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(12-14-2017 08:48 AM)bit_9 Wrote:  I guess another path is. He keeps learning and growing at the FBS level. Kiffin and these others have a lot of experience under some of the best right? You learn from those experiences and game film playing those top teams right? This is Wilders program, period. I think we all acknowledge that. You give that person the time to learn from the new experiences offered at this new higher level of play.

From 0 to having this discussion gives you a pretty long leash. Like others have said unless you all the sudden have a couple 0 or 1 win seasons then there is something terribly wrong.

So I personally feel you slowly grow with Wilder a while longer. Redirect the "top dollar" stuff over to a new BB coach if Jones isn't getting it done with these 2 solid recruiting classes.

Sure. What you said makes sense. The problem is we want it and we want it now. The path you are talking about means our fanbase needs to be patient. The average person posting on an ODU forum probably isn't the patient type. FAU and FIU both proved that making a high caliber hire can have an immediate impact. So I agree with you, and it will take patience, and I wonder how patient the average fan outside the message boards will be.

(12-14-2017 09:16 AM)odu09 Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 08:48 AM)bit_9 Wrote:  I guess another path is. He keeps learning and growing at the FBS level. Kiffin and these others have a lot of experience under some of the best right? You learn from those experiences and game film playing those top teams right? This is Wilders program, period. I think we all acknowledge that. You give that person the time to learn from the new experiences offered at this new higher level of play.

From 0 to having this discussion gives you a pretty long leash. Like others have said unless you all the sudden have a couple 0 or 1 win seasons then there is something terribly wrong.

So I personally feel you slowly grow with Wilder a while longer. Redirect the "top dollar" stuff over to a new BB coach if Jones isn't getting it done with these 2 solid recruiting classes.

Sure. What you said makes sense. The problem is we want it and we want it now. The path you are talking about means our fanbase needs to be patient. The average person posting on an ODU forum probably isn't the patient type. FAU and FIU both proved that making a high caliber hire can have an immediate impact. So I agree with you, and it will take patience, and I wonder how patient the average fan outside the message boards will be.

I understand this thinking as well, but could the age old saying of you get what you pay for apply here. Winning seasons definitely have an impact on recruiting as does a losing season. We are already seeing a decline in ticket sales and could quite possibly see the same with fundraising if we continue to have losing seasons. If these losing seasons also have an impact on recruiting, could the money loss we see from this and future losing seasons equal the cost of a new coach or out weight the effect in recruiting? Not saying I don't like Wilder, but he does and will continue to lack the experience that many power 5 coaches have nor will he ever experience the success that many coaches like Lane Kiffin have.

(12-14-2017 09:16 AM)odu09 Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 08:48 AM)bit_9 Wrote:  I guess another path is. He keeps learning and growing at the FBS level. Kiffin and these others have a lot of experience under some of the best right? You learn from those experiences and game film playing those top teams right? This is Wilders program, period. I think we all acknowledge that. You give that person the time to learn from the new experiences offered at this new higher level of play.

From 0 to having this discussion gives you a pretty long leash. Like others have said unless you all the sudden have a couple 0 or 1 win seasons then there is something terribly wrong.

So I personally feel you slowly grow with Wilder a while longer. Redirect the "top dollar" stuff over to a new BB coach if Jones isn't getting it done with these 2 solid recruiting classes.

Sure. What you said makes sense. The problem is we want it and we want it now. The path you are talking about means our fanbase needs to be patient. The average person posting on an ODU forum probably isn't the patient type. FAU and FIU both proved that making a high caliber hire can have an immediate impact. So I agree with you, and it will take patience, and I wonder how patient the average fan outside the message boards will be.

If JJ is any indication...very.

Ugh.

(12-14-2017 12:52 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  Ugh.

As the crevasse between the P5 and G5 widens, a G5 playoff is probably inevitable.

I get why people don't like the idea (I don't necessarily like it), but its not like we're ever going to get into the other one.

(12-14-2017 02:36 PM)ODU_NYG Wrote:  I get why people don't like the idea (I don't necessarily like it), but its not like we're ever going to get into the other one.

