<a href='http://www.mwcboard.com/www/forums/index.php?showtopic=1108' target='_blank'>Link to WAC fans who like the MWC</a>

<a href='http://www.mwcboard.com/www/forums/index.php?showtopic=1100' target='_blank'>Link to WAC fans who like the MWC</a>

It makes me proud when I see that <a href='http://mb12.scout.com/fhawaiifrm1.showMessage?topicID=16462.topic' target='_blank'>many</a> Hawai'i fans have the correct perspective on things.

When are some people going to learn that if you take care of your own bussiness then the rest will take care of itself?

I know that Utah St and New Mexico St fans are quite familiar with the MWC's tactics. Fresno St fans should be accustomed to those tactics like Hawai'i fans are by now, but many of them continue to disappoint. :rolleyes: I was under the impression that Boise St fans are excited about the new conference and were pleased to have more regional rivalries. Was I wrong? What is the general consensus? I haven't heard a peep from Nevada fans regarding moving to the MWC. Pack fans seem to be focused with the issues at hand and not concerned about being too good for their own conference. I get the impression from many Fresno St and Boise St fans that they are too good for the likes of the WAC. Are they really too good for the rest of us? I find that very difficult to believe. Is San Jose St and Idaho really not capable of having D1A football programs that are highly competitive? Even if Utah St can't improve its football program, is its success in basketball good enough to be worthy of Boise St's and Fresno St's presence? Is New Mexico St's upside not worth being loyal to? Is La Tech so far removed from the rest of the WAC that they have nothing to offer? Hawai'i fans seem convinced that the WAC is something that is worth being a part of. What does everyone think?

Did Utah St, Idaho, and NMSU make a mistake by joining the WAC. I'm confused as to the loyalty of the members of this conference. In fact, I'm convinced that the upside of the new WAC is not worth investing in, because Hawkins, according to many Boise St posters, is willing to move to another conference at the first offer.

Again, folks, what is the general consensus. I'm even beginning to wonder about my fellow Utah St fans. I'm of the opinion that the MWC has nothing to offer overall over the WAC. Playing in the same conference with Utah and BYU does nothing but make me sick. :cry: So what is it about the MWC that gets all of you WAC fans excited or vice versa?

Go WAC!

Are we gonna have to resurrect the "P" word in this forum? :mad:

A few personal observations:

1. I don't see the MWC expanding anytime soon.
2. The MWC is not likely to want the publicity it would get if it caused the collapse of the WAC.
3. The MWC will want to add institutions that it considers equal to or better than the top of the MWC and that is in academics.
4. If the MWC deal with CSTV, or whatever it is called, doesn't give then the national exposure that is necessary for a non-bcs school to have a shot at the bcs, then it will nothing more than a long shot gamble.
5. If the WAC can provide a competitively stable conference and attract the OOC home and home schedules it needs for recognition, then it will make a conference move a step backwards.
6. If we can stop worrying about something that is not likely to happen, then we could actually enjoy the season that starts in 11 days.

As I see it, the MWC has paced its growth carefully.

1st by jumping from the 16 team WAC to avoid the payouts from being to scaled down. (Makes business sense here)

2nd by inviting only revenue making schools. Hawaii was a travel cost burden and UTEP had the rep of taking more than giving.

3rd inviting TCU who was at the time a top C-USA program and a somewhat reasonable geographic fit.

With that said, I think the MWC will only look to raid the WAC if it feels in danger of being "upped" by the WAC. This is a distinct possibility in the future.

The WAC has everything to gain. BSU kept pace with Utah last year in the BCS hunt. Overall, I think the WAC can close ranks and become a very good conference. For this to happen, the newbies need to step up and not let BSU, FSU and Hawaii carry the load.

