(11-03-2015 01:24 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(11-03-2015 01:18 PM)HarmonOliphantOberlanderDevine Wrote:  Reurrect the Knights Templar and let them deal with ISIS.

The old Caliphate used to stretch from France to Asia Minor before the Franks and Byzantines blunted the edges.

Can you imagine the outrage over a religious war that pits Christianity against Islam? It's a controversial enough topic even with the media and non-muslim leaders pretending this isn't essentially a Holy way.

I can only imagine. So many misconceptions about the Crusades abound as it is. The First Crusade wasn't launched until the Byzantine Empire begged for help and the Islamic rulers of Jerusalem began to torture and harm pilgrims to the Heavenly City. 400 years of Islamic conquest happened before Europe countered. People forget that early Christianity expanded through peaceful means and early Islam built its empire on the sword. Ask the Persian Empire about that.

(10-30-2015 03:00 PM)Ole Blue Wrote:  

(10-30-2015 02:57 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  So he is backing Assad? LOL

I believe most US military action is centered around the Kurdish forces and the Pershmerga in the region fighting - directly - against Daesh.

We've had US Special Operations Joint Terminal Attack Controller Teams helping the Iraqi Kurds call in air strikes since July 2014. Brits have people with the Kurds in Syria as well.

(10-30-2015 02:41 PM)Ole Blue Wrote:  Well, something has to be done. Before long ISIS may take over parts of Turkey if the Turkish far-right groups keep their anti-Kurd propaganda campaign going.

There is not even a remote possibility of ISIS making inroads in Turkey. Turkey could destroy ISIS within a few weeks if it were motivated to do so. Instead, they have at times tacitly supported it, or turned a blind eye to help keep the Kurds in check.

(10-30-2015 02:47 PM)VA49er Wrote:  This was inevitable if we want ISIS gone.

No. Leave it to Iran and Russia to destroy ISIS at this point in time. There's really not much good to come from deepening our involvement except in two areas - one completely futile, the other puts the US down a very difficult road.

Putting troops on the ground will help demonstrate to the Iraqi people that it is in their interest that they ally with the US. That is a message that the Iraqis don't care to hear, and facts matter less than tribal alliances ... Iraqis believe (incorrectly) that it is the Iranians that have kept ISIS in check. Our influence in Iraq is doomed. Iraq is now and for the foreseeable future an Iranian client state, and it doesn't really matter whether Iraq would be objectively better off in all aspects if they allied with the US as opposed to Iran. They will move closer to Iran.

Putting troops on the ground does provide support to the Kurds. That puts the US at odds with Iraq (Shia), Syria, but especially Turkey. Syria would probably gladly see Kurdistan spin off so there are that many fewer people for the Syrian government to cope with. When Russia claims to have bombed ISIS, they bombed the Syrian Free Army. When Turkey claims to have bombed ISIS, they bombed the Kurds. ISIS is relatively weak and insignificant in the region. They are a useful foil for other players to manipulate the US and to provide an excuse for the regional powers to bomb whoever they wish to bomb whilst being able to claim they are bombing ISIS.

The real reason that we are probably putting troops on the ground has to do with presidential ego. President Obama vociferously declared a goal that he had no intention of following up with a meaningful strategy. One regional player after another has run circles around this administration. The best outcome would probably be to cut and run.

It is notably ironic that the character Yossarian had an Assyrian background.

(11-04-2015 01:45 PM)I45owl Wrote:  

(10-30-2015 02:41 PM)Ole Blue Wrote:  Well, something has to be done. Before long ISIS may take over parts of Turkey if the Turkish far-right groups keep their anti-Kurd propaganda campaign going.

There is not even a remote possibility of ISIS making inroads in Turkey. Turkey could destroy ISIS within a few weeks if it were motivated to do so. Instead, they have at times tacitly supported it, or turned a blind eye to help keep the Kurds in check.

(10-30-2015 02:47 PM)VA49er Wrote:  This was inevitable if we want ISIS gone.

No. Leave it to Iran and Russia to destroy ISIS at this point in time. There's really not much good to come from deepening our involvement except in two areas - one completely futile, the other puts the US down a very difficult road.

Putting troops on the ground will help demonstrate to the Iraqi people that it is in their interest that they ally with the US. That is a message that the Iraqis don't care to hear, and facts matter less than tribal alliances ... Iraqis believe (incorrectly) that it is the Iranians that have kept ISIS in check. Our influence in Iraq is doomed. Iraq is now and for the foreseeable future an Iranian client state, and it doesn't really matter whether Iraq would be objectively better off in all aspects if they allied with the US as opposed to Iran. They will move closer to Iran.

Putting troops on the ground does provide support to the Kurds. That puts the US at odds with Iraq (Shia), Syria, but especially Turkey. Syria would probably gladly see Kurdistan spin off so there are that many fewer people for the Syrian government to cope with. When Russia claims to have bombed ISIS, they bombed the Syrian Free Army. When Turkey claims to have bombed ISIS, they bombed the Kurds. ISIS is relatively weak and insignificant in the region. They are a useful foil for other players to manipulate the US and to provide an excuse for the regional powers to bomb whoever they wish to bomb whilst being able to claim they are bombing ISIS.

The real reason that we are probably putting troops on the ground has to do with presidential ego. President Obama vociferously declared a goal that he had no intention of following up with a meaningful strategy. One regional player after another has run circles around this administration. The best outcome would probably be to cut and run.

It is notably ironic that the character Yossarian had an Assyrian background.

I can see your reasoning. However, the US will be there for what happens AFTER ISIS falls more than being there to actually fight ISIS, IMO.