(05-30-2010 01:27 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I have no idea what Paul is writing

Your not fooling anyone.

Another question. Tell me the difference between Timothy McVeigh and Mohhamed Atta?

(05-30-2010 01:27 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I have no idea what Paul is writing but to the others. Serious question. Can we ever win these battles with missles and bullets? Is it possible to defeat radicals and their ideologies with guns and firing off tomahawks?

Answering this question is step 1 in your journey to enlightment.

At a minimum, at least a few terrorists end up dead as opposed to your blowing them just makes them hornier. I'll take dead terrorists. The alternative is conversion. You've chosen your burka, I chose freedom.

(05-30-2010 01:42 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Another question. Tell me the difference between Timothy McVeigh and Mohhamed Atta?

One of them learned to hate the country, the other was born to hate the country.

(05-30-2010 01:42 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Another question. Tell me the difference between Timothy McVeigh and Mohhamed Atta?

McVeigh was an Aberration, a lone gunman, Atta, part of a huge religion, with upwards of 100 million sharing his views.

(05-30-2010 01:33 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:32 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 12:17 PM)Paul M Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 11:59 AM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 09:10 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  They have a strip club the same distance away. We are NOT at WAR with Islam. You guys get that.............. right????

Iraq, Afghanistan soon to be Pakistan and Iran. If we aren't it sure as hell looks like we are. This is how they look at it too.

Next your going to tell us that their actions are just defensive.

And I don't listen to Rush. Never have.

Attacking the US by terrorists is not defensive but one might be able to make a case for it if they fight us in their own country.

We opened up the can of whoop-*** in response to their attack on us. Should we have not responded to 9/11?

Who attacked us on 9/11? Iraq? Are you still believing that ****?

(05-30-2010 01:59 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:33 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:32 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 12:17 PM)Paul M Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 11:59 AM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 09:10 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  They have a strip club the same distance away. We are NOT at WAR with Islam. You guys get that.............. right????

Iraq, Afghanistan soon to be Pakistan and Iran. If we aren't it sure as hell looks like we are. This is how they look at it too.

Next your going to tell us that their actions are just defensive.

And I don't listen to Rush. Never have.

Attacking the US by terrorists is not defensive but one might be able to make a case for it if they fight us in their own country.

We opened up the can of whoop-*** in response to their attack on us. Should we have not responded to 9/11?

Who attacked us on 9/11? Iraq? Are you still believing that ****?

While enforcing the no-fly zone over iraq, the iraqis would shoot missiles at the planes. One country's military attacking another country's military = act of war, just like Pearl Harbor. Or do you think we were wrong for attacking the japs?

(05-30-2010 01:44 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:42 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Another question. Tell me the difference between Timothy McVeigh and Mohhamed Atta?

One of them learned to hate the country, the other was born to hate the country.

So there is a "hate America" gene? Are you really that screwed up in the head S&M? Hate is learned no matter where the person is born. Who taught you to hate non-Christians and people of color?

(05-30-2010 02:12 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:44 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:42 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Another question. Tell me the difference between Timothy McVeigh and Mohhamed Atta?

One of them learned to hate the country, the other was born to hate the country.

So there is a "hate America" gene? Are you really that screwed up in the head S&M? Hate is learned no matter where the person is born. Who taught you to hate non-Christians and people of color?

You know what I meant, from the time Atta was born his indoctrination began. But there is a "hate America" gene, it's commonly found in liberals who want to turn this country into anything other than what it is now.

There is no difference smn. That's the point. We shouldn't treat them any differently. We have wasted trillions in in blood and capital. We can not Win an asymmetrical war with Islamic radicals. We have to approach this differently. We have to convert hearts and minds. When the right comprehends that. We can move ahead.

The problem with many on the right is the ground is moving underneath their feet. They long for days when this country looked and behaved a certain way. Demographics are moving away from them. If labor has to tolerate a global economy. Many on this room will have to tolerate a multi cultural society. We are integrated. Their is no reason a muslim mosque can not go anywhere in our country.

(05-30-2010 02:12 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:44 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:42 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Another question. Tell me the difference between Timothy McVeigh and Mohhamed Atta?

One of them learned to hate the country, the other was born to hate the country.

So there is a "hate America" gene? Are you really that screwed up in the head S&M? Hate is learned no matter where the person is born. Who taught you to hate non-Christians and people of color?

But you believe in a gay gene.

I believe Steve meant they are born into a culture that teaches them to hate. Ergo, born to hate.

Edit: never mind, Steve done set your dumb-dumb, bubble-gum head straight.

(05-30-2010 02:16 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  There is no difference smn. That's the point. We shouldn't treat them any differently. We have wasted trillions in in blood and capital. We can not Win an asymmetrical war with Islamic radicals. We have to approach this differently. We have to convert hearts and minds. When the right comprehends that. We can move ahead.

Mach, I agree that in most cases winning the hearts and minds is the way to go. I just don't think it's possible in this case because these people have a deep, almost inborn hatred of anything Western or not aligned with their beliefs. Just drawing a picture of their idol will get ya killed, how do you change that mindset?

(05-30-2010 02:19 PM)Paul M Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 02:12 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:44 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:42 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Another question. Tell me the difference between Timothy McVeigh and Mohhamed Atta?

One of them learned to hate the country, the other was born to hate the country.

