Looking at the situation I see no way a deal can be reached to stop going over the cliff as it is called. What will happen is the automatic cuts will go into effect until the legislature makes a deal to stop some of them from going into effect. Everyone will see increased taxes in all income levels instead of those below $400,000 and below keeping their current tax levels with the ones above those levels getting back to Clinton era tax levels. The President campaigned on $250,000 a year and above would go back to Clinton Era tax cuts or close to it, while those below that woud pay what they do now. The President did amend that to $400,000 and included some social security cuts that many of his party don't like. The Speaker has refused that change and offered that the tax cuts in place now would stay in place for those of one million a year and above with more social program cuts that will never pass the Senate if it passes the House, and that is likely to be a close vote in itself since some on the far right oppose it.

That doesn't exactly make you Nostradamus.

You left out that the president at one time wanted $800B in new taxes, but when that was presented to him he said he wanted $1.2T in new taxes, as well as a blank check when it comes to the debt ceiling for the next two years. Both sides are being stubborn. The republicans somewhat justifiably so. They were elected to balance out the democratic senate and white house, yet have met the president more than half way on nearly every issue. The president keeps wanting more. He calls for a balanced approach, but then wants the taxes now and push spending cuts into the future (and we all know they won't ever happen.)
Going over the so-called cliff may be the best thing.

Get the spending cuts in writing.

The House should have passed Bowles-Simpson as its first order of business in 2011 and forced Reid and Obama to deal with it then.

I have no use for Obama and Reid and Pelosi and their ilk, but at this point I have little use for the republicans either.

Way to go out on a limb.

I predict Tebow isn't a Jet next year.

(12-20-2012 05:16 PM)SgtGoldenEagle Wrote:  Looking at the situation I see no way a deal can be reached to stop going over the cliff as it is called. What will happen is the automatic cuts will go into effect until the legislature makes a deal to stop some of them from going into effect. Everyone will see increased taxes in all income levels instead of those below $400,000 and below keeping their current tax levels with the ones above those levels getting back to Clinton era tax levels. The President campaigned on $250,000 a year and above would go back to Clinton Era tax cuts or close to it, while those below that woud pay what they do now. The President did amend that to $400,000 and included some social security cuts that many of his party don't like. The Speaker has refused that change and offered that the tax cuts in place now would stay in place for those of one million a year and above with more social program cuts that will never pass the Senate if it passes the House, and that is likely to be a close vote in itself since some on the far right oppose it.

The republican leadership was neutered today when they failed to even bring their plan B up for a vote. Plan B would have made the threshold a million before they stooped getting the extra tax cuts.

Prediction is a 11:59PM deal where they kick the can down the road a few more years.

(12-21-2012 12:32 AM)ClairtonPanther Wrote:  Prediction is a 11:59PM deal where they kick the can down the road a few more years.

The post had an article about a lot of people selling assets this month, and corporations offering special dividends, in case the capital gains tax and tax on dividends does increase. Waiting 11:59pm may cause a bump in tax revenue for this year.

(12-21-2012 01:19 AM)dcCid Wrote:  

(12-21-2012 12:32 AM)ClairtonPanther Wrote:  Prediction is a 11:59PM deal where they kick the can down the road a few more years.

The post had an article about a lot of people selling assets this month, and corporations offering special dividends, in case the capital gains tax and tax on dividends does increase. Waiting 11:59pm may cause a bump in tax revenue for this year.

The company I work for gave special dividends.

Here's what I don't understand. Why isn't the GVT finding new things to tax? Tax alcohol, raise taxes on tobacco, put a luxury tax on tickets to sports & recreation events. Legalize & regulate prostitution & marijuana and tax it. Lets have a 5% national sales tax. And my word, why aren't there serious discussions on spending cuts anywhere. Democrats: "you can't cut this or that"... Republicans "you can't touch this"... Come one... Even though most of us disagree with each other quite a bit, I have a lot more faith in the people of this board to work out a feasible solution than I do our elected leaders. And that's a serious problem.

Boehner has no control of his caucus. No reason for Obama to ever speak to him again.

(12-21-2012 05:18 AM)ClairtonPanther Wrote:  Here's what I don't understand. Why isn't the GVT finding new things to tax? Tax alcohol, raise taxes on tobacco, put a luxury tax on tickets to sports & recreation events. Legalize & regulate prostitution & marijuana and tax it. Lets have a 5% national sales tax. And my word, why aren't there serious discussions on spending cuts anywhere. Democrats: "you can't cut this or that"... Republicans "you can't touch this"... Come one... Even though most of us disagree with each other quite a bit, I have a lot more faith in the people of this board to work out a feasible solution than I do our elected leaders. And that's a serious problem.

I actually think most any group that doesn't include Obama, Boehner, Reid, Pelosi, or McConnell could work out a feasible solution.

(12-21-2012 05:29 AM)firmbizzle Wrote:  Boehner has no control of his caucus. No reason for Obama to ever speak to him again.

Yeah, that's shows leadership.

This whole thing is a circus. If they were really serious there would already be a deal.

Meanwhile futures are down over 200 this morning. I expect the DOW to drop 400 or 500 points today before making a very modest recovery.

I just don't understand the Republicans. Clearly some of them want the cliff to happen but probably want the ability to blame President Obama when it does. But the circus that happened last night only reinforces to the nation that a failure will squarely put the blame on the Republicans. If they can't even unite as a party, how can they attempt to shift the blame to the other side?

This only gives President Obama more power and might kill any chances to gain any further concessions from the Democrats. Maybe the Mayans were only predicting the end of the Republican party on Dec. 21st, 2012, and not the end of the world.

Boehner is simply a very weak leader. Which is particularly disappointing because we have never needed a strong opposition more.

Republicans should have passed Bowles-Simpson out of the House on day one of 2011, and forced Obama and Reid to deal with it.

(12-21-2012 07:50 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Boehner is simply a very weak leader. Which is particularly disappointing because we have never needed a strong opposition more.

Name anyone of strength in the GOP. They're all weak. They unite to oppose anyone of strength. It's stunning.

(12-21-2012 07:50 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Boehner is simply a very weak leader. Which is particularly disappointing because we have never needed a strong opposition more.

Republicans should have passed Bowles-Simpson out of the House on day one of 2011, and forced Obama and Reid to deal with it.

Yep. Simpson/Bowles or Rivlin/Domenici. Those bills are already put together. The only way this is going to work is for Obama/Boehner to come up with a deal that will get democrats and enough republicans to pass. It will be Boehner's last act as speaker but he is on his way out anyway. Might as well get a deal done and get this over.

(12-21-2012 07:50 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Boehner is simply a very weak leader. Which is particularly disappointing because we have never needed a strong opposition more.

Republicans should have passed Bowles-Simpson out of the House on day one of 2011, and forced Obama and Reid to deal with it.

The very fact no deal is done proves the fact that both Boehner and Obama are weak leaders.