(07-23-2016 12:49 PM)john01992 Wrote:  crime rates are at historic lows. that is "the truth."

Except in the cities that Trump said rates were up in.

You can't keep doing yourself what you are bitching about.

(07-23-2016 12:51 PM)Paul M Wrote:  So Trump said as overall crime rates have fallen, in x number of cities rates have gone up.

I'm really having a hard time figuring out what john has a problem with. He gave both stats and john is complaining that he gave one and without the other, it's misleading.

I'll just assume john didn't hear him speak. Maybe got some misleading sound-bite from some partisan leftwing blog, twit, feed or whatever.

My "soundbite" is being generally educated and knowing that crime rates are at historic lows and have been consistently falling over the last couple of decades and have fallen under Obama. 1000s of stats say that. Trump focused on one of the few that doesn't say this. on top of that 1st gen immigrants commit crime at lower rates than those born in the USA. hence the reason his comments were misleading. I find it pathetic that I actually have to explain this to you guys.

(07-23-2016 12:55 PM)Paul M Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 12:49 PM)john01992 Wrote:  crime rates are at historic lows. that is "the truth."

Except in the cities that Trump said rates were up in.

You can't keep doing yourself what you are bitching about.

you mean "up" in a single year where they have been falling for decades? "up" for a single type of crime when nearly all of the other types of crime are going down?

trump didn't use crime rates. he used a single crime, murders.

(07-23-2016 12:55 PM)john01992 Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 12:43 PM)Paul M Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 11:35 AM)john01992 Wrote:  if you are unwilling to admit that people can take selectively picked stats to paint a misleading picture, then you are too dumb to have a conversation with.

Like the example from you In my last reply.

oh great our "I will deny gravity exists" guy is here. i was about to check out of this conversation because the cons on here were being too brain dead stupid to make it worth my time to play with them. but I'll bite with a single post.

how is trump using an incredibly narrowed stat of one type of violent crime, in one type of demographic (large cities), and in a single year in any way considered less or equally selective than what I said which was all types of violent crime, in all years, in all parts of the country?

(this will be interesting)

I will add the majority of non-violent crime into the mix as well.

I'm not holding your hand and walking you through your own posts.

Trump stated the facts and stats you gave.

You did what you are complaining about. Using one stat and ignoring/leaving out the rest. Trump didn't.

Rail against yourself.

(07-23-2016 12:59 PM)john01992 Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 12:51 PM)Paul M Wrote:  So Trump said as overall crime rates have fallen, in x number of cities rates have gone up.

I'm really having a hard time figuring out what john has a problem with. He gave both stats and john is complaining that he gave one and without the other, it's misleading.

I'll just assume john didn't hear him speak. Maybe got some misleading sound-bite from some partisan leftwing blog, twit, feed or whatever.

My "soundbite" is being generally educated and knowing that crime rates are at historic lows and have been consistently falling over the last couple of decades and have fallen under Obama. 1000s of stats say that. Trump focused on one of the few that doesn't say this. on top of that 1st gen immigrants commit crime at lower rates than those born in the USA. hence the reason his comments were misleading. I find it pathetic that I actually have to explain this to you guys.

So you didn't hear Trump then. That's all you needed to say. No reason to get bent believing he left something out. He didn't. You can relax.

(07-23-2016 12:49 PM)wahoowa Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 10:33 AM)john01992 Wrote:  The posters on this thread are pathetic.

(07-23-2016 11:24 AM)john01992 Wrote:  admit you are a troll or shut the hell up.

(07-23-2016 11:35 AM)john01992 Wrote:  you are too dumb to have a conversation with.

(07-23-2016 12:13 PM)john01992 Wrote:  you are a total idiot.

That's some strong cognitive argument there. We should treat John's opinions with more respect, because they are obviously presented with a great deal of reason and deliberation.

that's what happens when I deal with people who refuse to see logic. I have to remind them why logic doesn't work with them.

(07-23-2016 11:27 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 11:23 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 11:22 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  His speech was great.

And accurate. And truthful.

