(05-27-2018 01:14 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: (05-26-2018 09:30 AM)Nerdlinger Wrote: (05-26-2018 05:47 AM)Stugray2 Wrote: So NoDak's conference needs 7 schools to move up together with invites from the WAC, joining NMSU to be a FBS conference in good standing (per 20.02.6).
But first this 7 need to come together in a conference, with an announcement by July 1st.
OK, but you seem to be describing only a route for the WAC to go FBS. The Summit/Great Northern is supposed to be a separate FBS conference. I'm guessing for the next step, the Summit and Big Sky schools that joined the WAC to go FBS (the Dakotas, Montanas, Idaho, and Weber State, I believe) break off to form the GNC, after which the WAC restocks to look like NoDak's "vision" here: https://csnbbs.com/post-15267077.html#pid15267077
However, he's saying that the Summit/GNC is merely in "close association" with the WAC, suggesting that the final 8 GNC members wouldn't actually have joined the WAC at any point. I don't know how that's supposed to work.
... (super awesome list follows of amazing value)
Nerdlinger,
Without the WAC the Great North cannot move up to FBS because they will have no FBS conference sponsorship. The only path in the rules, without a waiver to be an Independent like Liberty attained, is to have an invite from an existing FBS conference ... or a former FBS conference - a concession to allow the WAC to reform back in 2012 when they were trying to do that. So the only way to move up as a group is with WAC full member invites (more specific rules, but at least 6 of the 7 have to be full members, the last one could be like Navy or Hawaii, a Football only member - this has to do woith multisport FBS classification for the WAC).
If they do not join the WAC then each will have to either get a waiver like Liberty to play as an FBS Independent for a number of years; how many depends on what the exact agreement state. We don't know the details of the waiver agreement Liberty and the NCAA settled on, but you can bet it included Liberty committing to multiple years as an independent and they demonstrated the financial backing to support that. Obviously going the route would effectively separate all these schools, who would effectively be in nothing more than a scheduling agreement. What's more each would have to individually demonstrate the ability to fund an Independent run.
The other non-WAC path open would be for each school to get an invite from an existing FBS conference. But there is no indication of any interest from any G5 conference in any of these schools. And again each would be on their own and not the Great North. And the reason for the Great North is the belief (by NoDak) that these schools all want to be FBS and are blocked by the G5.
When you go through the mechanics, the only strategy that could work is for the WAC to invite 7 schools, at least 6 as full members.
OK, but it sounds like you're going against the express word of NoDak -- heresy!
For 2020 (announced by July 1, 2018)
WAC goes FBS
Idaho, Montana, Montana State, Weber State from Big Sky to WAC
North Dakota, North Dakota State, South Dakota, South Dakota State from MVFC/Summit to WAC
New Mexico State (FB) from FBS Ind to WAC
UTRGV (FB) from [no program] to FCS Ind
At this point, FBS WAC perhaps looks like:
FB: Idaho, Montana, Montana State, New Mexico State, North Dakota, North Dakota State, South Dakota, South Dakota State, Weber State
NFB: Cal Baptist, Chicago State, Grand Canyon, UMKC, Utah Valley, UTRGV, Seattle
Not sure what happens to the Summit in the interim, as all they have left are Denver, Fort Wayne, Omaha, ORU, and WIU. Denver and Omaha are supposed to ultimately end up in the GNC, and ORU in the WAC, but the WAC by now is already full up with 16 members. The Summit needs at least 2 more basketball schools, plus possibly some other members/affiliates/new sport sponsors to fulfill other requirements. The MVFC is of course shorthanded too, but as a FB-only conference, they only need 6 members (they have 7 left). Although only WIU is in both conferences at this point, the remnant Summit and MVFC could combine their forces, giving the Summit an extra sport. However, this doesn't really help the MVFC schools, and such a merged conference is likely doomed anyway (at least as a multisport conference) when Denver, Omaha, and ORU leave.
For later (announced by June/July 1, 2020?)
Great Northern forms as new FBS conference
Idaho, Montana, Montana State, North Dakota, North Dakota State, South Dakota, South Dakota State, Weber State from WAC to Great Northern
Denver (NFB), Omaha (NFB) from Summit? to Great Northern
Oral Roberts (NFB) from Summit? to WAC
Cal Poly, UC Davis from Big Sky/Big West to WAC
Sacramento State from Big Sky to WAC
Missouri State (FB) from MVFC to WAC
Utah Valley (NFB), Seattle (NFB) from WAC to Big Sky [I don't know what advantage there is in moving from WAC to Big Sky here]
Azusa Pacific from DII GNAC/PacWest to Big Sky
Central Washington from DII GNAC to Big Sky
Dixie State from DII RMAC to Big Sky
Chicago State (NFB) from WAC to ??? [maybe drop to DII?]
UTRGV (FB) from FCS Ind to WAC
Lamar, Sam Houston from Southland to WAC
* also, some combination of:
Incarnate Word, Stephen F. Austin from Southland to WAC
Wichita State (FB) from [no program] to WAC [presumably with an intermediate FCS Ind stint]
With the same result as before:
Great Northern (FBS)
FB: Idaho, Montana, Montana State, North Dakota, North Dakota State, South Dakota, South Dakota State, Weber State
NFB: Denver, Omaha
WAC (FBS)
FB: Cal Poly, Lamar, Missouri State (FB-only), New Mexico State, Sacramento State, Sam Houston, UC Davis, UTRGV, [either or both of Incarnate Word, Stephen F. Austin; maybe also Wichita State (FB-only)]
NFB: Cal Baptist, Grand Canyon, Oral Roberts, UMKC
Big Sky (FCS)
FB: Azusa Pacific, Central Washington, Dixie State, Eastern Washington, Idaho State, Northern Arizona, Northern Colorado, Portland State, Southern Utah
NFB: Seattle, Utah Valley
It's fun trying to make sense of the madness.
/
The Great Northern Conference
