(08-27-2019 08:22 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 06:15 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  I bet they get a 3-year waiver.

They shouldn't get any waiver except for a couple of years for division play without round robin, like the MAC got.

If they want to pair the two best teams, play a round robin. If necessary, kick someone out.

But who would get the boot? Tulsa? East Carolina? Those are the two weakest schools I can think of. I think Tulane is safe given their location and academics.

Could they do it though? Has it happened before? Temple was football only in the Big East, C-USA 2.0 helped Charlotte and St Louis find a new home in the A-10, the MAC gave an ultimatum to football only UMass and the Sun Belt told football only Idaho and NMSU to find a new home but other than that I can’t think of any case where an all-sports school got kicked out.

Hopefully NCAA says no
Divisionless CCG is just stupid

(08-27-2019 09:39 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  Hopefully NCAA says no
Divisionless CCG is just stupid

At one time some feller said a CCG was stupid, having a playoff was stupid, having 14 teams in a conference was stupid, but nowadays not allowing a conference to decide their champion their way IS stupid!

(08-27-2019 05:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/statu...5291607040

Quote:AAC commissioner Mike Aresco tells
@929espn
the AAC will get rid of divisions starting next season. League is applying for a waiver so football title game will pit AAC's two best teams - same format as the Big 12

That may be the plan---but I dont see it working. Maybe its just an attempt to kick start a discussion among the conferences that will eventually morph into a coalition of conferences with enough votes to pass a rule change. Ive always felt that it would be easier to get a rule change for divisionless CCG's than a AAC waiver for a divisionless CCG.

(08-27-2019 09:12 PM)oliveandblue Wrote:  It doesn't hurt anyone if the AAC is allowed to reformat divisions.

Someone might object if the AAC is the only conference permitted to have a divisionless CCG without a round robin.

Guess we'll see what happens when they actually ask for a waiver.

(08-27-2019 09:37 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 08:22 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 06:15 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  I bet they get a 3-year waiver.

They shouldn't get any waiver except for a couple of years for division play without round robin, like the MAC got.

If they want to pair the two best teams, play a round robin. If necessary, kick someone out.

But who would get the boot? Tulsa? East Carolina? Those are the two weakest schools I can think of. I think Tulane is safe given their location and academics.

Could they do it though? Has it happened before? Temple was football only in the Big East, C-USA 2.0 helped Charlotte and St Louis find a new home in the A-10, the MAC gave an ultimatum to football only UMass and the Sun Belt told football only Idaho and NMSU to find a new home but other than that I can’t think of any case where an all-sports school got kicked out.

Marshal was booted out of the MAC in 1969 due to NCAA violations so it has happened before but it is rare and I do not see the AAC doing it for that specific reason.

(08-27-2019 05:23 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/statu...5291607040

Quote:AAC commissioner Mike Aresco tells
@929espn
the AAC will get rid of divisions starting next season. League is applying for a waiver so football title game will pit AAC's two best teams - same format as the Big 12

Not gonna work for Navy. No way they cancel Army, Air Force, or ND.

Will be interesting to see if they knock down the door and all conferences can scrap worthless divisions.

Who’s saying they need to? This is about league games not noncon.

(08-27-2019 09:32 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:12 PM)oliveandblue Wrote:  It doesn't hurt anyone if the AAC is allowed to reformat divisions. If I am a G5 conference, the last thing I want is a motivated AAC looking to poach.

If I am a P5 conference, I am not competing with them for an access bowl so who cares.

The NCAA doesn’t recognize P5 or G5, so there is no way the AAC is getting preferential treatment. They MAY be allowed 6 and 5 team divisions as a loophole, but no way they’re getting what every conference can benefit from: no divisions, no round robin, but a CCG. Not without everyone else.

actually the NCAA is one of the main things that makes a P5 conference

or as the NCAA calls them "the autonomy conferences"

the P5 conferences get two votes per conference on NCAA rules while the G5 get one vote per conference

what makes a P5 conference

1. two votes on NCAA business vs one

2. NCAA football playoff share in the $50 million range

3. NY6 bowl game guarantee with a $27.5 (ACC) to $40 million dollar payout (Big 12, SEC SEC SEC, Big 10, PAC 12)

without those things you are nothing like a P5 conference

the two votes per P5 conference is what makes getting a waiver or anything else so tricky for the AAC

