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The NCAA just caved
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stever20 Online
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Post: #21
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 02:37 PM)Gamecock Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 01:32 PM)VNova Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 01:25 PM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 01:12 PM)Wedge Wrote:  NCAA didn't cave. They are just slow-walking this whole thing. They will stall as long as possible, and will keep doing so until they absolutely have to do more. And then they will do as little as they can possibly get away with.

I bet you just nailed this. Watch for some sort of "committee" to be set up to study the feasibility of all this and then just come up with excuse after excuse to stall this. They were on a collision course to being forced to change with no say so in the matter. If they give the appearance of working towards changing it they can if nothing else control the pace at which it happens and maybe limit it in some way.

Each division has to come up with their own rules and specific details. So we'll probably see a rough draft in a few years.

They set a deadline of 1/1/21

Realistically it'll probably be around summer/fall 2020 which means the soonest we get a video game is probably summer 2021.

Still, baby steps

I think even if they could start working on it today, it'd be more like the Summer of 22 that it'd be ready.... Especially since I think they're going to new systems soon...
10-29-2019 02:44 PM
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quo vadis Online
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Post: #22
RE: The NCAA just caved
No details so a Nothingburger so far.
10-29-2019 02:53 PM
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Ohio Poly Offline
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Post: #23
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 01:56 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  The NCAA won't move faster than they have to, but they will move.

Because they'll have to...

Tons of states are talking about or already have passed laws allowing for this. Congress is talking about it.

Basically, if the NCAA doesn't come to terms with reality and make some changes relatively soon then they will have a huge mess on their hands. It's true they will never change of their own free will, but they won't have a choice this time.

2023 is the California deadline; other states are working on earlier deadlines. NCAA is not driving the bus now, they will follow on as required by the states.
10-29-2019 02:56 PM
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SoCalBobcat78 Online
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RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 01:12 PM)Wedge Wrote:  NCAA didn't cave. They are just slow-walking this whole thing. They will stall as long as possible, and will keep doing so until they absolutely have to do more. And then they will do as little as they can possibly get away with.

They caved. These are the same guys that were going to ban California schools from the NCAA. What happened to that? They cannot run to the politicians for help. They can't run to the courts for help. They can slow walk it for the next three years, but it goes into effect in California on January 1, 2023. There are other states that are offering legislation with a more aggressive timeline. They caved.
10-29-2019 02:57 PM
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stever20 Online
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Post: #25
RE: The NCAA just caved
I just think it's funny this happens and within 2-3 hours EA Sports has started trending (after NCAA 21 was earlier today).

Has there ever been a game as loved as NCAA Football?
10-29-2019 03:00 PM
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Post: #26
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 02:57 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 01:12 PM)Wedge Wrote:  NCAA didn't cave. They are just slow-walking this whole thing. They will stall as long as possible, and will keep doing so until they absolutely have to do more. And then they will do as little as they can possibly get away with.

They caved. These are the same guys that were going to ban California schools from the NCAA. What happened to that? They cannot run to the politicians for help. They can't run to the courts for help. They can slow walk it for the next three years, but it goes into effect in California on January 1, 2023. There are other states that are offering legislation with a more aggressive timeline. They caved.
Nothing but Posturing. It was also probably early on before the barrage of states that followed California’s law with their own proposals.
10-29-2019 03:02 PM
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goodknightfl Offline
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RE: The NCAA just caved
This will be a big help to the 1 to 5% of college players with a name/following big enough to bring out enough fans to make their likeness of any real value. For 95% of college athletes it will make no difference.
10-29-2019 03:18 PM
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chester Offline
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Post: #28
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 02:57 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 01:12 PM)Wedge Wrote:  NCAA didn't cave. They are just slow-walking this whole thing. They will stall as long as possible, and will keep doing so until they absolutely have to do more. And then they will do as little as they can possibly get away with.

They caved. These are the same guys that were going to ban California schools from the NCAA. What happened to that? They cannot run to the politicians for help. They can't run to the courts for help. They can slow walk it for the next three years, but it goes into effect in California on January 1, 2023. There are other states that are offering legislation with a more aggressive timeline. They caved.

They have not caved. Unless I've missed something, all the BoG has done is tell NCAA divisions to "consider" rule changes.

