(04-20-2013 11:35 AM)mixduptransistor Wrote:  I'm in the "let's wait for a trial" boat. Is there any evidence this guy is part of a bigger plot? What little bit of evidence that was out there points to his brother being the ring leader and this kid just tagged along because he didn't want to disappoint his brother. Doesn't mean he shouldn't spend 3 or 4 life sentences in Florence, but doesn't mean he is guilty of treason either.

Gitmo is not an option. This guy is not an enemy combatant. He's a citizen. He should get the same treatment Eric Rudolph or Timothy McVey got. Just because it's possible his motivation was Islamic extremism makes no difference. We haven't repealed the 5th and 6th Amendments.

(04-20-2013 11:23 AM)blah Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 08:20 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 07:41 AM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Thought Mass. didn't have the death penalty.

That's easy enough... If he is guilty hand him over to the Chinese so they can try him for the murder of the international student.

I like this idea alot...The Chinese know how to make an example of someone.

Yeah, rendering US Citizens to foreign nations for torture is a great idea. Fsck the Constitution, right?

Under the NDAA signed by Obama, US Citizens that qualify as an "Unlawful Enemy Combatant" may be delegated to the jurisdiction of the Department of Defense and dealt with accordingly by a Military Tribunal down at Gitmo.

Arguably little Dzhokhar falls under the conditions eligible for such a designation.

In fact this IS the fate that awaits Adam Ghadan, the infamous Al Qaeda Propaganda Took known as "Azam the American."

Alternatively Dzhokhar can be stripped of his US NATURALIZED Citizenship and deported back to Russia, where he will last about 15 minutes with the Russian FSB turning him inside out and backwards.

SuperMax is no picnic. He will probably go psychotic within a year of being locked up in a empty concrete cell with no human interaction, no TV, no radio, etc for 23 hours a day.

Let the little pr!ck suffer.

Look at the picture of him putting that dufflebag down right there in front of that little kid and tell me this rodent doesn't deserve to suffer for the remainder of his pathetic life.

(04-20-2013 01:10 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  I think the costs come from all the appeals, investigators, psychologists, etc. There are a lot of hurdles to clear.

It cost aprox 75k to house a prisoner in a supermax prison. I would expect that would be where this guy would end up.

For schits and giggles....Let say his life expectancy is 75. That would be 56 years of incarceration. At "today's" cost...that would be 4.2 million dollars.

Maybe I am crazy..but..I doubt seriously that it cost anywhere close that amount to execute someone. If it does...there is something seriously wrong.

(04-20-2013 01:29 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:10 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  I think the costs come from all the appeals, investigators, psychologists, etc. There are a lot of hurdles to clear.

It cost aprox 75k to house a prisoner in a supermax prison. I would expect that would be where this guy would end up.

For schits and giggles....Let say his life expectancy is 75. That would be 56 years of incarceration. At "today's" cost...that would be 4.2 million dollars.

Maybe I am crazy..but..I doubt seriously that it cost anywhere close that amount to execute someone. If it does...there is something seriously wrong.

It costs $2-3 million to jump through all the appellate hoops before execution. Since those are mostly up front costs, by the time you factor in the time value of money, incarceration for life is probably cheaper. Plus on the guy you execute, you still run through 10 years or so of incarceration costs before you get to fry him.

Leave him in a room alone with the father of the 8 year old boy that was killed.

F radical Islam ... a cult for losers.

(04-20-2013 01:50 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:29 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:10 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  I think the costs come from all the appeals, investigators, psychologists, etc. There are a lot of hurdles to clear.

It cost aprox 75k to house a prisoner in a supermax prison. I would expect that would be where this guy would end up.

For schits and giggles....Let say his life expectancy is 75. That would be 56 years of incarceration. At "today's" cost...that would be 4.2 million dollars.

Maybe I am crazy..but..I doubt seriously that it cost anywhere close that amount to execute someone. If it does...there is something seriously wrong.:banghead:

It costs $2-3 million to jump through all the appellate hoops before execution. Since those are mostly up front costs, by the time you factor in the time value of money, incarceration for life is probably cheaper. Plus on the guy you execute, you still run through 10 years or so of incarceration costs before you get to fry him.

In a case like this, it is money well spent. Plus, I expect he'd rather get the needle than spend 55 years in jail, so i'd doubt he'd appeal. In the average run of the mill case, the death penalty is probably very rarely a winning proposition, but in this case, it seems like a slam dunk.

(04-20-2013 01:50 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:29 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:10 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  I think the costs come from all the appeals, investigators, psychologists, etc. There are a lot of hurdles to clear.

It cost aprox 75k to house a prisoner in a supermax prison. I would expect that would be where this guy would end up.

For schits and giggles....Let say his life expectancy is 75. That would be 56 years of incarceration. At "today's" cost...that would be 4.2 million dollars.

Maybe I am crazy..but..I doubt seriously that it cost anywhere close that amount to execute someone. If it does...there is something seriously wrong.

It costs $2-3 million to jump through all the appellate hoops before execution. Since those are mostly up front costs, by the time you factor in the time value of money, incarceration for life is probably cheaper. Plus on the guy you execute, you still run through 10 years or so of incarceration costs before you get to fry him.

IMO...That is Fcked up.

Or we could beat him with baseball bats and then cut his head off, all broadcasted on al jezeera.

(04-20-2013 01:59 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:50 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:29 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:10 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  I think the costs come from all the appeals, investigators, psychologists, etc. There are a lot of hurdles to clear.

It cost aprox 75k to house a prisoner in a supermax prison. I would expect that would be where this guy would end up.

For schits and giggles....Let say his life expectancy is 75. That would be 56 years of incarceration. At "today's" cost...that would be 4.2 million dollars.