SEC SEC SEC was against any CCG changes there is nothing to suggest they will have a change of heart....so -2 right there

the Big 10 was the one that wrote the rules calling for the full conference round robin if you did not want divisions and wanted your two top teams in the CCG.....there has been whispers they might regret that, but nothing firm......most likely still a -2

the ACC wanted full CCG autonomy and the Big 10 screwed them.....the ACC would be for a full rule change, but I see no way they will allow a waiver for something they cannot also do -2

so there is 6 no votes right there....the PAC 12 did not care last time, but voted "present".....they will most likely vote how the Big 10 votes so there is -2

so right there 8 out of 15 votes measure fails

and again we are talking about a "waiver" is what the tweets said not a full rule change.....even if the Big 10 is interested in changing the rule I see zero chance the give a waiver to the AAC just like I see zero chance the ACC gives a waiver

why would either of those conferences allow the AAC to have something they cannot.....and none of the P5 conferences care about "stability"

and really the stability argument from the AAC is a joke anyway when they were all crawling under the table blowing david boren trying to get in the Big 12 they did not give a damn about "stability" that is why the AAC voted against ANY CCG changes because they thought they would force the Big 12 to have to expand

conferences do not vote "for the conference" they vote how a majority of the members say to vote and enough AAC members thought they had a chance to get in the Big 12 that they threw "stability" in the trash both for the AAC and other G5 conferences and tried to vote to force the Big 12 to have to expand to get a CCG....they FAILED

there is no reason to think the MWC is worried at all about losing a member and they have ZERO reasons to give the AAC a more favorable CCG match up so -1

the MAC is not worried about losing a member and again no reason to help the AAC have a more favorable CCG so -1

the Sunbelt same thing -1

that leaves the CUSA.....full of members that like the AAC are stupid enough to think they will get the call if the AAC is forced to expand.....so those members vote to have the conference vote no on a waiver -1

so you have 1 for to 4 against in the G5

so 12 out of 15 votes against

that leaves the Big 12....they should return the favor to the AAC and vote no, but they are probably not that smart or that strategic so possible +2

so you have 3 votes for 12 against

and again we are talking "waiver"......no matter what the Big 10 and ACC might want long term if the vote is for a "waiver" they will almost certainly vote against along with the SEC SEC SEC

there seems to be little chance this passes

(08-27-2019 05:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/statu...5291607040

Quote:AAC commissioner Mike Aresco tells
@929espn
the AAC will get rid of divisions starting next season. League is applying for a waiver so football title game will pit AAC's two best teams - same format as the Big 12

Can't see that being approved, as it's a back door to end Divisions without a formal decision. Certainly the SEC and B12 would be against it. CUSA, SBC and ACC would want the same waiver, the B1G would probably as well. That's too many potential exceptions, and the waiver would be seen as special treatment, something the B1G objected to with the ACC.

I'm dead certain option #4 will be the waiver they get. But the P5 will speed up the discussion on ending divisions, which I think they will. But they are not going to open Pandora's Box via waivers.

2nd comment. By going so public with this Aresco is trying to force a decision in his favor. That is not going to go over well with the commissioners of the other conferences that don't like being told what to do. The AAC is not in a position to tell the SEC, P12, B12, ACC and B1G what to do for them. They will decide on their own timeline. This may even incline them to give a shorter waiver length. Aresco is going to be spending a good deal of his time trying smooth things over at the next meeting of the commissioners.

(08-27-2019 05:23 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/statu...5291607040

Quote:AAC commissioner Mike Aresco tells
@929espn
the AAC will get rid of divisions starting next season. League is applying for a waiver so football title game will pit AAC's two best teams - same format as the Big 12

Not gonna work for Navy. No way they cancel Army, Air Force, or ND.

Will be interesting to see if they knock down the door and all conferences can scrap worthless divisions.

It's not a round robin. Still just 8 conference games, so no impact on Navy at all.

(08-27-2019 09:47 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:39 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  Hopefully NCAA says no
Divisionless CCG is just stupid

At one time some feller said a CCG was stupid, having a playoff was stupid, having 14 teams in a conference was stupid, but nowadays not allowing a conference to decide their champion their way IS stupid!

Divisionless ccgs are stupid.

The justification for the extra game is that you can't play everyone in those larger conferences. That's not the case in the Big 12.

(08-27-2019 08:12 PM)esayem Wrote:  There is no way they get some extended waiver on this. The NCAA will need something in writing about finding a replacement or it will be rejected. Play everyone or have divisions. No G5 is going to get a waiver when the ACC didn’t.

*If they are allowed unbalanced divisions, could be a loophole.

Unbalanced divisions ARE already allowed, and that would likely be the AAC's fallback if they don't get the waiver.

Personally, I think the NCAA will give the AAC a 2 or 3 year waiver, and thus kick the can down the road on a rule change.

(08-27-2019 09:39 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  Hopefully NCAA says no
Divisionless CCG is just stupid

The Big 12 has one every year, lol. Round robin, of course, but still a divisionless CCG.