I know NMSU has already reaped many bennies from joining the WAC, better recruiting, budget increased, higher profile coaches, etc. For this, I think I can speak for most, if not all, NMSU fans in that we are very excited and glad to join the WAC. And I hope the current makeup stays together for a long, long time. If we do that, we will be a top rated conference.

gaard Wrote:A few personal observations:

1. I don't see the MWC expanding anytime soon.
2. The MWC is not likely to want the publicity it would get if it caused the collapse of the WAC.
3. The MWC will want to add institutions that it considers equal to or better than the top of the MWC and that is in academics.
4. If the MWC deal with CSTV, or whatever it is called, doesn't give then the national exposure that is necessary for a non-bcs school to have a shot at the bcs, then it will nothing more than a long shot gamble.
5. If the WAC can provide a competitively stable conference and attract the OOC home and home schedules it needs for recognition, then it will make a conference move a step backwards.
6. If we can stop worrying about something that is not likely to happen, then we could actually enjoy the season that starts in 11 days.

I would add that Hawk's position is if you're not moving up, you're moving back. He did not like the addition of Idaho to the WAC from both a competitive and facilities perspective and no doubt sees it as moving backwards. He's focused on pushing Boise and southern Idaho into thinking big and he sees the MWC as the 'next step' up. It could be if the WAC doesn't get better top to bottom; certainly it would be a safer bet to sellout an updated 50k seat stadium each week in the MWC (fan recognition). But like Gaard says, there are some risks in the MAC master plan and the WAC can only go up as a conference.

And thanks to USU and NMSU, I see our league hoops strength improving overall and that should push us into getting better. We have to get to where the WAC puts 3 in the dance each year. I like the WAC. USU and NMSU are both seeing what we saw when we came into the WAC: more everything from fan interest, to coaching interest, to money infused into the program. I have high confidence we'll see them both rise quickly to the top.

There is alot of diehard fans that get caught up in all the hipe and hoopla that is College Football.
They look at what everyone else has and think the grass is greener on the other side. These fans pour their hearts and souls into these Fan Forum Sites and many give good info while others just add fuel to the fire. I sure hope that many of you that go to these sites realize that what you read is not nessessarly correct or a true reflection of what the majority of fans think.

These Fan Fourm Sites are a way to share info, smack talk, and just have fun. It's part of the College Football Season tradition. Don't believe everthing you read and consider the source!
There is alot of characters on these sites, (YOU KNOW WHO THEY ARE).

As for my school Fresno State, I think the majority of fans would like to tell the MWC to go to
#$%^. They have made it very clear that they don't want Fresno State. I would like to see us stay in the WAC along with Boise and help keep the conference stable. I think the future looks good for the WAC if we all stick together. Unfortunately if the MWC comes calling the decision is
going to be up to our Admin. We all know how that goes.

NO team is immune from getting there butts kicked. All the ratings, Polls, Top recruiting class, don't mean squat. It is just a prediction of how you might perform.
It all come down to the field of play, the team that comes to play and pours their heart and soul into the game will usually take it. If you think your to good and don't show some respect, your going to get your butt kicked. (Just ask Virginia)

Fresno & Boise have done well but just as easy things can turn around. Failure to respect your fellow WAC brothers will come back to hunt you.

GO FSU BULLDOG!!!..........................Shut Up & Hit Somebody......!

reddog4 Wrote:There is alot of diehard fans that get caught up in all the hipe and hoopla that is College Football.
They look at what everyone else has and think the grass is greener on the other side. These fans pour their hearts and souls into these Fan Forum Sites and many give good info while others just add fuel to the fire. I sure hope that many of you that go to these sites realize that what you read is not nessessarly correct or a true reflection of what the majority of fans think.

These Fan Fourm Sites are a way to share info, smack talk, and just have fun. It's part of the College Football Season tradition. Don't believe everthing you read and consider the source!
There is alot of characters on these sites, (YOU KNOW WHO THEY ARE).

As for my school Fresno State, I think the majority of fans would like to tell the MWC to go to
#$%^. They have made it very clear that they don't want Fresno State. I would like to see us stay in the WAC along with Boise and help keep the conference stable. I think the future looks good for the WAC if we all stick together. Unfortunately if the MWC comes calling the decision is
going to be up to our Admin. We all know how that goes.

