well. I’m now wondering just how good Alabama really is considering what they did to the Aggies.

Carolina has a bright future and I admire Mack making the gutsy call at the end which ultimately didn’t work and lead to another TAMU touchdown.

I have no qualms with the opt-outs, but it sucks as a fan not to see them play one more time. Bowl games used to be the last opportunity for many players to showcase their ability on the grand stage before the draft. Now non-playoff bowl games are merely a preview of next season and should not even be considered an extension of the season.

I do.
The worst thing about them is that they robbed their teammates (the rest of the team that will never have the chance to sniff pro football) of an opportunity to be a major bowl champion, which would probably be the highlight of their college football career.
Collegiate athletics should be about developing leadership, the value of teamwork and overcoming adversity instead of greed and showmanship.
It reflects poorly on the character of the athletes recruited.
I'm embarrassed for my University.

I suppose that’s one way of looking at it.

(01-03-2021 11:26 AM)XLance Wrote:  It reflects poorly on the character of the athletes recruited.
I'm embarrassed for my University.

You should be embarrassed by your university. Any of us who went to a P5 school should be embarrassed by what happens when a school/team doesn’t make one of two bowls. I hate the NFL Pro Bowl for this reason, and these non-playoff games become just that: self-indulgent tripe.

You can choose to shame the kids for protecting themselves and their career prospects at a level that hardly favors or supports them rather than the institution and coaching/administrative staff. In a sport where any injury has huge impacts on financial prospects. Shame that first, imo. I’m glad kids opt out. It’s a fixable problem. Simply expand the playoff to get more teams in. Or justify the risk assumed playing meaningless games (because this bowl was).

(01-03-2021 01:19 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(01-03-2021 11:26 AM)XLance Wrote:  It reflects poorly on the character of the athletes recruited.
I'm embarrassed for my University.

You should be embarrassed by your university. Any of us who went to a P5 school should be embarrassed by what happens when a school/team doesn’t make one of two bowls. I hate the NFL Pro Bowl for this reason, and these non-playoff games become just that: self-indulgent tripe.

You can choose to shame the kids for protecting themselves and their career prospects at a level that hardly favors or supports them rather than the institution and coaching/administrative staff. In a sport where any injury has huge impacts on financial prospects. Shame that first, imo. I’m glad kids opt out. It’s a fixable problem. Simply expand the playoff to get more teams in. Or justify the risk assumed playing meaningless games (because this bowl was).

I don't buy this argument for expanding playoffs. First, if a kid's focus is the NFL and that's what we should care about, then his entire college career is meaningless, save as a stepping-stone to the NFL. If expanded playoffs induce him to stick around and play, that's really bad for him because he's risking the same kind of injury that he could get in a bowl game. Expanded playoffs are in that sense a kind of tar-pit that could trap a kid by playing on his natural competitiveness, at the risk of his real professional career.

Second, if by "meaningless" we mean not having much if any bearing on who wins the national title, bowl games are not any less meaningless now than they always have been. Under the BCS, the only bowl that mattered was the BCS title game. In the pre-BCS era, when it was strictly polls and bowls, usually only a couple of bowls mattered, the ones in which the #1 and #2 teams were playing in.

In all decades, save in the very distant past when there were only a handful of bowl games**, the bulk of bowls have been meaningless. And yet bowl season has always been awesome, and remains so today.

** And even then, the bowls were meaningless, because the polls voted on the champ before the bowl games.

(01-03-2021 03:03 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(01-03-2021 01:19 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(01-03-2021 11:26 AM)XLance Wrote:  It reflects poorly on the character of the athletes recruited.
I'm embarrassed for my University.

You should be embarrassed by your university. Any of us who went to a P5 school should be embarrassed by what happens when a school/team doesn’t make one of two bowls. I hate the NFL Pro Bowl for this reason, and these non-playoff games become just that: self-indulgent tripe.

You can choose to shame the kids for protecting themselves and their career prospects at a level that hardly favors or supports them rather than the institution and coaching/administrative staff. In a sport where any injury has huge impacts on financial prospects. Shame that first, imo. I’m glad kids opt out. It’s a fixable problem. Simply expand the playoff to get more teams in. Or justify the risk assumed playing meaningless games (because this bowl was).