Yeah I'm starting to line up with this thinking. When your 10-win conference champion is playing 7-6 Akron in a bowl game, it might be time to start thinking outside the traditional bowl structure, which is only going to be even more weighted toward power conferences in the future. It's not ideal, but honestly I'd rather match up with a strong G5 team than a crummy P5 one living on a 6-6 record and its conference affiliation.

But the AAC has to play too. If they take this P6 schtick seriously enough to not participate, then it has far less appeal.

(12-14-2017 02:30 PM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 12:52 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  Ugh.

As the crevasse between the P5 and G5 widens, a G5 playoff is probably inevitable.
:coffee3:

The CFP contract is signed through 2025 I believe. Why even consider this until that is on the horizon? Very little chance a G5 playoff pays better.

(12-14-2017 02:46 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 02:30 PM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 12:52 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  Ugh.

As the crevasse between the P5 and G5 widens, a G5 playoff is probably inevitable.

The CFP contract is signed through 2025 I believe. Why even consider this until that is on the horizon? Very little chance a G5 playoff pays better.

At this stage you sort of have to consider all your options. Right now they're probably in the "is this even worth pursuing?" stage. If there's interest, then I imagine they talk to TV folks to give them some sort of sense of what kind of interest there'd be from them and how much they'd be willing to pay for it.

I can't say that I like it but if G5 teams are going to be only playing G5 teams in the postseason, which will be more and more the case in the future, I'd rather play them within the context of a tournament than a one-off bowl.

(12-14-2017 02:46 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 02:30 PM)ODUalum78 Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 12:52 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  Ugh.

As the crevasse between the P5 and G5 widens, a G5 playoff is probably inevitable.

The CFP contract is signed through 2025 I believe. Why even consider this until that is on the horizon? Very little chance a G5 playoff pays better.

G5 Football is such a disaster at this point, that they have to eventually stop looking at the dangling money and take a long view. The question should be, can we improve fan interest to fill stadiums (increasing revenue), drive donations (increasing revenue), slow the arms race (decreasing expense), get better tv deals because we have an interesting product (increasing revenue), etc.

At some point the G5 has to realize that it all starts with fan engagement, and things like building far flung conferences with a bazillion teams, and trying to pretend that they are competing with the P5 schools, is really just costing them money and fan interest. Be who you are and be the absolute best at that.

I agree. But most of the AAC thinks they're a phone call away from becoming a P5 team. So they aren't going to admit they dont belong. And most G5s on the east coast want that invite to the AAC. So, they will try to keep pace and in line with whatever they're doing. Basically, the G5 playoff just doesnt work without them and until they buy in, no one will.

The arms race, out of control as it is, probably won't stop until realignment is completely dead or the student fee money pump has been shut down nationwide. Trickle down mess.

(12-14-2017 03:57 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  I agree. But most of the AAC thinks they're a phone call away from becoming a P5 team. So they aren't going to admit they dont belong. And most G5s on the east coast want that invite to the AAC. So, they will try to keep pace and in line with whatever they're doing. Basically, the G5 playoff just doesnt work without them and until they buy in, no one will.

The arms race, out of control as it is, probably won't stop until realignment is completely dead or the student fee money pump has been shut down nationwide. Trickle down mess.

I tend to agree. Regarding the arms race, there are a good number of states who see the value in investing in sports and have no desire to cut off the student fee money pump. Which basically means schools in those states will likely have more successful sports teams and all of the publicity and economic benefits that come with that.

(12-14-2017 04:56 PM)monarx Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 03:57 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  I agree. But most of the AAC thinks they're a phone call away from becoming a P5 team. So they aren't going to admit they dont belong. And most G5s on the east coast want that invite to the AAC. So, they will try to keep pace and in line with whatever they're doing. Basically, the G5 playoff just doesnt work without them and until they buy in, no one will.

The arms race, out of control as it is, probably won't stop until realignment is completely dead or the student fee money pump has been shut down nationwide. Trickle down mess.