NO team is immune from getting there butts kicked. All the ratings, Polls, Top recruiting class, don't mean squat. It is just a prediction of how you might perform.
It all come down to the field of play, the team that comes to play and pours their heart and soul into the game will usually take it. If you think your to good and don't show some respect, your going to get your butt kicked. (Just ask Virginia)

Fresno & Boise have done well but just as easy things can turn around. Failure to respect your fellow WAC brothers will come back to hunt you.

GO FSU BULLDOG!!!..........................Shut Up & Hit Somebody......!

Thanks for your input, reddog! However, I'd like to hear from the fans who love to post on the MWC board and talk about how great it would be for their school to be in the MWC also. I'd like to get a better perspective as to why they think the MWC is so fantastic. I personally don't see it that way and that is why I'm asking, so that I can understand where they're coming from.

Thanks for everyone's points! Keep 'em coming! Tell me why your team is too good for the WAC or why the WAC is a perfect fit.

LMFAO, look at all the WAC posters having a conversation among themselves on the MWC board about who should be the next school invited to their league. totally pathetic! when will these people wake up realize the the Mountain Worst has nothing over the WAC! over the past four years the WAC has had more teams invited to the Dance, more bowl games and more bowl wins. what we lack is a huge contract with a fifth rate broadcaster that will be worth just about as much to the MWC as Steve Young's contract with the USFL was. what we should be worrying about is making our own leauge stronger so that if at some point the WAC decides to expand we can raid their conference!

my top three Mountain Worst expansion picks.

1. UNLV
2./3. San Diego State and Colorado State

Go WAC!

The only thing the MWC has on the WAC is more TV $. Benson and crew need to get a new TV deal in the next 2-3 years to put us on par with CUSA and MWC $.

We have 2 top 25 football programs.... and probably 2 top 25 hoop squads... ... we have the product.

ejmpalle Wrote:<a href='http://www.mwcboard.com/www/forums/index.php?showtopic=1108' target='_blank'>Link to WAC fans who like the MWC</a>

<a href='http://www.mwcboard.com/www/forums/index.php?showtopic=1100' target='_blank'>Link to WAC fans who like the MWC</a>

It makes me proud when I see that <a href='http://mb12.scout.com/fhawaiifrm1.showMessage?topicID=16462.topic' target='_blank'>many</a> Hawai'i fans have the correct perspective on things.

When are some people going to learn that if you take care of your own bussiness then the rest will take care of itself? 

I know that Utah St and New Mexico St fans are quite familiar with the MWC's tactics.  Fresno St fans should be accustomed to those tactics like Hawai'i fans are by now, but many of them continue to disappoint.  :rolleyes:  I was under the impression that Boise St fans are excited about the new conference and were pleased to have more regional rivalries.  Was I wrong?  What is the general consensus?  I haven't heard a peep from Nevada fans regarding moving to the MWC.  Pack fans seem to be focused with the issues at hand and not concerned about being too good for their own conference.  I get the impression from many Fresno St and Boise St fans that they are too good for the likes of the WAC.  Are they really too good for the rest of us?  I find that very difficult to believe.  Is San Jose St and Idaho really not capable of having D1A football programs that are highly competitive?  Even if Utah St can't improve its football program, is its success in basketball good enough to be worthy of Boise St's and Fresno St's presence?  Is New Mexico St's upside not worth being loyal to?  Is La Tech so far removed from the rest of the WAC that they have nothing to offer?  Hawai'i fans seem convinced that the WAC is something that is worth being a part of.  What does everyone think?

Did Utah St, Idaho, and NMSU make a mistake by joining the WAC.  I'm confused as to the loyalty of the members of this conference.  In fact, I'm convinced that the upside of the new WAC is not worth investing in, because Hawkins, according to many Boise St posters, is willing to move to another conference at the first offer. 