They certainly have not caved to what California wants, which is unrestricted access to the market outside of conflicting player/school contracts. If they have, Illinois schools would not have been directed to send this letter to Illinois' Governor and legislature just yesterday -- Illinois being poised to become the second state to pass NIL legislation, legislation that is provisionally the same as the Cali law in all respects.
10-29-2019 03:35 PM
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Post: #29
RE: The NCAA just caved
"...Student-athletes must be treated similarly to non-athlete students, must not be treated like employees of their respective universities, and there should be a “clear distinction between college and professional opportunities,” the NCAA said...."

This should be one of the key components of any change.
10-29-2019 03:39 PM
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SoCalBobcat78 Online
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Post: #30
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 03:35 PM)chester Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 02:57 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 01:12 PM)Wedge Wrote:  NCAA didn't cave. They are just slow-walking this whole thing. They will stall as long as possible, and will keep doing so until they absolutely have to do more. And then they will do as little as they can possibly get away with.

They caved. These are the same guys that were going to ban California schools from the NCAA. What happened to that? They cannot run to the politicians for help. They can't run to the courts for help. They can slow walk it for the next three years, but it goes into effect in California on January 1, 2023. There are other states that are offering legislation with a more aggressive timeline. They caved.

They have not caved. Unless I've missed something, all the BoG has done is tell NCAA divisions to "consider" rule changes.

They certainly have not caved to what California wants, which is unrestricted access to the market outside of conflicting player/school contracts. If they have, Illinois schools would not have been directed to send this letter to Illinois' Governor and legislature just yesterday -- Illinois being poised to become the second state to pass NIL legislation, legislation that is provisionally the same as the Cali law in all respects.

From the NCAA: The working group will continue to gather feedback through April on how best to respond to the state and federal legislative environment and to refine its recommendations on the principles and regulatory framework. The board asked each division to create any new rules beginning immediately, but no later than January 2021.

They know they have to have something in place real soon because states like California will have an unfair advantage in recruiting. They were threatening the State of California with banishment and the state just basically yawned. The NCAA barked but they had no bite.
10-29-2019 03:52 PM
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Post: #31
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 03:39 PM)bullet Wrote:  "...Student-athletes must be treated similarly to non-athlete students, must not be treated like employees of their respective universities, and there should be a “clear distinction between college and professional opportunities,” the NCAA said...."

This should be one of the key components of any change.

Bullet I agree with you in theory. In reality the camel's nose is under the tent and the demands are just getting started.

I still say the most defensible position would be to adopt the current policies of the IOC with regards to endorsements and amateurism.
10-29-2019 03:55 PM
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mpurdy22 Offline
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Post: #32
RE: The NCAA just caved
First domino fell already. Saw a tweet that Senator Richard Burr from NC says that if Athletes "cash in" on getting paid, he will introduce legislation then that treats scholarships as income. This will bring about a lot of taxation questions and can these athletes muddle through this responsibly.
10-29-2019 04:00 PM
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RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 04:00 PM)mpurdy22 Wrote:  First domino fell already. Saw a tweet that Senator Richard Burr from NC says that if Athletes "cash in" on getting paid, he will introduce legislation then that treats scholarships as income. This will bring about a lot of taxation questions and can these athletes muddle through this responsibly.

It should be counted for tax purposes as income along with all other perks (food, dorms, book/laptop expenses, tutoring costs, etc.) along with their stipends.

And when they become employees of the University (and in most cases the state), then they should not be counted against Title IX. This is the first thread to be pulled that will eventually unravel the entire garment of amateurism, and which should eventually lead to the demise of the NCAA. Once the nature of the relationship is determined by the courts then all that was built upon the old classification will change as well.

The NCAA has agreed to images and likenesses. That is their best bet to keep power. But the likelihood of this simply ending there is remote.
(This post was last modified: 10-29-2019 04:35 PM by JRsec.)
10-29-2019 04:33 PM
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RE: The NCAA just caved
Everything beyond tuition, books, and fees is taxable if you read the tax code.

