(04-03-2012 04:14 PM)Max Power Wrote: (04-03-2012 01:18 PM)200yrs2late Wrote: (04-03-2012 01:03 PM)Max Power Wrote: Yeah but those are foreign owned with virtually all profits flowing overseas, and typically only have a component of manufacturing such as assembly here in America. It's better than nothing but those clearly are not American companies even though they have some slack jaw bolting frames together in a right to work state for $9/hour.
Wow... Have much contempt for companies choosing to operate in right-to-work states? Nice gereralization as well, do you consider all of us living and working in right-to-work states "slackjaws"?
You might want to do a little research on this as well. Non union pay at automakers like Hyundai, Honda, and Toyota that are located in the southern right-to-work states is on par with UAW union workers pay. In fact since 2007 the gap has been closing between pay and many of those working in right-to-work states don't want unions in their plants.
Do you really care that much about ownership when these companies are investing in American jobs and factories? Sure a large portion of profits go overseas, but you do see the economic benefits provided by them don't you?
You'd better f'king believe I have contempt. I see how they operate. CAT world HQ is a couple blocks from my office, I have friends in there and as I've explained on here they jerked around my area and state to sell our workers down the river despite their record profits and never having an intent to open the plant they just built in Athens GA in Peoria. My fraternity brother was in charge of the relocation project.
You're wrong about wages being on par, and even if they were, less health insurance is offered and workers comp laws in right to work states are very anti-worker. I had an uncle die in Georgia working as an electrician due to the negligence of his employer and my aunt and 2 cousins got a whole $80k for his death. Here in Illinois he would have gotten $500k at least.
Quote:A February 2011 Economic Policy Institute study found:[11]
Wages in right-to-work states are 3.2% lower than those in non-RTW states, after controlling for a full complement of individual demographic and socioeconomic variables as well as state macroeconomic indicators. Using the average wage in non-RTW states as the base ($22.11), the average full-time, full-year worker in an RTW state makes about $1,500 less annually than a similar worker in a non-RTW state.
The rate of employer-sponsored health insurance (ESI) is 2.6 percentage points lower in RTW states compared with non-RTW states, after controlling for individual, job, and state-level characteristics. If workers in non-RTW states were to receive ESI at this lower rate, 2 million fewer workers nationally would be covered.
The rate of employer-sponsored pensions is 4.8 percentage points lower in RTW states, using the full complement of control variables in [the study's] regression model. If workers in non-RTW states were to receive pensions at this lower rate, 3.8 million fewer workers nationally would have pensions.
The corporations and US Chamber of Commerce work hard to turn workers against their own unions and actually run commercials showing workers complaining about paying union dues, and making it look like the commercials are beign made by disgruntled workers. F'k. Them. Hard. And f'k the right to work politicians in the pocket of big business conspiring to exploit the workers in their own state.
Wow... big bad CAT didn't want to pay a premium for workers in a union. Terrible them. It's their choice where they locate their plants.
Nice sidestep on the wage comparisons as well. I specifically mentioned three automakers and UAW wages, you site a report that makes no mention of autoworker pay comparisons.
Congratulations of finding your EPI report. I'm sure that a report written by 2 left wing economist that write and report for NPR and New York Times id completely unbiased. It's not like the EPI isn't widely regarded as a Liberal Think-Tank anyway. It's in their core beliefs to support and promote a strong labor movement.
I can play that game too.
Good for Business, Good for Workers
As reported on the Washington Examiner's "Beltway Confidential" blog, Development Counselors International (DCI) recently asked corporate executives and representatives which states they thought were the best to locate for business. As the Examiner notes, America's job providers overwhelmingly favored states with Right to Work laws.
Of course this should come to no surprise. The results of DCI's survey largely mirrors that of CNBC 2010 "Best for Business" list, in which states with Right to Work protections for its workers were ranked seven of the top 10 and 10 of the top 15.
http://www.nrtw.org/en/blog/new-study-sh...e-11152010
Percentage Growth in Real Personal Income (1999-2009)
Right to Work States . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 28.3%
Forced-Unionism States. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 14.7%
National Average . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 19.5%
Cost of Living-Adjusted Per Capita Disposable Personal Income (2009)
Right to Work States . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . $35,543
Forced-Unionism States . . . . . . . . . . . . . $33,389
National Average . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . $34,256
http://www.nrtw.org/en/blog/new-fact-she...i-10262011
Right to Work States Benefit From Faster Growth, Higher Real Purchasing Power – 2011 Update
Percentage Growth in Non-Farm Private-Sector Employees (2000-2010)
Right to Work States . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . +0.3%
Forced-Unionism States. . . . . . . . . . . . . . -5.5%
National Average . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . -3.3%
Source: Department of Labor, Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS)
Percentage Real Growth in Private-Sector Employee Compensation (2000-2010)
Right to Work States . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 11.3%
Forced-Unionism States. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.7%
(2000-2010) National Average . . . . . . . . . 4.3%
BEA; BLS
Cost of Living-Adjusted Compensation Per Private-Sector Employee (2010)
Right to Work States . . . . . . . . . . . . . $56,575
Forced-Unionism States . . . . . . . . . . . $55,420
National Average . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . $55,896
Missouri Economic Research and Information Center (MERIC);
BEA; Department of Commerce, Bureau of the Census (BOC)
Your "$9/ hour" generalization makes you look small, simple-minded, and incredibly ignorant.