It didnt help that Obama was giving a lecture on how all of the "doom and gloom" didnt "jive" with reality, just as another terrorist attack was occurring.

partisan idiocy on full display with your comment.

crime rates are at historic lows and fell 15% under Obama. first generation immigrants both documented and undocumented commit crime at rates lower than those born in the USA.

that's the reality. that is the full picture.

you could have stopped at "partisan idiocy" with your post. It seems you're talking about yourself.

But, that's okay, keep on being a Shrillary apologetic, it suits you. Just like her, not too bright.

(07-23-2016 12:45 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  johns having a hard time finding one of the true facts that trump said, and spinning it in a way that could be construed as misleading.

waiting. snowflake. we're waiting......

bump

Crime rates are low? Even where I live inLouisville We are way ahead of Murder rate nearly 60 for the year and it's only July. 60 has been the Yearly total for the last 10 years. Crime is way up. Ask Chicago residents. Black crime has been on the uptick this year. Maybe down in White neighborhood but not Black areas.

(07-23-2016 01:49 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Crime rates are low? Even where I live inLouisville We are way ahead of Murder rate nearly 60 for the year and it's only July. 60 has been the Yearly total for the last 10 years. Crime is way up. Ask Chicago residents. Black crime has been on the uptick this year. Maybe down in White neighborhood but not Black areas.

You are talking about murder. John says that while that is true, you are being misleading because its not fair to talk about murder.

I watched the speech and couldn't remember Trump saying what JohnnyZero insists he said so I read the transcript to see if I had missed it and what do you know.....he never said what JohnnyZero says he said.

Maybe what JohnnyZero needs to do is read the actual transcript instead of the crib notes from Dimocrapic Underground.

(07-23-2016 11:19 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  The facts may have been true but that doesnt mean they werent misleading. For example, he said cop deaths are up and used a percentage for effect but if he had used the actual numbers it doesnt sound as fantastic. Also, he used crime numbers which happen to be up this year but over the past twenty years are actually going down.

You mean like gun or global warming statistics?

Absolutely if you want a number to look large, you might use the number... And if you want to to look small, you might use percentages....

But factual is factual.

(07-23-2016 11:21 AM)john01992 Wrote:  when facts are accurate but highly misleading and distort the truth...yes.

how can that be acceptable for anyone?

Just because he's not making the point you want him to make, but is instead making one you don't want him to make, doesn't mean it's misleading...

How is what he said any different than saying that employment is at a record (for the last 4 years) or that the deficit is the lowest it's been (since Obama took office) or that unemployment is at 'this' rate, ignoring the underemployed and those who have stopped looking?

(07-23-2016 01:43 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 12:45 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  johns having a hard time finding one of the true facts that trump said, and spinning it in a way that could be construed as misleading.

waiting. snowflake. we're waiting......

bump

bump

(07-23-2016 12:41 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  The Lib butthurt and deflection in this thread is epic.

Yep, off the charts. Glad I started this one.

(07-23-2016 12:49 PM)wahoowa Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 10:33 AM)john01992 Wrote:  The posters on this thread are pathetic.

(07-23-2016 11:24 AM)john01992 Wrote:  admit you are a troll or shut the hell up.

(07-23-2016 11:35 AM)john01992 Wrote:  you are too dumb to have a conversation with.

(07-23-2016 12:13 PM)john01992 Wrote:  you are a total idiot.

That's some strong cognitive argument there. We should treat John's opinions with more respect, because they are obviously presented with a great deal of reason and deliberation.

He is young and apparently still doesnt understand this isnt twitter where you can name call your way to a "win".

(07-23-2016 12:59 PM)john01992 Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 12:51 PM)Paul M Wrote:  So Trump said as overall crime rates have fallen, in x number of cities rates have gone up.

I'm really having a hard time figuring out what john has a problem with. He gave both stats and john is complaining that he gave one and without the other, it's misleading.

I'll just assume john didn't hear him speak. Maybe got some misleading sound-bite from some partisan leftwing blog, twit, feed or whatever.