Again, folks, what is the general consensus.  I'm even beginning to wonder about my fellow Utah St fans.  I'm of the opinion that the MWC has nothing to offer overall over the WAC.  Playing in the same conference with Utah and BYU does nothing but make me sick.  :cry:  So what is it about the MWC that gets all of you WAC fans excited or vice versa?

Go WAC!

These are just message boards, no policy is made on this. These expansion threads come up in the summer when there is not much else to talk about. One reason people keep talking about this the chances of a BCS auto bid. However, the BCS is not about to give the MWC an auto bid. The criteria has changed, but if the MWC (or the WAC) come close to overtaking the Big Least then they would change the criteria again. It is their party and they aren't about to change it. (Mark my words, that is why they let Louisville use their C-USA record from last year. If TCU had gone 10-1 they would not have let the MWC use the record.)

The other reason is that the MWC that no WAC team will be added is $$$. If you look at the old WAC, no mountain time zone team has been added since 1978. (The AFA.) They also added Hawaii and SDSU that year. They then added Fresno in 1992. In 1996 they added 4 Central time zone teams and 2 more Pacific teams. (They wanted to get exposure outside of the Mountain and Pacific time zones.) It was a big mistake for all involved. The Utah, Colorado, and Wyoming schools created the MWC for 2 reasons. 1 was to preserve traditional rivalries and the second was to save money in travel costs. The only school that was not a long standing member was UNLV. They put them in because of cheap travel and lots of TV sets in Las Vegas.

Anyways TCU was added for a few reasons. The football team and BCS bid was one reason. The other reasons were as follows. 1 was the Dallas TV market and improved recruiting from Texas. The second was it is fairly easy to get to Dallas-Ft. Worth for travel. The 3rd was because they are a private religious school, a plus for BYU. (They do have a huge say in what happens.) They were also added for their academics and other sports programs. Lastly they were added because they would not be recruiting from the same base of that the current MWC teams do. (They wouldn't be a threat to diltuting talent.)

Looking at the pattern of expansion and their desired goals the MWC will add another Central team if they ever do expand. They will need it to keep the travel costs down, improve recruiting in the the Texas area, and to gain more exposure outside of the West. Basically the WAC teams are not what the MWC want. None of the schools fit these criteria, but fans love to speculate. Now that I have talked about the MWC let me say this about the WAC.

Teams want to join for understandable reasons. (Really) 1st is a monetary issue. The MWC has made money, though it is far from a BCS league. 2nd is stability. 13 teams have left the WAC in the past 7 years. Fresno, Hawaii, and SJSU have seen it all. Nevada, Boise, USU, NMSU, and Idaho were all in a crumbling league that eventually dropped football, and it has just gotten old. None of the MWC teams are going anyplace so it looks attractive. Every Western WAC team (except SJSU) tried to get in 2 years ago for good reason. The college landscape was in flux and teams needed a place to call home. Seeing what USU has gone through, it made a lot of sense for them to do that. 3 teams were leaving, no one knew if USU and NMSU would come without some sort of merger with the SBC and UTEP and La Tech were looking at other options. It was a little unnerving to say the least.

3rd is rejection. Some fans can't believe that they were turned down. (USU fans should be able to empathize with this.) We still moan about being turned down by the original WAC even though it happens 40 years ago. For most of the 60's and 70's USU was the best football program in the Rocky Mountain region, yet the WAC continually turned us down during that time period. Think about some of the schools that have strong football teams today. How can we expect them to get over something that happened 2 years ago when we still rehash something that happened 40+ years ago? Put yourself in that position.

Until people East of the Mississippi recognize MWC members are no longer in the WAC then nothing has really changed.

I personally believe the MWC was a one hit wonder last year.