I don't buy this argument for expanding playoffs. First, if a kid's focus is the NFL and that's what we should care about, then his entire college career is meaningless, save as a stepping-stone to the NFL. If expanded playoffs induce him to stick around and play, that's really bad for him because he's risking the same kind of injury that he could get in a bowl game. Expanded playoffs are in that sense a kind of tar-pit that could trap a kid by playing on his natural competitiveness, at the risk of his real professional career.

Second, if by "meaningless" we mean not having much if any bearing on who wins the national title, bowl games are not any less meaningless now than they always have been. Under the BCS, the only bowl that mattered was the BCS title game. In the pre-BCS era, when it was strictly polls and bowls, usually only a couple of bowls mattered, the ones in which the #1 and #2 teams were playing in.

In all decades, save in the very distant past when there were only a handful of bowl games**, the bulk of bowls have been meaningless. And yet bowl season has always been awesome, and remains so today.

** And even then, the bowls were meaningless, because the polls voted on the champ before the bowl games.

And in those days, it really was treated by most teams as an exhibition. It was a nice trip as a reward for a good season. That's what people who look back at those things in the 60s and 70s don't understand.

(01-03-2021 11:04 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(01-03-2021 10:59 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(01-03-2021 10:56 AM)esayem Wrote:  This was a great game, and TAMU definitely deserved to win. They made huge plays on offense when they needed to (usually on third down much to my chagrin) and have a great defense as well. I’m now wondering just how good Alabama really is considering what they did to the Aggies.

Carolina has a bright future and I admire Mack making the gutsy call at the end which ultimately didn’t work and lead to another TAMU touchdown.

I have no qualms with the opt-outs, but it sucks as a fan not to see them play one more time. Bowl games used to be the last opportunity for many players to showcase their ability on the grand stage before the draft. Now non-playoff bowl games are merely a preview of next season and should not even be considered an extension of the season.

We did have more opt-outs in the non-playoff bowls this year, but I am not sure this is going to be a trend. The virus has created unique conditions that I think encouraged more opt-outs then usual. The incentives for opting out didn't really change from this year compared to previous years, the virus is the big thing that is different.

I think the opt outs will continue to grow as it gets to be more common. Before a lot of players didn't even think about it.

Especially for non playoff games

I don’t disagree about other irrelevant bowls in prior systems, but, the relevancy issue for this system is front and present for any number of reasons. I’ll admit I’m hard on the schools, FBS, and the bowls, but the pro game/level is also guilty here. I would say that in years past, you had a lot of programs playing in the dark and offering only few opportunities (games with majors who had network/conference deals, bowls, and senior bowls) as a way to be seen and assessed. That is not the case (or as much nearly the case) as it is now. I think the non-playoff bowls present added risk for kids who can be more accessible than their predecessors and simply don’t know what level of maturity awaits them across the line. Back in BCS and prior, maybe not a lot unlike FCS today, some talent did not have a stage, and the national bowl provided it.

But, the (still) low hanging fruit on this one is player compensation. Assume the risk of an added meaningless game, for what? I’d also toss it at the coaches who either peace out from programs or let their kids “let it all out” at the game, where you can see some dirty, unfair, and unfortunate stuff. The pro prospects know better now. I’m sure their respective coaches are probably agreeable to it, too. And good luck purging lawyers and agents speaking with the kids at that point.

This is only a problem for non-playoff games, for now. It’ll be interesting if we ever see it to a big degree in the playoffs. I’m surprised with Covid that this didn’t happen. Heck, quite the opposite. I would have thought for sure Fields was done after his ribs got cracked like that. Kudos to him, but, I bet he isn’t seeing the field if OSU isn’t in the playoffs, or at least wouldn’t return. When this happens in the playoffs, now there may be another point to be had about players...

Are bowl games meaningless? No, not for TV or sports fans. Not for coaches planning next season or players looking to rise up the depth chart. Not for the vast majority of seniors that won’t play a down professionally. Like I mentioned before, bowls used to be a way for a player to showcase their abilities on the grand stage: I think it might have worked in Carolina’s backs favor to show what they can do against a legitimate top defense. I understand why somebody would whisper in their ears not to play though.

Are bowl games as important as they once were? Depends. There used to be so few that they were naturally more important for teams reaching the bowl games. They meant more in a sense that they were harder to come by. In the 70’s, there were just as many teams eligible for bowls as now, maybe more (ask DavidSt). It was a feather in the cap to make a bowl game and teams like Notre Dame turned down bowls unless they made a major one—imagine that!

I love bowl games, but I don’t love the corporate BS names on a lot of them. They aren’t going anywhere. It would be nice if a player could get a fat contract inked up before the bowl games.