The IRS just hasn't ever spent any energy on chasing students for the taxes due on housing, meals, and stipends.
10-29-2019 04:36 PM
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chester Offline
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Post: #35
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 03:52 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 03:35 PM)chester Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 02:57 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 01:12 PM)Wedge Wrote:  NCAA didn't cave. They are just slow-walking this whole thing. They will stall as long as possible, and will keep doing so until they absolutely have to do more. And then they will do as little as they can possibly get away with.

They caved. These are the same guys that were going to ban California schools from the NCAA. What happened to that? They cannot run to the politicians for help. They can't run to the courts for help. They can slow walk it for the next three years, but it goes into effect in California on January 1, 2023. There are other states that are offering legislation with a more aggressive timeline. They caved.

They have not caved. Unless I've missed something, all the BoG has done is tell NCAA divisions to "consider" rule changes.

They certainly have not caved to what California wants, which is unrestricted access to the market outside of conflicting player/school contracts. If they have, Illinois schools would not have been directed to send this letter to Illinois' Governor and legislature just yesterday -- Illinois being poised to become the second state to pass NIL legislation, legislation that is provisionally the same as the Cali law in all respects.

From the NCAA: The working group will continue to gather feedback through April on how best to respond to the state and federal legislative environment and to refine its recommendations on the principles and regulatory framework. The board asked each division to create any new rules beginning immediately, but no later than January 2021.

They know they have to have something in place real soon because states like California will have an unfair advantage in recruiting. They were threatening the State of California with banishment and the state just basically yawned. The NCAA barked but they had no bite.

I agree that they know that they will have to do something eventually. But whatever it is they want evidently falls short of what at least some states want for their citizens. The NCAA will want to control what is and is not a permissible NIL deal and, I dare say, what is and is not a "valid" $ amount.
10-29-2019 04:50 PM
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Post: #36
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 03:18 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  This will be a big help to the 1 to 5% of college players with a name/following big enough to bring out enough fans to make their likeness of any real value. For 95% of college athletes it will make no difference.

Unless, as an example, Nike, Adidas, UA decide to fund a payroll for certain programs.
Pay the scholly athletes, or the roster, 100K a year in exchange for using their likeness on a shoe box or whatever.
10-29-2019 05:23 PM
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chester Offline
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Post: #37
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 05:23 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 03:18 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  This will be a big help to the 1 to 5% of college players with a name/following big enough to bring out enough fans to make their likeness of any real value. For 95% of college athletes it will make no difference.

Unless, as an example, Nike, Adidas, UA decide to fund a payroll for certain programs.
Pay the scholly athletes, or the roster, 100K a year in exchange for using their likeness on a shoe box or whatever.

Would have to be all of the schools they're contracted with. Otherwise, you're pissing folks off, and losing continued deals.
10-29-2019 05:30 PM
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SoCalBobcat78 Online
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Post: #38
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 04:50 PM)chester Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 03:52 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 03:35 PM)chester Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 02:57 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 01:12 PM)Wedge Wrote:  NCAA didn't cave. They are just slow-walking this whole thing. They will stall as long as possible, and will keep doing so until they absolutely have to do more. And then they will do as little as they can possibly get away with.

They caved. These are the same guys that were going to ban California schools from the NCAA. What happened to that? They cannot run to the politicians for help. They can't run to the courts for help. They can slow walk it for the next three years, but it goes into effect in California on January 1, 2023. There are other states that are offering legislation with a more aggressive timeline. They caved.

They have not caved. Unless I've missed something, all the BoG has done is tell NCAA divisions to "consider" rule changes.

They certainly have not caved to what California wants, which is unrestricted access to the market outside of conflicting player/school contracts. If they have, Illinois schools would not have been directed to send this letter to Illinois' Governor and legislature just yesterday -- Illinois being poised to become the second state to pass NIL legislation, legislation that is provisionally the same as the Cali law in all respects.

From the NCAA: The working group will continue to gather feedback through April on how best to respond to the state and federal legislative environment and to refine its recommendations on the principles and regulatory framework. The board asked each division to create any new rules beginning immediately, but no later than January 2021.

They know they have to have something in place real soon because states like California will have an unfair advantage in recruiting. They were threatening the State of California with banishment and the state just basically yawned. The NCAA barked but they had no bite.

I agree that they know that they will have to do something eventually. But whatever it is they want evidently falls short of what at least some states want for their citizens. The NCAA will want to control what is and is not a permissible NIL deal and, I dare say, what is and is not a "valid" $ amount.