My "soundbite" is being generally educated and knowing that crime rates are at historic lows and have been consistently falling over the last couple of decades and have fallen under Obama. 1000s of stats say that. Trump focused on one of the few that doesn't say this. on top of that 1st gen immigrants commit crime at lower rates than those born in the USA. hence the reason his comments were misleading. I find it pathetic that I actually have to explain this to you guys.

Incorrect. 100% of illegal immigrants are commiting crime every day. The "other crimes" that they commit are going above and beyond the other bull**** we have to deal with by "natives". Why would you be OK with ANY more criminals?

(07-23-2016 10:03 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 12:59 PM)john01992 Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 12:51 PM)Paul M Wrote:  So Trump said as overall crime rates have fallen, in x number of cities rates have gone up.

I'm really having a hard time figuring out what john has a problem with. He gave both stats and john is complaining that he gave one and without the other, it's misleading.

I'll just assume john didn't hear him speak. Maybe got some misleading sound-bite from some partisan leftwing blog, twit, feed or whatever.

My "soundbite" is being generally educated and knowing that crime rates are at historic lows and have been consistently falling over the last couple of decades and have fallen under Obama. 1000s of stats say that. Trump focused on one of the few that doesn't say this. on top of that 1st gen immigrants commit crime at lower rates than those born in the USA. hence the reason his comments were misleading. I find it pathetic that I actually have to explain this to you guys.

Incorrect. 100% of illegal immigrants are commiting crime every day. The "other crimes" that they commit are going above and beyond the other bull**** we have to deal with by "natives". Why would you be OK with ANY more criminals?

so you are just a bigot. when your argument states that no matter how much the data supports or disagrees with my opinion that X race/religion etc. is bad, I will still claim X race is bad...that's the literal definition of bigotry.

it's a troll talking point and no legitimate scientific paper would ever present the stats that way. not even trump used that talking point.

thanks for being your stereotypical republican by framing your argument where regardless of what the data says, it will still have the same opinion.

CSNBBS where republicans are donkeys led by TV personalities.

anyone who thinks the crime situation in America is worse right now than it was in the past is an uneducated dumb***.

anyone who doesn't think Trump painted a misleading picture of immigration and general crime stats with his speech is again an uneducated dumb***.

anyone who thinks 99% of stats showing a trend is negated by 1% saying otherwise is (again) an uneducated dumb***.

john, john, john, he didn't say that.

Said nothing, zip, zero, nadda about any race being bad. Said everyone here illegally is committing a crime.

You just can't stop arguing with non-existent posters. You should stop quoting people and acting as though you are talking to them.

(07-23-2016 10:10 PM)john01992 Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 10:03 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 12:59 PM)john01992 Wrote:  

(07-23-2016 12:51 PM)Paul M Wrote:  So Trump said as overall crime rates have fallen, in x number of cities rates have gone up.

I'm really having a hard time figuring out what john has a problem with. He gave both stats and john is complaining that he gave one and without the other, it's misleading.

I'll just assume john didn't hear him speak. Maybe got some misleading sound-bite from some partisan leftwing blog, twit, feed or whatever.

My "soundbite" is being generally educated and knowing that crime rates are at historic lows and have been consistently falling over the last couple of decades and have fallen under Obama. 1000s of stats say that. Trump focused on one of the few that doesn't say this. on top of that 1st gen immigrants commit crime at lower rates than those born in the USA. hence the reason his comments were misleading. I find it pathetic that I actually have to explain this to you guys.

Incorrect. 100% of illegal immigrants are commiting crime every day. The "other crimes" that they commit are going above and beyond the other bull**** we have to deal with by "natives". Why would you be OK with ANY more criminals?

so you are just a bigot. when your argument states that no matter how much the data supports or disagrees with my opinion that X race/religion etc. is bad, I will still claim X race is bad...that's the literal definition of bigotry.

it's a troll talking point and no legitimate scientific paper would ever present the stats that way. not even trump used that talking point.

thanks for being your stereotypical republican by framing your argument where regardless of what the data says, it will still have the same opinion.

How is any of what I said bigoted? Is illegal immigration not illegal?