As far as Fresno State fans opinion on the subject I personally believe it is split down the middle. Some want us to shoot for the MWC while others feel we were screwed over twice in a backdoor situation.

gaard Wrote:A few personal observations:

1. I don't see the MWC expanding anytime soon.
2. The MWC is not likely to want the publicity it would get if it caused the collapse of the WAC.
3. The MWC will want to add institutions that it considers equal to or better than the top of the MWC and that is in academics.
4. If the MWC deal with CSTV, or whatever it is called, doesn't give then the national exposure that is necessary for a non-bcs school to have a shot at the bcs, then it will nothing more than a long shot gamble.
5. If the WAC can provide a competitively stable conference and attract the OOC home and home schedules it needs for recognition, then it will make a conference move a step backwards.
6. If we can stop worrying about something that is not likely to happen, then we could actually enjoy the season that starts in 11 days.

And 1 other thing.

Well said gaard.

I guess it's understandable because they are new guys, but the fans of USU take all this MWC expansion drivel far more seriously than they should. It's just talk..Dan Hawkins doesn't have a vote..Neither does Steve Cleaveland. It doesn't matter what they think. Message board posters don't decide anything either.

University presidents decide all this and they do so for a wide variety of reasons. Conference jumping happens every few years and will happen again..It may affect the WAC..It may not. Still, noboby is leaving at the moment...It will all work out okay..

nvspuds Wrote:I guess it's understandable because they are new guys, but the fans of USU take all this MWC expansion drivel far more seriously than they should. It's just talk..Dan Hawkins doesn't have a vote..Neither does Steve Cleaveland. It doesn't matter what they think. Message board posters don't decide anything either.

University presidents decide all this and they do so for a wide variety of reasons. Conference jumping happens every few years and will happen again..It may affect the WAC..It may not. Still, noboby is leaving at the moment...It will all work out okay..

What you are saying has some truth to it, nvspuds, however:
#1 Athletic Directors, most of them are concerned about pleasing their boosters. And if the boosters are mostly convinced that they're not happy with their conference then that could hold some water.
#2 The reason Utah St fans get worked up about this talk (note that you never see Aggie fans contemplating a move to the MWC), is that most of them are aware of what the MWC is made of and what politics are there. We see the potential of the WAC and look forward to when that potential is met.

ejmpalle Wrote:I'd like to hear from the fans who love to post on the MWC board and talk about how great it would be for their school to be in the MWC also. I'd like to get a better perspective as to why they think the MWC is so fantastic. I personally don't see it that way and that is why I'm asking, so that I can understand where they're coming from.

With few exceptions, the “fans

clpack Wrote:[quote="ejmpalle"] I'd like to hear from the fans who love to post on the MWC board and talk about how great it would be for their school to be in the MWC also.&nbsp; I'd like to get a better perspective as to why they think the MWC is so fantastic.&nbsp; I personally don't see it that way and that is why I'm asking, so that I can understand where they're coming from.

With few exceptions, the “fans

ejmpalle.

The boosters from Boise and Fresno can jump up and demand a move to the MWC all they want it doesn't change the fact that the MWC presidents are the only ones who can extend an invitation..

USU is hardly the lone victim in the expansion run arounds..There just aren't very many schools out west and they all have to keep an eye out for every opportunity out there should an opportunity arise.

No MWC school has done anything bad to Nevada..We have games with them in all sports every year. They schedule home and home arragements and treat our programs with respect. It's unlikely that they will extend an invitation to the Pack anytime soon but that doesn't make them the bad guys..

I like the WAC and am eagerly looking forward to renewing old rivalries..That's good enough for me..The rest is just talk..

What I find funny is that in some polls the MWC does not have any Top 25 teams while the WAC has BSU and FSU. The current WAC lineup has a lot of upside and given a few years will surpass the MWC in the polls.

clpack Wrote:[quote="ejmpalle"] I'd like to hear from the fans who love to post on the MWC board and talk about how great it would be for their school to be in the MWC also.&nbsp; I'd like to get a better perspective as to why they think the MWC is so fantastic.&nbsp; I personally don't see it that way and that is why I'm asking, so that I can understand where they're coming from.

With few exceptions, the “fans

<span style='color:blue'> Utah State (shakes head)... poor little brother.</span>