So there is a "hate America" gene? Are you really that screwed up in the head S&M? Hate is learned no matter where the person is born. Who taught you to hate non-Christians and people of color?

But you believe in a gay gene.

I believe Steve meant they are born into a culture that teaches them to hate. Ergo, born to hate.

Edit: never mind, Steve done set your dumb-dumb, bubble-gum head straight.

Hating a country or philosophy is COMPLETELY different than a "gay" gene. I wouldn't expect you to understand the differnece though.

(05-30-2010 02:15 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 02:12 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:44 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:42 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Another question. Tell me the difference between Timothy McVeigh and Mohhamed Atta?

One of them learned to hate the country, the other was born to hate the country.

So there is a "hate America" gene? Are you really that screwed up in the head S&M? Hate is learned no matter where the person is born. Who taught you to hate non-Christians and people of color?

You know what I meant, from the time Atta was born his indoctrination began. But there is a "hate America" gene, it's commonly found in liberals who want to turn this country into anything other than what it is now.

I agreee. We want it better than the crap you Republicans left it to us in.

(05-30-2010 02:26 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 02:15 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 02:12 PM)RobertN Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:44 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 01:42 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Another question. Tell me the difference between Timothy McVeigh and Mohhamed Atta?

One of them learned to hate the country, the other was born to hate the country.

So there is a "hate America" gene? Are you really that screwed up in the head S&M? Hate is learned no matter where the person is born. Who taught you to hate non-Christians and people of color?

You know what I meant, from the time Atta was born his indoctrination began. But there is a "hate America" gene, it's commonly found in liberals who want to turn this country into anything other than what it is now.

I agreee. We want it better than the crap you Republicans left it to us in.

Do you really believe the country will be better off after obama's evicted from the WH than when Bush left? Really?

(05-30-2010 02:21 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 02:16 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  There is no difference smn. That's the point. We shouldn't treat them any differently. We have wasted trillions in in blood and capital. We can not Win an asymmetrical war with Islamic radicals. We have to approach this differently. We have to convert hearts and minds. When the right comprehends that. We can move ahead.

Mach, I agree that in most cases winning the hearts and minds is the way to go. I just don't think it's possible in this case because these people have a deep, almost inborn hatred of anything Western or not aligned with their beliefs. Just drawing a picture of their idol will get ya killed, how do you change that mindset?

That is why we need to teach them at an early age to live and respect others. What are they learning now? That we have big bombs and guns that are killing their families. It won't change over night and it may take several generations but sow the seeds of peace and respect rather than killing and violence.

(05-30-2010 02:16 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  There is no difference smn. That's the point. We shouldn't treat them any differently. We have wasted trillions in in blood and capital. We can not Win an asymmetrical war with Islamic radicals. We have to approach this differently. We have to convert hearts and minds. When the right comprehends that. We can move ahead.

The problem with many on the right is the ground is moving underneath their feet. They long for days when this country looked and behaved a certain way. Demographics are moving away from them. If labor has to tolerate a global economy. Many on this room will have to tolerate a multi cultural society. We are integrated. Their is no reason a muslim mosque can not go anywhere in our country.

So your fine with other hate groups building meeting places where they can teach their hate anywhere they wish? The KKK? Aryan Brotherhood? Or are you selective in the hate groups you approve of? Is it just the one that is committing atrocities all around the globe your OK with?

(05-30-2010 01:27 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I have no idea what Paul is writing but to the others. Serious question. Can we ever win these battles with missles and bullets? Is it possible to defeat radicals and their ideologies with guns and firing off tomahawks?

Answering this question is step 1 in your journey to enlightment.

You are not posing a serious question. You are posing a stupid question. If we give up missles and bullets, are they going to. I do not think so, and neither do you. You are reverting back to your old drive by posting ways. Your return from self imposed ban has you provoking fights. Stupidity.

Islam is not some monolithic force. Therefore neither missiles and bullets nor peace and understanding will work across the board. You need some of each.

When we have gone to war, we haven't gone all the way to war. Limited warfare is the WORST way to deal with the situation we face. We need to show more warmth and udnerstanding (and I mean real understanding, not trying to change them to our way of thinking) with those with whom that will work. And we need to obliterate those for whom that will not work.

When you understand this, you truly WILL be on your way to understanding. Unfortunately, both the Bush and Obama administrations have been so busy trying to impose their will on others that they have not paid attention and learned.

(05-30-2010 02:37 PM)Paul M Wrote:  

(05-30-2010 02:16 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  There is no difference smn. That's the point. We shouldn't treat them any differently. We have wasted trillions in in blood and capital. We can not Win an asymmetrical war with Islamic radicals. We have to approach this differently. We have to convert hearts and minds. When the right comprehends that. We can move ahead.

The problem with many on the right is the ground is moving underneath their feet. They long for days when this country looked and behaved a certain way. Demographics are moving away from them. If labor has to tolerate a global economy. Many on this room will have to tolerate a multi cultural society. We are integrated. Their is no reason a muslim mosque can not go anywhere in our country.

So your fine with other hate groups building meeting places where they can teach their hate anywhere they wish? The KKK? Aryan Brotherhood? Or are you selective in the hate groups you approve of? Is it just the one that is committing atrocities all around the globe your OK with?

Somone did build your house. As for KKK or AN, they aren't recognized religions Islam is(I know your response here so you can skip the "it isn't a religion" crap).