(08-27-2019 07:50 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 06:29 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 06:15 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  I bet they get a 3-year waiver.

This will be permanent Quo. The ACC wants this as well. I suspect the Big 10, MWC and maybe the SEC wants this and the other 6 conferences will comply.

I would think the MAC, CUSA, and SBC would want this for sure as well so they wouldn't be in danger of getting raided by the AAC if they're forced to get a 12th team.

huh?

(08-27-2019 09:37 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 08:22 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 06:15 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  I bet they get a 3-year waiver.

They shouldn't get any waiver except for a couple of years for division play without round robin, like the MAC got.

If they want to pair the two best teams, play a round robin. If necessary, kick someone out.

But who would get the boot? Tulsa? East Carolina? Those are the two weakest schools I can think of. I think Tulane is safe given their location and academics.

Could they do it though? Has it happened before? Temple was football only in the Big East, C-USA 2.0 helped Charlotte and St Louis find a new home in the A-10, the MAC gave an ultimatum to football only UMass and the Sun Belt told football only Idaho and NMSU to find a new home but other than that I can’t think of any case where an all-sports school got kicked out.

Nobody is getting kicked out, lol. Aresco has made that clear many times.

Plus, it's impossible to play a 10 game round robin with Navy in the league.

(08-27-2019 10:01 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:23 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/statu...5291607040

Quote:AAC commissioner Mike Aresco tells
@929espn
the AAC will get rid of divisions starting next season. League is applying for a waiver so football title game will pit AAC's two best teams - same format as the Big 12

Not gonna work for Navy. No way they cancel Army, Air Force, or ND.

Will be interesting to see if they knock down the door and all conferences can scrap worthless divisions.

Who’s saying they need to? This is about league games not noncon.

The statement didn’t address the amount of conference games. You want a team to leave? Make a ten game round robin and Navy is setting sail.

(08-28-2019 06:47 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:47 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 09:39 PM)templefootballfan Wrote:  Hopefully NCAA says no
Divisionless CCG is just stupid

At one time some feller said a CCG was stupid, having a playoff was stupid, having 14 teams in a conference was stupid, but nowadays not allowing a conference to decide their champion their way IS stupid!

Divisionless ccgs are stupid.

The justification for the extra game is that you can't play everyone in those larger conferences. That's not the case in the Big 12.

Your statements contradict one another.

(08-28-2019 07:11 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 10:01 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:23 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/statu...5291607040

Quote:AAC commissioner Mike Aresco tells
@929espn
the AAC will get rid of divisions starting next season. League is applying for a waiver so football title game will pit AAC's two best teams - same format as the Big 12

Not gonna work for Navy. No way they cancel Army, Air Force, or ND.

Will be interesting to see if they knock down the door and all conferences can scrap worthless divisions.

Who’s saying they need to? This is about league games not noncon.

The statement didn’t address the amount of conference games. You want a team to leave? Make a ten game round robin and Navy is setting sail.

For the umpteenth time, Aresco has already made it clear a 10 game round robin is not happening, and Navy isn't leaving or getting kicked out. And they will continue to play Army in December.

(08-28-2019 07:11 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 10:01 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:23 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/statu...5291607040

Quote:AAC commissioner Mike Aresco tells
@929espn
the AAC will get rid of divisions starting next season. League is applying for a waiver so football title game will pit AAC's two best teams - same format as the Big 12

Not gonna work for Navy. No way they cancel Army, Air Force, or ND.

Will be interesting to see if they knock down the door and all conferences can scrap worthless divisions.

Who’s saying they need to? This is about league games not noncon.

The statement didn’t address the amount of conference games. You want a team to leave? Make a ten game round robin and Navy is setting sail.

For the umpteenth time, Aresco has already made it clear a 10 game round robin is not happening, and Navy isn't leaving or getting kicked out. And they will continue to play Army in December.

Aresco also said on the radio they are staying at 8 conference games, so the fallback to no waiver will be an unbalanced division schedule.

(08-28-2019 07:13 AM)TripleA Wrote:  

(08-28-2019 07:11 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 10:01 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:23 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(08-27-2019 05:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/statu...5291607040

Not gonna work for Navy. No way they cancel Army, Air Force, or ND.

Will be interesting to see if they knock down the door and all conferences can scrap worthless divisions.

Who’s saying they need to? This is about league games not noncon.

The statement didn’t address the amount of conference games. You want a team to leave? Make a ten game round robin and Navy is setting sail.

For the umpteenth time, Aresco has already made it clear a 10 game round robin is not happening, and Navy isn't leaving or getting kicked out. And they will continue to play Army in December.

I’m making it clear 10 games is not an option.