Bowl games are declining.

1) is the number of them. It used to be a treat for fans and players. Now nearly every .500 FBS program goes.
2) is the cost for fans and schools. Tickets and hotel stay requirements and prices have gone way up. Also see #1.
3) is the NFL. More and more players will opt out. With the proliferation, its not a new experience.
4) is the students. The average viewer of college football is over 50. Younger people aren't as into it as prior generations.
5) is the number of students--going to local colleges and community colleges instead of State U. There are more people with ties to universities other than State U. And so the "T-shirt" fans are less enthusiastic as a whole.

They aren't going away, but neither did the NIT. It is just far less important.

(01-04-2021 01:26 PM)bullet Wrote:  Bowl games are declining.

1) is the number of them. It used to be a treat for fans and players. Now nearly every .500 FBS program goes.
2) is the cost for fans and schools. Tickets and hotel stay requirements and prices have gone way up. Also see #1.
3) is the NFL. More and more players will opt out. With the proliferation, its not a new experience.
4) is the students. The average viewer of college football is over 50. Younger people aren't as into it as prior generations.
5) is the number of students--going to local colleges and community colleges instead of State U. There are more people with ties to universities other than State U. And so the "T-shirt" fans are less enthusiastic as a whole.

They aren't going away, but neither did the NIT. It is just far less important.

The decline of bowls may be the reason for CFP expansion. Why play a bunch of meaningless exhibition games when you can put those same teams into a playoff where every game counts?

Bowls ...Before Season ...In September ...Big Kick off for Season....Playoffs after Season ..Just like ALL other College Sports ..!!!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

(01-04-2021 12:11 PM)esayem Wrote:  Are bowl games meaningless? No, not for TV or sports fans. Not for coaches planning next season or players looking to rise up the depth chart. Not for the vast majority of seniors that won’t play a down professionally.

I love bowl season as well. The 10-12 days or so between December 20 and January 1st with games on every day is great fun, I watch as many as I can and always look forward to it.

And sure, while there are NFL opt outs and even some teams that aren't motivated, most bowl games are very competitive. Countless times, I have seen a random 4th place CUSA team rush the field and douse their coach with Gatorade because they just beat the 4th place MAC team in something like the Boca Raton Bowl on a last second FG. Usually, motivation is very high.

Pro prospects opting out is one thing that seems to be creeping up on this game. Just wait for the impact of the transfer rule relaxations.

IMO, I suspect the transfer portal is going to make this game get very ugly no matter where the game is played. It’s one thing to see kids opt out of a bowl game because it denies a game where we can see a future pro play one last time for dear old state. No curtain call for us. The portal impacts practically every slot on a team. You might not know or care about the kids choosing to move on (or you might if the star player at tiny school is looking to move up and out to big school), but it’s potentially more disruptive to seasons and bowls.

I was reading on the PSU boards about guys already putting themselves out there about the portal. Like, heck, do you need this distraction on a team at any time during the season?

(01-03-2021 11:26 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(01-03-2021 10:56 AM)esayem Wrote:  This was a great game, and TAMU definitely deserved to win. They made huge plays on offense when they needed to (usually on third down much to my chagrin) and have a great defense as well. I’m now wondering just how good Alabama really is considering what they did to the Aggies.

Carolina has a bright future and I admire Mack making the gutsy call at the end which ultimately didn’t work and lead to another TAMU touchdown.

I have no qualms with the opt-outs, but it sucks as a fan not to see them play one more time. Bowl games used to be the last opportunity for many players to showcase their ability on the grand stage before the draft. Now non-playoff bowl games are merely a preview of next season and should not even be considered an extension of the season.

I do.
The worst thing about them is that they robbed their teammates (the rest of the team that will never have the chance to sniff pro football) of an opportunity to be a major bowl champion, which would probably be the highlight of their college football career.
Collegiate athletics should be about developing leadership, the value of teamwork and overcoming adversity instead of greed and showmanship.
It reflects poorly on the character of the athletes recruited.
I'm embarrassed for my University.

Fully agree that you should be embarrassed by your university, but not for this reason.

Imagine you major in anything other than football. I was a business major, for example. Let's say you work your tail off, land an internship, impress potential employers, and are offered a great job during your last semester.

The company that gave you the internship calls and says you can come in for one extra day of work before you move on. There will be a pizza party at the end of the day(yay), along with a fun drawing where a couple of you might lose your job offer. Are you signing up?