I tend to agree. Regarding the arms race, there are a good number of states who see the value in investing in sports and have no desire to cut off the student fee money pump. Which basically means schools in those states will likely have more successful sports teams and all of the publicity and economic benefits that come with that.

The schools that matter don't need the student fee money pump (Alabama, Ohio State, even VT). Eventually it will all come crashing down though along with cable TV and we may start seeing a return to more parity.

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(12-14-2017 07:25 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 04:56 PM)monarx Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 03:57 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  I agree. But most of the AAC thinks they're a phone call away from becoming a P5 team. So they aren't going to admit they dont belong. And most G5s on the east coast want that invite to the AAC. So, they will try to keep pace and in line with whatever they're doing. Basically, the G5 playoff just doesnt work without them and until they buy in, no one will.

The arms race, out of control as it is, probably won't stop until realignment is completely dead or the student fee money pump has been shut down nationwide. Trickle down mess.

I tend to agree. Regarding the arms race, there are a good number of states who see the value in investing in sports and have no desire to cut off the student fee money pump. Which basically means schools in those states will likely have more successful sports teams and all of the publicity and economic benefits that come with that.

The schools that matter don't need the student fee money pump (Alabama, Ohio State, even VT). Eventually it will all come crashing down though along with cable TV and we may start seeing a return to more parity.

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Wishful thinking. The NFL is more vulnerable to taking a hit than P5 football at this point. Big time college football is not going anywhere in the foreseeable future.

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(12-14-2017 03:57 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  I agree. But most of the AAC thinks they're a phone call away from becoming a P5 team. So they aren't going to admit they dont belong. And most G5s on the east coast want that invite to the AAC. So, they will try to keep pace and in line with whatever they're doing. Basically, the G5 playoff just doesnt work without them and until they buy in, no one will.

The arms race, out of control as it is, probably won't stop until realignment is completely dead or the student fee money pump has been shut down nationwide. Trickle down mess.

Well, for us at least, lets hope they aren't wrong. Some of them are going to need to be invited in order for us to get into that conference.

(12-14-2017 08:00 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 07:25 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 04:56 PM)monarx Wrote:  

(12-14-2017 03:57 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  I agree. But most of the AAC thinks they're a phone call away from becoming a P5 team. So they aren't going to admit they dont belong. And most G5s on the east coast want that invite to the AAC. So, they will try to keep pace and in line with whatever they're doing. Basically, the G5 playoff just doesnt work without them and until they buy in, no one will.

The arms race, out of control as it is, probably won't stop until realignment is completely dead or the student fee money pump has been shut down nationwide. Trickle down mess.

I tend to agree. Regarding the arms race, there are a good number of states who see the value in investing in sports and have no desire to cut off the student fee money pump. Which basically means schools in those states will likely have more successful sports teams and all of the publicity and economic benefits that come with that.

The schools that matter don't need the student fee money pump (Alabama, Ohio State, even VT). Eventually it will all come crashing down though along with cable TV and we may start seeing a return to more parity.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

Wishful thinking. The NFL is more vulnerable to taking a hit than P5 football at this point. Big time college football is not going anywhere in the foreseeable future.

Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk

No, college football won't go anywhere, but traditional cable TV is at the very least going to have to change it's business model. I bet that eventually, it will go to a pay-per-view type streaming system for all TV and this will seriously hurt the P5 schools that have little demand and ride the cotails of the big conference media deals (think Wake Forest, Syracuse, Boston College) and immensly help G5 schools that are anchored by their conference affiliation. We may revert to a more independent-type model. Not going to happen next year but I do believe, over time, that conference power will get weaker, not stronger as the big media like ESPN have less money to sling around and new outlets like BeIN arise and are able to produce better quality broadcasts at a much lower cost. Ultimately, you'll get a choice of watching Wake Forest vs Boston College on an ESPN broadcast for $10 or Navy vs UCF on something like BeIN for $0.50. A lot of contracts are in place, but I bet, as they slowly start to fall off, we'll start moving back toward more parity, especially with the money, and schools negotiating more independently vs through the conferences.

All just opinion.