Maybe I am crazy..but..I doubt seriously that it cost anywhere close that amount to execute someone. If it does...there is something seriously wrong.

It costs $2-3 million to jump through all the appellate hoops before execution. Since those are mostly up front costs, by the time you factor in the time value of money, incarceration for life is probably cheaper. Plus on the guy you execute, you still run through 10 years or so of incarceration costs before you get to fry him.

IMO...That is Fcked up.

Yeah, I mean, we should totally do away with protections that make sure we don't execute innocent people.

(04-20-2013 01:13 PM)Paul M Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 11:57 AM)mixduptransistor Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 11:48 AM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 11:35 AM)mixduptransistor Wrote:  This guy is not an enemy combatant. He's a citizen.

Those categories are not mutually exclusive.

Actually, in terms of what little legal meaning that term actually has, they are. If he is a citizen giving aid and comfort to the enemy, he should be tried for treason, not locked away indefinitely without a trial.

Quote:

Quote:He should get the same treatment Eric Rudolph or Timothy McVeigh got.

I'd be fine with that.

They got trials. They didn't get sent to China for torture.

Quote:

Quote:Yeah, rendering US Citizens to foreign nations for torture is a great idea.

It would require some careful thought, and it depends on which citizen(s) we're talking about. If we're talking about a US citizen who planted the Boston Marathon bombs, I would probably be fine with it, **provided** that our government was satisfied that it had squeezed all the relevant information out of him that was there to be squeezed.

Granted I don't know your political leanings but I will call you out if I ever hear you complain about the government doing anything unconstitutional. What a load of horse excrement.

Quote:

Quote:Fsck the Constitution, right?

No, just fukk the Boston bomber(s).

For your sake I hope you're never wrongly accused of a crime.

"If he is a citizen giving aid and comfort to the enemy, he should be tried for treason, not locked away indefinitely without a trial."

Now is that what he was doing?

If he's a member of AQ or some other foreign group, yes. If these were two guys who decided on their own to do it a la Timothy McVey or Eric Rudolph, then I don't think treason is the right charge.

(04-20-2013 02:25 PM)mixduptransistor Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:59 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:50 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:29 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(04-20-2013 01:10 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  I think the costs come from all the appeals, investigators, psychologists, etc. There are a lot of hurdles to clear.

It cost aprox 75k to house a prisoner in a supermax prison. I would expect that would be where this guy would end up.

For schits and giggles....Let say his life expectancy is 75. That would be 56 years of incarceration. At "today's" cost...that would be 4.2 million dollars.

Maybe I am crazy..but..I doubt seriously that it cost anywhere close that amount to execute someone. If it does...there is something seriously wrong.

It costs $2-3 million to jump through all the appellate hoops before execution. Since those are mostly up front costs, by the time you factor in the time value of money, incarceration for life is probably cheaper. Plus on the guy you execute, you still run through 10 years or so of incarceration costs before you get to fry him.

IMO...That is Fcked up.

Yeah, I mean, we should totally do away with protections that make sure we don't execute innocent people.

I am referring to the costs....but you go ahead and put words in my mouth if you wish.

rub him down with pigfat. then give him the needle. I've got an idea that would put a sudden stop to a lot of the islamic radicals that are expecting 72 virgins in paradise.

He's an American citizen accused of committing a criminal act against Americans in America.

He gets his due process or none of us is safe.

For the people who ***** about the president ignoring the Constitution (and, admittedly, I'm one of them) we'd better damned well be ready to honor it.

(04-20-2013 04:50 PM)Smaug Wrote:  He's an American citizen accused of committing a criminal act against Americans in America.

He gets his due process or none of us is safe.

For the people who ***** about the president ignoring the Constitution (and, admittedly, I'm one of them) we'd better damned well be ready to honor it.

I think the citizenship argument is empty.

he has been an american citizen for 7 months, and almost without question it was acquired fraudulently. there is no way he wasn't in the planning stages of the terrorist attack when he was going through the citizenship process. concealing facts or lying to the USCIS is grounds for revocation, to say nothing of planting a 50 pound bomb next to an 8 year old boy and his little sister.

It doesn't matter what we want because Massachusetts has no death penalty and we have a liberal administration. We the people got what we elected, life will have to be good enough.

(04-20-2013 05:03 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  It doesn't matter what we want because Massachusetts has no death penalty and we have a liberal administration. We the people got what we elected, life will have to be good enough.

that's going to be a problem. all the other terrorists have cable. well, probably directv; the channel selection is much better, but you get the idea. anyway, they're watching. if something ghastly doesn't happen to this little monster, we're declaring open season on our citizens.

Nurse him back to health then take a sledge hammer to his feet. Nurse him back to health again and ask him why he did it. Rinse and repeat until satisfied with his answers. Then if It can be reasonably proven he committed these acts of his own free will hang him publicly.

I am normally opposed to the death penalty.

HOWEVER...... those who have been here for some time know I have some stipulations for allowing the death penalty to happen. Specifically, irrefutable video evidence of a crime that ends another human life.

If a jury finds him guilty and finds the video evidence irrefutable ... he should move directly to the front of the line in death row.

(04-20-2013 06:34 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  I am normally opposed to the death penalty.

HOWEVER...... those who have been here for some time know I have some stipulations for allowing the death penalty to happen. Specifically, irrefutable video evidence of a crime that ends another human life.

If a jury finds him guilty and finds the video evidence irrefutable ... he should move directly to the front of the line in death row.

you could get your libertarian card taken away for that, ya know.

As Glenn Greenwald put it today, "The reason to care what happens to him is because how he is treated creates precedent for what the US government is empowered to do, including to US citizens on US soil. When you cheer for the erosion of his rights, you're cheering for the erosion of your own."

D@mn straight. Agree totally.