The NCAA will eventually come forward with something that looks very similar to what California passed. They will talk about how the new rules, "Reaffirm that student-athletes are students first and not employees of the university." They will congratulate each other on their hard work and thank NCAA President Mark Emmert for his leadership. They will protect their bloated salaries.
10-29-2019 05:37 PM
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Renandpat Offline
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Post: #39
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 02:14 PM)chester Wrote:  Bunch of bologna.

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/medi...ortunities

Quote:The Board of Governors’ action directs each of the NCAA’s three divisions to immediately consider updates to relevant bylaws and policies for the 21st century, said Michael V. Drake, chair of the board and president of The Ohio State University.

Yep, they're stalling.

Quote:Assure student-athletes are treated similarly to non-athlete students unless a compelling reason exists to differentiate.

There it is. "You can do it if we say you can."

Quote:Make clear the distinction between collegiate and professional opportunities.

In other words, "No, you can't do that or "No, you can't make that much money. We don't think you have that much marketability."

Quote:The working group will continue to gather feedback through April on how best to respond to the state and federal legislative environment and to refine its recommendations on the principles and regulatory framework. The board asked each division to create any new rules beginning immediately, but no later than January 2021.

Uh huh. Most state legislatures are session through the first few months of the year only. The NCAA is hoping to forestall more laws with this announcement.

You forgot the most important line in the NCAA's release:
Quote:to benefit from the use of their name, image and likeness in a manner consistent with the collegiate model.

The Florida bill, already introduced, would become law on July 1, 2020.

IMO, the NCAA still wants to guide this thing federally thought Rep. Gonzales, but it seems too late for that, as SB 206 author Nancy Skinner wrote today on Twitter.
Quote:California has made it clear that we won't accept any arbitrary limitations on college athletes' right to their name, image, and likeness.
10-29-2019 05:40 PM
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chester Offline
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Post: #40
RE: The NCAA just caved
(10-29-2019 05:37 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 04:50 PM)chester Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 03:52 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 03:35 PM)chester Wrote:  
(10-29-2019 02:57 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  They caved. These are the same guys that were going to ban California schools from the NCAA. What happened to that? They cannot run to the politicians for help. They can't run to the courts for help. They can slow walk it for the next three years, but it goes into effect in California on January 1, 2023. There are other states that are offering legislation with a more aggressive timeline. They caved.

They have not caved. Unless I've missed something, all the BoG has done is tell NCAA divisions to "consider" rule changes.

They certainly have not caved to what California wants, which is unrestricted access to the market outside of conflicting player/school contracts. If they have, Illinois schools would not have been directed to send this letter to Illinois' Governor and legislature just yesterday -- Illinois being poised to become the second state to pass NIL legislation, legislation that is provisionally the same as the Cali law in all respects.

From the NCAA: The working group will continue to gather feedback through April on how best to respond to the state and federal legislative environment and to refine its recommendations on the principles and regulatory framework. The board asked each division to create any new rules beginning immediately, but no later than January 2021.

They know they have to have something in place real soon because states like California will have an unfair advantage in recruiting. They were threatening the State of California with banishment and the state just basically yawned. The NCAA barked but they had no bite.

I agree that they know that they will have to do something eventually. But whatever it is they want evidently falls short of what at least some states want for their citizens. The NCAA will want to control what is and is not a permissible NIL deal and, I dare say, what is and is not a "valid" $ amount.

The NCAA will eventually come forward with something that looks very similar to what California passed. They will talk about how the new rules, "Reaffirm that student-athletes are students first and not employees of the university." They will congratulate each other on their hard work and thank NCAA President Mark Emmert for his leadership. They will protect their bloated salaries.

lol, now that, that would be just fine. 04-cheers Don't mind at all if the NCAA pretends to be for something that it really isn't. As long as what's right gets done.

But first, the NCAA will try its hand with its lackey in Congress, Anthony Ganzalez, who, along with the NCAA's lobbyists, will try for Federal legislation that meets the NCAA's truest, most restricting NIL desires.
(This post was last modified: 10-29-2019 06:06 PM by chester.)
10-29-2019 06:04 PM
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